On The Road, by Jack Kerouac.

[Godfather]

It was about a month or more ago that I read it, but I loved it!

That is all.

[AprilBoo]

On the Road is one of my favorites - the orange in the bathtub makes me laugh every time I read it.

[clintl]

It's been quite a few years since I read it, but I loved it, too.

[Godfather]

I have got to get Mexico City Blues too. I just gotta.

Man, I fell in love with Dean Moriarty when I read it. I started to call a friend of mine Dean, because he's similar to him. He called me Sal.

[TemlynWriting]

I've been meaning to read this for at least 8 years. When I was in college a bunch of my fellow English majors were big fans of the Beat Generation writers, and somewhere along the lines I bought the book, but it's sitting on my shelf. I think what got me was when one of my friends read the last paragraph or two aloud for our Oral Interpretation class.

One of my roommates was so sure I'd like Kerouac that she gave me a copy of The Subterraneans for my birthday a few years ago. Still haven't read that, either. I'll add both to my "next reads" list. :)

[sassandgroove]

It is interesting because when I read it, I had moved back home, and I was sort of in a static mode, my life on hiatus... Iwas waiting/preparing for the next move. I had lived in Los Angeles for 7 years and moved to Cuba KS population 260. This is where I read On the Road, a very frantic crazy book full of motion. I've heard that Jack actuallly wrote it on a roll of paper in his typewriter, so he wouldn't have to stop to change paper, messing up his rhythm. The first wordprocessor, if you will.

It amazes me that there are people who can do what Sal did, just GO, with no plan, no idea where they will sleep or eat, or get money. They just GO. I always have a plan, I always know where my my next paycheck will be and how much it will be. I type out a menu and grocery list, for Pete's sake!

[Godfather]

he wrote it in one session, and didn't revise it apparently.

sals moving, and deans general behaviour fascinates me. like woody guthrie and that stuff

[SylviaDiamandez]

At the time, AP and UPI wire service printers in radio stations and at newspapers used long rolls of newsprint. Jack wrote On The Road on one so he wouldn't have to stop to change the paper in his typewriter. The finished product was more like a book length run-on sentence. I've heard stories that the ms he originally submitted to publishers was the unedited roll.

All of his characters were based on real people. Henri Cru, a friend who lived in San Francisco, was Remi Boncoeur. "The world owes me a few things, that's all. You can't teach the old maestro a new tune ... "

[KTC]

I am a HUGE Kerouac fan. On The Road is my least favourite. My favs are Tristessa, Dharma Bums, Satori in Paris, Pic, Pomes All Sizes and The Subterraneans. I think I may have read On The Road three times. I've read Dharma Bums and Satori over and over again.

[sassandgroove]

KTC, What did you think of it, though?

[KTC]

KTC, What did you think of it, though?

On The Road? I think it did not live up to its hype. I enjoyed it, yes. But there were places where he just didn't seem into it. Most of the Kerouac I read is electrified with intensity...this one, not so much for me.

[KTC]

With Tristessa, on the other hand...I lose my mind. It's so beautiful that I forget who I am when I am reading it.

[sassandgroove]

That's interesting because it's the only one I've read. To me, it was constantly in motion, so if it wasn't so much to you, his other ones must be really intense. I'll have to check them out. Thanks.

[KTC]

Just don't hit me over the head with On The Road if you disagree. It's a small book, but if you're really mad you could probably wield it well. (-;

[sassandgroove]

:)

[Nyna]

On the Road's definitely worth reading, but I have to pop in and say I much preferred The Dharma Bums, and that's the one I recommend to people. :)

[poetinahat]

On The Road? I think it did not live up to its hype. I enjoyed it, yes. But there were places where he just didn't seem into it. Most of the Kerouac I read is electrified with intensity...this one, not so much for me.
I had a different problem: I found the protag. unlikeable -- flitting around, splitting town when things went sour, and eventually running back to his trust-fund home.

'Course, I read OTR twenty-odd years ago, and I oughta re-read to see whether my memory serves me poorly. Maybe after I read some other Kerouac; Kevin, you make a good case for doing so (as well as for other Salinger).

[SylviaDiamandez]

Viking / Penguin is publishing the original unedited roll next year, for the book's 50th anniversary. The first draft had scenes too suggestive and/or sexual for publishing in 1957.

