Teen novels

[aspiringwriter]

Recently i've ventured into YA novels, geared more towards teens... How far is too far? Meaning should they even be talking about sex? Doing it? Not quite sure b/c I don't want to go over the edge.

Also I was in the bookstore the other day and saw a book about a girl who spends a summer at an amusement park. I can't remember the name of it but it got me to thinking how teenagers talk nowadays... I'm so old :) I just don't know how some teens talk, since i'm not around them all the time.

Any help would be greatly appreciated... you can IM me if you want.

[TwentyFour]

I am working on a teen book, based in the late fifties as you know...lol. I still think back to my teen years, I spent alot of time with the teens in the neighborhood...not to mention a few too many teenage boys...lol.

Well, to be honest, I think nothing is too far. I feel if you go back and read some other books about teens you'll find murder, sex, drugs, anything and everything!

[aspiringwriter]

Thanks Jo... I don't want to go too far you know :) But don't want it to be boring either.

I remember you saying something about your book, it sounds pretty cool...

[moondance]

Best advice anyone gave me when I was starting out in YA was to READ. Read CURRENT books - YAs that have been published in the last five years, say. I was astounded by how much the market had changed (and I'm not that old!) and you'll be able to see what writers get away with nowadays. Talking about sex? Definitely. Doing it? Some of them, yes. Read, read, read. It can only help!

[UrsulaV]

Heh! I was just wondering about this myself yesterday.

The only useful advice I've heard--and I've never published a teen novel, so take this with a grain of salt--is that kids know very well when you're patronizing them, and nothing infuriates them more. If you start choking back on the sex and death and horror, when the story leads logically to that, out of a feeling that one must protect the kids, your readership will see that, perhaps more clearly than you do, and they will put the book down and wish plagues of locusts upon you.

[Kristen King]

I take out 6-8 YA books every time I go to the library. The librarians used to look at me funny, but now they're used to it. It might be a little creepier if you're a 50-something dude, but that would be a good day to wear your "I'm a Writer" tee shirt. ;] Seriously, though, ask your library's youth librarian what all the kids are reading these days, and grab books that are cover out in the YA section. You'll find a goldmine of info.

Once caveat--do NOT try to "talk cool" unless you're actually good at it naturally. The parents will buy the books for the kids because they sound "street" or whatever, and the kids will just make fun of them cuz we're old and we sounds like idiots if we're not actually comfortable with the lingo.

I occassionally pay a "tween" girl I used to babysit for $5/chapter to tell me everything she hates about my YA work. It's the best money I've ever spend on my writing.

Kristen

[aspiringwriter]

I was in the library this afternoon looking for a book called Summerlandand was unable to find it...but it's in the bookstore. I'm getting into writing teen novels more than ever...maybe it's because there are more kids perhaps?

Thanks everyone for your input so far.

[Arisa81]

Writing a young adult novel is something I've always wanted to do. Written bits and pieces, here and there, but never really stuck with anything. I am thinking about it more seriously now though. This weekend I definitely have to check out a bunch of books from the library to study.

I have an idea in mind and would really love to run with it. I'm glad I found this little corner of the board, I'll definitely come here more often.

[PattiTheWicked]

There are different levels of teen novels, too. A book geared towards a 13 year old may not be of any interest to a 19 year old, and a 14 year old boy is reading completely different stuff than a 14 year old girl.

If you don't have teenagers, make friends with someone who does, and watch them. They're a completely alien culture, and should be observed before writing about or for them.

Do what I do - pretend you're Jane Goodall, and they're all a bunch of gorillas.

[stephblake24]

A good place to observe teens is a coffee hangout...they are being "themselves" without parents present. It is shocking!

Of course, I have a 14 year old who brings his buddies over, and I like to eavesdrop on them when they are hanging out in our basement.

[Arisa81]

I'm am shocked at how teenagers act these days. And I'm not old, just 25. I know when I was in high school there were things that shocked me, but these days it just seems worse. I'm not sure that I would want to include a lot of what they say and do in my books, even if that mean being unpopular.

[Akuma]

I was in the library this afternoon looking for a book called Summerlandand was unable to find it...but it's in the bookstore. I'm getting into writing teen novels more than ever...maybe it's because there are more kids perhaps?

Thanks everyone for your input so far.

