Querying a NaNo?

[kaitie]

I just was reading through some of the comments on Nathan Bransford's blog, and someone had commented that they finished their NaNo and sent him the query for it on December 1st. At first I thought someone was joking around, but someone else asked if it was true that he was receiving more, and apparently he really is receiving an unusually high number of queries today.

So now I'm wondering...anyone out there actually querying their NaNos already? I didn't do it, and heck I've been working on my current story for something like 19 months so needless to say I can't even begin to imagine, but I know quite a lot of you out there are fast writers. Is it really possible to write and polish in a month? If you're not TT42, I mean. ;)

[BenPanced]

NO. I've only just gotten my 2004 NaNo in querying shape this year and I have serious doubts about this year's ever being finished. A lot of agents have mentioned they get tons of post-NaNo queries during December; unfortunately, many, many people who participate don't understand the entire writing/publishing process.

[firedrake]

I saw those comments too and couldn't believe it!

My NaNo is going on the back burner for a while. It won't be ready to query for ages.

[suki]

From my understanding, from agents and editors commenting online, every December and January they get a flood of NaNo queries, increasing the slushiness of their slush piles since so few NaNo-written manuscripts are anywhere near ready to be queried so soon after finishing NaNo.

So, yes, people do it. People also query rough drafts of books all year long, not understanding the level of revision needed to make most books queryable. There's just a huge uptick of these kinds of queries in the few months post-NaNo, or so I've read...

~suki

[kaitie]

I'm guessing that's also the kind of thing you wouldn't want to put in your query letter then lol. ;) Or maybe the opposite instead: "This is not a NaNo novel!"

[BenPanced]

Maybe after the book is accepted for publication, you can use it as a talking point in the myriad interviews you'll be giving on your three-continent book tour...

[Shadow_Ferret]

Oh, great. So this isn't the best time to be querying a real novel? :(

[Sage]

Yeah, I was really worried about sending queries out this month for the novel I'm querying, which is being queried as a 50K novel. I got a bunch of queries out two days ago, but I'm thinking it will be harder now.

[BrooklynLee]

I suspect most agents and editors can quickly tell the difference between a legitimate query and a "hey! I wrote 50,000 words in a month, wanna read it?" query.

[DeadlyAccurate]

Oh, great. So this isn't the best time to be querying a real novel? :(

Look at it this way: you'll stand out as better than the rest.

[katiemac]

Yeah, I was really worried about sending queries out this month for the novel I'm querying, which is being queried as a 50K novel. I got a bunch of queries out two days ago, but I'm thinking it will be harder now.

Either that or agents will be really excited to see something that looks like it is better written than the average NaNo.

There are pluses and minuses to querying any time of the year, so unless you think your manuscript could use a few more weeks of edits, or you'll go crazy if your query sits in their inbox a little longer than the norm, then just send it.

[kaitie]

My goal is to start sending out within a week or two, and I was wondering the same thing, though I do imagine it would stand out more if most of what's being presented is lower quality than usual.

I also agree that the query probably isn't as good if it's been written in a day or two. I rewrote mine five times before I was happy with it over the course of about a month. I know a lot of people work much faster than I do, but I tend to think if you spend more time revising something it's usually obvious. Granted, I've had friends who can put out a better first draft than what I have after five edits, so obviously not always true.

[Snowstorm]

I figure my Nanovel won't be ready until fall next year, and I think I'm being hopeful. I'm really tickled with what I wrote, but I haven't beat it with a rock for the upteenth time yet. But that's me.

[Albannach]

I don't like to query in December, but it's true that there is NO time of the year when someone won't have some bad thing to say and suggest waiting. It's Christmas, January catchup, tax time, summer vacation, August convention season, septermber catchup, winter doldrums, Thanksgiving...

Some truth to all of them but... you have to query sometime, right. I just think December has too much going against it. Mid to late January things calm down a bit. But then probably 10,000 people think the same thing and query the same day.