[persiphone_hellecat]

God it's been so many years since I read it ... I remember that summer I had these two squirrels in my front yard - they used to sit on the mailbox and wait for their lazy butts to be fed peanuts ... I named them Dean and Marylou ... A few years later, I considered naming my son Cassidy but the hubby nixed it ... That's a book that's more than just a book for people my age - it was a rite of passage ... Great memories ... I will re read this summer ...

[KTC]

Oh Poet, don't even get me started on Salinger. I'm obsessed. Literally.

Rob, with your poet's mind I think Tristessa will stop you in your tracks. It's rather all over the place...I have to confess. But it's pure poetics. It's like your heart keeps expanding the more you read until you're afraid it's going to burst. (But don't take my word for it...I'm weird.)

[Sesselja]

I enjoyed the rythms of the language, but that was about all I enjoyed of OTR. It bored me a quarter into the book, so I didn't even finish it. My hubby liked it though.

[Schnurretiger]

"Road" was the book that got me hooked on Kerouac. And now I've got more than 4 feet of Kerouac, secondary sources and Beat-lit on my shelf.
I admire OtR for its description of the U.S., the description of the times Kerouac lived in. He was a brilliant observer and the way he depicts the changes in society are worth reading each and every one of his books.
Tristessa didn't move me that much, but that opinion might change, as I'm about to read it again, as I want to write my final exam paper on Kerouac. Anybody got an idea for a topic? There's so much to write about him...

[Shadow_Ferret]

I loved On the Road, but oddly enough I never read anything else by him.

[KTC]

Not odd. For a ferret.

[whistlelock]

Man, I fell in love with Dean Moriarty Funnily enough, so was Jack.

And the "typing it out in one session" is a myth started by Jack himself. There are multiple revisions on multiple onion skin rolls.

And On the Road is my favorite, and I have read the majority of his works.

I likes him.

[Scarlett_156]

That book has been a huge influence on me my entire life-- not just my writing, either-- like EVERYTHING.

I always wanted to do the "drive coast to coast in one shot" thing but could never find anyone who wanted to try it. Very discouraging! Last summer, however, I made a trip from here (Denver) to Knoxville TN (where me and my sisters were all born) on my motorcycle, by myself. I purposely did not plan my route, and made many side trips.

Frankly, sometimes I wonder how I managed to live through the experience. The whole thing was totally larger-than-life and monumental, though. I nearly wrecked into some deer who were crossing a highway exit ramp in Topeka at 3 in the morning, found a haunted house in rural Missouri, saw scenes of incredible beauty and mystery nearly everywhere I looked, got chased by some guys outside a cemetery, rested for a few hours in a vast used car lot, stayed in one of the skeeziest motels ever in Wichita (I called my friend who's into Bukowski and told him that Chuck would have loved this place), saw the full moon rise on solstice eve over the Mississippi River, nearly got eaten by ants in St. Louis, slept in a cornfield in Kentucky, talked to a variety of interesting people, saw the biggest hairest gray spider I've ever seen in my life under some blackberry brambles in Tennessee, exchanged grins and a wave with a cute Amish teen who was driving a wagon on a back highway, and... well, just did a bunch of crazy stuff. Did a whole bunch of stuff for the first, but likely not the last, time in my life.

Here's a picture of a place where I pulled off the road to rest just at sunrise in southern Missouri--
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b103/RScribes/Pictures%202005/sunriseMissouriJune2005.jpg

And let you think that I'm trying to make this thread be about me instead of Jack-- if it wasn't for Jack I would definitely be a much different person today, whether better or worse I have no way of knowing, but: It's all about you, Jean baby! ;) You the man.

I was already a writer and in love with writing when I first read "On The Road" (in sixth grade, attending Catholic school in Wichita Kansas). But the way this guy wrote set my brain on fire. I wanted to write like him in that pumping flow of words like a heartbeat and a whoosh of blood, and BE him. (I started playing chess so I could be like Jack!)

So now that I've finally roaded like Jack, I'm going to try a more ambitious project. I had been going to do this this past September with a friend of mine but-- guess what?-- she wussed out. "Oh I just can't see the point in driving that far!" Once again, then, it'll just be me, in November, going east and maybe (if the weather cooperates) into Canada. (Did you hear me, Jean!? Canada, baby!!)

[BottomlessCup]

I'm a colossal Kerouac fan.

He's probably the writer whose work has had the largest influence on my life - spawning many road-trips and hitch-hiking journeys (including one that specifically hit all the major Kerouac cities.)

I've read - I think - all his work (although "Some of the Dharma" wore me out) and I sort of feel like all the various opinions about OTR make sense.

