Making money in blogging?

[Leva]

I just thought I'd do a quick run-down of affiliate and advertising programs beyond Adsense and Amazon that I'm aware of and have had personal experience with. There's a lot out there, and some have better deals than Amazon.

First off, a word about Linkshare -- they currently pay every week and they pay for any amount over $1. I honestly think this is the best deal among any of the big affiliate companies.

Linkshare is an affiliate *network* and they handle affiliate sales for a number of major companies. You have to be accepted by each affiliate individually but Linkshare handles the payments in most cases and you only have one site (Linkshare) to log in to and one interface to make your ads in. (Edit to clarify that Disney, iTunes, etc. linked below all go through Linkeshare.)

-- Disney -- though they're picky, they just accepted me and Firefox News has been around two years in a pro format.

-- iTunes -- 5% per download, which isn't much, but iTunes is an "impulse" buy for a lot of people. Spending $.99 for a song is a lot like buying a candy bar. It's instant gratification and pocket change. iTunes has, besides the obvious, movies, audio books, and TV episodes. If you're blogging about a TV show or movie it might make more sense to link to iTunes than Amazon.

-- Netflix -- $9 per person you manage to convince to sign up last I checked.

-- Lego! *Grin*

-- KB Toys

-- Walmart

-- And a huge number of other name-brand companies. That's only a tiny sampling.

Next is Allposters. I will say I've never sold anything from Allposters. (I also haven't tried that hard.) However, the ads have very pretty pictures that are much larger than Amazon's little ads, with unobtrusive links to buy the posters. Lots of celebrity photos, movie posters, etc. You might make the occasional poster sale and they're pretty pics to put on your site in the interim that are royalty free. I'll probably be making more use of them in the future on my site ... Allposters.com. They pay 25%. Their prices have come down a bit, so sales may be more possible through them.

Buy.com also has an affiliate program similar to Amazon, but their prices on merchandise are sometimes better.

Commission Junction (cj.com) has a program similar to Linkshare, with bunches more "name brand" retailers.

Now, fo pay per click or pay per view ads, besides Adsense:

-- Yahoo has a similar program called Overture -- it has some stricter criteria to get in, but I did get an approval for my site. You can't run Overture and Adsense together, but some people claim Overture pays better. Some people say it's worse. I suspect it's content-dependent.

-- Adbrite.com -- lets you sell ads directly. i.e. an advertiser wants to buy a spot on your blog; you can sell an ad to just that advertiser on Adbrite, and control exactly where the ad appears. They also have a contextual network that sucks (and can't be used with Adsense) and inline links (that also suck). If you have an advertiser who wants to buy ad space on your site, however, they might be a better choice than Adsense, because you can better control the ads. (Or you can just sell the ads directly, but then you have to deal with things like, oh, collecting payment.) I'm not a big fan of Adbrite but they have their uses.

Kontera.com -- I like Kontera. It's a nice supplement to Adsense. They just do inline links (highlighted words) in your text. Payout varies depending on content but Firefox News has been averaging around a buck a day from them and I'm in a low-paying niche. Payout is at $100 like Adsense but if you've got a busy blog it might be worthwhile. Kontera's customer service is fantastic.

Now ... if I could just find an affiliate that sells anime and manga other than Amazon.com ...

[flashgordon]

Great list, I only use Adsense and Amazon now. I'm very hesitant to add more as I don't want the sites to be spammy, and I have a pretty low tolerance for spam. If I do another, I might think of adding another affiliate.

What about TextLink and Clickbank?

[Talia]

another option is feedburner

They insert adverts in your feed and also on the first post of any blog. They pay every month even if the amount is only a few cents. You can approve or decline any adverts that aren't relevant. Today I declined a finance company because it doesn't fit with my audience

[Talia]

I just thought of another... blogherads
They pay on impressions, not clicks so they're a good source of revenue

[Leva]

Ooh, I got stickied. *grin*

Regarding Clickbank, I have no information. Never used them. They're probably a legitimate source of revenue as they have their own forum on Digital Point (which is where the people who make a living from web sites hang out -- ranging from the big shots to the lowlife scammers). But I can't speculate beyond that; no experience.

For Textlinks, if you mean Textlink Ads, my personal jury's still out.

The Issue with Text Link Ads (text-link-ads.com) -- TLA -- is that they're selling links, not advertising. And Google hates link selling. Seriously. They are waging open war on sites selling links.

Google's stance is they determine the credibility of web sites for search engine rankings by the number of other sites linking to them. Therefore, if a site buys a bunch of links they have artificial rank -- they're gaming the system. Google tries to weed these sites out, but it's a resource drain and expensive for Google. Therefore, Google is hitting the sites that sell links with a reduction in their page rank.*

The reason people want to buy links is that they want to increase the google rank of their own site. And they'll pay good money. Sometimes, real good money, if you have a high-PR site.

The downside is, you lose PR and search engine rank yourself by selling links. And once your PR goes down TLA would presumably pay less.

*Also, you might get less search traffic -- I say "might" because I'm hearing conflicting things on how much page rank corresponds to actual search rank in Google. PR is a measure of how much credibility you can "give" to other sites by linking to them. Search rank is how well you do in search engines. They are closely interrelated but not identical twins. Google may be penalizing PR without penalizing search rank.

Note that this is all about Google. If Yahoo, Live, Altavista, Ask, etc. are also penalizing sites that sell links I haven't heard it.

... Bottom line? Text links from TLA or another company can make you some good money. However, it could very well be a temporary windfall. You might lose search engine traffic. However, you might make enough money that losing the search engine traffic would be worthwhile. This is particularly true if most of your traffic comes from other sources than Google.

Out of pure morbid curiosity, I e-mailed TLA today to ask them to give me a rough estimate of what I thought I could make. We'll see what they say, if they'll even disclose that.

