Advice for a kid?

[Cardcastle]

Hello everyone, I’m new here…
Okay, first off, I’m a teen writer. No, I don’t write books for teens, I am a teen. I’ve been writing stories ever since I learned to write, and I’ve wanted to be a writer ever since I learned that books actually come from someplace and do not breed in libraries. I’m trying to learn proper writing and grammar skills, though I still have a long way to go. So, don’t kill me if I use improper English by accident. ;) Even after reading grammar books all summer, I cannot remember everything.
Anyway, as I said, I’ve been writing for a long time. Right now, I have one finished novel, one finished first draft of a novel, the first draft of the first book in a trilogy, two picture books, several poems, and a couple short stories. Currently, I am working on the second book in my trilogy, editing my unedited works, and prewriting for another book. While working, I found out about this site, and so I thought I’d mention a problem I have.

Basically, I’m not sure what to do with my works. I tried sending my finished novel, a children’s fantasy, to Chickenhouse Publishers. It was rejected, and, though I am not bitter about the rejection, I don’t know where to go from here. I’m still pretty young and I don’t know much about the publishing world. I did take a class at the college in my town, but I still feel like I’m swimming in deeper waters than I have been in before.
Another issue is the fact that I just learned that my trilogy will probably be hard to get published. I can see why, as I have no idea how to query about it! It’s a… historical fiction story with political undertones and fantasy elements. The story also includes sensitive subjects, like child abuse, racism, the role of women in the time period, labor laws, eugenics, people with disabilities, religious biases, and social corruption. There is also a lot of symbolism about politics and literature.
Actually, it does work. I’ve had several different people read it and they have made comments and critique, but they enjoyed the overall story. My problem is writing a query for it. It isn’t a normal conflict-resolution story about a main character facing some problem and overcoming it (or succumbing to it).
Any advice?

[Serena Casey]

Nice to meet you, Cardcastle - wow, you are prolific for being so young. Actually, that's prolific for any age! I don't have any advice for you about the publishing world because I'm new to it myself, but if you need some feedback, you might try the Share Your Work forum.

Hope you stick around. There are some other teen writers here, too.

[Maryn]

It's a pleasure to meet you, despite how your accomplishments make me question how I've been using my own time. (Just kidding. Well, sort of.)

If you'll spend a while checking out the boards, you'll find one dedicated to critique of query letters. Read several threads and you'll get the general idea of what needs to be in every query and what should probably be left out.

It's late where I am, and I'm sure someone west of me will be able to produce a more coherent reply for you--but I still got here first! (Edited to add: Did not!)

Maryn, impressed with your productivity

[Cardcastle]

Oh, thanks… I have no social life. LOL. My sister says I act like Luna Love good (sp?) from Harry Potter, so that might explain it.
I don’t post my writings online. It’s sort of a family policy. So, I guess I won’t be doing that.
How many other teen writers are there here? I should like to meet some of them.
Nice to meet you. :)

[Cardcastle]

"If you'll spend a while checking out the boards, you'll find one dedicated to critique of query letters. Read several threads and you'll get the general idea of what needs to be in every query and what should probably be left out."

Oh, thanks! Nice to meet you, also. :)

[oneoftwo]

Cardcastle...You sound like your heart is writing. WONDERFUL. Passion. James MacDonald goes into details about query in the novel section. Take a look. Also, Miss Snark has a great blog and she just had a contest of query letters. Take a look over there. These pros straightened me out.

[Alan Yee]

I am a teen writer as well, but quite frankly, you're far more prolific than I am. There's lots of teen writers around here. It just might be hard to find most of them.

It's a pleasure to meet you. I hope you stick around here.

[badducky]

GO TO BED! DO YOUR HOMEWORK! PUT THAT DOWN! GET YOUR HANDS OFF THAT MEMBER OF THE OPPOSITE SEX!

All good advice for teens.

Better advice: Read the thread titled "Learn Writing with Uncle Jim".

[Willowmound]

Oh, thanks… I have no social life. LOL. My sister says I act like Luna Love good (sp?) from Harry Potter, so that might explain it.
I don’t post my writings online. It’s sort of a family policy. So, I guess I won’t be doing that.
How many other teen writers are there here? I should like to meet some of them.
Nice to meet you. :)

I used to be a teen writer. But that was a long time ago.