When people hate it, I get it. It's very much an imperfect book - as are all of his works. That's part of Kerouac, love it or hate it. His work has never felt, to me, like a typical 'book' - edited and perfected and finished. It's like something my friend sat up all night writing and called me at four in the morning and made me come read in a greasy spoon over coffee and Pall Malls.

Maybe it doesn't read like standard literature, but, IMO, it was never meant to. Kerouac wrote because he wanted you to understand what he was saying and feeling. Everything else be damned.

When JK fans say that it's not his best work, I understand and agree. But I still think it's the best one to start with and that it should stand as his representative work. If you start with, say, Visions of Neal, it's all over. OTR is the closest his work (his real work - screw "The Town and the City" and that "Pic" monstrosity) gets to mainstream, so it's a good jumping off point.

Kerouac did some readings which are on CD. I think they're a good thing to listen to if you're having trouble with his prose. He was raised bilingual and his rhythm can be quirky. Hearing him read it makes it flow much more easily.

[Lee G.]

I'm reading On the Road right now, and it is a really great book. I love how it gives me insight into where other artists I admire came from: Bob Dylan, Thomas Pynchon, and on and on. They were all deeply inspired by this book.

The sights, sounds, and weird characters the book captures are the best. It's definitely THE modern American picaresque novel.

One aspect of the book I find interesting but no one seems to mention is the ambiguity of the Dean Moriarty character. Everyone but the narrator (who is an obvious stand-in for JK) thinks Dean is just a flake. As one character puts it: "He's really nothing but a very interesting con man." Personally, I think you CAN see him that way. To me, he's definitely not the "holy man" JK seems to think he is.

I think it's interesting that JK ended up as a bitter, deeply conservative man who lived with his mama until he died in his forties. It kinda casts a pall over the "philosophies" espoused in the book. I know it sounds like I didn't like the book, but that's not true. I just like looking at it from a critical angle as well as just being entertained by it. And it is one heck of an entertaining read.

[Scarlett_156]

^^ That's why I seldom try to find out more about authors OR musicians with whom I'm infatuated. I know them through their work, and not as people-- and that's how I prefer it.

Creating something really wonderful seems to take something out of an artist a lot of the time. Though the process of creation is invigorating, when it's all over you're sort of... empty.

[Shadow_Ferret]

Everyone but the narrator (who is an obvious stand-in for JK) ....

Wait. Did I read On the Road wrong? I thought it was an autobiographical journey? It was fiction?

[Stew21]

Visions of Cody, Dharma Bums and On The Road are all great. I haven't read any of Jack's work in a long time. I must get back to him.
GF - there's a movie (gee i sure can't remember the title, I'll look it up) that's about Neal Cassady and a girl. Let me see if I can find out what it was so you can maybe watch it for another Kerouac fix. it is based on a letter Neal wrote to Jack.

ETA:
http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0119502/

this link talks a bit about neal cassady - (dean moriarty in OTR)
http://us.imdb.com/name/nm0143944/bio

[Lee G.]

Wait. Did I read On the Road wrong? I thought it was an autobiographical journey? It was fiction?

It's largely autobiographical (not sure to exactly what degree), but Kerouac gave everyone fictional names. He's Sal Paradise, for example. Allen Ginsberg is Carlo Marx, Neal Cassady is Dean Moriarty. And the book is listed under Fiction, for whatever that's worth.

[Stew21]

It's largely autobiographical (not sure to exactly what degree), but Kerouac gave everyone fictional names. He's Sal Paradise, for example. Allen Ginsberg is Carlo Marx, Neal Cassady is Dean Moriarty. And the book is listed under Fiction, for whatever that's worth.
yes, and they typically are re-incarnated in his other books as fictional characters as well. Cassady appears as Cody, Dean, and I believe one other character in Jack's books. Largely autobiographical, though listed as fiction because he probably peppered a few things.

[Lee G.]

^^ That's why I seldom try to find out more about authors OR musicians with whom I'm infatuated. I know them through their work, and not as people-- and that's how I prefer it.

Creating something really wonderful seems to take something out of an artist a lot of the time. Though the process of creation is invigorating, when it's all over you're sort of... empty.

