happy endings in a romcom.

[kitt]

I am a sucker for a romcom, usually the sappier the better. It's my guilty pleasure. Some may remember from my other post that I am writing a romcom. I read an article that was sent to me( thanks ;)) and it stated

5. Romantic comedies have happy endings.

While studying romcom's and scriptwriting in general I hear a lot of people complaining over this very thing. I'm a sucker for a happy ending myself, that's why I found myself somewhat devestated when it occured to me that my main man maybe should, wince, die in the end. This would definetly be killing my darling( my first if I go through with it) So What do you think would be most effective to readers, Do they want a Happy Ending or will a bittersweet tragedy make my script stick out more. I wouldn't be randomly killing him off, it's not contrived, the entire story can very well lead to this conclusion, but I could also go with my original happy ending. Just looking for opinions. I'm assuming it's not "proper" to send alternative endings in a script, it seems like that would be frowned upon.

[Nicholas S.H.J.M Woodhouse]

there was a recent adam sandler flick 'the remote' or something i think. anyway, one of the early versions had him dying at the end and it got booed at screenings. so they changed it to happy.
it depends what you want...who are you sending it to...what is their target audience...if you want this to be popular, mainstream - your chances of getting taken on is greatly increased by a happy ending.

[Goodwriterguy]

I am a sucker for a romcom, usually the sappier the better. It's my guilty pleasure. Some may remember from my other post that I am writing a romcom. I read an article that was sent to me( thanks ;)) and it stated

5. Romantic comedies have happy endings.

While studying romcom's and scriptwriting in general I hear a lot of people complaining over this very thing. I'm a sucker for a happy ending myself, that's why I found myself somewhat devestated when it occured to me that my main man maybe should, wince, die in the end. This would definetly be killing my darling( my first if I go through with it) So What do you think would be most effective to readers, Do they want a Happy Ending or will a bittersweet tragedy make my script stick out more. I wouldn't be randomly killing him off, it's not contrived, the entire story can very well lead to this conclusion, but I could also go with my original happy ending. Just looking for opinions. I'm assuming it's not "proper" to send alternative endings in a script, it seems like that would be frowned upon.
Remember the first rule of comedy, nobody gets hurt.

Now, that "rule" has been broken time or two or three and comedy is only half your genre; nevertheless, a sad ending makes a Romcom something else and difficult to promote, because the audience expectation of a Romcom is a happy ending. If you turn this on its head it had better be a gripper, it had better not make your audience stand up and boo as they did with the Adam Sandler piece, or, worse, turn readers off so badly they say "Thanks but no thanks."

I'm of the school that contends nothing is impossible, however, we have to recognize the odds too, and I believe the odds are stacked against you. Could someone pull it off? Never say never. But do realize that you would be swimming against the current and you'd need a blockbusting ending with explosive force of profound meaning to make it fly. Probably a one-in-a-million shot.

An ironic ending may be more workable, we see them in Love stories fairly commonly ("Bridges of Madison County").

But a Romcom? Skating on thin ice out there I'd say. Maybe what you do is have the guy die ... but then, in a denouement we learn he really didn't die after all ... whatta ya know, and our expectations aren't shattered. We get the horror of his death, but then he rises like a Phoenix and all's well that ends well. Whew! WE leave the theater perhaps a little shaken but nevertheless happy with the happy and assured once again that love wins, just as we all want it to in our hearts.

Tough stuff.

[kitt]

Maybe what you do is have the guy die ... but then, in a denouement we learn he really didn't die after all ... whatta ya know, and our expectations aren't shattered. We get the horror of his death, but then he rises like a Phoenix and all's well that ends well.
Tough stuff.

Thanks GWG, That sounds like a great solution. But do you think that's taking the easy way out? I don't know, I would like some more opinions, but so far I think that's the way I'm going to go with it. The almost death.

[dpaterso]

Not knowing your story I can't say yea or nay, but dying sure does take the "com" out of romcom.

For some reason I'm thinking Joe And The Volcano. Spoiler warning. We thought Tom Hanks was going to die twice, once from the fatal disease (medical charts mixed up), and twice from jumping into the volcano (burped back out again). Three times, if you count probability of drowning (before the suitcases pop up to give them a raft).

But actually dying? Then coming back? Hmm, I dunno. I might believe it. Or it might spoil the entire movie for me. Go ahead, punk. You willing to take that risk?

Shrug, just thinkin' aloud.

-Derek

[dpaterso]

Just testing, system blip didn't update thread index.

-Derek

[Lindo]

Don't get thrown by "rules" they are not made by the people who sell (or buy) scripts. Most are made by people who sell "How To Write" books instead of scripts.

Having a tearjerker ending to a romcom is a bold step and you need talent and guts to pull it off. But it can be done. If somebody wants to say that turns the romcom into something else, who cares. The combination of comedy and tragedy can produce powerful films.