Piece of advice: get yourself a social life. It makes you a better writer. Observe people and what they do. Observe yourself with other people.

You'll need this to make credible characters. Heck, you might even enjoy it!

Good luck :)

[Nakhlasmoke]

Any particular reason not to post your stuff online? The critique thread is password locked as far as I know, or you could find a small closed critique group.

They might be able to give you some feedback as to why your book was rejected. it also *really* helps you in your own writing to see where others have gone wrong and how to fix it.

[SeanDSchaffer]

First, Cardcastle, welcome to the Water Cooler. I hope you enjoy the forums.

Second, as far as advice goes, I would say everything that has been said, but also to keep it up. It is easy to be discouraged as a writer, but the best thing you can do is to develop the proverbial 'Thick Skin' talked about often on the boards. That means, when you get a rejection, keep plugging away at it; continue shopping around. Remember that it is your work being rejected, and not yourself.

Also, I would recommend you research your prospective publishers with great care; always look to third-party sites with a good reputation to see if the company you are thinking of working with also has a good reputation. Wonderful examples of this would be Preditors & Editors, WriterBeware, and AgentQuery.com.

Whatever you write, I wish you well, and I hope you find many answers to your questions on these and any other boards you might find on the 'Net.

[James D. Macdonald]

Advice? I have plenty, and it's all free.

First, finish your works.

Second, as you finish them send them out to legitimate publishers only. As they get rejected (and they will be) send them out again the same day they return.

A "legitimate publisher" is one that can get books physically onto the shelves in bookstores. If you don't see their books shelved, you aren't interested. Aim high.

Get the publishers' guidelines; follow them to the letter.

[Carrie in PA]

Welcome!

My advice? Write. Then write some more.

Then snoop around here for answers to your other questions. Anything you can think of, do a search... there's a wealth of information lurking here!

[Kharisma]

Welcome to the boards! These boards and the members are so very helpful. I myself am finding myself in need of crit partners and am weary of posting anything online so someone suggested to me to join RWA. Even though I live in Canada (they are international) and I can't go to meetings but I can join online group. Maybe if you ask around their might be a group for your style of writing that is similar to RWA.

Best of luck and happy writing
sherry

Good luck and welcome :)

[Alan Yee]

Also, I would recommend you research your prospective publishers with great care; always look to third-party sites with a good reputation to see if the company you are thinking of working with also has a good reputation. Wonderful examples of this would be Preditors & Editors, WriterBeware, and AgentQuery.com.


Ditto. Before you decide to send your work to any potential publishers, research as much as you can. There's lots of scammers, some unqualified and/or incompetent but well-intentioned agents and publishers, as well as many good ones. Do what I did: Learn all the basics and pitfalls on the craft and business of writing as early as possible. That way you won't practice making the same mistakes for many years.

I originally came to AW because of NEPAT and Bewares and Background Check, more than a year ago following the release of Atlanta Nights. I've become pretty familiar with the material there, so if you need help wading through it, I'll be willing to help you.

Some GOOD and RELIABLE resources that have helped me become more educated about the world of writing and publishing:

Critters Online Workshop (http://critters.org/). For Science Fiction, Fantasy, and Horror writers who want feedback on their work. With over 5,000 members, there are several pro writers and up-and-coming writers, and there's a long list of successful sales that occurred after some writers' stories and novels were Crittered (critiqued). I was an active member for quite some time, though I've now gone inactive. I still highly recommend it (if you write in these genres), and I learned many valuable things from the experience.

Preditors & Editors (http://www.anotherealm.com/prededitors/). An industry watchdog website maintained by DaveK (David L. Kuzminski), which provides basic information about the writing and publishing business. It also includes an extensive list of agents, publishers, magazines, and other related things, with ratings that range from Highly Not Recommended, Not Recommended, Recommened, and Highly Recommend, as well as warnings about certain agents and publishers.

Writer Beware (http://sfwa.org/beware.html). The watchdog group sponsored by SFWA (http://sfwa.org/) (Science Fiction and Fantasy Writers of America). Founded by Ann (A.C.) Crispin and Victoria Strauss, it provides all the information you need to know regarding scams and undesirable agents/publishers. They provide warnings on those who have investigations regarding certain agents/publishers. They answer people's questions about specific agents/publishers, and see if their files come up with anything negative. Victoria posts often around here, so you can also ask in B&BC.

