"To write you must live"

[scheherazade]

I'm a shy person and quite the homebody. When I was younger I encouraged these traits because I figured that writers should be awkward and need to be able to spend a lot of time alone, reading or writing. But lately I'm realizing that if you don't live a life, you don't have a lot to write about. Sure, you can always make up alternate universes or write about what you read about, but even the most alien universe is enjoyable to read because we notice things that ring true to our own lives.

Do you have good access to material to write about through your life (family, work, friends, hobbies)? If not, do you make any strategic efforts to dive into the world around you for the sake of your writing? I'm inspired by Julia Cameron's notion (in The Artist's Way) of going on "writer dates" - going somewhere or doing something you've never done before just to inspire your writing or gain new material. Have you done anything purely to find material to write about?

[CaroGirl]

Do you have good access to material to write about through your life (family, work, friends, hobbies)?
I take the bus to work.

[Chameleon]

err..I thought fiction was about making stuff up? Make belief. Tell tall tales. Isn't that why people read fiction? to escape reality?

For example, if my setting is in San Diego, and I have never lived there...I can take a trip, right? Do a little research, then use it as material. That's how I look at writing fiction.

Personally, the stuff I've written (very preliminary) I havent needed to do that much research.

[Quossum]

I might not make trips specifically to experience things to write about, but pretty much everything that I do and experience appears in my writing in some way, shape, or form.

That said, if I had the means and time to take jaunts that would increase my store of ideas, shoot yeah I'd do it.

--Q

[Clarec]

I don't know any vampires, werewolves or demonic dwarves, so I have to rely on my imagination. But it's a fertile place, so I do ok. Other research I do on the t'internet.

Clare

[lawtowriting]

It certainly helps give you something to write about if you live an interesting life. However, the danger is falling into the "I need to experience life before I can write anything great" school of thought, which usually ends up meaning you never get around to actually writing anything.

[FntsyScribe]

I think it is great to experience things in life, but I certainly wouldn't rely on those experiences to write.

Do research, travel when you can, and most importantly, use your imagination!

[rainboy]

Sounds more like an excuse for why you're not living (no pun) up to your own expectations as a writer.

If you're the introspective / reclusive type, the last thing you need to do is fool yourself into thinking you need to "get a life" in order to write well.

People who are busy living life complain that they're not getting any writing done because life always gets in the way. Some friend calls. Kids need attention. Do this. Do that.

See the problem? You might just end up in a never-ending loop of excuse-making.

Some of the greatest authors in history lived in isolation, but was still able to captivate the rest of world with their imagination.

And you can get plenty of "life moments" from watching movies, TV and reading other books. Only difference is these moments are usually packed with conflict, the kind of stuff you need as a writer. Let's face it. Most real life moments are pretty dull by comparison (unless you're one of those constant thrill-seekers) -- that's why people use movies and books in the first place; to escape the mundane chores of everyday life.

This might sound harsh, but maybe you're just not the writerly type?

[CaroGirl]

For characterization, I think the best thing you can do is observe real people. You can observe while you're interacting with them personally, or you can observe strangers at a distance (provided you do so discreetly, otherwise you can get arrested, not that I'd know anything about that...). It's hard to imagine a character's personality if you haven't observed or met a lot of different people, IMO.

But never let that get in the way of writing. Write the best you can and if you feel you need to experience something to make a scene richer, go out and experience it. If you're writing a scene in a park, go to a park and hang out for a while. That's all it takes. Everything else can be taken care of with imagination.

[Bluestone]

I've lived a lot, but there are many experiences that will never make it into my books. And one of my favourite authors has been such a prolific writer I don't know how she has time to live at all! And yet her books are, to me, lyrical.

There's always the "write what you know", sure, but that could mean the way your family interracts with one another, how the seasons change outside your window or what made your town different from the next town over.

I think your stories can be sparked by a newspaper article, or observing someone and imagining what their life must be like. Have you ever sat in a coffee shop and watched the couple at another table and wondered if they were newly dating, in an old relationship, brother and sister, what those mannerisms meant or why did he look away when she put her hand on his arm and said something? I don't know your genre, but I think lots of great stories can be made from the whole cloth of what you read, think about and observe.

I've never gone out specifically to have an experience to write about and I think that could end up being artificial and not what you were expecting at all. I'm a parent and I know the absolute worst vacations I've ever spent are the ones I planned to have maximum fun for the kids and nothing turned out the way I thought it would! On the other hand, if you want snorkeling to be an integral part of the MC's life in your book, it might make it more authentic to find somewhere to snorkel for insight into what he/she would see and experience.

Once you have the genesis of your novel or the framework, you can start to think about where you need to go to find out more, or how much you can get done on the internet - which is a heck of a lot.

Good luck with your writing!

[Bluestone]

I think CaroGirl and I were having a universal consciousness moment -we seemed to have been writing and posting the same thing at the same time!

And one more thought: let's say you were writing murder mysteries. It doesn't mean you have to go out and murder someone - god, let's hope not - to write about it. You've seen TV, movies, read stories and can call on your imagination to get into that murder mode. It's the same thing with other genres or ideas for books.

[Shweta]

However, experience does add the sorts of telling detail and sense of feel that don't come across as original if you're getting them from secondary sources.

So do go out and live some too.
And don't just rely on one source of information. Don't just read fiction in one genre, or one type of nonfiction. Apart from nonfiction books there are journals, articles, photographs, art, letters, newspapers...

[jennifer75]

I take the bus to work.

This would make for an epic novel, I'm sure.

[Clair Dickson]

I'm a hermit and happily so. I've traveled a bit, but it means nothing to my writing since I set my stories right where I live.

I don't think you have to "live" to write. Part of it depends on what you're writing. And sometimes, I think it can work out if someone else lives for you.

Consider some sort of job or volunteer work that gets you close to people. Talk with them, but most importantly listen.