Summerland by Michael Chabon?
Or the Binding of the Blade series by L.B. Graham with the first book called Beyond the Summerland?
L.B. Graham's books are for teenagers, I believe, if you're interested and they do make for a very good read.

[Akuma]

There are different levels of teen novels, too. A book geared towards a 13 year old may not be of any interest to a 19 year old, and a 14 year old boy is reading completely different stuff than a 14 year old girl.

If you don't have teenagers, make friends with someone who does, and watch them. They're a completely alien culture, and should be observed before writing about or for them.

Do what I do - pretend you're Jane Goodall, and they're all a bunch of gorillas.

That's the first time I've ever been referred to as a gorilla. (o.O)p

[Zolah]

If you don't have teenagers, make friends with someone who does, and watch them. They're a completely alien culture, and should be observed before writing about or for them.

Do what I do - pretend you're Jane Goodall, and they're all a bunch of gorillas.

Actually, I think you should be careful about that. It's never a good idea to write a book de haut en bas - adding a bunch of transitory 'cool' words, referring to up-to-date fashions and current concerns might make your book sizzlingly relevant when you send it out to a publisher, but it will be seriously dated by next year. Besides, that stuff is only a thin skin over the surface of a teenager's life anyway. What is really important to teens today - and the sort of thing which should be important to a YA writer - is the same sort of thing that has ALWAYS been important to young adults - their relationships with friends and family, their place in the world, their desire to make a difference or to hide or to fit in. In order to convincingly write about teenagers you don't need to observe today's teenagers so much as to reach back to your own teenage self and try to embrace the thoughts, feelings and passions that burst out of your life during that turbulent and exciting time. Then you're creating something which should not only stand the test of time, but also something which is about human beings not just 'teens'.

In support of this, I should point out I have not voluntarily spoken to a young adult since I was one. When I write, I write for fourteen or twelve year old me, and it's worked pretty darn well so far.

I would advise anyone wanting to write for a YA market to read extensively in the genre before they decide to write in it, though. Chances are that (like many of my friends) you will be shocked by what is acceptable in a book for young people today. Holly Black, Annette Curtis Klaus, Liz Berry, Margaret Mahy, Garth Nix, Melvin Burgess, Jacqueline Wilson, Sherwood Smith, Tamora Pierce, Phillip Pullman, Gail Carson Levine, Phillip Reeve...those would be good places to start.

[aspiringwriter]

I found the book...it's called Thrill Ride it's about a girl who works for an amusement park over the summer...it's a 1st person novel.

Anyway i've started working on one about a teenager (17) who has a fling with an older woman but likes this girl...anyway, I happen to like the story... :)

[Akuma]

Anyway i've started working on one about a teenager (17) who has a fling with an older woman but likes this girl...anyway, I happen to like the story... :)

And that's all that matters. :o

[LeeFlower]

Tamara Pierce is famous for getting away with the risque. Of course, she's also a bestseller who's in a position to tell schoolastic to stuff it, so she's not necessarily a judge of what a first-time YA writer can get away with.

Like UrsulaV said-- don't don't don't don't talk down to teenagers. The best way to earn a teenager's respect is to respect them, and that means treating them like intelligent human beings. Keep in mind that YA readers are not a representative sample of young adults as a whole. YA readers, just like Adult readers, are generally very intelligent and have wide-ranging imaginations.

Should your work include graphic sex scenes? Probably not. But most schools start sex ed in fifth grade, revisit it in seventh or eighth, and then again in ninth or tenth. Teenagers know what's what, and they know when they're being sent to the kiddie table because an author's unwilling to have faith in them.

[cree]

interesting topic. I agree with Zolah on embracing your own teenage self and writing from that reference point. A writer needs to be inside a character's skin, and you won't be able to get inside a teen's skin merely by watching them at a coffee shop and making superficial observations. And they are not alien at all! They are unrefined versions of their adult selves, all energy and no wisdom of experience, and that makes them fascinating. That makes them great characters.

[Christine N.]

Be a substitute teacher. You'll know everything you ever wanted to about teenagers (or, in my case, Middle Graders). The pay's not bad and you get summers off too. :)

[PattiTheWicked]

I don't think anyone here was suggesting "making superficial observations". I have a fourteen year old, and on any given day there are at least five to ten kids from 13 to 16 hanging out around my house. I watch them, I hear them, and most importantly, I TALK to them.