[BigWords]

My NaNo won't be ready for anything until I've gone through it a few dozen times, and given the fact I have so many other projects nearer completion it will probably be mid-2011 before I'm happy with it. There needs to be a period of time that you live with a book before it is ready to go out into the world.

[blacbird]

Who needs to know it's a NANO? It's a novel. Query as normal.

caw

[kaitie]

Who needs to know it's a NANO? It's a novel. Query as normal.

caw

I imagine most people do. I think the issue is more of whether or not it's a good idea to submit a story that was written and revised in a month. Unless you're a super-genius.

[blacbird]

I imagine most people do. I think the issue is more of whether or not it's a good idea to submit a story that was written and revised in a month. Unless you're a super-genius.

Agreed, but why tell anybody you're submitting to that the thing is a NANO, in any case? What's the point of that?

caw

[kaitie]

It wouldn't necessarily be possible to tell aside from quality. I was shocked that people do this, and wondered if it was a case of people jumping the gun, or if people really do believe their work is that good. The original commenter who I took for a joke said that it didn't require any editing. Now, I've known people who put out amazing first drafts so it's entirely possible, but I still find that shocking.

As for not being able to tell, they were surmising that was the case because there was a big deluge of queries sent on the first.

I wonder if people get caught up in the excitement of winning and just go for it, but then look back on it later on and say, "What was I thinking?"

[thethinker42]

Is it really possible to write and polish in a month? If you're not TT42, I mean. ;)

Hahaha :D

Okay, okay, I'll stay out of this...

had a partial request on last year's NaNo novel by Dec 4...

[thethinker42]

Just kidding, I'm not staying out of this.

For the record, last year's NaNo novel wasn't ready to be queried. Turned out to be a good thing that I sent it, because I ended up developing a really good rapport with the editor. She ultimately rejected it, but gave me the pointers I needed to rewrite it into what it is now.

Several books later, yes, I can write something that fast. I started The Devil You Know on October 7, finished it 11 days later, revised it, submitted it (to an editor with whom I was already working on something else), and got the contract on November 7. A year ago, something I wrote quickly wasn't ready for querying. After a year of writing shitloads of words - and doing so quickly - I'm better at it, my stories are better, and yes, something written/edited fast can be ready for submission.

It's a muscle...the more you use it, the more you can use it, and the more effectively you can use it.

[K. Taylor]

Wow, querying the NaNo book this quick......yeah, no. Mine isn't even finished, for one. Poor saps thinking they're done when all they looked for were typos......

[thethinker42]

Wow, querying the NaNo book this quick......yeah, no. Mine isn't even finished, for one. Poor saps thinking they're done when all they looked for were typos......

Not everyone who edits quickly is only looking for typos. Some people write/edit fast, some don't. I'm not saying the NaNo books being queried ARE ready, but don't assume they aren't just because they're done quickly. I just finished doing a thorough line edit, including rearranging some chapters and revamping a few plot issues, in 3 days...on my 93,000 word NaNo novel.

[scarletpeaches]

Wow, querying the NaNo book this quick......yeah, no. Mine isn't even finished, for one. Poor saps thinking they're done when all they looked for were typos......God, yeah. Lori's such a loser with her four publishing contracts in less than six months with the longest time spent on one book being 37 days.

[Misa Buckley]

Lori's such a loser with her four publishing contracts in less than six months with the longest time spent on one book being 37 days.

Lori's the exception though. And, I suspect, not entirely human :tongue



Helen, who is still convinced Lori has infinite monkeys chained to typewriters in her cellar

[scarletpeaches]

Are you calling me a monkey?

[thethinker42]

Lori's the exception though. And, I suspect, not entirely human :tongue

Helen, who is still convinced Lori has infinite monkeys chained to typewriters in her cellar

Hahaha :D

In all seriousness though, it can be done. Everyone works at different speeds, and those of us who work fast are no better or worse than those who don't. While I certainly do believe that many, if not the majority, of these NaNo queries are premature, I cringe at the assumption that "done fast" = "done poorly".