-- Leva

[Talia]

I asked for the post to be stickied! It answers a lot of questions that bloggers tend to ask

I haven't considered TLA but I do like BlogHerAds. They pay 30 days after the end of the month although it takes a few days for the echeck to clear. Did you see on Problogger someone saying they've made more money from TLA since the google PR reshuffle?

Feedburner insert advertisements in a banner at the bottom of your feed. Adsense is a new option for Feedburner and YouTube, in the past it was advertising from any company that wanted to pay. I've seen ads from finance companies, some new fangled Blackberry and the like

[Leva]

TLA hasn't returned my e-mail, but I suspect they're a bit, um, preoccupied right now. There's enough $ in linksales that I expect the lawyers will be summoned shortly and they're probably quite busy at the moment.

I'm not all that sympathetic with Google; their stance is a little unrealistic, IMHO. And my personal opinion is that the whole "links determine the worth of a web site" is getting to be an outdated method of determining search engine rank. It'll be interesting to see how this shakes out.

My suspicion? Eventually, something bigger and better than backlinks will come along to determine search engine rank. This might involve artificial intelligence of some sort, or a human factor. Google apparently is already using human beings to rank web sites to some extent.

*wanders off to Problogger*

[theloveofwriting]

I've tried TLA and I never made money from it.

[Leva]

TLA never did respond to my e-mail, either.

For what it's worth, I'm fairly impressed with iTunes through Linkshare. They pay 5% or better (they extended me a private offer after joining) and people are willing to download episodes. Currently, I'm donating 100% of affiliate sales revenue on Firefox News to support the writer's strike, so that's skewing the numbers, but there was ample evidence beforehand that it's a viable source of revenue.

iTunes has both music and TV shows*

So if you're blogging about a TV show or musician, you can link to their work on iTunes. If the reader's curious they can download an episode or a song -- it's instant gratification for the reader & only costs them a buck or two. Selling an entire season of a TV show through Amazon is hard. Convincing a reader to cough up $1.99 to check out the TV show you just gushed about? Not so hard.

The nickles and dimes you make can add up to lunch money pretty quickly if you have enough readers ... and Linkshare pays weekly, and has no minimum, so you actually see your money right away.

Amazon Unbox is another possibility. They're currently paying 20%. However, the user interface has some navigation issues (Apple is simply better at making things sleek and streamlined) and I think that cuts down on sales. Also, they don't have as many titles.

(*Yes, digital downloads are one of the hot-button issues in the writer's strike. The writers ARE getting compensated for iTunes downloads (at the same rate as DVDs), so I don't have a moral issue with downloading iTunes. Other than the oogy feeling of believing they're not getting paid enough, but then, that's pretty much the truth for all writers everywhere. What they're not getting paid for is FREE video downloaded from network web sites.)

[Ravenlocks]

Probably a stupid question, but I wasn't aware until today that it was possible to make money on your blog through Amazon, and I can't figure out what to click on Amazon's site to get to the info about how to do it. Can someone tell me how it works?

TIA

[RobCurtis]

I can't figure out what to click on Amazon's site to get to the info about how to do it. Can someone tell me how it works?

Try Amazon Associates (http://affiliate-program.amazon.com/gp/associates/join). The UK has a similar scheme.

[jawar]

Outside Adsense, affiliate programs and my ebooks (http://www.makemoneyselfpublishing.com) I also use video revenue sharing sites to make money online (http://www.moneyonline.blogspot.com).

What is working for me is a full organic integration of Adsense, affiliate, ebooks (http://www.gomusicconnection.com) and video to monetize my web presence (http://www.moneygoldmine.blogspot.com). In addition, I tend to maintain a number of websites, blogs and webpages that allow me to leverage cycles in traffic across various subjects. Below are a few of my videos, so you may see hot it works.

JaWar (http://www.gojawar.com/), Author of the Music Industry Connection Books talks about the new Music Business Record Label and using tools to make money online while creating multiple streams of revenue in the music industry. To view the Music Business Make Money Online Video (http://one.revver.com/watch/386223/flv/affiliate/112020) by JaWar Click Here (http://one.revver.com/watch/386223/flv/affiliate/112020).

http://frame.revver.com/frame/120x90/386223.jpg (http://revver.com/watch/386223/affiliate/112020/)

New Music Business Model by Video JaWar

JaWar (http://www.gojawar.com/), Author of the Music Industry Connection Books talks about the evolving New Music Business Model (http://one.revver.com/watch/385573/flv/affiliate/112020), music publishing and licensing and business to business opportunities for you to make money in music industry. To view the New Music Business Model Video by JaWar Click Here (http://one.revver.com/watch/385573/flv/affiliate/112020).

http://frame.revver.com/frame/120x90/385573.jpg (http://revver.com/video/385573/affiliate/112020/new-music-business-model-video-by-jawar/)


http://frame.revver.com/frame/120x90/586030.jpg (http://revver.com/video/586030/affiliate/112020/picking-up-pennies-video-by-jawar/)

[A Word With You]

I hope no one minds the newbie stickin' a nose into an old post but Yahoo's program is actually called Yahoo! Publisher. I've used both YP and AS; YP definitely has a higher pay per click. BUT they have fewer advertisers right now so their ads are going to be less targeted, especially if you have an extremely tight niche. Also, they have few ad formats available so you're going to have to make do without formats like AS's link units.

[Leva]

I hope no one minds the newbie stickin' a nose into an old post but Yahoo's program is actually called Yahoo! Publisher. I've used both YP and AS; YP definitely has a higher pay per click. BUT they have fewer advertisers right now so their ads are going to be less targeted, especially if you have an extremely tight niche. Also, they have few ad formats available so you're going to have to make do without formats like AS's link units.

People will refer to Yahoo's program as Overture, because that's what it used to be called.

Like a lot of things, your mileage may vary. I tried Yahoo a few years ago and the payout was significantly less for my niche. (Entertainment news.) I have some good reasons for staying with Adsense at the moment, and no practical way to experiment, so I have no recent experience with Yahoo.