I completely agree that trying to use up to date "cool words" and referring to fashion trends will make the work seem dated within a matter of months -- teens change their idea of what's hot and what's not as often as the rest of us change our socks. On the other hand, there are some things that are consistetly important to teenagers -- relationships, school, dealing with parents, feeling like you fit in, trying to cope with sexuality, etc.

The fact is, you can't write realistically about teenagers unless you have observed them in their natural environment. Hence my earlier "gorilla" statement :)

Also, if you're reading YA and teen novels to get an idea of what is popular, don't just grab a book off the shelf. Ask a teen what they're reading, or ask the librarian what the kids are checking out. My library has a section for Teen Fiction, and it includes copies of Michael Crighton novels and Jane Austen -- the librarian told me she could count on one hand the number of kids who had taken out Jurassic Park.

Another important thing to remember is that teens are way smarter and wolrld-savvy than we give them credit for. They're certainly more open about a lot of things than we were as kids. I'm 37, and I know there are things that my teenage friends and I would NEVER have discussed with other people that kids today are quite open and willing to discuss. Kids are more open about sexuality now than we were twenty years ago, just for starters. They're more also politically aware, they have healthy amount of activism in them when something matters, and they're a lot more independent and self-sufficient at younger ages.

Just like with any demographic, if you're writing for them, you better know your audience.

[Zolah]

The fact is, you can't write realistically about teenagers unless you have observed them in their natural environment. <SNIP>

Of course you can! I've written convincingly about murderers, sorcerers, Kings and warriors but I've never observed any of them in their natural environment. The important thing is that they're all human. As another astute commentator pointed out, teenagers are not aliens, just younger adults. They feel the same emotions, have the same desires, fear the same things, as the rest of the human race - and even better, each and every one of us had the teenage experience once. When I write about murderers or Kings I reach into myself and find the parts of myself which I have in common with those people. I do the same when I write about young adults, and it's worked for me so far. Maybe I'm a case of arrested development or something. But I avoid observing teens in their natural environment as much as humanly possible (because I live in a rough area and I like my money and my teeth just fine where they are now).

[Christine N.]

And you have to remember that teenagers (children in general) behave much differently with adults than they do with each other.

[britlitfantw]

They're more also politically aware, they have healthy amount of activism in them when something matters, and they're a lot more independent and self-sufficient at younger ages.

Very true (and not just talking about myself here). For seven months, I was the third youngest member in a group of 15 teenagers (our youngest was 14, our oldest was 18) who had one common passion: acting. Each week, during our break, there were, of course, the typical conversations about who's going out with who and the upcoming school dance. By the end of the seven months, however, there were debates about religion, the prime minister, you name it. And they were well thought out, informative debates.

Granted, we were a very unique group. As a writer, it was fascinating for me to sit back and watch teenagers from various walks of life and with different interests come together and meld into a unit. The two who engaged in the religious debate were a young woman who is anime-obsessed and a boy (our second youngest) who is a self-admitted partier.

Teenagers are an ever-changing, complex entity which continues to fascinate (and exasperate) adults, children, and fellow teenagers alike. Be prepared to have a plethora of notes if you do decide to pull a Jane Goodall (I rather like the gorilla comparison, myself). :)

[PattiTheWicked]

Of course you can! I've written convincingly about murderers, sorcerers, Kings and warriors but I've never observed any of them in their natural environment. ).

Are any of these individuals reading your books? If you're writing a book about teens FOR teens, you have to get to know them.

The important thing is that they're all human. As another astute commentator pointed out, teenagers are not aliens, just younger adults. ).

I never said they were aliens. I said their culture was an alien one. Not as in little green people from outer space, but as in different than that of the adults who are here discussing it. If you want a perfect example of people who write for teens and young adults without ever having watched them in action, just watch any of the Nickoloden shows like "Zoey 101" or "Ned's Declassified Survival Guide."


They feel the same emotions, have the same desires, fear the same things, as the rest of the human race - and even better, each and every one of us had the teenage experience once. When I write about murderers or Kings I reach into myself and find the parts of myself which I have in common with those people. I do the same when I write about young adults, and it's worked for me so far. Maybe I'm a case of arrested development or something. But I avoid observing teens in their natural environment as much as humanly possible (because I live in a rough area and I like my money and my teeth just fine where they are now).