For more updated accounts, specific incidents, and descriptions of living life as an industry watchdog, there's also the Writer Beware blog (http://accrispin.blogspot.com/), written by Ann and Victoria.

The Association of Artists' Representative (AAR) (http://www.aar-online.org/mc/page.do/). An organization of agents who must abide by a code of ethics. Agents who are AAR members are not allowed to charge reading fees or any fees for that matter before a sale is made. If you find an agent on the AAR website, they are generally completely legitimate.

[WARNING: THERE IS A HUGE INFODUMP AT THE FOLLOWING LINK. READ IT ANYWAY.]

Everything you wanted to know about literary agents. (http://www.neilgaiman.com/journal/2005/01/everything-you-wanted-to-know-about.asp/) Very long, but it contains extremely valuable and important information about finding an agent. At the end is a (very very long) list of TNH's Making Light blog posts relating to writing and/or publishing and/or scams. It wouldn't hurt to read all of them (though reading the comment threads might hurt your eyes after a while).

So, that leads to Making Light (http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/). Teresa and Patrick Nielsen Hayden are both experienced editors at Tor Books. Please take their word seriously, as they know what the hell they are saying.

And of course, there's the unstoppable Miss Snark (http://misssnark.blogspot.com/). She is a qualified literary agent whose blog is well-respected by those who are in the publishing business. Don't be inclined to not trust her because she posts under a pseudonym. She answers readers' questions, posts about writing-related topics, critques readers' queries, and delivers it with a heavy dose of snark. No one knows for sure who she really is, but that's not important. She wouldn't be able to get away with what she says if she had used her real name. Believe me, listen to her, and you will be much happier later on down the road.

That's all I have for right now. I'll post more links if I find any later.

Good luck.

[britlitfantw]

I can't really offer any advice other than what's been given. Your passion is extremely admirable, as is your work ethic. The one thing I'd like to add is an emphasis on what was said earlier by Willowmound:

Piece of advice: get yourself a social life.

As a fellow teenager, and one who has gotten ensnared in this before, let me just say this: don't get too wrapped up in your writing so that everything else fades in importance. Our teen years are for exploring and getting away with being unfocused. ;) That doesn't mean that we shouldn't prioritize, naturally, but just be careful.

Disclaimer: I know nothing of your life outside of what you've told us, and I'm not saying that this is what WILL happen to you, I just thought I'd mention it.

All in all, welcome to Absolute Write, and best of luck! I'm sure you'll learn a lot. I know I have. :D Nice to have you here!

[emeraldcite]

Read read read. Write write write.

Practice really does make you better.

No matter how many rejections, keep working. You won't succeed if you don't try.

[Provrb1810meggy]

Hey! *waves hands in the air* I'm a teen writer too. It's always great when other teen writers are around. Wow, your writing is much deeper than mine. How old are you?

Anyway, I'm trying to get published. It seems very overwhelming at first and can be quite depressing with all the rejections. I decided to start out by querying agents. Since I'm poor, being a teenager and all, I found most of my research online, though that's not reccomended by most, and I've sent out tons of e-queries. At least 50. I have one full request out, and two partials. I've had other partial requests, but have been rejected. One had revision suggestions, and I actually rewrote the novel, making it much better, and now they're looking at the partial of the rewritten novel. Many times I've felt discouraged, but one author here was rejected 500 times before they got published!

Have you considered getting an agent? Some people never want an agent and some do. If you don't get an agent, you can always go to publishers that accept unsolicited submissions. I have a whole list of people I'm going to send to if this agent search fails.

A lot of this business seems to be about persistence. Of course, you need to have talent and a polished story, too!

Feel free to PM me sometime and we can talk about our writing endeavors.

[L.Jones]

My first thought as a writer and a parent of a teen writer is that someone in your position, who is determined to send materials out, might do well to look into querying agents first.

A good agent would certainly be better equiped to deal with publishers than you are (if you aren't 18 it's a whole legality issue with contracts, etc) and to know how to present (or conceal, I suppose) your age to your advantage.

So do your agent homework - you've got some great links here. Knock around the how to sections a while and follow the links to websites that can guide you through the process and avoid scams.
Check out agents that rep the kinds of things you like to write, and query on behalf of a your very best (finished, clean copy) work.

best of luck
annie jones (Sisterhood of the Queen Mamas - Dec 06)
awa Luanne Jones (Heathen Girls - out now)

[DamaNegra]

Another teen writer over here!