One of the important things with advertising online, however, is to experiment. (If practical. In my case, I can't.) It's very possible someone with a specific niche might find Yahoo to be more profitable than Adsense. Just depends on the site.

-- Leva

[JacobWorld]

I have to say thank you for the list I will have a website and this will help me a lot
I reckon first I will go with google adsense and then I will c
I am not a big fun of a mezon and I wouldnt like to have too much advertizing on my site but as you know you have to compromize
Hopefully one day we would do without adverts of any kinds .

[razibahmed]

Darren Rowse at ProBlogger has spoken very highly about Shopzilla. You can read it here:
http://www.problogger.net/archives/2008/05/30/shopzilla-publishing-program-showing-very-promising-results/
Well, I applied there and got approved with one of my blogs but the tragedy is that Shopzilla pays only with Paypal to bloggers who are outside of USA. So, it is useless for me for the time being.

[nancy sv]

Does Adsense sense how much traffic you have and adjust ads accordingly? I seem to recall reading somewhere that the amount we get per click is based on how much the companies agree to pay - I'm wondering if there is something in there where companies would be willing to pay more if there is a lot of traffic? I don't know if this even makes sense, but it seems to me that I read something like this before.

If they don't work it like that, how do they figure out how much you get per click?

[Georganna Hancock]

No, it doesn't work that way. You can control the type of ads that appear, to a degree, both in how you set up your account and by using keywords in your content. AdSense is especially sensitive to the words in blog titles.

Your pay is determined by how many clicks an ad receives, and it takes thousands to add up to a very few cents. This is why we emphasize building traffic. Very few of the visitors click on the ads. AdSense is really a waste of real estate for websites with low traffic.

I think you're confusing the pay-per-click with the auction that advertisers participate in, bidding on keywords.

[nancy sv]

Would you explain the bidding on keywords stuff for me - I don't get that at all.

[veinglory]

You are paid for click on the ads, not on your site. General a few cents for each click.

[nancy sv]

But I've noticed the ads pay different amounts. Sometimes I'll only get one click a day and I'll get $.02. Other time I'll have one click and get $1.50. How does that all work? Do the companies say, "We'll pay X for each click"? Or what?

[razibahmed]

Adsense earning depends on a number of factors. Google will never give you the exact figures but it is thought that the earning per click depends on keywords. Keywords related to auto, finance, gadgets bring more money than many other topics.

[flashgordon]

Yes, when a person decides to do a pay-per-click campaign, they go to AdWords and designate how much they are willing to pay per click to bring someone to their site. These ads are then served via Adsense (on your site) and thus depending on what the ad publisher agreed to, you get that amount. If there is little competition for those keywords that the publisher (ad person) is targeting, they can designate only say .02 cents per click.

Google IS working on bringing in traffic numbers into their ad sales algorithm. Their goal is to give advertisers a better service by not only placing the ads close to relevant content, but also by rating the sites that ads are being served on. So, if you are not getting much traffic, they will give your site a lower rating which will impact how much publishers have to pay for a click from your site. This is officially not in place yet - but this is the direction Google is heading.

Either way, it all boils down to you having more traffic and good content. The nuances are changing, but the basics are still the same.

[eScotty]

Hi,
I've been considering starting a blog, but I'm not sure it's a good investment of my time. I don't want a blog in order to promote my "brand" or provide an outlet for my thoughts. My interest is purely financial: can it be a significant new revenue stream for me? Hope that doesn't sound crass, but I treat freelance writing as a biz. So I'm wondering if bloggers, except for a select few, make any serious money - say, $500 a month - from ad and affiliate revenue?

Cheers. ;)

[Ava Jarvis]

Go see Problogger (http://www.problogger.net/) and DoshDosh (http://www.doshdosh.com/) if you haven't already.

[June Casagrande]

Seems to me that even the people who do make money off their blogs are those who started them as a labor of love and that passion plus time made them successful.

If you could provide very rare, very high-interest content (say by planting an electronic listening device in the Oval Office or capturing and publishing photos of Simon Cowell being nice to someone or something), then there's a chance that you could one day get enough traffic to make money.

But short of that, I think blogging has approximately as much get-rich-quick potential as writing poetry.

(That's a long way of saying: Try the stock market instead. Oil futures, perhaps.)

[spacekadet]

What June said is spot on: my blog is definitely a labor of love. I'm making about $20/month on it now and it took a while to get there. But that doesn't even pay my internet bills! I'm sure I could do more to make it more profitable but don't have the time. Still, I keep it ticking along with new posts and all that. And I'd do it even if I weren't making a dime.

http://www.smarterfitter.com/blog/

[razibahmed]

There is a lot of “serious” money in Blogging but you have to give a lot of time and effort. No one will give you the money. You will have to get it. You will have write the contents, promote them and ensure that many people come to read them in your blog. The only problem is that you will hardly find any money for the first 5/6 months despite working extremely hard. I doubt that if you can get $500 from the first month of your blogging but you can surely can get much more than that after 1 year depending on the amount of time and effort you give.

[Ava Jarvis]

Yeah, a lot of time and effort is needed to make blogging really pay off. It took four years or so for Darren Rowse of Problogger to make enough money to support himself and his family via blogging; before that, in addition to his rapid-fire blogging, he also worked multiple part-time jobs at a time.

Which is why passion is necessary; Get Rich Quick as your only passion doesn't usually work, and anyways that slot is already taken by someone pretty big these days. (I forget his name. His blog is about other people reading his blog for money-making tips. It's very meta.)

Nevertheless, it is possible. It just takes a lot of time and patience and research and innovation and genius and creativity in phenomenal amounts and effort and sweat and blood and sacrifice.

[MovieBlogger]

Go see Problogger (http://www.problogger.net/) and DoshDosh (http://www.doshdosh.com/) if you haven't already.

I'd say not to, as I think those sites give an unrealistic look at blogging.

