Share your Plotholes!

[Kaiser-Kun]

I was thinking about a big plothole I found in my novel and thought it'd be a good idea to read about those times from our works.

In my novel, there are three categories of magic: Creation, Destruction and Change. The MCs, Anara, Vynen and Rophen, are the last born members fo each type. An organization, called the Guardians, only accepted Destruction Mages.

I started creating more and more Guardian characters, and only then noticed the plot hole: There shouldn't be any Guardians younger than Rophen, since he's the last Destruction Mage.

So, I had to turn several Guardians into Change or Creation Mages, and explain that the organization's rules had changed to allow their admittance.

What plotholes have you noticed in your works?

[Slushie]

In a novella I wrote during my high-school days, I killed a character mid-way through only to have him join in dialogue a few scenes later. That was just one of the many problems with that lil piece of literary shit...

[Mara]

So far, my novels tend to have huge plotholes after 20,000 words or so, when all of the sudden time freezes because I gave up at that point. :)

I've also had characters meet someone for the first time after meeting them for the first time in an earlier scene.

[backslashbaby]

Mine revolve around which town they are in and how to jump around where they need to be when/why they need to be there. The setting is big in my work, so I knew I'd complicate things for myself :)

[RJK]

Here's one a beta reader questioned:
My MC is tied to a chair. there is a high intensity light in a shaded fixture hanging a foot over his head, meant to make him sweat for a while. The bad guys leave him to cook.
He works up a lot of saliva and spits on the bulb. The relatively cool spit hitting the 1,000degree glass causes it to break.

Beta says this is stretching credibility. What do you say?

[setchmo]

Hmmm...I think it would work if there was a weak spot on the globe. It would be more from force of impact that anything. Maybe your MC notices a dark spot on the bulb and aim for it? Bullseye!

[Cyia]

He works up a lot of saliva and spits on the bulb. The relatively cool spit hitting the 1,000degree glass causes it to break.

Beta says this is stretching credibility. What do you say?

At 1000 degrees, the spit would start to vaporize (or completely vaporize) mid-air. That's ignoring the fact if the bulb was that close, not only would he not have spit at that point - or fluid in his eyes - but he'd literally cook. His skin would look like pepperoni.

[colealpaugh]

Here's one a beta reader questioned:
My MC is tied to a chair. there is a high intensity light in a shaded fixture hanging a foot over his head, meant to make him sweat for a while. The bad guys leave him to cook.
He works up a lot of saliva and spits on the bulb. The relatively cool spit hitting the 1,000degree glass causes it to break.

Beta says this is stretching credibility. What do you say?

I'd imagine it would take quite a wad of spit. The initial spit would vaporize, but a subsequent spit stream would begin to cool the direct ambient temperature enough to allow the spit to reach the bulb and boil. We had a chimney fire in our wood stove last winter that hit 900 degrees F and I poured water directly into the metal joint. Glass would have exploded. 1000 degrees F isn't too crazy hot, IMO.

Not like the several million degrees at Earth's core <shameless Al Gore Zebra spots reference>.

ETA: I just checked the maximum temp of a 250w metal halide bulb I have and it's 752 degrees F. I've had my hand within six inches...

[Matera the Mad]

Well, let's say the spitter is that accurate at a very odd angle, and let's say that his gob hits the lightbulb and is enough to make the hot glass shatter. How does he avoid being blinded by glass shrapnel?

[Slushie]

He could be wearing a blindfold, thus not only protecting his eyes but making the spitting feat that much more impressive.

I cook my pizzas at 425F

[colealpaugh]

He could be wearing a blindfold, thus not only protecting his eyes but making the spitting feat that much more impressive.

I cook my pizzas at 425F

Impressive, but 1000 degree glass shards versus a blindfold? I suggest a fencing mask with the optional spit hole.

[JoNightshade]

My novel takes place over the course of a single school year, and the MC's are teachers. So personal time tends to hover around various holidays. And I just realized I forgot to even mention Thanksgiving!

I think I can gloss it over with a couple of sentences though. :)

[kaitie]

As for the glass thing, I think even if it did work the shattering, 1000 degree glass falling on his skin would be incredibly, incredibly painful. I'd say see if there's a way for him to get to a switch or even just knock his chair over and scoot out of the way before it hurts him and it might work better.