As an alternative high school teacher, I have quite a few students who have/had experience with drugs, violence, and jail time. I learned a lot just listening to them trade tales. Which is good, because I'm so square, I've never even gotten a speeding ticket. My readers don't seem to notice any absence of verisimilitude in my crime fiction writing.

[Nateskate]

Some of the worst experiences of my life have given me material for the story and characters. Much also comes from observation of other people and their situations.

[scheherazade]

Hmm, true. But there are so many great writers out there (mostly men, now that I think of it) who have lived in different countries or gone on adventures and written great books as a result. Or women who have stayed home as mothers and written beautiful tales of motherhood, or stories of juggling motherhood with a full-time job, or whatever. I don't feel like I have any relatable social element to my life that I can put into my books. So I end up writing about people in situations much different than my own - which then introduces the whole problem of having to research it to make it realistic.

I'm not just talking about being adventurous. I'm also talking about just being around people, meeting different personalities so that you have more characters to pull from. I'm quite empathetic, I know how to approach a character from a perspective other than my own, but if I lack the language - of a child or a teen or a drug addict or a ER doctor or a professional snowboarder - I'm not going to write a very realistic character.

No matter what realm you're writing in, even if realism is completely unimportant, you still need to write something that resonates with people in some way. That's why a major introvert like HP Lovecraft can write beautifully imaginative alternate worlds but hit you over the head with wooden dialogue. Life is still important to writing. You don't always need to report on real life, but you do need to write some layer that rings true to a reader. Usually that layer is the one concerned with relationships - love, life, death, family. If you don't have much of that in real life, how can you write about it?

[scheherazade]

I take the bus to work.

That's a good one. I've found characters on the subway, for sure. It's like central casting.

[Akuma]

I find a fun thing to do for writing material or just experiencing life is to just follow any impulses that come to you (as long as they aren't too reckless).

I spent one afternoon watching this drunk chick screaming and singing all over campus. Eventually she was confronted by the police and I was there for all of it, takin' notes.

Do I regret not actually talking to her? Hell no, she was crazy.



And one more thought: let's say you were writing murder mysteries. It doesn't mean you have to go out and murder someone - god, let's hope not - to write about it.

Oh crap--ah, that is, I think I left my. . .sink running. Gotta go.

[dayne-jen]

I'm inspired by Julia Cameron's notion (in The Artist's Way) of going on "writer dates" - going somewhere or doing something you've never done before just to inspire your writing or gain new material.

A writer's adventure day sounds like a great idea, though the danger to be aware of here is of forcing something to happen. Steinbeck's Travels with Charlie comes to mind. That book just didn't have the heart (feel, soul, etc.) that his other writing did, all because he seemed to be forcing himself to having an adventure he could write about.

Have you done anything purely to find material to write about?

Yeah, but I called it research, whether I knew what I was researching or not. :D

[dayne-jen]

It doesn't mean you have to go out and murder someone - god, let's hope not - to write about it.

Isn't that how they caught the Menendez Brothers (in LA, quite a few years ago)--one of them wrote a screenplay that was a little too detailed...?

[Danger Jane]

I bet a lot of those writers didn't intend to use their adventures as source material for their writing. Also, there are plenty of great writers who didn't exactly "go out and see the world", but who learned a lot from their own environment. See Jane Austen or Virginia Woolf.

When writing a real-world place, it's best to get as much first-hand experience there as possible. But every story (almost) has people in it, and they tend to be what readers identify with. Which is why it's good to observe--or interact with--other people as much as you can. Lucky for me, my favorite thing to do is talk to people :tongue

[Hollan]

I'm not sure if my writing improved or not, but I feel traveling and 'living life' changed my perspective on life which is noticeable in my writing. Plus, I've been to some really cool places, done some cool things and met lots of different people. Get out there and see the world if you have the chance. Not just for your writing but for your own sake as well ^_^

[Use Her Name]

Even if you look at it this way: Character drama is about existential experience-- trauma, and change; basically things that happen that the character cannot control. If you look at fiction, you will see it is never about simple things. It is about great opposite forces which totally interrupt the character's comfortable apathy. Have you ever been in a situation that you cannot control? If not, please put yourself in one. I suggest going to a foreign country to teach English. There are many places where you can do this. You may even be able to get a job as a carny or a rodeo clown. They're good for experience.

[Straka]

Interesting spread of opinions here. I write the best from personal experience. But I also write SF/F and SF... with that said have I seen vampires? or other such monsters? No but I know what it is to be afraid so I can incorporate that in my work.

In terms of character interactions or strange habits I look at the people around me. I'm naturally curious and observant of other people and myself. Many characters in my works are parts of me I injected into a character and magnified.

I have done things to figure out just want it is like but also because it interests me; trap shooting, reef diving, drinking to excess, full contact sword fighting... and so forth.

Either way getting out there will make you a more rounded person, which can only enhance your writing. You never know what you'll be inspired by so just try. Good stories are about people so get out there an talk to a few of them.

[rainboy]

That's why a major introvert like HP Lovecraft can write beautifully imaginative alternate worlds but hit you over the head with wooden dialogue.

Maybe he just sucked at dialogue?

If you need to study dialogue, you don't necessarily have to go out there and eavesdrop on people (although that's not a bad idea at all). You could try reading some screenplays or transcripts with great dialogue, turn on the radio, tap someone's phone, or sneak a mic under someone's turnover collar. That's what I do.

[shebitme]

it's hard to write a sex scene if you havent had sex. You dig me?

[TrickyFiction]

Do you have good access to material to write about through your life (family, work, friends, hobbies)? If not, do you make any strategic efforts to dive into the world around you for the sake of your writing?

I got a job in customer service.

err..I thought fiction was about making stuff up? Make belief. Tell tall tales. Isn't that why people read fiction? to escape reality?

Of course, but it's also about reality. Most of my characters' traits and appearances, for example, are based off people I know or have met in the real world. It makes 'em more believable, IMO.

[rainboy]

it's hard to write a sex scene if you havent had sex. You dig me?

Depends.

