# or ## ?

[danielmc]

When formatting a manuscript, am i right in thinking that you use a single # without a line space on top or below, to indicate a single line break; a break in a scene or a small gap in time without the need to start a new chapter?

And the use of # # indicates a gap of two lines in the MS, i.e. a longer break in the action?

Is this system flawed? Am I wrong or is there a standard way for doing this?

Ta in advance.

[loquax]

I'm not aware of the difference between a single or double line break. For me, a big break is a new chapter, a small break is a single *

[Cathy C]

There are only two types of breaks in fiction novels. A "scene" break (also called a line break), is where you are moving forward in time, moving to a different location, or moving to another character's POV, but remaining in the same chapter. It's designated in the manuscript by inserting a hard return, as though starting a new paragraph and then inserting EITHER a single hash mark (#) or a double hash mark (##) against the left margin. Whether you insert one or two hash marks is immaterial to the editor. You then drop another paragraph and begin to type once more.

A chapter break ENDS a scene and is designated by a hard page return.

As loquax asked, what do you consider to be a "longer" break that might be between the two?

[scribbler1382]

That's how I do it, except I center them on the line. Sometimes instead of typing THE END I'll put three centered hash marks at the end of the manuscript, as well.

[James D. Macdonald]

While # is correct, there is no practical difference between #, ##, and ***.

If your manuscript is accepted, it won't be because you used #, and if it's rejected it won't be because you used +++.

[danielmc]

There are only two types of breaks in fiction...

As loquax asked, what do you consider to be a "longer" break that might be between the two?

A single line break indicates a small timeshift, an hour, a day perhaps, whilst two indicates a longer break, a week , or a location change. The WIP is in first person present tense and doesn't lend itself to transtions that jump forward great swathes of time. (The whole novel is based over twelve months). i.e, it would jar if I wrote "And then we did such and such for a week before I ended up here and as the cat sits on the mat I'm smoking I'm drinking..." etc. It wouldn't be strict and proper present tense.

I can't remember where I got the single # and double # tip from.

The best example in a novel, that I can think of, where transitions are handled like this is in the English Patient, where there are 'levels' of line breaks, ranging from one to half a page, each indicating changes of time, location, year, continent.

I'm certainly no Michael Ondaatje, but there can be nothing wrong with borrowing and adapting techniques such as this. I think!

[Cathy C]

I haven't read The English Patient, so I can't comment on the author's use of spacing in this manner. Can anyone else comment on that?

Pretty much the industry standard is a hash mark but, as Uncle Jim indicates, it doesn't really matter which symbol you use, so long as you use it consistently and it's unusual (in that it couldn't be accidentally confused for text by the editor). So, *^#+~ or other things could probably be used for the purpose. But # is traditional.

[James D. Macdonald]

The best example in a novel, that I can think of, where transitions are handled like this is in the English Patient, where there are 'levels' of line breaks, ranging from one to half a page, each indicating changes of time, location, year, continent.

The technical term for this is, I believe, "weird-a$$ formatting."

If you're going to use weird-a$$ formatting, the time to bring it up is in discussion with your editor while the book is in production.

IOW, the plot, characters, and theme will have had to have sold the story long before then.

[ChunkyC]

The # or *** should just denote a pause for a shift in time and/or place within a chapter. How long and/or how far should be made obvious by the text that comes after the mark. Like Jim says, how it should be presented to the reader in final form (the book) is a discussion to have after you've sold it to a publisher, and probably after any post-sale editing has been completed.

[Maryn]

Although this has little direct bearing, I just want to go on record as detesting all the cutesy crap some publishers put to mark section breaks. I know I'm reading a murder mystery, thanks--no need for the dripping daggar.

Maryn, who owns a book where each footnote is marked with--ugh--a foot

[Cathy C]

Maryn, who owns a book where each footnote is marked with--ugh--a foot

:ROFL: Maryn! I agree, but the author seldom gets a choice. Our first one has the breaks designated by crossed railroad spikes. Not my FAVORITE choice, but not horrible, either. I would probably have beat my head on the wall if they'd chosen little choo-choo trains.