No one is disuputing that you find a way to get inside your teenage self when you write for teens. My point is simply that if you want teens to read your book and not roll their eyes and snork at you, you need to spend some time around some real teenagers. Obviously, if your story takes place in a different time period this isn't quite the rule, but if it's contemporary teen fiction, you have to know your audience. That means listening to what they have to say.

[Zolah]

Sorry Patti, but I don't agree. This might be because you and I write in completely different ways, it might be because I remember my teenage years with an unhealthy clarity which would drive most people mad or it might be because I really am a case of arrested development. I don't know. But I do know that teenagers - the way they talk or act - don't seem alien to me in the slightest (or not more than they ever did) and I have no trouble writing credible young adult characters without having gone out and observed groups of young adults in 'their natural environment' (which would be - what? The Mall? School? Striving to keep their HIV positive parents alive in a mud hut in Uganda? Prostituting themselves for drugs in the Russian Republic? Running from police death squads in the slums of Brazil?).

[Provrb1810meggy]

Really, how much violence and sex young adults one depends on taste. Some people my age will devour books with sex and violence. On the other hand, that type of thing annoys me. It irritates me to be reading a good book and halfway through have all this unwarranted sex or violence.

[britlitfantw]

Unwarranted sex and violence is one thing; including it if you think it is necessary for the plot is another. There is a place for it. Using an example from Tamora Pierce, obviously, with Kel being the only girl among how many males, at least the mention of it had to come up at some point.

As long as you can draw the line between gratuitous and necessary, and as long as it's not graphic (which is out of place in some adult novels), I don't think there's a problem with it.

[C.bronco]

If you don't have teenagers, make friends with someone who does, and watch them. They're a completely alien culture, and should be observed before writing about or for them.

Do what I do - pretend you're Jane Goodall, and they're all a bunch of gorillas.

That's priceless. :) Oddly, when they speak w/ adults one on one, they seem very normal most of the time.

[Ekimwolf]

Good topic, I don't think teens are strange , and I don't think putting sex into YA novels is a good idea. there is enough of that everywhere.I think love and accept. is better. I think teens want more to be understood then sex and that they would respond better to a book that moved in that direction..maybe that sounds kind of stuffy,sorry.

[wandergirl]

Good topic, I don't think teens are strange , and I don't think putting sex into YA novels is a good idea. there is enough of that everywhere.I think love and accept. is better. I think teens want more to be understood then sex and that they would respond better to a book that moved in that direction..maybe that sounds kind of stuffy,sorry.

but if they're thinking about sex (which they are! all the time!) and we as young adult authors ignore that, then we're not trying to understand them, we're doing the opposite -- writing about what we believe they should be thinking, not trying to empathize with the way things really are.

I think your heart is in the right place. But this whole Renaissance of YA literature has much to do with authors finally writing about real teens instead of to them; not with censoring sex and other real-life issues. Finally, teenagers can actually relate to the books they read. That doesn't mean we have to follow the Gossip Girl train and write flippantly about sex and drugs and drinking -- but we can certainly write about realistic situations, and use them to guide (not to preach!).

Examples: Story of a Girl by Sara Zarr, Someone Like You by Sarah Dessen, Thirteen Reasons Why by Jay Asher... trillions more, I'm sure others can suggest.

[Melissa_Marr]

Recently i've ventured into YA novels, geared more towards teens... How far is too far? Meaning should they even be talking about sex? Doing it? Not quite sure b/c I don't want to go over the edge.


There's no right answer for these questions. "It depends" is the best answer I know. The degree of sex in a novel--be it for teens or adults--is determined by the character & the plot, not by the fact that it's a teen novel.

If you're asking abt what's acceptable within YA in terms of marketability, the answer is again "it depends." My editors (both in the US & overseas) have had no issue with there being sex or strong language in my texts bc neither is used gratuitously.

If you're asking abt it in regards to veracity for readers, I'm going to say that the question to ask is if the teens in YOUR book are thinking abt sex. I suppose it depends on who they are, & that's a question only you can answer. There are characters in YA texts that answer that question in all sorts of ways, just like real teens. I wouldn't say that there's a This Is Teen Experience constant I could gleen in regards to sex, drugs, love, liquor, violence, goals, worldliness, political awareness, or anything. There's all sorts of variety--just like adults . . .