If you try to mimic real-life sex too much, you might just end up with something like this,

http://spikedhumor.com/articles/157525/If-Hollywood-S3X-Were-Real.html

...which is not always what you want :D

[TrickyFiction]

Depends.

If you try to mimic real-life sex too much, you might just end up with something like this,

http://spikedhumor.com/articles/157525/If-Hollywood-S3X-Were-Real.html

...which is not always what you want :D

OK, I just burned off my mocha laughing at that.

[kuwisdelu]

I'm going to break the mold here and say that I think life experiences are extremely important to writing well--in many cases. It certainly helps, anyway.

It doesn't have to be some big adventure or anything, though. And I would advise against purposely going out and trying to have some Big Important Experience or anything like that. But personally, I never wrote well at all until I got my heart broken, at least once. I'd say that's important.

It could be as simple as going someplace you've never been before. Go to the middle of nowhere. Go into the center of a city you've never been to before. Go sit in a park. If you don't usually stay up late, go out at night, and wander around. If you don't usually drink, get drunk. If you've never had a cigarette, smoke one. If you'd never gotten on a train without knowing where it goes, and with no idea how to get back, come aboard.

Is all this necessary? No. But it helps, I think. It's just so hard to write about something you've never experienced before. Sometimes it's even hard to write about something you're not currently experiencing. I know that's what I'm going through, now. It's been a while since anything terrible has happened to me, so I'm running out of ideas, I'm losing my edge, my motivation.

Sometimes, I think, I have to be broken to write. It's hard to be creative when I'm happy, so I watch a dark movie. I read a sad book. I drink, smoke, self-destruct. Maybe that's not what you should do. But I write dark, bittersweet, Romantic with a big R stories. Experience is pretty important to me.

[Use Her Name]

Interesting spread of opinions here. I write the best from personal experience. But I also write SF/F and SF... with that said have I seen vampires? or other such monsters? No but I know what it is to be afraid so I can incorporate that in my work.


But vampires and so on are based on human character types. I was recently fired by a fellow who trumped up charges. He took my house, my paycheck, my car, and all of my savings. He was, to me, a true vampire, thus when I see a vampire (on film, or read of one) I know the hideous impulse behind a creature who saps the very life blood out of you. I have also known various individuals who live to suck your spirit from you. Who's to say this is not the model for a vampire? I don't think there is any "monster" out there that can't be understood by knowing people.

[Use Her Name]

OK, I just burned off my mocha laughing at that.

OMG that's exactly the way I write sex scenes!

[Polenth]

It does seem you're doing things too much because you think it'll help your writing. You encouraged yourself to be reclusive because of your writing. You want to go out now because of your writing.

Do stuff because you want to do it. See what happens next.

[Danger Jane]

I'm going to break the mold here and say that I think life experiences are extremely important to writing well--in many cases. It certainly helps, anyway.

It doesn't have to be some big adventure or anything, though. And I would advise against purposely going out and trying to have some Big Important Experience or anything like that. But personally, I never wrote well at all until I got my heart broken, at least once. I'd say that's important.

It could be as simple as going someplace you've never been before. Go to the middle of nowhere. Go into the center of a city you've never been to before. Go sit in a park. If you don't usually stay up late, go out at night, and wander around. If you don't usually drink, get drunk. If you've never had a cigarette, smoke one. If you'd never gotten on a train without knowing where it goes, and with no idea how to get back, come aboard.

Is all this necessary? No. But it helps, I think. It's just so hard to write about something you've never experienced before. Sometimes it's even hard to write about something you're not currently experiencing. I know that's what I'm going through, now. It's been a while since anything terrible has happened to me, so I'm running out of ideas, I'm losing my edge, my motivation.

Sometimes, I think, I have to be broken to write. It's hard to be creative when I'm happy, so I watch a dark movie. I read a sad book. I drink, smoke, self-destruct. Maybe that's not what you should do. But I write dark, bittersweet, Romantic with a big R stories. Experience is pretty important to me.

Yea. I didn't mention this as much in my first post as I probably should have, but personal experience is extremely important to my writing, too. I couldn't write well til I'd experienced some pretty bad shit when I was old enough to process it, and until I'd fallen in love.

I've always thought "write what you know" meant emotions more than anything else.

[JustGo]

Experience helps. I spent a night in an improvised shelter in the forest during a massive thunderstorm, and that certainly helped me write a similar scene in my novel. I had to write about a character getting stitches, which I've never gotten, so I shoved a needle through my arm. That hurt, but it was helpful when combined with research.

That being said, you don't need research. For example, I've never had a girlfriend. Never so much as kissed a girl. But reading as much as I do, I've learned how to write romance all the same. None of my betas have ever complained about the love stories in my novel (probably the single thing that not one person complained about, actually) and at least half of them have had/are currently in romantic relationships.

If you get an opportunity to experience something, go for it. But don't feel like you can't write something just because you haven't been there and done that.

[Straka]

But vampires and so on are based on human character types.

I think we are saying the same thing, at any rate I agree with you. Sorry to hear about your loss.

[Quossum]

Depends.

If you try to mimic real-life sex too much, you might just end up with something like this,

http://spikedhumor.com/articles/157525/If-Hollywood-S3X-Were-Real.html

...which is not always what you want :D

Or this. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHOSEcmZvG8&feature=related)

--Q

[KarlaErikaCal]

My first break I've ever experienced with my first boyfriend inspired me to write about a girl who's trying to move on with her life. It really does help to experience as much as you can in life, so that you have more to write about and it really does ring true.

[Zoombie]

it's hard to write a sex scene if you havent had sex. You dig me?

I seem to have done okay according to people who've read me...

[kzmiller]

I'm going to break the mold here and say that I think life experiences are extremely important to writing well--in many cases. It certainly helps, anyway.

It doesn't have to be some big adventure or anything, though. And I would advise against purposely going out and trying to have some Big Important Experience or anything like that. But personally, I never wrote well at all until I got my heart broken, at least once. I'd say that's important.

