Narrative questions

[hlywkar]

Hey. I'm about to try to pull of my first novel. Previously I have just messed around and pumped out a few short stories for school. I was wondering if I could get some help in my new endeavor.

I want to write a novel. With one main character, and about 5 or more other strong characters. I'm fairly sure I want to follow the main character around solely and have the story from their point of view. Now here's the tough part. What narritive should I use?
I'm fairly sure I want this to be a from the start of the go story, meaning, no uplead or I'm telling this story from the future and this is what happened to me. I don't want dear diary format either. I'm stuck between first person or third person. And the various forms of each. I like the thought of using first person; however, then it seems hard to include other things in the novel that may be important to the story/reader, but not as much to the 1st person. Like describing a scene and including symbolism. But I also like the thought of including personal thoughts or feelings on a situation (the 1st person's that is). Is it bad to switch inbetween 3rd person and 1st person? or is there a way to have it 1st person and still pull off the benifits of the 3rd? Or... could you offer any other advice that may come to mind...

As a side note. I have actually debated following multiple characters around either as 3rd person, or as seperate 1st person narritives or the cobination of them. That would seem excessively jumbbled though and probly out of my league. Feel free to comment on this as a possibility as well.

Thanks for all your help. Rich.

[janetbellinger]

Hey. I'm about to try to pull of my first novel. Previously I have just messed around and pumped out a few short stories for school. I was wondering if I could get some help in my new endeavor.

I want to write a novel. With one main character, and about 5 or more other strong characters. I'm fairly sure I want to follow the main character around solely and have the story from their point of view. Now here's the tough part. What narritive should I use?
I'm fairly sure I want this to be a from the start of the go story, meaning, no uplead or I'm telling this story from the future and this is what happened to me. I don't want dear diary format either. I'm stuck between first person or third person. And the various forms of each. I like the thought of using first person; however, then it seems hard to include other things in the novel that may be important to the story/reader, but not as much to the 1st person. Like describing a scene and including symbolism. But I also like the thought of including personal thoughts or feelings on a situation (the 1st person's that is). Is it bad to switch inbetween 3rd person and 1st person? or is there a way to have it 1st person and still pull off the benifits of the 3rd? Or... could you offer any other advice that may come to mind...

As a side note. I have actually debated following multiple characters around either as 3rd person, or as seperate 1st person narritives or the cobination of them. That would seem excessively jumbbled though and probly out of my league. Feel free to comment on this as a possibility as well.

Thanks for all your help. Rich.

Hi, Rich.
You're actually only an hour away from me and I graduated from U of W (okay it was in 1974, but still , I was there.)
I don't think there is one right POV. It can either be first or third person. Lots of people write their first novel in first person. I have done that with my current novel. It does leave lots of openings for getting inside the character's head that way, but of course, if you do that too much the story might seem too passive or as though you're telling rather than showing. I am actually rewriting my novel, deleting thousands of words of the main character's thoughts as I felt it might be too boring to the r reader to read long passeges of interior monologue. I don't know that there is one best way. Some publishers like Harlequin require third person for all of their lines but one. I like it for my current novel because it gives me direct access to my character. But third person is probably most preferred by writers. Good luck.

[HeyBooBoo]

You can do a third person POV and still narrate the character's thoughts and feelings. If you do decide to do a third person POV don't jump back and forth between third and first, it can be confusing to the reader. If you do the story in first person you can always have your character describe a scene. I personally find first person to be difficult, but it's up to you to decide which works best for you.

Starting from where the story starts is a good idea, any necessary character back story can unfold as the novel progresses. I have a few questions about you saying that you don't want to tell the story "from the future and this is what happened to me." First, is this based on a true story or the story of your life? Just curious. Also, are you referring to telling the story in past tense? If so, from what I've gathered on this fine board is that past tense should be used. You might find that a story is easier to tell in past tense. While I don't know if present tense is frowned upon, I do know that once you pick one make sure to stick with it.

I'm sure more people could give you helpful advice, and good luck!