If you want to get a feel for the range of what's out there, you could chat up your local YA librarian. Tell him/her that you want a sense of the breadth of the texts currently in strong rotation with the teens inyour community.

Good luck with it :)

[aspiringwriter]

Thanks for all the posts :)

[Blind Writer]

I'm an aspiring YA writer, but I am also a teenager, and I'll let you know right off the bat that all teenagers--whether their parents know it or not--know about sex. Heck, most of them are having it. It's one thing to have a moral of abstanance in your book, but its another to pretend sex does not exist. I've read plenty that feel that way, and those are the most irritating to me. Realistically, teenagers talk about sex, whether they ar having it or not, and generally it is mentioned quite a lot.

As far as language goes, I'll be honest, I have never heard more swearing than riding a high school bus. The F bomb is dropped left and right in the back of that yellow bus, and no one bats an eye, so swearing in generally normal among the novels that lean towards the realistic. I will mention, however, that my high school librarian avoids putting books in the library that contain too much swearing, but that's just her. Not all feel that way.

I'm a good kid. I've never been in trouble and my parents are very proud of me, but I am a typical teenage girl, and we're pretty open about sex and drinking and swearing, at least when we're with friends.

Just a little insight that might help.

[maddythemad]

I'm an aspiring YA writer, but I am also a teenager, and I'll let you know right off the bat that all teenagers--whether their parents know it or not--know about sex. Heck, most of them are having it. It's one thing to have a moral of abstanance in your book, but its another to pretend sex does not exist. I've read plenty that feel that way, and those are the most irritating to me. Realistically, teenagers talk about sex, whether they ar having it or not, and generally it is mentioned quite a lot.

As far as language goes, I'll be honest, I have never heard more swearing than riding a high school bus. The F bomb is dropped left and right in the back of that yellow bus, and no one bats an eye, so swearing in generally normal among the novels that lean towards the realistic. I will mention, however, that my high school librarian avoids putting books in the library that contain too much swearing, but that's just her. Not all feel that way.

I'm a good kid. I've never been in trouble and my parents are very proud of me, but I am a typical teenage girl, and we're pretty open about sex and drinking and swearing, at least when we're with friends.

Just a little insight that might help.

Ha, I have heard some truly revolting things on the bus.

Also, I think it's good to keep in mind that teenagers run the whole gamut (... is this actually a phrase?) There are 19-year olds who have never been kissed, and 12-year olds who are giving head. In my experience, the majority of high schoolers are having sex somewhere between 10th and 12th grade, but obviously there are exceptions. Everyone talks/thinks about it, though.

[Blind Writer]

Ha, I have heard some truly revolting things on the bus.

Also, I think it's good to keep in mind that teenagers run the whole gamut (... is this actually a phrase?) There are 19-year olds who have never been kissed, and 12-year olds who are giving head. In my experience, the majority of high schoolers are having sex somewhere between 10th and 12th grade, but obviously there are exceptions. Everyone talks/thinks about it, though.


Yeah, and I'm one of those never-been-kissed kids, except I'm 17. Still, I know what's out there. I know that there are 13-year-olds getting pregnant in my town, so teenagers know whats going on pretty early in life. Parents don't have to tell them because their friends will.

[Ciera_]

I have the opposite problem; my characters are older than me. I'm not sure why I felt the need for my MC to be sixteen, while I'm not yet fourteen...it is MUCH more convenient to have an MC that can drive, though. Maybe that's all it was. I do have the whole too-old-for-my-age thing going on, I guess, and find I can relate a lot better to the mind of the average 16-year-old than that of someone my age.
My main series is about vampires. And my vampires are, in the tradition of Anne Rice, quite sexual. I don't go around writing explicit sex scenes (my mother eventually reads most of my stuff!) but it's understood that that is a part of their lifestyle.
I am much more liberal with the violence and gore. And when it comes to swearing, I don't use the 'f' word. I just don't think it's necessary. Anything tamer than that is fair game. But still, my characters don't even say 'shit' in every second sentence like real teens do. (However natural it is in real life, it comes out as 'gratuitous' on paper = \ )
Uh, the point was that I don't hold anything back. I write about things that are a little 'mature' for me, because that's what the story calls for. I barely give my readers a passing thought, it's all about what I'm comfortable writing.
Okay, maybe not comfortable. I get red in the face when writing a kissing scene, I'll admit. But I always get through it!

