My custom format

[Mike The Mover]

Hey everybody, I'd like to start my membership here with a question.

I'm writing my first screenplay. I've read all about the standard format but I don't like it. I thought I'd try something new; my own format. It looks like this:

Scene 1:
Setting: In Jim's apartment

Jim: Move that chair.
Tim: Okay.
Action: Tim moves the chair.

Is this a bad idea? I've heard that producers don't even look at scripts that aren't written using the standard format. At the same time I believe my format is very easy to read and understand. Infact I think it's easier to read than the standard format.

Any ideas?

[MrJayVee]

Sorry, but your new format is a really bad idea. Like it or not, producers expect your script to adhere to standard format. Stick to it.

You can tweak format when (if) you make the big time.

[JennaGlatzer]

I'd agree. Using anything but the format they're used to tends to make it look like you just haven't done your homework and don't know what the industry calls for.

P.S. Welcome, Mike!

[whistlelock]

Don't try to reinvent the wheel before you understand why it's round.

[odocoileus]

films are made by big groups of people working together. Everyone has to understand what everyone else is doing. The basic information that crew and cast members need to do their jobs is in the screenplay. Who is in the story, what happens, how, where, and when.

Because the format is standard, the same type of information is always in the same place. The filmmakers can then use the script as a basis for planning, scheduling, and budgeting. The moneymakers can use the script as a basis for comparing one potential movie to another to see which one might make the most money. Or lose the least.

http://odocoileus.blogspot.com/2006/07/need-to-know-about-screenplay-format.html

[wordmonkey]

Look at the ads from people looking for scripts. There are two kinds.

- The ones that specifically say something like, "submissions not done in standard screenplay format will not be read/considered."
or
- The ads that don't say that because they assume it's a given.

At the end of the day, you can do it however you like and more power to you. But if you want to be read, taken seriously and hopefully sell, you need to do what the industry says.

I think that if I'm driving down a street and the traffic is snarled but the road in the opposite direction is empty, we should be able to use that side of the road too. I could do that if I wanted, but I'd likely end up with a ticket, or worse.

[dpaterso]

And, your dialogue is on the nose.

Couldn't resist, sorry.

You're advocating talking a foreign language in a world that only wants to talk screenwriting-speak.

Frankly I don't see how your new format is easier to read.

-Derek
My Web Page - sci-fi, fantasy, horror, cyborgs, AIs, dragons, vampyres. (http://hometown.aol.co.uk/DPaterson57)
Bio-readouts are all in the green, looks like she's alive. Well, there goes our salvage, guys.

[JustinThorne]

I'd focus on the quality of the script, not its format.

Once you've sold a few blockbusters, I'm sure the industry will appreciate being educated.

Also, it's important to remember that the standard format is designed to be easier to use by the industry and not easier to use for the writer.

[alleycat]

Another vote for "this is not a good idea".

I believe stageplays in the UK are written in a format similar to what you posted. I'm not sure about this however.

[Mike The Mover]

I'd like to know more about this UK format.

For now I guess I should adhere to the industry standard. But. But, I only invented this new way to make it easier for the film makers to read. Not for me to type. What I didn't show before was that I have composed a detailed information page to be included with the screenplay. It looks like this:

PLOT:
Four friends are partners in a cleaning company. They get a contract to clean a mansion. They start to clean but become severely distracted. The insane behavior of the residents threatens their ability to finish the job they were hired to do.

SETTING:
The movie takes place in Los Angeles, California. Within the city the movie is set in the following locations: In an office. In a parking lot. In a James’ car. In a house. At an outdoor chip truck. In a restaurant. In a mansion. In a grocery store. In Bert’s car. In an apartment. In a hospital. In a museum.

MAIN CHARACTERS:
Jim
Tim

SECONDAY CHARACTERS:
Cop1
Cop2

EVENTS:
Tim moves Jim's chair

[wordmonkey]

Dude.

If it ain't broke.

And you can go with UK stage versions, but if you sub to a US film producer, guess what they want?