Was my NaNo novel ready to query last year? No, because I hadn't come into my own and matured as a writer yet.

Is my NaNo novel from this year ready to query? As of about 20 minutes ago, yes, it is. The only reason it isn't being queried yet is I've got some beta readers looking at it because of some particular plot points (checking for accuracy) and SP is writing my synopsis for me. Otherwise? I'd query it this minute.

[thethinker42]

Are you calling me a monkey?

If the shoe fits...

[scarletpeaches]

Ook ook ook.

[kaitie]

Maybe I'll just pay TT42 to edit my book for me lol. It'd be done way faster lol. ;)

[thethinker42]

Maybe I'll just pay TT42 to edit my book for me lol. It'd be done way faster lol. ;)

Little known secret about tt42: She may write and edit fast, but she is THE slowest beta reader on the face of the Earth. :D

[scarletpeaches]

You know what, if tt42 and I weren't so fabulously productive and obsessed with our own books, we could make a mint.

She could edit, I could synopserise and between us we'd get everyone on AW published within a year.

[Misa Buckley]

Are you calling me a monkey?

Are you chained up in Lori's cellar? Actually, scratch that - I don't wanna know...


While I certainly do believe that many, if not the majority, of these NaNo queries are premature, I cringe at the assumption that "done fast" = "done poorly".

Well, no, of course it doesn't. Just as books that take years and years aren't necessarily excellent works of art.

But there is a difference in being able to write 50K in a month and being able to write a book in a month. Sadly, most of those subbing have only done the former and are going to get their fingers burnt.

[scarletpeaches]

Are you chained up in Lori's cellar? Actually, scratch that - I don't wanna know...There's a reason she keeps insisting my ticket to Japan should only be one way...

[thethinker42]

Well, no, of course it doesn't. Just as books that take years and years aren't necessarily excellent works of art.

But there is a difference in being able to write 50K in a month and being able to write a book in a month. Sadly, most of those subbing have only done the former and are going to get their fingers burnt.

Oh, I agree, trust me. Most aren't ready, I would guess. But some? You never know.

There's a reason she keeps insisting my ticket to Japan should only be one way...

:D

[kaitie]

Little known secret about tt42: She may write and edit fast, but she is THE slowest beta reader on the face of the Earth. :D

Lol, probably because you're busy writing an entire book a month. :tongue

[Jersey Chick]

Lori's, like, Superman or something... when I grow up, I wanna be like her. :D

Seriously, I wish I could write and produce something that quickly, but alas, my skillz - they are not so sharp that way.

I'm thisclose to having last year's NaNo project ready to go (which is a good thing because I am sick,sick,sick of looking at it, to tell the truth.)

[Sheryl Nantus]

CAN it be done?

sure...

SHOULD it be done?

I'd say not, unless you really, REALLY have that knack of writing a fantastic first draft that barely needs editing.

however, it is possible to sell Nanos...

*points at sig*

2007 and 2008 Nano novels, sold.

but I sure as heck didn't send them off until months later...

;)

[Cliff Face]

My NaNo isn't even finished yet - there's still about 30k to go, assuming I don't do another 6k chapter of dialogue again. Seriously, this last chapter has been nearly all dialogue, and while it's interesting and semi-relevant, it'll probably just get chopped up later. Meanwhile, it ends with a cop being handcuffed to a bed, so that's win.

As for the argument that most NaNo's aren't ready to be submitted, I'd have to say that that's a fair cop. I'd hate to submit my NaNo even if I was finished with the first draft. It'll need at least a month of editing, I'd say... of course, this is my first time editing, so I need to get used to the harrowing feeling of having to chop a bit that I love but which isn't necessary, which could take days.

Ultimately, though, I think I'll be a fairly quick editor. That's because while not all of my words are relevant, or the best they can be, the overall effect of the novel was well-thought-out and I didn't just write crap for the sake of getting my word count up. I'm not working, so I had plenty of time to hit 50k, so I thought about what I was writing. It's really only the sprints I did that led me down Irrelevant Lane. :)

If I had stopped at 65k like I had orginally planned before adding to the story, then I would've had time to start editing by now, and so there's a very slim chance that if I was persistent it'd be ready for querying about now.