I have no idea if I can explain this such that it will make sense out of context, but I found a pretty big, glaring plot hole in my last read through.

There's a scene in which my chick has been convinced that my MC is really a bad guy and is trying to trick him into meeting with her so he can be caught (he's on the run at this point). He had arranged a method of contact as an emergency measure before. Here's where it gets complicated. His actual reason for making the arrangement is that he really feels responsible for her (it's his fault she got involved and three people have already been killed) and he's still trying to look after her, even though they've split up at this point.

She's shown lots of false (or falsely presented) evidence to show that he's really a bad guy and told that he's likely to agree to meet with her because it appeals to his sense of ego and shows that he still has control over her. So this is what she believes.

To make matters worse, this scene is from her perspective. She has to try to convince him to meet with her without letting on that she knows the "real" reasons. Meaning she has to play like she's really in trouble and really believes that he's on her side, while at the same time believing him to be a bad evil dude.

Complicated much? Well, if you followed that far, the plot hole that got introduced was basically that there was a part where the logic she was using to convince him was completely opposed to what she's been told. I don't remember off the top of my head what the exact problem was, but it just was one of those things that at first glance made sense, but when you thought about it you'd say, "But wait...she believes this..."

It took about six or seven edits before I clicked to that, and my readers didn't notice either, but it was pretty glaring on second thought. I basically had to rewrite the whole conversation, but it's much better now. :)

[Cliff Face]

Not so much a plot hole, but a loose end anyway.

Cop finds case files from the big city (he's in a small town) on his kitchen table, all murder cases (unsolved). I know the bad guy was the murderer, and left the cases there to taunt to cop (he got in his house while the cop was drugged/poisoned) - only, I've already killed off the bad guy, and didn't mention anywhere what the deal with those cases was.

So now I have to try and figure out how to bring the information up, but because it won't be a confession from the bad guy, it pretty much needs to be more important than what I had originally planned, which is where I'm struggling.

If all else fails I'll have to go back to an earlier scene and have the bad guy confess, but now that option seems really anticlimactic... yay me - a puzzle to solve before I finish off the book...

[Slushie]

Impressive, but 1000 degree glass shards versus a blindfold? I suggest a fencing mask with the optional spit hole.

Are those by the same makers of the canvas knickers with the optional shit hole?




*puts self in time-out for vulgar and lame joke*

[Stijn Hommes]

One of my earliest short stories had a family in it who went camping in a couple of tents. All right so far until their youngest son discovers the dead body of one of his classmates... Did I mention all this happened in the winter and the dead kid was willingly wearing shorts? The image of blood on snow was great, but I didn't fully think this one through...

[Maxinquaye]

Well, to give you a glimpse of the disaster of my first two attempts at this ting called fiction, I wrote about six chapters of a WIP - and then forgot I had killed off a character in Chapter 3. He happily joined my MC for the two last chapters. It was exciting and fun to write, except the character was dead...

That was probably the smallest flaw of that attempt at a story.

[socact]

The only way I can fix a plot hole is to revise the manuscript from start to finish, preferably in a day. Otherwise I lose track of things.

Ugh, I know this is a horrible system. It's just how I do it.

[Fredster]

Right now I'm at 35k and counting on my story, and I haven't found any big plot holes. The little ones I've found I just let the characters discover themselves -- it seems a little more realistic. For example, in a scene where a guy is trying to convince a general he needs to do something, and he's coming up with his story on the fly (during a crisis situation), I just wrote the hole right in:


Whittle heard the creak of bedsprings through the phone. He couldn't blame the General for sitting down. “There's more. This particular strain was engineered to be fast. A host is contagious less than an hour from exposure, fully symptomatic in eight, and dead within three days.” He smiled, pleased with the lies that came so easily. “Charlie left the facility, and got off the base. Dr. Nelson happened to be here and found the note he left behind. His intentions are to go to Las Vegas and walk the Strip, infecting as many people as he can before he succumbs.”

Whittle realized his story had a huge hole—with the time frame he'd given the General, it was impossible for him to have made it to the office so quickly. He hoped Vaughn wouldn't notice the inconsistency.

“Why didn't you stop him?” Vaughn asked. His voice had an edge to it now.
I'll probably tweak it in revisions, but it seemed more real to me to have him realize it.