It seems the most popular blogs, as far as earning money, are from blogs about how to earn money from blogging.

You need to have a site that generates at least tens of thousands, if not hundreds, or a million, visits a day before you can plan on earning anything from a site. That would take a few months at the least to do.

While some do quite well, the majority are lucky to make $100 a year.

[flashgordon]

Exactly what MovieBlogger said. You can earn money, but the highest paying niches (which are already pretty saturated) are in the fields of marketing, business, mortgages, celebrities, and technology. If you are not going to write about those niches, then it will be hard to make a "lot" of money from blogging. You can, but it will take more time, more effort, and is more of a gamble. However, I'm making money from blogging and am enjoying it. It does take a lot of time and effort - especially promoting and driving traffic.

[eScotty]

Thank you all for the valuable feedback. Very helpful. :)

[Ava Jarvis]

I'd say not to, as I think those sites give an unrealistic look at blogging.

Not quite. Problogger is, I think, very realistic---in terms of the time scale. E.g., took him four years, and he's good at this stuff.

Plus Problogger ran a very revealing survey (http://www.problogger.net/archives/2007/11/30/how-much-money-do-bloggers-earn-blogging/).

For knowledge about marketing and professional blogging, the advice is there and that's the best place to get it. Whether it all works out or not is another thing.

Another thing Darren pointed out a little while back is that blogs are relatively small, even the "top" blogs, compared to actual full websites out there. As a result, making money blogging is more difficult.

[razibahmed]

I really cannot understand that why so many people think that blogging is a get rich quick or earn easy money type of thing. It is quite the opposite. On the other hand, I cannot figure out that why so many people think that there is no money in blogging.
The best part of blogging is that you can enter into this field without spending any money. My personal blogs are in Blogger/Blogspot and I do not have to spend any money for it. Instead, Google has given me all the things I need to publish and promote my contents and earn money. I cannot think of any other thing that I can earn money without investing a single dollar.

[veinglory]

I agree with June. Even those that make good money probably come down to minimum wage for the first few years of development. Technorati puts my blog in the top 2% and it makes 3c a day, go figure. Of course I didn't set it up to earn, just for fun. My advice for blogging for profit would be to choose a good topic (not just popular, but under-served by existing blogs), blog daily, starting using project wonderful, after about a month add pay per post and when you have traffic add google adsense. And try to develop good content-specific affiliates and direct advertisers along the way.

[MovieBlogger]

when you have traffic add google adsense.
I'd argue to add Google Adsense right when you start your site.

That way:

A: Everyone gets used to seeing the ads on your site. You don't want to have a blog get popular, then see adds show up while people say "Hey! You sellout!!"

and

B: Even if you have very few readers, you still get paid for people clicking on your links.

[brc23]

What the heck does Technorati actually do? I read all about it and I have not generated any traffic from them...that I know of. I just wonder if I am doing something wrong.

[Georganna Hancock]

But I've noticed the ads pay different amounts. Sometimes I'll only get one click a day and I'll get $.02. Other time I'll have one click and get $1.50. How does that all work? Do the companies say, "We'll pay X for each click"? Or what?

Simply designating an amount to pay for a keyword would not be cost-effective, I think. BIDDING in an AUCTION means being willing to pay top dollar (or cents) to get your ad shown at or near the top most of the time. That's the only way to get it seen.

When you, the blogger, receive $1.50 per click, it is because a higher-paying keyword is associated with that ad.

As I recall, part of the Google process for determining which ads are shown and in what order also involves the quality of the "landing page", that is, the page to which the ad links (NOT the page on which it is shown). Unless Google's changed that part, it is the advertising purchaser who determines ad placements to some degree.

It's much easier to participate in AdSense than in AdWords!

[veinglory]

The reason to start with project wonderful is that you will makes a few cents a day on a low traffic blog, but nothing with google adsense. You swap over when the blog is more popular because project wonderful doesn;t pay out much at the top level. the reason to not run both is that readers are put off blogs with too many ads, and they load slower.

Technorati is mainly a directory and blog search engine rather than a traffic generator.

[DTNg]

It took me two years to start earning good money through FWJ. It took three years for me to earn a profit - and that's after paying someone to write for me each month and a re-desgin.

[Talia]

Exactly what MovieBlogger said. You can earn money, but the highest paying niches (which are already pretty saturated) are in the fields of marketing, business, mortgages, celebrities, and technology. If you are not going to write about those niches, then it will be hard to make a "lot" of money from blogging. You can, but it will take more time, more effort, and is more of a gamble. However, I'm making money from blogging and am enjoying it. It does take a lot of time and effort - especially promoting and driving traffic.

I'd add politics and weight loss to those topics, but the gist of it is you need an audience to make money and building up readership takes time. Making money from your own blog can take years (as others have already said). Some companies will pay you to blog for them and have an established customer base but you usually need to work as an unpaid blogger first to prove that you understand the blogging system e.g. blogger, typepad, wordpress

[razibahmed]

I am perhaps lucky that I got accepted in a blog network very early and it brought me some decent amount of money in the first months of my blogging life.

[james45]

Can anyone tell me where I can get complete free stuff about it, from start till end?

Pls don't refer books available.

[veinglory]

It is all online but the exact strategy (and so information sources) depend on what kind of material you have or what kind of market you are trying to tap.

[NJFoster]

I subscribe to the RSS feed of ProBlogger and Darren made an interesting post on when to introduce advertising to your blog over here (http://www.problogger.net/archives/2008/06/23/when-should-i-put-advertising-on-my-blog/)

So it got me thinking... do you guys try making money from your site? Whether it be through adsense, adverts, affiliate marketing or text links there are now dozens of ways to make money from your blog.

Now I don't mean are you able to make a living out of it? Indeed on my sites I have adsense and text ads up (http://recruitmentstartup.blogspot.com), not because I am looking to be a full time blogger (indeed I am blogging about my setting up a business) but because I hope that it will earn me enough to buy a domain name and hosting... I just like the idea of it being completely self funded.