It could be as simple as going someplace you've never been before. Go to the middle of nowhere. Go into the center of a city you've never been to before. Go sit in a park. If you don't usually stay up late, go out at night, and wander around. If you don't usually drink, get drunk. If you've never had a cigarette, smoke one. If you'd never gotten on a train without knowing where it goes, and with no idea how to get back, come aboard.

Is all this necessary? No. But it helps, I think. It's just so hard to write about something you've never experienced before. Sometimes it's even hard to write about something you're not currently experiencing. I know that's what I'm going through, now. It's been a while since anything terrible has happened to me, so I'm running out of ideas, I'm losing my edge, my motivation.

Sometimes, I think, I have to be broken to write. It's hard to be creative when I'm happy, so I watch a dark movie. I read a sad book. I drink, smoke, self-destruct. Maybe that's not what you should do. But I write dark, bittersweet, Romantic with a big R stories. Experience is pretty important to me.

I'm with kuwisdelu on this one. It's not that you have to go have an adventure or even do the stuff you plan to write about to write. But having life experiences in general helps writing a lot. I also like chatting to people about their life experiences, and read non-fiction in about equal quantities to fiction.

Traveling is one of my favorite life experiences as a fantasy writer. I can get even more wild and unusual with cultures after I've seen some real ones that were previously outside my knowledge and experience. And architecture. Wow. So much variety. And the different scents of air in different cities and countries. And the spice that's not always an added thing but an innateness to the place. I still remember the sweetness of Belize that's like strawberry jam, only it seems to infuse everything--meat, starches, the food at the Jamaican jerk stand on the beach ...
Which leads me to make up even more unexpected things just because the things that really exist are such great launching pads.
And having life experiences often leads to more writing while you're in the thick of it, at least for me. I like rereading my travelogues.

[lawtowriting]

This is why in my younger days, I used to tell women I wanted to sleep with them but solely for research purposes. Shockingly, this approach was not very successful.

it's hard to write a sex scene if you havent had sex. You dig me?

[tehuti88]

I'm a shy person and quite the homebody. When I was younger I encouraged these traits because I figured that writers should be awkward and need to be able to spend a lot of time alone, reading or writing. But lately I'm realizing that if you don't live a life, you don't have a lot to write about. Sure, you can always make up alternate universes or write about what you read about, but even the most alien universe is enjoyable to read because we notice things that ring true to our own lives.

Do you have good access to material to write about through your life (family, work, friends, hobbies)? If not, do you make any strategic efforts to dive into the world around you for the sake of your writing? I'm inspired by Julia Cameron's notion (in The Artist's Way) of going on "writer dates" - going somewhere or doing something you've never done before just to inspire your writing or gain new material. Have you done anything purely to find material to write about?

I'm painfully shy as well. Not just shy--avoidant. I basically stay in or near the house all day and have no real contact with other people aside from my parents, and no real friends online either, just maybe one or two people I e-mail now and then. It's terribly lonely, but I've been rejected too many times, and there isn't really anybody around here who'd be interested in somebody who writes all the time!

While I never thought any of this was prerequisite to being a good writer, I think it helped me in that I don't have as many "distractions" from writing as regular people do. That is, no family or job or social life to keep me away from writing.

Then again, I think that MAYBE the fact that I have such emotional states has helped me be able to delve into characters' motivations and their own emotions and reactions to things. I'm very introspective, to a fault, and maybe this helps me examine my characters so they don't turn out flat. My writing is heavily character based, with a strong psychological angle, and I think that's a direct result of my own mental state. Hey, you tend to think about psychology and the mind a lot when your mind is the only company you have!

Most of my material comes from emotional sources, of course, and things I observe or read about. I don't really have a life or interactions with people, but I have plenty to write about. I've never felt like my lack of a life means I have a lack of ideas. I'm not sure why this is. Maybe it's because my lack of a life gives me a lot of time to observe things around me when other people might be just too busy to do so?

I won't say I don't go out and do things to help find material to write about, but it's not along the same lines that you mentioned. I read books on my areas of interest, and go out and look at the trees, and take a walk, and yearly visit a nearby island that my fictional Island is based on, and take pictures, and even though I'm not really interacting with people, I get all kinds of ideas. I guess I'm interacting...just not with other human beings. Which is fine, since I wouldn't want to write about the people I meet in real life anyway. They always depress me!

It's weird; I think I'm pretty good at empathizing with people (even those I completely disagree with, I can usually see where they're coming from), and putting this to use in writing, but when it comes to applying this to my own life and interactions with others, I'm completely lousy. I have no clue about using MYSELF to interact with others. Not sure why this is. I guess it's just my lack of self-confidence. My characters have their own self-confidence to rely on.

[tehuti88]

I seem to have done okay according to people who've read me...

Ditto with me. That's an area where I have NO personal experience whatsoever, but my writing has apparently had people fooled! (One person, reading an M/M story of mine, thought I was a guy!)

There's not just firsthand experience, but secondhand, too. I must have picked up things from reading somewhere.

[ACEnders]

err..I thought fiction was about making stuff up? Make belief. Tell tall tales. Isn't that why people read fiction? to escape reality?

For example, if my setting is in San Diego, and I have never lived there...I can take a trip, right? Do a little research, then use it as material. That's how I look at writing fiction.

Personally, the stuff I've written (very preliminary) I havent needed to do that much research.

I don't think that the question means just visiting a place where you want to put your book.

I think that it also means going out and experiencing new things. Rock climbing, kayaking, horse-back riding. Love with all your heart and experience heartache. Observe others. Observe their reactions. Try new things. Meet new people. Put yourself out there, take a class and learn something new.

I think this is vital in the writing world. Thanks to my husband, I've become more of this kind of person and experienced all kinds of things that I can put in my novels. I ride a motorcycle - once we had an oil leak, so I know how it feels to almost have an accident. I've been rock climbing. I've taken salsa lessons.

While being a writer means you have to write and of course read, you also have to get out of your house and DO. Otherwise, you're characters are either going to be boring, or it's not going to be realistic when you try to describe the sense of accomplishment your MC felt after climbing the rock to the top.