I can't say it'd be an easy sell, but it's still probably the best thing I've ever written, even before editing, so editing for a couple of weeks would've made it start to sparkle, like a Cullen in a field.

But what I took from the whole, "These people are querying their 50k as soon as it's done" sort of thing, I took that it was similar to what I did with my first book, which was send it out to an agent without editing it, and wondering why it was rejected (before I got my head out of my arse :D).

If I do wind up getting this NaNovel published ever, then I'll make a mention of NaNoWriMo in my thankyou page, but I won't be mentioning that this was a NaNovel when I query it. My feelings are that regardless of how many good writers do NaNo, it's still got an air of "amateur-night" about it... sad, but that's my gut feeling.

Note: I'm in no way calling anyone here an amateur for having done NaNo. I'm just saying that the bulk of the people who DID do NaNo around the world, chances are most of them have never been published, and a lot of them this would've been their first foray into writing, and publishers and agents will know that.

I think the people on this site have a leg up over the competition. We have probably the largest "writing circle" in the world, and plenty of great writers to learn from, and most of us are here every day.

If only mentioning AW in my query would get me an in... *schemes*

[K. Taylor]

But there is a difference in being able to write 50K in a month and being able to write a book in a month. Sadly, most of those subbing have only done the former and are going to get their fingers burnt.

Exactly. I didn't say anything about fast=crap.

A lot of NaNo participants are first time writers or first time novelists. Are they ready to query as soon as they've run spell check? Highly, highly doubtful. Very few beings ever are naturally brilliant writers right out of the bat. The vast majority of us have to work at the craft and get better over time. And put serious thought into looking at the book for possible editing.

We all know how many people query agents/publishers that weren't even close to ready.

[Chasing the Horizon]

I'm sure most of the NaNo novels being submitted aren't ready to be queried. But then, most of the novels being queried at any given time aren't ready, which is why they get rejected, lol.

I could write, edit, and polish 50k in a month easily if I wanted to. But my novels run more like 100k, so it would take me two months or so to have one ready.

[scarletpeaches]

I took a year to sub the novel I started last November. Course, it ran to 148k on the first draft and it took some effort to whittle it down to 85k...

Actually, little effort to be honest. All the crap I took out just didn't need to be there, as illlustrated by the fact you can't see the join.

And I wrote two other books since then and half of another.

[blacbird]

I'm sure most of the NaNo novels being submitted aren't ready to be queried.

Most of the novels of any sort being submitted aren't ready to be queried. Ask any agent.

caw

[Samantha's_Song]

Just what I was thinking. It seems that some people think that every little thing they write is worth publishing, and yet most of the time it's not worth the email or paper it's printed on. ;)
Oh, great. So this isn't the best time to be querying a real novel? :(

[Ellefire]

I'll hold my hand up. When I finished 'A Threnody For Scarlet' I edited it (probably not very well) and queried it. Looking back I realise it was a mistake. It wasn't ready. I wasn't ready. It's not a bad book, but it could be better.

'Asylum' (Last years nano) is already better and I haven't edited it yet. Mainly because it crashed and burned until this July when I took it up again and finished it. Currently I'm finishing this years nano, then editing 'Asylum' properly. Maybe 'Asylum' will be ready to query sometime next year.

It's quite easy for a newish writer to get all carried away. You look at your book and think it's good, everyone who reads it tells you it ought to be published, and you start seeing it as far superior than it actually is. You don't have the experience to realise it has major problems. When I let people read 'Asylum' I warned them it has problems. That it's a shitty first draft - although a beta-reader from here did tell me he couldn't believe it was a first draft, so there's something right with it - and despite them loving it, it needs to be better before I take it to the next step.

[gothicangel]

To me it sounds like a lack of commitment to craft (can't or won't?) Or otherwise they've read too many JKR articles!