Obviously, as with any aspect of blogging, making money takes time (I have earnt a HUGE £5 in my first 3 weeks) so I am not disheartened

But I was intrigued as to other people. Is it ALL about the love of the writing, the love of the message? Or are you interested in making your tea money from it as well, if only to give you a small sense of reward, much as comments and webstats can do?

[razibahmed]

I am here for money as earning from blogging has been the only source of income for the last 2 years. In my country, we still do not have Paypal or any form of online transaction. So, Google Adsense is the best blessing for me.

[silktwisteddagger]

How do you physically put adsense on a wordpress? I've tried doing it, but my blog doesn't seem to like the code. A lot of tutorials talk about plugins, but when i go to the wordpress site, it says plugins aren't allowed.

[L M Ashton]

As far as I know, those plugins are only for WordPress blogs that are self-hosted, not hosted on WordPress.com.

[Ava Jarvis]

Blogging is passion first, money second (or maybe even not in the running). It's a tiring business, and if you wouldn't be there even without the money, you're doomed.

Especially the frequency of blogging needed to actually churn out the good content regularly enough so that people will visit/pay you.

I don't try to make money on any of my sites---apart from donations. "Buy me a coffee" kind of stuff, which I only put up after 6 months worth of content on my sites. I did get my first donation on my main blog yesterday---which is a very cool feeling. And it indeed could get me a cup of coffee in Seattle, WA.

[veinglory]

I started experimenting with advertising this month. It will be interesting to see how much I can make without detriment to the main purpose of the blogs (which is to inform, or sell my own stuff).

[MovieBlogger]

I don't try to make money on any of my sites---apart from donations. "Buy me a coffee" kind of stuff, which I only put up after 6 months worth of content on my sites. I did get my first donation on my main blog yesterday---which is a very cool feeling. And it indeed could get me a cup of coffee in Seattle, WA.

For me (and I know this has been debated on this forum before) I absolutely HATE those "Buy me a coffee" buttons. They are as annoying as embedded music. I think it cheapens the site, and in some ways, looks like a form of begging. People may be uncomfortable to read the site seeing it, and not become a regular reader.

Meanwhile Google Ads are easy to set up, are everywhere (even on this site) so aren't too obtrusive, and if you have enough traffic, or are patient enough, they do pay out.

One thing that I don't know if Darren mentioned it, but it is always good to start up advertising early. That way people don't get a shock when all of a sudden, ads start to appear. They don't want to them accuse you of selling out. If you sell out right when you begin, you can't be accused of that.

[razibahmed]

I am not against the Donation button. I cannot set up one because I do not have access to Paypal or any kind of online transaction. I don’t think that it is begging. A beggar does not give anything to anyone. A blogger is giving service to the readers for free of charge. Often, you are looking for some information and then you get it from a blog. Unless you have daily at least 1,000 page views, it is very difficult to earn enough money even to buy a coffee daily.

[Angela_785]

Interesting conversation. I've never considered the possibility of making money from my blog though a donation button. I'm not into the ad thing, because it clutters a blog, IMO and just isn't for me I don't think.

[Manderley]

No, I don't make money from the blog and I don't intend to either. I'm not in it for the money, I'm in it for the karma.

[Ava Jarvis]

For me (and I know this has been debated on this forum before) I absolutely HATE those "Buy me a coffee" buttons. They are as annoying as embedded music. I think it cheapens the site, and in some ways, looks like a form of begging. People may be uncomfortable to read the site seeing it, and not become a regular reader.

... geez frickin' louise. People asked for a donation button.

I do provide a service, and if people don't like my site, they don't have to do anything about it. My readership hasn't gone down since I added the thing, and it's at the very bottom of my sidebar. If you think I'm begging and not giving anything in return, go and look at my site and hit the blogging for writers category.

Thanks for being a jerk.

Edit: Sorry for the ad-hominem attack. It wasn't warranted, and your opinion is fine. I didn't like the way you stated it, but I had no business (a) responding the way I did or (b) calling you a jerk.


Meanwhile Google Ads are easy to set up, are everywhere (even on this site) so aren't too obtrusive, and if you have enough traffic, or are patient enough, they do pay out.

Whatever works.

I don't go out and blast people about ads, even though I don't prefer them for my site.

Again, thanks.

Edit: And this bit of snark was really stupid on my part.

Apologies. And I do mean that. I don't like to offend folks. Unfortunately sometimes I am just the stupid.

[veinglory]

Movieblogger did say "for me". Seems like we all get to have an opinion. I despise music on the blog but saying so isn't an attack against those who decide to use it. Any choice will gain you some benefits and loose others.

I advertise on several of my blogs but not on others. I have yet to try a donation button, it does seem like begging to me.

[Ava Jarvis]

Movieblogger did say "for me". Seems like we all get to have an opinion. I despise music on the blog but saying so isn't an attack against those who decide to use it. Any choice will gain you some benefits and loose others.

I understand that's his opinion, I support people having opinions different from mine, and I know you win some, lose some.

I think he (and you) state your opinion in an offensive way, just as if I'd said "I think ads cheapen a site and take advantage of readers". I've learned that this is ultimately a way to offend people and that's not the point.

Edit: I'm still being snarky and dumb here. Opinions can be stated however they can be stated and if one takes offense it is one's own problem. Namely, mine.

And if this was a thread arguing the merits of one way of making money over another (as opposed to "do you do it?") I would never have mentioned the donation button at all, because I know that such a thing is fraught with debate. I suppose I shall never mention it again.

Edit: Snark again. Stupid of me, really.

That said, I over-reacted, and made an ad-hominem attack, which basically makes me the stupid person in the room and invalidates my opinion.

I advertise on several of my blogs but not on others. I have yet to try a donation button, it does seem like begging to me.

Try one sometime is all I can say to that.