[Blind Writer]

I love that you're so into novels already! I was writing a fantasy epic at your age, but when I was done, I realized that i hated it and started on another project. However, I was also writing fifteen and sixteen-year-old charactes when I was thirteen. I can only recommend that you save everything you write and reread it when you actually are sixteen. You may look at things totally different, or you may realize how mature you really are. It can go both ways.

[Horserider]

You should come to my school for a day and listen to some of the kids talk. I've learned more than I ever wanted to know in one day of school.

Lots of teen books go into murder, sex, drugs things like that. I've never read a teen book (yet) that goes into descriptive terms about it, but they are mentioned.

I have the opposite problem; my characters are older than me.

Ditto. I'm 15 trying to write about 17 year olds. That's not too much of a difference since I doubt I'll change that much in only 2 years.

Yeah, and I'm one of those never-been-kissed kids, except I'm 17. Still, I know what's out there. I know that there are 13-year-olds getting pregnant in my town, so teenagers know whats going on pretty early in life. Parents don't have to tell them because their friends will.


Yeah my school to. I'm 15 and have never had a boyfriend. I've only like two guys in my entire life and yet I know a girl who's had sex twice.

[Tersiniam]

Heh! I was just wondering about this myself yesterday.

The only useful advice I've heard--and I've never published a teen novel, so take this with a grain of salt--is that kids know very well when you're patronizing them, and nothing infuriates them more. If you start choking back on the sex and death and horror, when the story leads logically to that, out of a feeling that one must protect the kids, your readership will see that, perhaps more clearly than you do, and they will put the book down and wish plagues of locusts upon you.

FINALLY!!! A perfect summary of the sensitivity of my peers! I HATE it when people do that! Patronization of adolescence especially is one of the greatest mistakes that an author, or anyone for that matter, can make. There are so many variables that affect the reader at that point, for that is when everyone has different personalities and maturity levels. My friend texts me 'titties' daily and has since 6'th grade, while another person of the same age doesn't know what a prostitute is. In answer to the original question, I think it completely depends on the maturity level of the character in question. Hope this helps!

[FTJoshua]

FWIW, my two cents: Remember. The YA I write is largely based on what I remember as a teenager (and it helps that we had a videocamera around). The stories I end up telling are stories people like me, at that age, would know and relate to. I might personally enjoy reading a "nice" YA books, sans violence, sex, etc., but I'd have a tough time writing one because that was not my experience.

The adage, stale as it might be, of "writing what you know" probably applies best to this genre. But as always, writing a good book is writing a good book, genre be damned. I'd hesitate to set out to write a certain genre; I'd rather encourage a writer to write, and figure out the genre later. I know I'm not the first person to point out that a teenage protagonist does not a YA novel make.

Again - two cents! :)

[AmandaAcidic]

Speaking as a 18 year old fresh out of high school, there's no need to tone down the sex. You'd be surprised about how early most teens experience sex first hand. You shouldn't be graphic, but I agree with the others that you shouldn't pretend that sex doesn't exist. But I also disagree with the people who are saying that teens think about it all the time. You just need to find of balance of the way it is (people having sex before they turn 14, swearing every other word, graphic sex talks in the halls) and how it should be.

[jmascia]

I don't think that there is much that is considered "Too Far" in today's YA market. I have seen some of the novels my students in High School are reading and believe me, they are like porn books. I think no matter what you want to put into it, it wouldn't be considered too far.

[bethany]

I don't think that there is much that is considered "Too Far" in today's YA market. I have seen some of the novels my students in High School are reading and believe me, they are like porn books. I think no matter what you want to put into it, it wouldn't be considered too far.

I'd like to see some titles. I stay pretty up to date on edgy titles, and I haven't read anything in YA that read like mainstream romance, much less erotica...much less porn. Maybe you're seeing something I'm not.

[wandergirl]

I'd like to see some titles. I stay pretty up to date on edgy titles, and I haven't read anything in YA that read like mainstream romance, much less erotica...much less porn. Maybe you're seeing something I'm not.

agreed. I stay pretty up to date as well, and though explicit talk is pretty prevalent, sex is usually implied, or faded away, or otherwise handled in a tasteful way... I can't think of a single graphic sex scene in YA. Even rape scenes in books such as Speak are visceral, yet still non-graphic. I think the sexiest YA scene I read recently was in Wicked Lovely, and the most graphic it got was hands curling in a bedspread.