Um... you just made me feel bad about my writing, happy? Sheesh.

Nah, just kidding. The advice here is excellent. Do check Uncle Jim's writing thread (I've found it better than those how to write books and it's free), and, well, get a life.

Seriously, getting a life gets you loads of great ides for stories and such. No, better than that. Get some really weird friends. No cliché punk/goth whatever friends. I mean really weird. Their weirdness will be your best source of inspiration (try Alan Yee, he's as weird as anyone can get :D). Read the newspaper every day. Every section. There's a lot of good stuff going on in the world every day.

Read, read, read. I don't need to tell you to write, because you seem to do fine on that field ;) Revise everything you've written. Then revise some more. And then revise. Another revision, then send it to a beta reader. More revision, revise some more. Send it out until you spend all your family's fortune on SASEs (kidding).

And don't forget to look after yourself :tongue

[Project nachonaco]

Keep at it.

That's what us teenagers do best - annoy people by perseverance! :D

[PeeDee]

Here's my advice: Write a short story around that line you mentioned in your first post, about books breeding in libraries. If you don't, I will.

(Sci-fi met up with Technical Manual and we bred Technopunk)

(and welcome to the AW looney-pot.)

[wordmonkey]

If your novel is finished, put it aside and start writing short stories.

You wanna get published and the easiest way to do that is to be published.

Catch 22.

(Hey, that'd make a cool title for a book or something)

The extra added bonus to short stories is that there are lots of places to sell to (way more than legit publishers). Once you have some published shorts in magazines or anthologies your query letter suddenly looks a whole lot more appealing.

Crappy fact: Everyone wants to discover the next big author but no one wants to risk putting a chunk of money behind an unknown.

Get some credits and your letter will zing. Trust me on this. I know. I now land gigs without even showing samples, just my list of works gets me work.

The extra sweet bonus is that if you can tell a story in 3-5,000 words, your longer form writing will be so much better. Your prose will be tighter; you won't use words for the sake of it, but only use the ones you need; and you'll be a more disciplined writer to boot.

These pieces of advice are brought to you by those nice primates at writingmonkey.com (http://www.writingmonkey.com), and come to you at the over-priced cost of two cents.

[PeeDee]

You wanna get published and the easiest way to do that is to be published.

Catch 22.

(Hey, that'd make a cool title for a book or something)


You're right, it would make a good book.

That nice Joseph boy sure thought so, anyway. (http://www.amazon.com/Catch-22-Joseph-Heller/dp/0684833395/sr=8-1/qid=1158452255/ref=pd_bbs_1/102-7340866-7880160?ie=UTF8&s=books)

[Imelda]

Hey Cardcastle! I'm 20, but I feel like I'm still in my teens, so I completely relate :D Being a young writer is tough, but no tougher than for anyone else (except maybe the funny looks when you say you're a writer :) ).

My advice to you: submit to another publisher. Now. Right away. People get rejected even if their stuff is good, if the editor doesn't feel for it personally. You have no way to know where you're going wrong (if you are) on just one rejection. Tweak the query letter a little (look at other exmaples, if you don't want to let others see yours [although I heartily recommend critiqueing circles to anyone! If you're nervous about someone stealing your ideas, try to get over it because it's highly unlikely and the benefits of critting outweigh the risks]) and send it right back out. It'll make you feel better!

Oh, and I have no social life either :D Somehow I'm surviving ...

[Aubrey]

Geez, I'm 25 and all I have is a eight year old horrendous poems, bunch of fan fiction (every completed one a one or two shot), a handful of original (and mostly unfinished) short stories, a bunch of premises on scraps of paper, and one story from last year that only got about 70 pages in before I drifted away from it. I'm starting it up again though, and hoping I actually finish this time. I admire you for being so prolific. I hope you'll eventually come back to this thread. There's a lot of good advice here.

[Alan Yee]

Geez, I'm 25 and all I have is a eight year old horrendous poems, bunch of fan fiction (every completed one a one or two shot), a handful of original (and mostly unfinished) short stories, a bunch of premises on scraps of paper, and one story from last year that only got about 70 pages in before I drifted away from it. I'm starting it up again though, and hoping I actually finish this time. I admire you for being so prolific. I hope you'll eventually come back to this thread. There's a lot of good advice here.