I suppose people can block ads but not donation buttons, and therein lies their offensiveness. However, I put mine way at the bottom of the sidebar.

Maybe if someone made a Greasemonkey script to detect sites with donate buttons and block them is a good idea.

Edit: I'm going to go sit out now. Today I'm just too stupid for the forum.

[veinglory]

I think my feeling about them comes from how I first discovered donation buttons exist. for some time I had been reading a blog. The button came up with a post about how the blog took so much time and if we wanted it to continued we needed to pony up. I was a bit affronted as it took the interaction from 'fellow fan' to 'I'm doing you a favor here bub'. First impressions can be funny like that. I've never liked them much since. As a reader-suggested initiative the tone would be different.

[MovieBlogger]

No offense taken, Ava.

It is a matter of taste I guess, and sorry if it sounded like I was stating it otherwise. If you are making money from yours, great. I'm glad it is working.

It is just, I remember I used to read this one site. It was an okay site. I enjoyed it. But it got to the point the writer was putting a message in EVERY POST saying "Do you like this post? Buy me a cup of coffee!" It may have seen cute to them, but to a reader, to see that on every post, you get the feeling that they EXPECT you to pay. Since you don't, you are made to feel guilty.

What made it even worse was that it was one of those "How to make money blogging" sites where, you would think this person is successful and doesn't need to continually ask for money. They probably have more money than the readers do.

Oh and BTW, Ava, I checked out your blog and I like the way you have your donation button. No complaints from me about that.

[Ava Jarvis]

I agree that a donation button that shows up everywhere is pretty bad. One really should have ads if one is concerned about "coverage" (or whatever that person was concerned with).

To me, the whole point of a donation button is that it stays out of the way. Thus I made mine as unobtrusive as possible, where it's found only by people who do want to scroll through the content. (Also made it pretty to fit the blog theme, and not a glaring orange-yellow paypal button.)

I've found that if people really want to donate, they will look *all over* for the button or link so you don't have to worry much about placing it. :) Even if you put it in the footer they will find it. (It might even be easier for them to find it there.)

Who knew? I just kept getting emails to that effect. So I just put up the button at last :)

[L M Ashton]

So I'm merging threads about making money in blogging and then stickying the whole mess. I figure it'll be easier than having a new thread on making money in blogging show up every week or two. :D

Please PM me with any other threads on the same topic that need to be merged here so we have a general compendium to be used as a resource for future posters. And of course, keep posting in here with more questions and comments about making money in blogging. :)

[Laurie PK]

Does anyone have experience with WidgetBucks?

[Leva]

Laurie, I don't have any experience with widgetbucks, but I know they're very controversial and have been in a fairly bad odor on digitalpoint. There's a lot of people who think they're a scam, and a lot more who claim they're legitimate.

Because they're not the only advertiser out there, I've elected to use others and wait to see if they're still around -- and have a good reputation -- in a year or two.

[razibahmed]

In this thread, we have talked about Donation buttons. Well, I have posted an entry in my blog about donation: http://techblogbiz.blogspot.com/2008/07/donate-something-for-this-blog-without.html
“Donate Something for this blog Without Spending any Money”

Yes, I don’t seek any money from the visitors but I requested them to help me in some other ways. I have mentioned 7 ways that the readers can support me without spending a single cent.

[silktwisteddagger]

For the UK users - trade doubler (http://www.tradedoubler.com) looks like it's our best equivalent for linkshare, and rpoints (http://www.rpoints.com/?ruid=85135) is pretty good too. I get about £30 a month in total from these - admittedly some of this is through buying cds etc myself!

[Leva]

I just thought I'd add another possibility here -- Tribalfusion.com is doing well for me. They have a minimum traffic requirement of 2,000 pv/day which is a moderately sized blog but they pay better than Adsense. And they're reputable; they've been around for awhile.

I'm having issues with Kontera -- Adsense reports 3,000-4,000 pv a day on content on my site on an average day and Kontera reports less than 2,000. I suspect they might be short on ad inventory. And the cost per click is also way down. Once i get my next $100 check from them I'm dropping them.

-- Leva

[razibahmed]

Leva, thanks for mentioning Tribalfusion. Do they pay regularly? How do they pay- Paypal or cheque? How long does it take to get payment?

[MelancholyMan]

Making money blogging? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha.

[Ali B]

For me (and I know this has been debated on this forum before) I absolutely HATE those "Buy me a coffee" buttons. They are as annoying as embedded music. I think it cheapens the site, and in some ways, looks like a form of begging. People may be uncomfortable to read the site seeing it, and not become a regular reader.



I kind-of agree. The first time I saw one of those I went, "Woooooow, that's a little off-putting." IDK, just something I would never do personally, I guess.

[Nick Russell]

I have had a blog on my RV website www.gypsyjournal.net for about 18 months now, and recently started a blog on my publishing website. I have Google ads on my three sites, not just the blogs, and my Google checks average about $550 a month. My best month was about $670. I spend about 30 minutes to an hour a day writing and posting to the blog. So it's a good part time job if nothing else.

[L M Ashton]

Nick, that's a pretty impressive amount of Google Adsense earnings. Thanks for sharing - it's nice to know what can happen. :) Do you mind sharing how many hits a month you get for that kind of earnings?

And welcome to AW. :)

[Nick Russell]

Laurie,
Last month was a slow month in terms of commissions. I only made about $450. Since my main website is the RV site, hits drop in the summer when people are out traveling and camping, and go up in the winter when they are at home more. In July we had 45,650 page impressions on the three websites combined, and 1,503 clicks on ad links. That comes to about 29 cents a click.

Today, as of 9:30 p.m. local time, we have had 1,229 page impressions, 85 clicks, and our commission so far is $31.88.

It is interesting that the clicks on the RV site pay the least commission, on average. Many are just two or three cents. Most are about 25 to 30 cents. Clicks on the motorcycle website average about 55 to 65 cents each. However, clicks on the self-publishing website average around $1 each.