[xhouseboy]

I'd like to know more about this UK format.

For now I guess I should adhere to the industry standard. But. But, I only invented this new way to make it easier for the film makers to read. Not for me to type. What I didn't show before was that I have composed a detailed information page to be included with the screenplay. It looks like this:

PLOT:
Four friends are partners in a cleaning company. They get a contract to clean a mansion. They start to clean but become severely distracted. The insane behavior of the residents threatens their ability to finish the job they were hired to do.

SETTING:
The movie takes place in Los Angeles, California. Within the city the movie is set in the following locations: In an office. In a parking lot. In a James’ car. In a house. At an outdoor chip truck. In a restaurant. In a mansion. In a grocery store. In Bert’s car. In an apartment. In a hospital. In a museum.

MAIN CHARACTERS:
Jim
Tim

SECONDAY CHARACTERS:
Cop1
Cop2

EVENTS:
Tim moves Jim's chair

basically all you're doing here is writing up details that will be required later down the line anyway.

Your plot will be integrated into the treatment.

Your settings will be the job of the locations manager, and will form the shooting schedule.

Your characters will be on a list that goes to the casting director, and so on and so forth.

As for the UK format, that's similar to stage plays. If you intend to submit to UK prodcos, you'd better make sure it's in the recognised format.

[Mike The Mover]

What is the treatment?

[xhouseboy]

A condensation of the story told in prose, rather than screenplay format.

[wordmonkey]

What is the treatment?

And, just for fun, there are format issues to be adhered to with a treatment and a synopsis too.

Is this fun or what? :D

[odocoileus]

But. But, I only invented this new way to make it easier for the film makers to read.

Nearly everyone who works in the US film and TV industry has read fifty or more scripts in standard screenplay format. So they are quite familiar with it, and can read it easily. A non standard format will make it harder for people to read, and harder to extract the necessary information.

On the development side, the assistants, readers, and execs have all read hundreds if not thousands of scripts. On the production side, everybody from wardrobe, hair, and makeup, to camera, grips, and electric, has read many, many scripts in standard format. The actors aren't just reading the scripts for the show they're doing. They're also reading scripts for future projects.

All feature films, all hour dramas, and most sitcoms (those shot with a single camera) use a variation of the standard screenplay format.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/writersroom/scriptsmart/screenplaytv.pdf

The one exception is the specialized format used by three camera shows shot on a soundstage (Two and a Half Men, Everybody Loves Raymond). These shows use a script format derived from radio and stage plays, a format that allows for more hand written notation on the script, and uses about 1 1/2 times the number of pages for the same length of screen time.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/writersroom/scriptsmart/threecamera.pdf

[wordmonkey]

It occurred to me that you might be thinking in terms of a shooting script, which is very different from a pitch script.

Once you sell the script and the project goes into production it will be taken apart and reformatted. Now at heart, it will still stay just the same, but it will include things like characters in a scene, props needed, things like that.

HOWEVER, you are not writing that (unless you are, obviously - and you have a production crew lined up ready to roll film). You are writing a script that will attract an agent/actor/director/producer/investor. And even if you are gonna shoot the script yourself or you have that crew ready and waiting, you STILL need to go standard since that's the script you will show people who you're hitting up for investments and they want to know you know what you're talking about and know how the industry works.

But you're free to ignore all the advice here and let your creativity run wild and free, use your own format and style, whatever works for you. But when you come to show/sell.....

[Mike The Mover]

Well it's hard to ignore ever signle person arguing against my format. I'd have to be pretty stuborn...

[Joe Unidos]

You need to turn your back on your "improved" format right now and never again acknowledge its existence.

[mommyjo2]

This looks more like the form for a "scriptment", a hybrid outline/treatment with some dialogue in it. (check out Jim Cameron's original Spidey scriptment (http://www.scifiscripts.com/scripts/spidermanscriptment.txt) here - it's much different from the movie though!)