My novel is currently at about 65,000 words and 290+ manuscript pages. I had never written anything that long before. Before that, I wrote short stories exclusively. I think I just found a topic with a story and characters that I was passionate about.

ETA: And, as my ticker indicates, I'm almost 15. I'm not sure how old the OP is.

[MicheleLee]

I can think of two things no one has mentioned at all. 1. Be organized. This means get a notebook and write down one story/novel per page, title, work count and genre. Keep track of where you send it and what they say (especially if they give more than a form rejection.) You might also want to make a list of places you want to send it so as soon as you get that reject you can send it right back out (unless some good points have been made and you feel you need to edit). I also keep an eye on the anthologies over on www.ralan.com . They are often themed and sometimes just thinking of the theme can get me writing.
2. Start a blog or journal. It's a different sort of writing, but it'll help you practice several times a week. Plus you might build an audience. Not that it will help a great deal, but the practice is the most important part.

[Thomma Lyn]

Hi, Cardcastle, and welcome to the AW Water Cooler! Sounds like you've got a lot of talent and fortitude for such a young writer, and those qualities are essential for making a go of writing over the long haul.

Keep nurturing your talent and your fortitude, and you'll be unstoppable. :)

Re: query letters, I can't recommend highly enough that you post your query letter for critique in the Share Your Work section here at the Water Cooler. The folks there can really help polish up a query until it shines.

:welcome:

[wordmonkey]

Geez, I'm 25 and all I have is a eight year old horrendous poems, bunch of fan fiction (every completed one a one or two shot), a handful of original (and mostly unfinished) short stories, a bunch of premises on scraps of paper, and one story from last year that only got about 70 pages in before I drifted away from it. I'm starting it up again though, and hoping I actually finish this time. I admire you for being so prolific. I hope you'll eventually come back to this thread. There's a lot of good advice here.

Aubrey:

It's a job. A great, creative, loose, wear-your-p.j.s-to-work, long-weekend-if-you-want job. But a job nonetheless.

OK, now if you just want a creative hobby, ignore this, but if you wanna push it more, that's the way you have to look at this. It's work. It's a grind. Every day you sit down to work you have to work. And the writing part is the easy bit. The rewriting is where the real work starts.

That all sounds really pompous and up-myself, and it's not supposed to. But if you want to be sell a book in a professional market, you gotta be a professional. Have a professional outlook. Take your work seriously. And that means finish it and polish it and tweak it and polish some more then send it out and keep sending it out.

That said, some of your early work will be horrible. Truly bad. Ghastly. Embarrassing. You'll be shocked that you sent it out. You'll be shocked that you thought for a second it was even close to being good. You need to face that and accept it.

But that isn't even close to being a bad thing. Because when YOU can look back and see how bad your early stuff is, you know you've improved. And secondly, nothing you write is ever wasted. Even if it never sees print, it's the creative loam that your next projects will grow from. And the more loam you lay down, the more bountiful you subsequent crops will be.

Here endeth the preachy lesson. I'll try not to do that again anytime soon.

[Eric Summers]

The only advice I would offer to a teenager is:

1 - NEVER, EVER, get a Credit Card. Maybe when you are so absolutely, fabulously rich that you don't even need one and just use it for convenience then it might be okay.

2 - Don't think of rejection slips as "rejection". They are not personal, they are not judgements of your work, they are simply a note from the person you offered the story to that they do not wish to publish your material.

3 - As a writer, you will make a lot of mistakes. Coming here will help with that situation though. I once had a story rejected because I used a font that the editor didn't approve of. That my friend, is why you read the Submission Guidelines :)

4 - Remember rule #1.

[DragonHeart]

I'm a teen writer for three more months myself. :D I only wish I wrote that much but unfortunately I mistook social life for full time job, and that tends to put a damper on time and energy. I'd advise getting at least a part time job if you don't already; being in a place with a lot of people is great for ideas, thick skin, and interesting dialogue. ;) At least, that's what I get from my retail job. Now if only that interesting dialogue wasn't aimed at me so much. (Or if I was allowed to say equally interesting comebacks! )

All the advice already given here is very sound and covers pretty much everything, so there isn't much else I can offer other than to keep writing, no matter how many rejections you get. Publishing is all about patience and perserverance.

~DragonHeart~