Just my opinion.

[Quossum]

My first break I've ever experienced with my first boyfriend inspired me to write about a girl who's trying to move on with her life. It really does help to experience as much as you can in life, so that you have more to write about and it really does ring true.

Interesting...this reminded me of my first break up, too. I wrote about five short stories in a row, each one exploring some aspect of what was in my head at the time. In one, the boy (after realizing the error of his wicked ways) and girl got back together. In one, the boy wanted to come back, but the girl rejected him. In one, the girl went crazy with grief. In one, the boy came to a terrible end...you get the picture. Very cathartic.

--Q

[RG570]

I think this is one of those commonplaces that sounds nice, but unless you're literally living in a cave somewhere, I don't know how valid it really is.

Not that actually going out and doing stuff isn't helpful, because it can be. But I think doing stuff has more to do with keeping the writer sane and grounded than improving the stories.

[Kitty Pryde]

I don't think that the question means just visiting a place where you want to put your book.

I think that it also means going out and experiencing new things. Rock climbing, kayaking, horse-back riding. Love with all your heart and experience heartache. Observe others. Observe their reactions. Try new things. Meet new people. Put yourself out there, take a class and learn something new.

I think this is vital in the writing world.

I gotta totally agree with AC. You don't have to be the most social butterfly of all time. But you do have to get out in your community, observe people, and have a couple of adventures first hand. Have you ever: come really close to dying? seen someone come really close to dying? seen two people in a physical fight? accompanied someone to a chemotherapy session? been so in love you can barely remember your own name? heard a truly heartbroken child crying? thought you'd never crawl out of bed after being dumped? helped out someone who was very sick? changed someone's bandages? been so exhausted you thought you couldn't go one more step, but you just had to carry on? been totally lost and afraid you might die? met someone/been someone whose whole life has come down to where their next drug fix is coming from?

these are all basic situations, and we write about them all the time. the emotions are powerful and hard to understand without experience. these situations also don't at all play out the way they are portrayed in tv and movies, so that's no kind of substitute for real experience and real emotion.

I think this is what the OP was getting at. Without life experience, writing can fall pretty flat. You don't have to climb everest, you don't have to go to france you don't have to go to cocktail parties every weekend, and you don't have to be extroverted. you just have to go out, test yourself, reach out to people, try new things, and explore your world. I would describe myself as fairly nerdy, book-loving, and introverted, but i have met lots of interesting people, visited lots of places, and gotten into lots of scrapes. it is very doable! go forth! experience!

[Emily Winslow]

Something that annoyed me a LOT in a mystery series I read years ago was the way that each character, no matter how different in personality or circumstance, wanted material success in the form of money, cars, and fancy clothes. There was absolutely no variation, no one who had another kind of ideal life. There was just one kind of person that this author had in her, just one kind of aspiration and motive (not to say that she herself must have been avaricious in this way, but that, evidently, it was the only motivator she understood for intense actions). She writes cracking good suspense plots, but her characters are flat and repetitive to me.

In my opinion, life experience should help with that. Getting out of one's comfort zone. Meeting all kinds of people and *really* getting to know them. Taking risks, and getting surprised by aspects of *oneself*. Novelists create whole worlds full of different characters, and need to be able to speak for *all* of them in their marvelous variety.

So count me in as voting for life experience.

I wouldn't ever advise doing something against your principles (I remember back in my artsy youth when drugs were sometimes justified as necessary artistic "experience," for example, and I think my creativity is just fine without having ever tried them). It might be worth doing something that intimidates you, if it also calls to you. I don't think "experience" must take any extreme form; for some it will, for others, experience will lie closer to home.

I guess I would say: life your fully and with passion, according to what matters to you. If you do that, I'm guessing you'll bump up against experiences that will help your writing resonate.

PS--Hey, Kitty, you posted while I was typing--and I heartily agree with your last paragraph especially.

[rainboy]

I think this is one of those commonplaces that sounds nice, but unless you're literally living in a cave somewhere, I don't know how valid it really is.

Not that actually going out and doing stuff isn't helpful, because it can be. But I think doing stuff has more to do with keeping the writer sane and grounded than improving the stories.

Agreed.

[Aegwynn]

Sounds more like an excuse for why you're not living (no pun) up to your own expectations as a writer.

If you're the introspective / reclusive type, the last thing you need to do is fool yourself into thinking you need to "get a life" in order to write well.

...

Some of the greatest authors in history lived in isolation, but was still able to captivate the rest of world with their imagination.

And you can get plenty of "life moments" from watching movies, TV and reading other books. Only difference is these moments are usually packed with conflict, the kind of stuff you need as a writer. Let's face it. Most real life moments are pretty dull by comparison (unless you're one of those constant thrill-seekers) -- that's why people use movies and books in the first place; to escape the mundane chores of everyday life.

That's a relief. I am very reclusive - not necessarily by choice - and I've been wondering lately if it is a really negative thing in terms of my desire to write. I do not go out much, and so I do not often have the opportunity to interact with various types of people... but my imagination is quite fertile, so I tend to write from there.

I'm not sure this sort of question has an answer. For some authors, getting out and experiencing different people, places, and things feeds their drive. For others, it hinders their drive. It all depends on what type of person you are...

[shebitme]

the above post made me realize it's kind of a balance:

on the one hand, the best writers are the most imaginative, and that requires that they spend long periods of time alone, daydreaming, fantasizing, etc--basically cutting themselves off from the real world for a long enough time that they can create an alternative fantasy world.

however on the other hand, they need to be in touch with reality and human nature, and have had enough experiences that their readers will be able to relate to the book. the writer has to be in touch with reality enough so that when they write, the readers will find the content of the book interesting (rather than obscure or weird).
Also, more experiences in real life gives them a larger pool of ideas/experiences from which to draw when they write

[dayne-jen]

the above post made me realize it's kind of a balance...

Very much agreed! The key is finding your personal balance: whether it be 70% experience and 30% solitude or 90% introspection and 10% experience. I think I fall into the 30% action/70% thinking realm.