Another article here (http://www.davidanaxagoras.com/2006/09/23/start-with-the-second-draft/) (this is someone's blog - forgive me for posting! I'm not pimping their blog, but trying to make a point and disseminate valuable info.)

The format is there for a reason. The page count in standard format is about the same as the running time of the movie.

The actors can easily find their character's lines.

The director/line producer can easily find descriptions/action.

The white space is valuable real estate.

Everybody's doing it, and if you don't, you won't be part of the "in" crowd.

And only the "in" crowd gets paid and gets their movies made.

[Mac H.]

At the same time I believe my format is very easy to read and understand. Infact I think it's easier to read than the standard format.People who read scripts all the time find the standard format easier - simply because they are used it.

So you've made a system that will be preferred by people who have no idea about film - who are exactly the kind of people you DON'T want making your movie !

There is another approach that would be helpful - about 1.3 billion people on the planet find Chinese easier to read than English.

So, using that logic, why don't you submit your script to Hollywood written entirely in Chinese?

Mac
(PS: Even if you personally find Chinese a superior language, you probably wouldn't want to submit a script written in it to Hollywood...)

[Mike The Mover]

I guess I'm going to have to turn my back on my little idea.

[scripter1]

Scene 1:
Setting: In Jim's apartment

Jim: Move that chair.
Tim: Okay.
Action: Tim moves the chair.



Let me point out a few things from your format and compare them with the industry standard so that you understand why things are the way they are.

Your way is redundant and eats up valuable line space. The scene numbering takes up a whole line. Then you have the setting taking up another line BUT it doesn't tell us very much. In order for us to understand all we need to know about this location you will have to take up another two or three lines.

In standard script format the slug line is all capped making it VERY obvious. It shows us that some kind of change is coming. The letters INT. and EXT. not only tell us where the camera is BUT are a visual clue that we've moved somewhere. These are the only times these letters will appear in the script.

Using your format you may begin to feel that other info should be included in your heading. Perhaps you will end up with headings that are a full sentence long. Very bad. Info will get lost.

Characters and Dialog.
It's all run together. Afte just a few paragraphs the reader's eyes will start to cross and the whole blasted thing will just all smudge together.

The industry format naturally creates a paced flow between dialog and action. The two stand out from each other and it is very, very, VERY easy to see how the script is built. Is it dialog heavy with pages and pages of centered lines and long speeches? Or is it action/description heavy with long paragraphs (black). Either one is NOT a good sign.

Again, your writing and style is redundant. You tell us that something is going to happen Action: and then "Look see, it has happened." Someone moves the chair.

Well, the industry standard just gets right to the point, and saves a TON of line spaces.

You don't understand right now how quickly lines add up. And when you've only got 100 to 120 (MAX) it's a VITAL thing to understand.

Using your format you'll get scripts that run 135 to 150 pages just with redundant lines.

I don't mean to rub this in your face.
It's just important that you and other new writers understand how things work.

And then there is the point that these people want to make you jump through hoops. It's a test.
Three brads or two?
Do you know the answer?

[Big Tex]

Seriously -- is this a troll?

Rule #1: If you want to be taken seriously, stick with the format. It will get rejected without even having the first line read if it is not in format.

That's how they tell how many scenes there are (which has an impact on budget), how many minutes the script will run, how much (or little) dialog there is, and so on.

If you want to impress someone, come up with a new and original story, not a new and original format.

[Big Tex]

People who read scripts all the time find the standard format easier - simply because they are used it.

So you've made a system that will be preferred by people who have no idea about film - who are exactly the kind of people you DON'T want making your movie !

There is another approach that would be helpful - about 1.3 billion people on the planet find Chinese easier to read than English.

So, using that logic, why don't you submit your script to Hollywood written entirely in Chinese?

Mac
(PS: Even if you personally find Chinese a superior language, you probably wouldn't want to submit a script written in it to Hollywood...)


I would add that the format is adhered to not just because "they are used to it." It's also used because the standard format can tell you a lot of things about production, running time, etc., that can also be used to qualify scripts.