Should Julia Roberts have come back to life and found true love in "Steel Magnolias" or Ally McGraw in "Love Story"?

Write your story the way you feel it.
Good luck

[Goodwriterguy]

Don't get thrown by "rules" they are not made by the people who sell (or buy) scripts. Most are made by people who sell "How To Write" books instead of scripts.
I don't think this is the case at all. I think writers make the "rules," for it is writers who write screenplays and screenplays have assumed genre over time. Writers have created cinematic genre, which have roots in the stage and in literature. The industry has a role in this too in that it buys what it thinks will be successful and generate box office. The vast majority of RomComs it has bought and produced have had happy endings, and it is that fact which defines the "rule," not anything else.

People who write "how to books" merely reflect what's happening in the industry, or, from writer-to-writer, their interpretation of what's happening.

We had an employee of a prodco on here a day or so back who said her company absolutely refuses to accept a script from a first timer if it has voiced over dialogue in it, absolutely refuses. Now there's an example of a prodco contributing to the making of the rule about first timers not using VO dialogue.


Having a tearjerker ending to a romcom is a bold step and you need talent and guts to pull it off. But it can be done. If somebody wants to say that turns the romcom into something else, who cares. The combination of comedy and tragedy can produce powerful films.

Should Julia Roberts have come back to life and found true love in "Steel Magnolias" or Ally McGraw in "Love Story"?

Write your story the way you feel it.

I don't think the advice given here has been at variance with the advice you've given. Mostly what was proferred was the cautionary tale you too set forth. The "talent and guts" to which you refer must create an untypical ending yet convince interested parties that it overcomes its untypical nature and succeeds anyway. Possible? Of course, just no mean feat, and definitely running up hill. Why? Because everybody expects a RomCom to have a happy ending.

How one feels about their story is important, to be sure, but feelings alone usually cannot fully inform a screenplay.

[RainbowDragon]

It worked well in Moulin Rouge, but that's not a romantic comedy, it's a (musical) romantic tragedy with comedic elements. . .still great, just a different genre. Do what you think the story calls for, then promote it as what it is. . .

[Celia Cyanide]

I don't know if the "happy ending" thing is an arbitrary rule so much as it is a prerequisite of the genre. As far as I know, if a romance novel doesn't have a happy ending, it's officially not a romance novel.

If you think the story will not have a happy ending, perhaps it isn't a romantic comedy.

[kitt]

Well I didn't start off trying to write a rom com. It's a love story, there's humor. I just assumed it fit into the romcom genre. There's also a subplot that envolves tragedy and plots for revenge. I'm not sure. The story is almost writing itself at this point. I'll have to see where it goes. I want it to have a happy ending, I do. The story seems to have developed a mind of it's own.

[Goodwriterguy]

Well I didn't start off trying to write a rom com. It's a love story, there's humor. I just assumed it fit into the romcom genre. There's also a subplot that envolves tragedy and plots for revenge. I'm not sure. The story is almost writing itself at this point. I'll have to see where it goes. I want it to have a happy ending, I do. The story seems to have developed a mind of it's own.
As stories have a habit of doing!

But it apears to me you've found your answer, it isn't a RomCom, it's a love story, and that means it can have any sort of enfing that makes sense in terms of your story's logic, happy, sad, or ironic.

Nearly all movies have some comedy in them, funny lines, little jokes, witty dialogue, humorous situations. But this does not push them into a comedy genre. When you "see where it goes" you'll know what you have, and will be able to promote it as such. I suspect you'll have a love story and it will have its share of humor, but it won't be a RomCom.

Enjoy! :D

[RainbowDragon]

Stories tend to do that!

[Goodwriterguy]

I don't know if the "happy ending" thing is an arbitrary rule so much as it is a prerequisite of the genre. As far as I know, if a romance novel doesn't have a happy ending, it's officially not a romance novel.

If you think the story will not have a happy ending, perhaps it isn't a romantic comedy.
Exacta-freaking-mundo!

The happy ending is a convention of the genre.

Sorta like the good guy in a Western oughta wear a white hat. ;)

[whistlelock]

How many romantic comdies that you have watched and liked ended badly or with the death of one of the characters?


It can be done, and done well. But know what you're doing and why you're doing it.

[Celia Cyanide]

It can be done, and done well.

Such as?

I can't think of any romantic comedies without happy endings at all, let alone one I liked.

A romance is defined as a love story, and if the characters are not together happily, how is it a love story? It's a story about a relationship that didn't work out, and that's not what a romantic comedy is.

[whistlelock]

Well,

Some people would point to Love Story as one. And Chasing Amy. Also, The Family Stone.

Specifically, Chasing Amy is a romantic comedy that does not end with them together (well). Although they're not together they do end up better people, so you can still argue the "well" part.

I think the Family stone handled it better, however.

Which is part of the "done well" part.