If I give a seminar at an RV rally, ad clicks (and commissions) go way up for a week or two. Likewise if I do a self-publishing seminar or workshop. Last winter I put on a day-long self-publishing workshop, and commissions for the next day alone were almost $200. I’d love to have more days like that!

Again, I spend no more than an hour a day at this. I’m convinced that if I invested more time, the income would grow.

[L M Ashton]

Nick, thanks for sharing. It's great information - gives the rest of us an idea of what's possible, what's reasonable, and so on. Thanks!

It's also making me rethink a few things... :)

[razibahmed]

Nick,
Thanks a lot for sharing all the information. However, I am afraid that you are not supposed to share this kind of specific information in public. This may cause you get banned from Google Adsense.
You can find more information here:
http://www.quickonlinetips.com/archives/2005/05/15-common-mistakes-by-google-adsense-publishers/
“5. Do not disclose confidential information about your account like the CTR, CPM and income derived via individual ad units or any other confidential information they may reveal to you. However, you may reveal the total money you make as per recent updates to the TOS.”
I am not sure about it. I just thought that you may look into Adsense TOS again.

[veinglory]

ToS tend to say all sorts of things but I have trouble seeing how one's own earnings would be effectively gagged.

[Nick Russell]

Thanks for your input Razi. I appreciate your concern.

I published similar information on my websites, and mention it in my self-publishing seminars. Before doing so, I ran it past Google to be sure I was within their parameters. Since I did not mention specific clicks or ads, they seemed to feel it was okay. I always try to speak or write in generalities:

"I only made about $450"

"In July we had 45,650 page impressions on the three websites combined, and 1,503 clicks on ad links. That comes to about 29 cents a click."

"Many are just two or three cents. Most are about 25 to 30 cents. Clicks on the motorcycle website average about 55 to 65 cents each. However, clicks on the self-publishing website average around $1 each."

"...commissions for the next day alone were almost $200."

So far it has kept me out of trouble.

[Ali B]

Great stuff, Nick! It's also great to know that Google will let you tell how much money you make. I've had many discussions with other writers on how they feel about this and most are terrified of Google penalizing them.

[Leva]

You can release the total ad income of your site. What you can't release is your eCPM for Adsense. Per their TOS. And something I verified with a Google rep.

By the way, if you're making three-digit $$$ a month at Google you really need to have CPM ads on the site too. You might try Tribalfusion. If they accept you, I think you'd be happy with the income from them. If not Tribalfusion, Fastclick or Casalemedia, but TF has a better reputation and by my observation, classier ads.

-- Leva

[Nick Russell]

Thanks for the tip on Tribalfusion, Leva. I'll check it out.

[Leva]

And one more tip -- this obviously is a short-term one-rat study.

I put a 300X250 square on my main page from TF last night. After exposure to a few thousand pvs, the CPM on it is significantly higher than the towers and banners. I'd say it's a keeper. It's beating Adsense in the same slot.

Dunno if it'll continue to be a good $ maker but I thought I'd mention it.

(One thing you learn is to keep experimenting with ad formats, and different ad providers.)

[Nick Russell]

I have been experimenting with the Amazon Associates program the last three week, and so far it has been a bust.

From the very first day, I made a little bit of money with AdSense. Not a fortune, but it has been growing steadily. With Amazon, after three weeks, the total commission has been 70 cents. I just posted a blog about my impressions so far, for those who might be interested http://publishing4profit.com/myblogs/

I'll give it a while longer, but I don't think I'll be staying wth Amazon Associates.

[Leva]

Amazon's been a bust for me, too.

Did you try Tribalfusion?

If they accept your sites, you may find they pay better than Adsense. TF is very selective about the sites they accept, but it's worth applying. Their CPM is REALLY good.

I have been experimenting with the Amazon Associates program the last three week, and so far it has been a bust.

From the very first day, I made a little bit of money with AdSense. Not a fortune, but it has been growing steadily. With Amazon, after three weeks, the total commission has been 70 cents. I just posted a blog about my impressions so far, for those who might be interested http://publishing4profit.com/myblogs/

I'll give it a while longer, but I don't think I'll be staying wth Amazon Associates.

[Nick Russell]

In addition to advertising revenue, don’t forget the power of your blog as a marketing tool. We hold two RV rallies a year for our subscribers, and as soon as I announce the dates in my RV blog, http://gypsyjournal.net/NicksBlog.htm registrations start rolling in.

Last week we announced that we now have T-shirts made up for our rallies and for the Gypsy Journal itself. So far we have sold over 65 shirts, at $15 each.

I have decided that I want an Amazon Kindle e-book reader, which sells for close to $400 with shipping. So two days ago I announced a special on one of my e-books. Actually, it was not a special, the e-books sells for $24.95, like always, but if they order it for e-mail delivery, I am throwing in seven Special Reports, which sell for $2.50 each, or all seven for $10. Since the blog went up yesterday (Tuesday) morning, I have received six orders, totaling $149.70. Not enough for my Kindle yet, but I’ll get there.

So do not overlook the power of blogging to sell your books, products and services.

[Nick Russell]

Just an update on my previous post about selling an e-book on my blog this week. As of now I have sold 14 e-books since Tuesday morning. Two more to go to reach my goal.

[Nick Russell]

Okay, one more update. As of 3 p.m. this afternoon I had sold 19 of the e-books. The Kindle is ordered and will arrive Monday, and I have a new appreciation for my blogs as marketing tools.

[kristin724]

I'm trying out today.com. Blogger News Network and Helium sure I made money there- a whopping 15 cents per post! We'll see how this one goes for a little extra pocket money in my paypal account. As to my adsense-let's just say I haven't earned enough for the big check yet.

For the life of me I can't find where I read Today's policy on posting. I can't find it anywhere and I thought I saw it here, too. I know its for hire and they keep what you post, but my previews reviews that were on my blog, can post them at today as well?