I totally agree with you, most of the time. But when a book becomes a lifestyle guide (as this one has for millions of people over several generations), it's worth looking at the life led by the author/protagonist. When said author ends up living with his mama back in New Jersery and totally repudiating his earlier belief system, you should probably ask questions about the philosophy his book espouses. I have no problem with On the Road. I think it's a great picaresque novel and a good motivator for people to get out and see America. I do think that when you look for deep, life-changing meaning in the book's characters, you need to take it with a grain of salt. Just my opinion.

It reminds me of a reality TV show that's filmed in my hometown. It features a bunch of guys flipping houses and making ungodly profits. It all looks fun on TV. But I happen to know people in their family, and I know that one of the guys is going through a messy divorce because his wife (a sweet lady) says he 's too busy making money and being on TV to make time for her and the kids. You'll never see that part on the "reality" show though, even though it makes a perfect counterargument to the idea that making money is just fun and games.

I just think it's interesting to see the story that goes on after the show is over... or after the book is published... That is, if you want to look at it from the angle of character study and personal philosophy, and not just as entertainment.

[Scarlett_156]

It's possible that there is some objective merit in holding heroes up to intense scrutiny. I do see what you're saying, but when all is said and done-- the guy is dead. He died a long time ago. Who knows what he would be saying now if he was still alive? I don't think that he really meant to become a spokesperson for anything, he was simply doing what a writer does and WRITING, so that's how I take what he says. (I take the meat and leave the gristle in other words. Yes it's selfish. I'm a terribly selfish and self-centered individual. :))

Like apophysis or epiphany, death is but a moment. If I was to suddenly have a heart attack while sitting on the can, hopefully the writer of my obiturary would be kind enough to leave out the words of judgment-- "An old crank known for her dislike of children who keeled over while reading 'Liber AL vel Legis' on the toilet. I would say 'God rest her soul', but we all know God will have no use for her."

I mean, brutal honesty in the case of dead people can only take ya so far. When I read William Buckley's vitriolic commentary written at the death of Ayn Rand, it seemed to me the creepy ranting of a jealous old fart. She sold more books than Bill ever could hope to, she was an atheist, and he hated her. That was all too obvious. If he could have said one positive thing about her, it would have given me a better opinion of him.

Ginsberg-- for example-- has been obsessively lionized and was given an honorary position at Denver University. But who is he as a person and what has he done, if anything? (A needy old chicken hawk, according to my friends who had the bitter experience of trying to get to know him.) (Not that there's anything wrong with that.)

Really, the only thing Ginsberg did that makes him "better" in a lot people's eyes than Jack, was that he remained alive longer. To my mind there's no virtue in that, it's just pure dumb luck. (Or lack of it, or something. It's dumb, whatever it is.)

If you put their works side-by-side, there's no comparison.

Just my opinion, of course! I mean, hell-- if you judged works of music by the character of the person who created them, rock music, along with many other popular genres, would have died out long ago. I like to listen to Drowning Pool, and looking at images of the cute boys in the band. I most definitely DON'T want to meet them! I wouldn't enjoy them anymore after that, I'm sure.

[Schnurretiger]

Just a few quick thoughts about Scartlett's last posts (I'm in a hurry and maybe I need to think this over a bit more....):
Finding out more about an author might be pretty revealing, when it comes to the things he writes about. Following Kerouac's biography (doesn't matter which one you read) is almost like reading a novel in itself and it's interesting to see, where he got his ideas from. Especially with a writer like Kerouac, who wrote autobiographical stuff, finding out more about him is like looking behind the scenes of a movie set. After reading the first bio about him, his novels became even more vivid to me and I was able to understand much more about the little details he wrote about.
Kerouac never wanted to be proclaimed "King of the Beats", it was a title he dreaded, more or less. After all, the kids who came to his door, looking for Sal Paradise didn't find a young man in his early to mid 20ies, but someone who was 30 or even older, someone showing the first signs of drug and alcohol-addiction. Having a look at his biography around the time when "Road" was finally published is incredibly interesting because it is the turning point in his life, the moment when everything started to go wrong for him.
Ginsberg wrote some of the best poetry ever produced. Just look at what happened, when they published "Howl" - Ginsberg and Ferlinghetti opend up a whole new world to poetry and writing in gerneral. Suddenly, you could use words like "f***" publicly in your writing and you even had the blessing of a court to do so. Without Ginsberg, Kerouac et al. wouldn never have made their way to the public, because A.G. tried everything to get them published. I can't say anything about his personality, but I've met some writers, who were great to deal with and others, who were not. It's the same with "normal" people you meet.
And yes, there's a difference between actually meeting "famous" people and getting to know them better, or just reading about their life.
I hope you somehow get what I'm driving at. Got to go.