Even then, I'm not comfortable interviewing people for research (though I have); yet I do enjoy people-watching in public places and catching gems of action and conversation. The drunken woman running around the college campus sounded like great research. I'd have been tagging along, too, at a safe distance!

[tehuti88]

the above post made me realize it's kind of a balance:

on the one hand, the best writers are the most imaginative, and that requires that they spend long periods of time alone, daydreaming, fantasizing, etc--basically cutting themselves off from the real world for a long enough time that they can create an alternative fantasy world.

however on the other hand, they need to be in touch with reality and human nature, and have had enough experiences that their readers will be able to relate to the book. the writer has to be in touch with reality enough so that when they write, the readers will find the content of the book interesting (rather than obscure or weird).
Also, more experiences in real life gives them a larger pool of ideas/experiences from which to draw when they write

I think it's very true. I believe something that people who give the advice "To write you must live" don't mention or take into account is that for everyone, "living" means different things. A lot of it hinges on emotional reaction, and we all react emotionally to things in vastly different ways. While for one person they might need a huge event like a disaster or the death of someone close to them to write a convincing story about grief, for someone else it might be much smaller things that can trigger such emotion. I've never been in a terribly life-threatening situation, to be truthful; nothing major or exciting has ever happened to me. But I've felt strong emotions, and as a result I have characters who live through things I've never experienced. Somebody might need to nearly get hit by a train to write a good story about terror. For me, all it takes is looking a person in the eye.

Likewise, someone can go out and have all the most exciting adventures there are to have in life but if they don't get much of an emotional charge out of any of it, their writing won't be compelling either. Somebody made a comment earlier about sitting on the bus making for an epic story. If sitting on a bus is all it takes to generate strong emotions in a writer, it very well could make for a great story.

For one person, living might mean climbing mountains and saving lives. For another, it might just mean waking up to face the day. Whatever is considered "living" to a writer can make for great writing, no matter what it is, if there's emotion in it.

[t0neg0d]

I take the bus to work.

Do you write horror? O.o

[Shadow_Ferret]

I'm a shy person and quite the homebody. When I was younger I encouraged these traits because I figured that writers should be awkward and need to be able to spend a lot of time alone, reading or writing. But lately I'm realizing that if you don't live a life, you don't have a lot to write about.
Nothing can replace life experiences.

People watching is invaluable to writing. Learning how real people interact cannot be gained by watching TV or reading books.

And I say this as the biggest introvert and the biggest fear of people person on the planet.

[rainboy]

Nothing can replace life experiences.

People watching is invaluable to writing. Learning how real people interact cannot be gained by watching TV or reading books.

I'm playing the devil's advocate here, but I think it can. Ever watched a reality show like Big Brother? Shows like that are perfect for studying human interaction, and there's hundreds of shows like that in all kinds of settings with all kinds of people.

The initial statement of this thread was "To write you must live". "People watching" goes more under "observing" than "living" in my opinion. People who are busy "living" don't spend as much time reflecting on their observations. I think many introverts* are introverted because they're naturally reflective and prefer to take an "observer role" as opposed to being in the midst of the action, or being the center of attention.

If you're having an intense conversation with somebody, you likely won't be able to recall a lot of details about the interaction afterwards, such as the subtle expressions and mannerisms of the person you were talking to. You would have been too caught up in the conversation, too caught up in thinking about what to say and looking that person in the eye. A third-party observer would likely pick up on a lot more nuances, and would probably be able to give a more interesting and detailed account of said interaction.

So while I agree that "people watching", and observation in general, is essential to being a good writer, I don't really see how it benefits your argument since many introverts are great observers, and you don't have to be an extrovert to observe other people.

*Keep in mind I'm using the word introvert as meaning a person who's "shy and quiet", not a person who looks only inwardly and is blind to his / her surroundings (a such person would not be a good "interpreter of life", me thinks)

[Mike Martyn]

I don't know any vampires, werewolves or demonic dwarves, so I have to rely on my imagination. But it's a fertile place, so I do ok. Other research I do on the t'internet.

Clare

What? You don't know any demonic dwarves? You don't get out much, do you.

[Quossum]

I'm playing the devil's advocate here, but I think it can. Ever watched a reality show like Big Brother? Shows like that are perfect for studying human interaction, and there's hundreds of shows like that in all kinds of settings with all kinds of people.

At last! A reason not to feel guilty about my enjoyment of reality TV! :D

--Q

[ynoirb]

I don't think that I could have written the novel I'm (trying) writing now if I hadn't gone off and found some crazy adventures to inspire me.

That said, imagination is kinda important too :)

[simplyaven]

My writing is like a movie - I see scenes, colors, expressions and then I have to describe them. All those memories are part of the past, I just put them together in one story. Without the inspiration of one particular place where I've been before, I would have never been able to write even one page. Travelling is my key to writing but I don't look for faces or personalities when I travel. I rather let my mind to absorbe everything around, to make photos. When the time comes the stored impressions come to me.

[JJ Cooper]

Certanily adds a level of 'authenticity' if you have had experiences that are relative to your writing.

There are very good writers out there who take on a task they perhaps know little about, but those who do and are good at what they do probably have good advisors helping them along the way.

And Big Brother is a poor example to study human interactions and actions.

JJ

[Dichroic]

Just for the record, opposite perspective here. I'd had experiences out the kazoo; I won't bore you but just to start with I can say I've visited all seven continents, loved, hated, met a *wide* variety of people, jumped off a bridge and out of an airplane, etc etc etc. What I don't do: I don't write in-depth analyses. Much as I'd like to write a novel I keep ending up with vignettes. I don't feel I have the insight into people someone like Jane Austen had, that she got from watching a variety of people interacting at close quarters. Being outward-focused is *not* always best for a writer. Sometimes it's best to just shut up and observe the people nearest you.

[Gray Rose]

I write speculative fiction, have an active imagination, and am somewhat of a recluse.