[wordmonkey]

And then there is the point that these people want to make you jump through hoops. It's a test.
Three brads or two?
Do you know the answer?

Y' know, I didn't even think about that aspect, but that's a great point. Script format is set up to roughly equate to a page per minute, so if you start messing with the format you could end up with 90 page script that is only 45 minutes of actual movie.

Now I know that the page per minute thing is obviously NOT gonna happen. I wrote a script that has some really fast dialog in it; then later some dialog that is filled with pregnant pauses, lots of looks and things left unsaid; and there are a couple of major action scenes that are only a page in length. Obviously the dialog scenes are gonna play out to different speeds and paces and the action scene, while a page in length could run for about 5 mnutes. But the script averages out at a page per minute.

And yeah, there is a part of making you tow the line as a test, but there is a real reason for format strictness.

As for the brads, it's a trick question. You don't have to name ANY character Brad, let alone two or three! ;)

[scripter1]

Ha ha ha ha ha!


There are so many layers to this issue of ...not conforming.

The studio wants to make sure that you are a serious writer and not just a fly by night hack trying to turn a fast buck. Screenwriting is serious business and they want serious people.

1 you've got to know your stuff. Have you educated yourself? Do you know who Vogler is? Seger? Field or Mckee? Trotteir? Russo? Who are your favorite writers? What have they done and why does it work? What is current in Hollywood? Who and What are hot? Have you taken the time to learn about and develop the craft? Have you SERIOUSLY put any effort in to writing by studying? The most basic test for this format. A format that has developed over many years and is proven to work. Are you willing to be structured? Can you work with rules, guidelines, and expectations?
If you want to hang with the pros you've got to be able to walk the walk and talk the talk.

2 Can they work with YOU? Are you going to fight them on notes? Are you willing to take suggestions, make changes, rewrite to some one else's ideas?

So, slow down just a bit. Do some more studying.
And if the format really does just kill you then get a program so you don't have to worry about it. Once you get used to it and you understand it you'll handle it better.

[Mike The Mover]

I just spend an entire day reformating my screenplay - the right way. It's not as hard as it looks, in fact it makes more sense.

And I do study Hollywood. I've read lot's of screenplays. I love movies. And I am willing to do what other people say - I just changed my whole damn script based on the comments I recieved on this message board.

[English Dave]

I just spend an entire day reformating my screenplay - the right way. It's not as hard as it looks.

That should do it then.

[wordmonkey]

What you might wanna do is look for some local indie film makers. I seeyou are based in Canada, which I know is a big place, but Toronto has a lively film scene.

Since you aren't in Hollywood (a major stumbling block for taking meetings) building a portfolio of smaller indie productions would help you a great deal in pushing your career.

And indie folks will often be more flexible about working with you over a distance. From North Carolina I have worked with a production companys in Ohio, LA, Sweden and Texas.

[Mike The Mover]

My current screenplay would work well with indies because it's pretty low budget. The people in Toronto could afford to make it. I've seen some pretty lousy Canadian films, but I've also seen good ones. I guess it's the same as Hollywood - hit and miss. At the same time I love California, and going there for a meeting would be a pleasure.

[scripter1]

you changed your tune.

Our work here is done.


Uh, until you ask more questions or post pages.

Happy writing.

[Jennifer Robins]

I think that new way of yours would take up more pages than they would like. You are only able to go up to 120 pages and maybe more if it's a special feature. I read many books on how to format my script before I got started. I also looked at many scripts to get an idea of how it's done. so far, my first script was asked for by a director who said it was good, but the producer went with another one. At least it was considered.

Jennifer
www.jenniferrobins.com (http://www.jenniferrobins.com)

[dpaterso]

I think Mike's got the message, so it's time to close the thread, thanks all.

-Derek
My Web Page - sci-fi, fantasy, horror, cyborgs, AIs, dragons, vampyres. (http://hometown.aol.co.uk/DPaterson57)
Yeah, but I think that whole sucking the life out of people thing would have been a strain on the relationship.