[jmascia]

The one I remember one of my students reading distinctly was a book called Hood Rat (can't remember the author), maybe it's not a YA book, but it is about a 16-17 year old girl (or group of) and it definitely has some disturbing content that I didn't think a young teen should be reading.

[Ciera_]

The sequel to Wicked Lovely, actually, is quite edgy. Well, it's very dark, which makes it seem edgier to me. There's rape and hard drugs, but they don't go into detail. The books, both Wicked Lovely and The Ink Exchange, just scream 'edgy and dark' to me. It's refreshing, because they aren't TOO angsty or emo-sounding, just a little spooky and glum. But I certainly wouldn't want to read that kind of book all the time, I'd get depressed.
My writing has a lot of 'edgy' content, but because it's written in such a light, somewhat sarcastic, sometimes awestruck way, I think it comes off as 'purer', less edgy.

[saeglopur]

I'll throw my 2-cents in on this. I'm in my mid twenties, and have been writing since I was 9 years old. I've kept EVERYTHING I've written. Just hundreds of notebooks all shoved in boxes under my bed.

Now when I write, I try to keep it PG-13, maybe delving in an R, only on occasion. I don't know why I decided to write with a filter. It's just what I like to read. I don't like anything I couldn't pass on to my mother or 17-year old nephew without feeling uncomfortable (even though my mom's a fan of romance).

A few months ago I was looking for inspiration and found a journal I kept, pretty much every day, from 14 to 17-years old. I practically had to slap myself I was so shocked with the explicit blackmail-worthy material in there! I won't incriminate myself any further than that, but it was bad. Very bad.

So I say, off with the filter! No more censoring. It's not necessary. I mean, I was kind of wild when I was young, but I was a saint by comparison to a lot of the kids I knew.

Teenagers know it all, they can handle it. If anything, I've grown entirely more conservative as I've aged.

[Shady Lane]

what a great post, saeglopur :) And I know what you mean--I wrote my raciest book when I was fourteen. I'm nearly eighteen now and wouldn't dream of writing so graphic...but I think in my case it's for the best!

[eyeblink]

I don't think I've ever had a filter as to what content to include in the stories and novels I've written. I've yet to have any subject that I couldn't in principle write about - the only considerations are how to do it right, and the amount of detail necessary in keeping with the tone and atmosphere of the story. If I think someone might be offended by a story with a, say, gay sex scene in it, then I won't show it to them. Or I might warn about a graphic horror story, for example. My parents have read my published collection, though, and it contains straight and gay sexual content in certain stories (not all of them by any means). For the record, the material I found most difficult to write was something strictly autobiographical, and identifiable as such, even if it was included in a short story.

Certain stories may demand explicitness, others a fade to back and the characters in bed afterwards. It's all down to the story's tone, and that's something you learn to sense as a writer after a while.

Mind you, I've not yet been published as YA, but I'm working on it...but I don't anticipate having to tone things down too much, assuming I'd be aiming for a 13+ or 14+ age group.

[timewaster]

I don't know. Teenagers are people. We were all teenagers once. I'm forty eight and I'm about to publish my eighth teen novel. I have teenage children but I don't evesdrop.
I write about people trying to work out who they are, how they feel and how they should behave. I don't patronise teens because being a teen ager is much like being a middle aged woman only with less money, fewer responsibilities and a much better body.
Teenagers are not mentally defective, hormonal enslaved aliens they are just people with the mixed fortune of being young.

[saeglopur]

I don't know. Teenagers are people. We were all teenagers once. I'm forty eight and I'm about to publish my eighth teen novel. I have teenage children but I don't evesdrop.
I write about people trying to work out who they are, how they feel and how they should behave. I don't patronise teens because being a teen ager is much like being a middle aged woman only with less money, fewer responsibilities and a much better body.
Teenagers are not mentally defective, hormonal enslaved aliens they are just people with the mixed fortune of being young.

What a funny post. And good on you for allowing your teenagers their privacy! I think you've got a good formula worked out. Well done!