I figured out pretty early that my best writing draws on life experiences. No, I have never met a mage who is a sadistic genius. Nor did I ever go on a mission in space. I've never encountered a spaceshifter crocodile either.

But I know how it feels to trail a finger down my lover's arm. I know what fine wine tastes like, when you drink it above the ocean. I know how hard it is to wash the smell of smoke out of my hair. I can tell fine, lovingly made stitches from coarse, hurried stitches and from machine-made stitches. I know what a dirty floor looks like, and how satistying it is to finally wash it.

Details are everything, I believe. And yes, mine come mostly from real life. Not even from travel or adventures, but from daily life, from savoring it.

Good luck with your writing.

[Sean D. Schaffer]

I'm a shy person and quite the homebody. When I was younger I encouraged these traits because I figured that writers should be awkward and need to be able to spend a lot of time alone, reading or writing. But lately I'm realizing that if you don't live a life, you don't have a lot to write about. Sure, you can always make up alternate universes or write about what you read about, but even the most alien universe is enjoyable to read because we notice things that ring true to our own lives.

Do you have good access to material to write about through your life (family, work, friends, hobbies)? If not, do you make any strategic efforts to dive into the world around you for the sake of your writing? I'm inspired by Julia Cameron's notion (in The Artist's Way) of going on "writer dates" - going somewhere or doing something you've never done before just to inspire your writing or gain new material. Have you done anything purely to find material to write about?


EDIT:

I originally wrote this post in a quick, angry response. That is not good of me.

So I will simply suffice with one simple thought.

You cannot rely on another writer's opinion to find out what works and does not work for you. Like Uncle Jim says, "If it works for you, it's right." He's right on. If something works for you, it's right for you. But that does not mean it works for everybody else.

And with that, I'll go ahead and press 'save'. :)

[rainboy]

And Big Brother is a poor example to study human interactions and actions.


Why? Contestants in such shows forget about the cameras after a while (the Stanford prison experiment is a good example of this) and then it's just like watching a slice of life. Seriously, when I was studying psychology, I learned so much about human behavior and thinking from watching and analyzing reality TV experiments such as BBC's "The Experiment".

I'm not advocating "abstinence from life", but the idea of seeking out "life experience" in the hope that it will make you a better writer seems a bit laughable to me seeing as some of our greatest writers were inveterate recluses. Hell, some of the greatest romance writers of our generation wrote some of their best love stories before they had a love life themselves. If you want to write a book, pour your soul and heart into writing that book, and stop inventing elaborate schemes of procrastination.

But whatever. Do what works for you. Just don't expect a miracle.

[Susan Breen]

I think dealing with other people, whether it be family or crazy people on the subway or both, forces you to enlarge yourself and is critical to being a writer. This sounds like a bumper sticker, but I think looking inward can take you only so far. At some point you have to look out.

[rainboy]

True, that's why I wrote

"*Keep in mind I'm using the word introvert as meaning a person who's "shy and quiet", not a person who looks only inwardly and is blind to his / her surroundings (a such person would not be a good "interpreter of life", me thinks)"

You still have to be a keen observer of life around you.

[kzmiller]

Careful with what reality shows you take 'real life' from, though. Some are scripted. All are heavily edited to create a story arc that makes it interesting for people to watch. It's not completely invalid, but just be aware of it's foibles and limitations.

[pisqualie]

I definitely do. I almost feel like I live to write, and find myself narrating in my head as I would write what I am experiencing. I feel like a nut half the time. I always figured I couldn't really be a writer (of a meaningful novel) until I was in my 30s because until then, you just haven't lived enough to have anything to say. I don't know if I believe that or not, but I am turning 29 this year and... I have managed to pack alot in so far, heh. :D

[MsK]

Maybe, "To write you must feel."
We can write about what we observe while people watching and we can write about what we have learned in our research, but if we can't stir a variety of emotions in our readers, we can't hold their attention. And to really be able to convey those emotions authentically, I think it is easier if we have experienced those feelings ourselves. (Not necessarily the exact circumstances that would bring about the feelings, just the feelings themselves)

[Doogs]

And to really be able to convey those emotions authentically, I think it is easier if we have experienced those feelings ourselves. (Not necessarily the exact circumstances that would bring about the feelings, just the feelings themselves)

I agree 100%, though I would hasten to add sensations, as well as feelings.

Case in point - my WIP is set in the Roman Republic. I've never experienced modern warfare firsthand, much less ancient warfare, going at someone with nothing much more than a sword and shield. But when I was writing battle scenes, I drew on certain experiences that happened to line up well - that awkward fight back in junior high, or that hockey game where the crowd got so worked up and cheered so loud that everything turned into a single, deafening roar.

Now, that hockey game is about as far removed from an ancient battlefield as you can get, but the sense of camaraderie en masse and the deafening roar of the crowd stood out as elements to draw on when I was writing.

I did the same with another scene where my MC's son is born. At the time I wrote it, my wife and I hadn't even starting thinking about trying to have kids, so I drew on the anxiety and fear and protectiveness and overwhelming joy from other experiences. After our son was born in March, I went back and read the scene, figuring there'd be a lot I'd want to change. To my surprise, there wasn't.

[Shadow_Ferret]

I'm playing the devil's advocate here, but I think it can. Ever watched a reality show like Big Brother? Shows like that are perfect for studying human interaction, and there's hundreds of shows like that in all kinds of settings with all kinds of people.


Yes I have. Those so-called "reality" shows aren't how REAL people interact. They're how people put in front of a camera in the hopes of winning money interact.

[Emily Winslow]

Beautifully put, Gray Rose.



I figured out pretty early that my best writing draws on life experiences. No, I have never met a mage who is a sadistic genius. Nor did I ever go on a mission in space. I've never encountered a spaceshifter crocodile either.

But I know how it feels to trail a finger down my lover's arm. I know what fine wine tastes like, when you drink it above the ocean. I know how hard it is to wash the smell of smoke out of my hair. I can tell fine, lovingly made stitches from coarse, hurried stitches and from machine-made stitches. I know what a dirty floor looks like, and how satistying it is to finally wash it.