I don't think being a first time author is a justifiable reason either, my first novel had several drafts before subbing [was still shit though!) But there again, I had spent a lot of time reading books and magazines on the craft and the industry itself.

[Ellefire]

First novel you wrote or first queried, gothicangel? Mine wasn't the first I wrote. It was the 4th or 5th. When I submitted it, I honestly believed it was good enough. I had very little experience with the publishing side of things. I'm older and wiser now, and better educated in what agents are looking for.

[gothicangel]

First one I wrote, otherwise same thing.

I thought it was so good, I went into shock over the first rejection!

Aah the innocence of youth . . .

[Ellefire]

Haha, I've had that! When I told a friend I'd had a rejection from quite a new publishing house he was livid on my behalf. "They published <insert name of mediocre novel here> but passed on yours?"

After reading some real cruddy published novel over the years, it comes as a shock when your, far far superior, novel is rejected. But you live and learn. :D It's all experience innit?

[Rhoda Nightingale]

Wow. I guess I'm not surprised--for some people, I suppose NaNo marks the first time they write a complete draft, and they must take it as a sign that they're doing it right. Hell, I love my NaNo, I think it has loads of potential, but I am definitely not querying it yet. I know I have a lot of work to do still.

Then there's this guy I work with who, when I told him I'd written a novel, insists on asking me every day if it's been published yet. I tried to explain to him that these things take time, some people query for YEARS and still don't get anywhere. He hasn't read my manuscript, by the way; he just thinks that anyone who writes a book automatically gets published within weeks, if they ask nicely, or something. *sigh*

On the plus side, once those rejections get handed back en masse maybe they'll learn something from them.

[RJK]

The slushpile statistics are pretty accurate. 95% are just plain crap. 2% might make it some day. 2% have something that, with some work is publishable, and 1% is ready for the publisher. Those NaNo folks who sent in, or queried their first draft are most likely in the 97%.

[ejwriter]

i think it really just depends on the story, right? some may come out better in the first draft than others.

i think the novel i spent all last year writing has a great concept and a query that could probably pull lots of partial requests. however, i'm not sending out that luscious query, because now that the story is finished, I can see it needs MONTHS of work - possibly another year's worth... and maybe an entire rewrite.

however, just 20K into the story i'm writing now, I can already tell it's closer to done than the story that's actually, y'know, done.

maybe it just depends.

[Samantha's_Song]

Your beta-reader was very lucky. I get sent stuff that seems very much first draft when I'm looking at it, even though I always make it plain that I'll only beat-read stuff that the writer thinks is ready for querying. ;)
That it's a shitty first draft - although a beta-reader from here did tell me he couldn't believe it was a first draft, so there's something right with it - and despite them loving it, it needs to be better before I take it to the next step.

[Phaeal]

One reason why I'm taking a querying break in December -- why compete with the NaNo queries or risk hitting an agent more than usually harrassed by premature pitches?

[scarletpeaches]

I subbed to a publisher yesterday, but the editor concerned had had a warning around a month ago that I'd be sending it so I assume I'm safe, and that she would know this is not a NaNo novel. That is to say, she knew I had the manuscript then and was just tweaking it. These aren't 85,000 words I've written in November.

[Ellefire]

Your beta-reader was very lucky. I get sent stuff that seems very much first draft when I'm looking at it, even though I always make it plain that I'll only beat-read stuff that the writer thinks is ready for querying. ;)

I think I was the lucky one. I beta read his first and he offered to read something of mine in return. I said I had something that I wouldn't mind some feedback on, but I did tell him I hadn't even so much as corrected the typos yet. I didn't want line by line, but 'tell me this doesn't suck and the story works' kind of feedback.

[Etola]

You know, reading this thread has gotten me annoyed that I can't be faster with my edits. I've gotten a lot faster with writing first drafts over the years (thanks to the impetus of Nano spreading into the months following), but I have never actually completed a second draft of a novel. I'm almost there, but it's taken me a year :P Gah, I need to get faster!