[Shadow_Ferret]

It's largely autobiographical (not sure to exactly what degree), but Kerouac gave everyone fictional names. He's Sal Paradise, for example. Allen Ginsberg is Carlo Marx, Neal Cassady is Dean Moriarty. And the book is listed under Fiction, for whatever that's worth.

OK, because I put it in the same category as Hunter S. Thompson's Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas and Henry Miller's Tropic of Cancer. Autobiographies with fictional exagerated elements.

[ColoradoGuy]

My all-time favorite On The Road line (from memory, I think I got it mostly right):

Whither goest thou, America, in that shiny black car in the night?

Good on several levels.

[JaneyJay]

I usually pick up On The Road when I'm stuck in a rut (often), and like to feel that enviable freedom of just being able to take off and explore. I have been trying to read Desolation Angels for years, but the isolation of it makes me feel claustrophobic and thus, panicky, every time I pick it up.

[Schnurretiger]

I'm about to start writing my exam paper and I want the topic to be Kerouac or the Beats in General. I've got several topics that I find interessting and I'd like to hear your opinions about them:
1.) The role of the women in the Beat Generation. (Might be cool to get in touch with Waldmann, Carolyn Cassady or Ann Charters)
2.) The deterioration of Kerouac: how his life changed after the publication of OTR and the way he couldn't handle the sudden success.
3.) The critical reception of Kerouac's works over the years (before and after his death). This might get interesting with the publication of the original scroll next year.
What do you guys think? Any commetns, other ideas or suggestions?

[BottomlessCup]

I'd do it on the use of drugs to aid creativity. I did a paper on it in high school.

It's very common in beat generation works.

If it's specifically about Kerouac, the religion angle could be very interesting, too. He used religious themes constantly, which is interesting enough, but the tension between Catholicism and Buddhism in his life is fascinating.

His decline is a good one - and mirrored in Neal Cassady, his hero. The way their lives ended kills me.

The woman aspect was covered pretty well in Carolyn Cassady's book, but you might be able to put a new spin on it.

[Schnurretiger]

Okay, the topic has been brought down to this: "In how far does Jack Kerouac treat his personal decline in his books?" That's not the final topic for the paper, that is only the rough direction. What I want to analyze is in how far his upbringing, religion and his difficulties with fame helped to destroy his life and I want to look at some of his major personal problems. If anybody comes up with a good topic phrase/question for that, I'd be grateful! I'll keep you informed about any progress I make.

[HardBoiled1920]

My favorite beats are Jack (who coined the word beat after beatified), William S. Burroughs (who was Old Bill Lee in On the Road), Alan Ginsberg (just because), and probably the best poet of them all, Gary Snyder (who won the Pulttzer, spent years in a Zen monistary in Japan and was the character Jack was making up Hikus with coming down Cold Mountain in Daharm Bums).

Jack and Ginsberg went t visit William S. Burroughs and helped him edit Naked Lunch (in fact Jack came up with the name). They sent it to the publisher in the order it was edited in. They both admired Burroughs as a writer; he was older and had a great influence on them.

Due to the contract Jack signed with his publisher he had to change the names of his characters in every book. He was trying to chronicle his life and travels like Proust. The books and the names he used for the actual characters are listed in one of the biographies about him (by Ann Charteris or something like that).

The most autobiographical of his books was Big Sur (which has a great 40 page poem at the end). I don't believe anyone mentioned that book.

I am one of those who has made a pilgrimage to his grave in Lowell, MA. Interesting, now they have a statue erected to him now, but in his life-time he got kicked out of every bar in Lowell.

"A Prophet is not without honor save in his own land."

Library of America has a book out: Jack Kerouac: Road Novels 1957-1960: On the Road / The Dharma Bums / The Subterraneans / Tristessa / Lonesome Traveler / Journal Selections (Hardcover) available for $23.10 at Amazon.com.

I think in March I'll go pay him hommage again at Jack's gravesite. He was a great influence on my life and times. The last thing I remember seeing him publish was an essay for the Boston Globe or Parade magazine called "I am not the Father of the Hippie generation." And then he was gone and I dropped out of college that week and I didn't go beck to college for years. It effected me a lot.

I have a dear friend who knew Kurt Vonnegut very well. He once asked him if he had known Jack. Kurt replied, "Crazy as a bedbug!" I do believe Jack would've liked that.

hardboiled