Details are everything, I believe. And yes, mine come mostly from real life. Not even from travel or adventures, but from daily life, from savoring it.

[AdamH]

Yes I have. Those so-called "reality" shows aren't how REAL people interact. They're how people put in front of a camera in the hopes of winning money interact.

Exactly! If you take any prizes away and then film them, you'd get a truer sense of interaction...but the mere fact that a camera is filming someone AND they are aware of it will make people act different from normal. The closest to true reality on TV I've come across is this great show on A&E called Intervention (http://www.aetv.com/intervention/).

[Akuma]

Helen Keller and The Frost King.

Thoughts, anyone?

[Seif]

There are more crazy people that I have met throughout my life that it would it take a series of a 100 novels to cover each one and to be honest its these characters that inspire me to write.

And to the person who said 'isn't it all made up' - no, what you and I write is an extension of the reality we experience.

[NeuroFizz]

Fizzyism #49:

In Science, it’s insatiable curiosity.
In Writing, it’s unrestrained imagination.
Or is it the other way around?

[KVL]

I personally don't actively seek out "life experience" in order to be able to write. I don't travel "for the sake of my writing" or anything :) I go places and do things because I'm genuinely interested in them, and the writing follows (keeping a journal helps).

My main WIP is post-apocalyptic YA fiction. Some of the imagery in my head is influenced by a train trip I took across Hungary, Bulgaria and Romania. Some of it is influenced by amateur photographs of decaying urban structures in inner-city Detroit.

The more I think about it, the more I agree with what Gray Rose wrote: daily life and details are important.

[scheherazade]

A writer's adventure day sounds like a great idea, though the danger to be aware of here is of forcing something to happen. Steinbeck's Travels with Charlie comes to mind. That book just didn't have the heart (feel, soul, etc.) that his other writing did, all because he seemed to be forcing himself to having an adventure he could write about.

That's very true. I think setting out on a major adventure with the expectation you're going to get a book out of it is like bringing a camera crew to a haunted house. You're probably not going to get any of the good dirt. But, on the other hand, if you're feeling stuck and just need something to write about, it never hurts to go visit that new exhibit at the museum, or visit the Spanish neighborhood in town, or ride the bike trail you've been meaning to explore for years. I'd think if I took on some major life adventure: moving to another country or backpacking across the country, for example, I'd bring along my notebook - not necessarily because I wanted to write a story about backpacking across the country, but because I'd expect to be exposed to different ways of thinking, different language and different characters that I could use to write any story - even one about a character with a boring job who lives in the same town I grew up in.

I think as soon as you become a tourist - whether in a new country or just an unexplored corner of your home town - you're suddenly more open-minded to the world around you than you are as a blindered local. So I wonder if any other writers out there use their writing as an excuse to be explore things they just never would have otherwise.

[Wolvel]

I don't have to have an experiance to write. Now a idea may form out of a trip but I don't go looking for ideas that way.

Most ideas that are forced usually do not pan out anyway.

[scheherazade]

Ever watched a reality show like Big Brother? Shows like that are perfect for studying human interaction, and there's hundreds of shows like that in all kinds of settings with all kinds of people.

I agree with that... in spite of creative editing and scripted elements, I'd say nothing has given me so much confidence in my own social skills as watching reality TV. :) Some people may be beautiful and great talkers, and yet also horribly deluded about themselves! You don't necessarily get that understanding when you're a part of the interaction and you're more focused on what to say next or whether so-and-so is looking at you.

But I'd say a person can learn about the world while still being slightly removed from it. There's probably some ideal balance, and that depends on personal preference, between interacting with the group around you - asking questions, gaining the trust of others by revealing of yourself, etc - and being removed enough to be objective.

[scheherazade]

It does seem you're doing things too much because you think it'll help your writing. You encouraged yourself to be reclusive because of your writing. You want to go out now because of your writing.

Do stuff because you want to do it. See what happens next.

No, I was reclusive because that is my natural tendency. What I wanted to do was exactly what I did: stay home, read books, watch movies. I didn't fight against that nature because I figured it would suit life as a writer. But if someone had told me as a kid that writers connect to their readers by sharing their understanding of humanity, then I might've tried a little harder to break out of my shell.

Over the years my automatic response has been to decline social invitations, because almost every time I've gone to a party or joined a club, it's ended with me tongue-tied and miserable in a corner. No matter how hard I tried to enjoy myself I always failed. But now I've changed the objective: I'm telling myself to accept the invitation and attend, if only to collect material that I might some day write about. I'm guaranteed to succeed at this goal. Chances are, while I'm there, I might enhance my social skills and network so that the next time becomes a little easier or more enjoyable.

So by your litmus test, do I want to go out with relative strangers? Hell no. Do I benefit from going? Sometimes. I've found writing partners, career advice, mentors, boyfriends; I've tested story ideas, found inspiration for characters and subplots, learned about new authors to admire, and discovered that people find me funny. But the only way I'll convince myself to attend that party, or go out for beers, or move to another country, or do the thing that terrifies me, is if I can break through the rationalizing odds-of-failure calculation, by telling myself, "at the very least, you can find something to write about."

[Shadow_Ferret]

I don't know any vampires, werewolves or demonic dwarves, so I have to rely on my imagination. But it's a fertile place, so I do ok. Other research I do on the t'internet.

ClareBut even so, there have to be REAL people in your story, too, right? So you'd still need to know how REAL people interact. Besides, werewolves aren't always werewolves, they are REAL people when they aren't ripping your throat out and they have real emotions and real human interactions.

So really, I still think you need to have had some life experiences, some human interaction, to write believably about those things. Writing, though imagination, is also about believability and creating characters people care about.

If those characters don't act real because the writer hasn't experienced how people live, love, laugh, and hate, the whole story is going to fall flat.

[Pachydermia]

I think it should be, "to live, you must write."

that's what it feels like sometimes.