[Maryn]

Of course it's really all up to you, but there are hordes of people (hear them at the gates?) who are comfortable only with limited third person POV (that's point of view), past tense.

Open several recent novels at random, and that's what you're most likely to see.

Of course this presents challenges (how can I tell the reader something my guy doesn't see?)--but every POV does.

Sure, there are authors who use present tense, second person, first person, multiple POVs, and so on, in every variation imagineable, but to do that well takes more skill and practice than the more conventional method. That's why I'd recommend a first draft in past tense, 3rd person limited. You can always change it in rewrite if you think it will serve you better.

Maryn, pleased to meet you

[hlywkar]

I have a few questions about you saying that you don't want to tell the story "from the future and this is what happened to me." First, is this based on a true story or the story of your life? Just curious. Also, are you referring to telling the story in past tense? If so, from what I've gathered on this fine board is that past tense should be used. You might find that a story is easier to tell in past tense. While I don't know if present tense is frowned upon, I do know that once you pick one make sure to stick with it.

Sorry I was speaking in narrative at the time... for example "my name is Brian, I am a mutated rat subjected to horrible lab tests. And this is my story." So to answer your question, it's not about me. It's also not about a mutated rat, god rest his soul, named Brian. It is also not a true story. I want it all to seem new and unusual. Such that even those in the know, the characters in the know, wouldn't have known about what is happening. I personally feel that that might be lost if I write in past tense. Because then the narrative, whom or what ever it is, knows what is going on. Or do you guys feel that past tense is still the way to go? is present tense too hard? or perhaps would present tense not make sense in describing scenes etc.

[Avalon]

If I were you, I'd just pick one, jump in, and start writing. Play with first and third, depending on the scene, etc, and as you write, the best way to tell the story will probably make itself evident. Then you can make it consistent (or deliberately inconsistent) in your second and third drafts -- when you likely will have to revise just about everything, anyway.

[JanDarby]

I'd second what Maryn said -- third person limited is the most universally accepted by readers, and is probably easiest to do well on a first manuscript.

Past tense is so thoroughly accepted by readers that they (we? Writers are readers too) don't really think of it as implying that the characters know the outcome, unless there are bookends -- a prologue/epilogue pairing (e.g., The Princess Bride, which starts with someone reading the book and ends with someone wanting to hear the story again) -- to signal that this is a story that's being told, rather than unfolding in the story time.

Besides, it doesn't really matter in your first draft what POV or tense you use, as long as you're consistent. You can always change it in revision. So, pick one -- I'd recommend the "standard" of third person limited, past tense -- and start writing.

JD

[Gillhoughly]

You use whatever is the most comfortable "voice" for you to be able to tell the story.

Your viewpoint character has to be the best person to tell the story.

I began my first novel in 3rd person. Not so many pages in it dried up for me. I switched to first person so I could get inside the character's skin and feel the sweat, hear his thoughts.

It worked. However, you can do that in third person, too.

I strongly suggest you take this summer and do nothing but reading before you start writing. Read ALL kinds of books, not just the ones you normally like.

For good third person read "Confederacy of Dunces" by John Kennedy Toole. You are exactly at the right age to totally enjoy that one!

For 1st person read Conan Doyle's Sherlock Holmes series--and I mean the whole shebang. Watson was in 1st person most of the time. It was from Doyle that I learned how to deliver a succinct but informative description of characters. He was also a master of PLOT.

More third person: go with Lois McMaster Bujold's Warrior's Apprentice. It's a coming of age story, well told, and part of her Hugo-winning S/F series. You can't have a better teacher!

But this is the most important--go to the 808 section of your library (while you're picking up the above titles) and start reading it. The 808 section has all the books on how to write. You won't use everything that every writer says, but it will give you the background you need as a writer.

One book you will need to buy if you've not already gotten it is Strunk and White's Elements of Style. Most used stores will have a copy if you're on a budget.

Every pro I know has that one on or near their desk, and it is well-thumbed from use.

Good luck!

[Avalon]

And don't forget Uncle Jim's thread, right here. Can't do much better than that! :)