As much time as I spend plotting and making notes, I hope I'm not going to have any big holes to fix when I get done. :)

[Stargazer]

... I wrote about six chapters of a WIP - and then forgot I had killed off a character in Chapter 3. He happily joined my MC for the two last chapters...

I wonder if it's errors like this that helped spawn films like 'The Sixth Sense'.

[Ehab.Ahmed]

I wonder if it's errors like this that helped spawn films like 'The Sixth Sense'.

Errors like this? I don't think that movie was a product of an error. I think it was planned for him -- the MC -- to be dead. But obviously you were joking, lol.

[Sarah W]

I tend to pull "Citizen Kanes"--you know, when a character says something when s/he's completely alone, but whatever it was becomes the impetus for other characters . . .who weren't there, hadn't bugged the place, and aren't psychic.

[Cyia]

Errors like this? I don't think that movie was a product of an error. I think it was planned for him -- the MC -- to be dead. But obviously you were joking, lol.

Nope. He wasn't dead until like the 5th draft or so. It was a happy accident.

[Phaeal]

I tend to get the most mixed up with regards to time. So now I make sure to include dates in my chapter outlines. When the action gets frenetic, especially when there are several POV lines braiding together, I make an hour by hour timeline for those scenes. Or even minute to minute!

[Ehab.Ahmed]

Nope. He wasn't dead until like the 5th draft or so. It was a happy accident.

Oh? I need to get my facts up-to-date.

[RJK]

Now that I think about it, 1,000 degrees is pretty hot. I don't know how hot those high intensity bulbs get but my nephew can tell you they will give you an instant blister if you touch one even for a half second.
spraying glass would be a problem, but I have him clamping his eyes shut as soon as he spits.
I didn't think of him moving the chair, but we'll all assume the chair was bolted down and he's tied securely to it.

[Stargazer]

What if he spat in a totally different direction and hit the bulb with a ricochet? That'd explain why he's not picking glass out of his face for the following week.

[Mara]

I wonder if it's errors like this that helped spawn films like 'The Sixth Sense'.

When I run RPGs, some of my favorite plot twists have been when I had to close up stupid plot holes I created. :)

[colealpaugh]

The glass bulb of a general use incandescent runs about 500F...here's a vid of someone spitting on it. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXHYVR75T8g)



Warning: 23 seconds from your life you won't get back.

[Slushie]

lol

What people do in their free time...

[colealpaugh]

What people do in their free time...

What's worse are people who hunt through Youtubes looking for stuff like that...

:o

[kaitie]

The glass bulb of a general use incandescent runs about 500F...here's a vid of someone spitting on it. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXHYVR75T8g)



Warning: 23 seconds from your life you won't get back.

Huh...it works. :) And it looked like there that the bulb itself didn't shatter completely, so that might work even better haha.

Would have thought I'd learn something new from a crazy YouTube video. ;)

[The Lonely One]

In a novella I wrote during my high-school days, I killed a character mid-way through only to have him join in dialogue a few scenes later. That was just one of the many problems with that lil piece of literary shit...

Must've been an interesting conversation.

[Slushie]

Must've been an interesting conversation.

Come to think of it...

I could rewrite so he's reincarnated as a vampire.

[ChristineR]

When I was a kid, I went through a phase of putting wet cloths over light bulbs. I don't know exactly why I did this--I think it started when I saw a movie or something where people put clothes over lampshades to give their rooms that groovy seventies look. I don't remember why there was a wetness involved, or why I was bypassing the lampshade, but after the first more or less accidental event, it was something I felt the need to do. More than once.

In my experience, what happens is that the outer part, the bulb, just sort of implodes, and there isn't much opportunity for it to spray at you, but of course there was a wet cloth involved, so, maybe that is part of it. Light bulb glass is really thin and light. Then the inner part starts to burn in air, and makes a really impressive sort of flare which lasts only a second or two before the whole thing ends. That video gives the general idea, but really doesn't even do it justice.

So. Spit away. It works, and you'll be impressed with the results.

[Slushie]

*goes to spit on nearest lightbulb*





*dials 911 with blood-soaked cheeks*





*files class action lawsuit against AW and innerwebz in general*