[Ali B]

I'm trying out today.com. Blogger News Network and Helium sure I made money there- a whopping 15 cents per post! We'll see how this one goes for a little extra pocket money in my paypal account. As to my adsense-let's just say I haven't earned enough for the big check yet.

For the life of me I can't find where I read Today's policy on posting. I can't find it anywhere and I thought I saw it here, too. I know its for hire and they keep what you post, but my previews reviews that were on my blog, can post them at today as well?

Here is Q and A: http://www.today.com/vip/member.cgi?faq=1&idx_child

I think it may be in there.

[Leva]

Either Helium's/Blogger News's per-article hit rate is really low or they're really ripping off writers. $.15 per article? Ouchie.

By the way, for those of you with blogs that have decent traffic but a low CTR, with good content, I can't say enough about Tribalfusion. I got my first check from them Saturday. Their customer service is awesome.

Has anyone here ever tried Chitika? They keep contacting me trying to get me to sign up with them. I've heard good and bad about them.

[mbroadway]

Man, I'm listening to all this and realizing how little I know. I wish someone would visit my blogs (I have two now) I started the Corvette on nine days ago and the Fifties one two days ago. I've just been placing the Adsense ads on it.

I'm definitely going to check out that cj.com, kontera.com, tribalfusion, and Yahoo Overture that you mention in an earlier post, unless there are better ones you've listed later.

And, just wondering, do I get paid when people click on the video links from Adsense? Some of the things they're putting on there are old Lucy episodes (which is great for me) as long as I'm earning money.

Any info you could share would be valuable, and any overview or comments on my two blogs would be a great help, I'm sure.

Thanks ever so.

Michael

[mbroadway]

You couldn't guess the web address?

Dummy me. Forgot to include it.

Here it is:

http://americandreamcar.blogspot.com

http://fiftiesnostalgia.blogspot.com

[L M Ashton]

Michael, if you want a review of your blogs, post in the AW Blog Reviews section. Is that what you meant by wishing someone would visit your blogs?

[mbroadway]

Yes. That's what I meant. I'm new to this and I'm not sure what I'm doing yet.

[L M Ashton]

Okay. Then post your blog review request in the AW Blog Reviews subforum. :)

[MargoWest]

I'm considering using Adsense, but to be honest not sure it's even worth it because I don't have enough traffic at the moment - that being said, I just started recently after much dithering and debating.

[BillTrain]

Has anyone had much experience with Kontera? It looks like a good addition to Adsense. Do you just have to add in some code to get it up and running?
Thanks,
BT

[starbirdy66]

Has anyone had problems with AdBrite. I've been researching them on the net and I see a lot of hits referring to click fraud and there is even one rip off report on them.

Bill, I know a lot of reputable sites that use Kontera successfully. Also Vibrant is another good site to look into. I was impressed with some of their features when we tested them for Today.com.

[mljoshua]

Ooh, I got stickied. *grin*

Regarding Clickbank, I have no information. Never used them. They're probably a legitimate source of revenue as they have their own forum on Digital Point (which is where the people who make a living from web sites hang out -- ranging from the big shots to the lowlife scammers). But I can't speculate beyond that; no experience.



-- Leva
Don't know if anyone else has responded here, but Clickbank is a good site for referrals, I've used them on a couple of drop-ship websites I have and have never had a problem getting paid. (But they do hold back a small percentage for returns.)

[The Don]

I am attempting to draw traffic to my blog which may even result in some traffic to some of my other on-line writings. My question is, does putting in a lot of time into sites such as blogcatalog or Digg pay off,? I enjoy these sites either way, just curious if they are really any good for marketing.
Thanks for any response!

[razibahmed]

The Don,
I have vitied your blog Sustainable Planet. You just wrote 11 entries in 2009. So, instead of giving any time, you should try for putting more content.

[The Don]

The Don,
I have vitied your blog Sustainable Planet. You just wrote 11 entries in 2009. So, instead of giving any time, you should try for putting more content.

I know this, about to finish my grad degree, so time will not be at such a premium. Just attempting to get a little feedback before I determine exactly what route to take.

Thanks

[passiontowrite]

Thanks for providing an extensive list of paying websites.

[jackbency]

These all sites are very useful for making money in blogging but I would like to say also that Affiliate programs enable your blog to serve as a conduit between readers and online sites offering various goods and services. The Internet is profoundly indifferent to your desire to make money with it.

[Medievalist]

1. Affiliate links are not allowed on most content networks--they want the ad income.
2. Affiliate links are pretty pointless unless you've got a fair amount of traffic.

[veinglory]

I would agree, unless you have the right topic or thousands of uniques a day, affiliate earnings will make adsense earnings look good : /

[Eddiewilson]

Hi Everyone,

Thanks You give a great information about Blog and how we make money using Blog..

Thanks
Eddie wilson

[VBurd2128]

The biggest thing I realized is you need to think of what programs make sense for what you blog about, and utilize only those that make sense given your topic/format. If you are running a lot of different things on your site and you don't/hardly make anything off a few of them, you should really consider removing the unpopular ones (even if you don't think they're getting in the way).

[DeniseTaylor]

I've used Chitika and Infolinks, as well. Just don't go overboard and load up your pages with this stuff. Search engines don't like it, and visitors don't particularly like it either.

Also, something that may help: One should attempt to align content with affiliate products. The more targeted the visitor, the more profitable the visit. :-)

If you put irrelevant, generic ads on your site, the click through rate diminishes greatly. But if you offer products related to your content, and weave recommendations for those products into your copy, conversions will increase.

Placing ads in the same place over and over causes ad blindness and visitors won't convert. So you must experiment with ad placement to discover optimum performance.

Oh! And don't forget to put "nofollow" tags on affiliate links for good measure!

[thekingsguard]

I've been looking to monetize my blog. Currently I use AdSense, but am looking for better payouts.