[eyeblink]

I quite agree and I'm of a similar age to you, timewaster (44). Not sure about the "less money" part though :)

I do find that too many people make sweeping generalisations about teenagers - that they all take drugs and get laid on a weekly basis and grunt when you try to talk to them. No doubt some do, but not all - they are as varied as adults. You just need to hang around this forum to find plenty of intelligent and articulate people whose ages begin with 1. (Two-digit numbers beginning with 1, of course - are there any centenarians posting on AW? :))

[wandergirl]

Not sure about the "less money" part though :)

Ha, that's true. I think I felt richer as a teen than I have in all my years as an adult. I might have been making a few quarters over minimum wage at my high school jobs (coffee shops, pet stores), but I also didn't have much to pay for! Gas was cheap. Drinks were usually free, pilfered from friends' parents' cupboards. Plus, I was a grunge kid -- I shopped in thrift stores. Though nowadays I mostly shop at Buffalo Exchange.

[saeglopur]

I remember having the greatest weekends with my friends. We would have $20 between 3 of us or something like that, and we would use it for bus fare and just go all over the place.

Ah, fond memories.

[Ciera_]

You know what I find strange about teenagers (my peers, that is) as a generalization?
Okay, well, there are always going to be kids who read and kids who don't. But when the newest big phenomenon comes along and 'everyone's reading it', well, everyone is reading it. I think we know what book series I'm talking about here, but I have this hope that by not mentioning it by name we can pretend I'm making an actual generalization. Anyway, suddenly we have people who've never willingly cracked a book in their life raving about a book, but more importantly, actually reading it! (Most of them. Some are just posers, getting by just watching the movies >.<)
And then, when the series is over and done with...most of the potential-converts-to-the-reading-world go back to avoiding big blocks of text like they're the plague.
*Sigh*
Oh, and the majority of the boys go on entirely unchanged by the 'phenomenon', if it happens to be aimed at girls like the series I'm not mentioning by name.

I'm not sure what the actual point of that little rant was...maybe that teenagers are a strange people, one whose habits and reactions can never be predicted.

[eyeblink]

True - we thought we'd lost my nephew (who turned 16 on Boxing Day) to computer games but he at last moved on from Harry Potter to something else - even if that is the Eragon series. His younger sister (12) likes Anthony Horowitz's books - let's hope she carries on reading as I might be asking her to read some of mine when she's a year or so older. :)

They come from a family of readers - both their parents, me, and both surviving grandparents (on mine and their Dad's side) all read, so let's hope that did rub off on them permanently!

[Dana-Lynn]

That was well put, Ciera.

:e2brows:

[anne_marie]

The best advice that I can give you is to say that if you could picture yourself doing something as a teenager - then probably other teens do the exact same stuff and it would be more realistic if you write it from that kind of perspective rather than having characters doing things that you would never do.

I have a series in the YA genre that I am working on. I have based the MC on myself as a teen and this is how I wrote her character. I have other characters that I based on friends who had different experiences as me and how they dealt with things in their lives.

[Leila]

I don't know. Teenagers are people. We were all teenagers once. I'm forty eight and I'm about to publish my eighth teen novel. I have teenage children but I don't evesdrop.
I write about people trying to work out who they are, how they feel and how they should behave. I don't patronise teens because being a teen ager is much like being a middle aged woman only with less money, fewer responsibilities and a much better body.
Teenagers are not mentally defective, hormonal enslaved aliens they are just people with the mixed fortune of being young.

I agree!

I feel uncomfortable even using the word 'teenagers', because the worst way to write YA is to start getting all 'them and us' about it. In the end, we're all human and teenagers are not some foreign species. Don't think of them as some group you can pin down exactly, because there is no such thing as a typical teenager; there is no such thing as a typical person! I work at a children's bookshop and my customers always come to me to buy books for kids they don't know, and go, 'Sixteen year old boys. What do they like?' They seem to think I can somehow pin down all sixteen year olds with the one book, and I want to throw up my hands and rant at them, because while I can tell them what's popular, there is no way it's even vaguely possible to account for every boy's taste. I deal with people, with individuals. Not with age groups.

Also, I spend a lot of time reading the YA at work. And trust me, there is nowhere YA cannot go. I've read violence, sex, swearing, self-harm - everything. And as long as it isn't gratuitous and really does work in the context of the story and the characters, then it's fine. YA has always explored edgy territory, and it has ever since Catcher in the Rye. I think it's generally the adults who get freaked out by that sort of thing, not the teenagers.

The best way to get an idea of things is to read as much YA as possible. And to be true to your characters and unafraid to go wherever a story calls for you to go.