[dpaterso]

I don't mean to intrude. I didn't see Chasing-Amy but I read the script (http://www.imsdb.com/scripts/Chasing-Amy.html) just a few weeks ago (and liked it lots). No, they didn't end up together... but despite what they said to each other on parting I caught a vibe that the possibility was still there, however remote and unlikely. He had changed, and she recognized this. Sure, maybe there's more chance that life will be discovered on Mars before they ever get back together, but the door wasn't welded shut forever, a spark of hope still lingered, if you're a cock-eyed optimistic, which I guess I must be. And for that reason the ending felt right. Even tho' Kevin Smith probably didn't want me to think that way...

-Derek

[billythrilly7th]

My Best Friend's Wedding.

Julia didn't get her guy.

Luckily, Rupert Everett was there to send us out of the theaters with a nice feeling.

[gp101]

My Best Friend's Wedding.

Julia didn't get her guy.



Very true. But had she got him, the movie wouldn't have felt right. Cameron Diaz deserved the guy more and had Julia gotten him, she might have seemed like the home wrecker.

That said, you really should shoot for the happy ending as a newbie. To write a satisfying romcom where the ouple in question does not end up together requires quite a lot of maneuvering from the writer, and I would venture to guess, would be an easier sell from someone with a track record than from a newbie--don't forget, your initial target audience is not some thetre-going demographic, it's the agent or producer you're soliciting. Why would they want to take on a romcom without a happy ending from a newbie? They might, but it has to be spot-on, and that adds even more pressure to a writer trying to write a sale-able script.

Audiences who enjoy romcoms almost always expect a happy ending, and I would guess a lot of them demand it. Their interest, and the writer's challenge, is to deliver on the journey. That's what makes romcoms so hard to write. The audience pretty much knows the couple will end up together, but the way they end up together separates When Harry Met Sally from most others. And if you can work it so that by the end of Act 2 the audience is convinced the couple won't get together--that this is going to be one of those downer movies--and then spring a way for the couple to hook up, you'll have succeeded. In this way I think the art of romcoms lies in deception--fool the audience into thinking "no way, they're done. They won't hook up." and then find a natural way to unite the couple. Just don't make it contrived. The major step that the MC takes to finally win over his/her love MUST seem logical from a story POV (but not necessarily from common sense POV), maybe even heroic, perhaps even something planted or set up earlier in the script. This is one arena where a major "rule" is broken quite often: the MC might do something completely out of character in order to win over his love. He'll go against his sensibilities sometimes if he thinks it'll score his true love. Most other stories, the MC always stays true to his character. But sometimes with the romcom, part of the message is that people do things they never would have before in the name of love. Go figure.


Major Spolier Alert!!!
Just watched The Break Up with my woman (don't ask, she loves Vince Vaughn). We both screamed "No!!!" at the end because they don't end up together even though we shared their emotional journey. By the end, we were ready to see them patch things up. True, the ending leaves the door open for a possible reunion, but we needed to see it on screen.

[Celia Cyanide]

My Best Friend's Wedding.

Julia didn't get her guy.

I knew someone was going to say this, but I agree with gp101. The film still had a happy ending. And it ended with a wedding.

I never really thought of Chasing Amy as a romantic comedy, but I also thought the ending was happy.

I think I take back what I said about them having to end up together. That doesn't always have to happen, but I think that if the end of the film is not uplifting in some way, it ceases to be a romantic comedy.

[billythrilly7th]

Every writer should watch the Albert Brooks classic "Modern Romance."

Or not.

I love it.

[scripter1]

wasn't a RomCom. It was a drama.


Kitt, sounds like you've all ready started to work out that your story isn't a RomCom. Therefor it doesn't HAVE to have a happy ending.

And happy doesn't always mean that the two get together and live happily ever after. Often, very often that is the case. That is the dream that all of us want to live vicariously through film.
BUT a happy ending can be we are happy the person changed.
We the audience are now okay with the new person the character has become.

What determines you ending is what the whole point of the story is. If the point is to hook up with someone then yeah, the happy ending MUST be winning the guy or gal. IF however the point is to change in some other way then the happy ending is achieving that.

In My Best friends Wedding the happy ending was Julia reaching her goal of understanding that she was okay WITHOUT a guy.

[a tree of night]

Such as?

Roman Holiday. The final scene is either profoundly brilliant or completely wrong, depending on if you're me or my wife.

[kitt]

I think that in the case of my best friends wedding-the moral of the story was you can't decide you actually want the guy thats been pining after you for years just because he's getting married to another women, it's about Julia getting over her own ego.

[scripter1]

and audiences were happy for Julia.

Happy ending, no guy. She didn't need him.

[dpaterso]

What she needed was locked up to keep other people safe. Friggin nutbag.

-Derek

[scripter1]

why the hate?

I mean, all she was doing was trying to steal someone elses hubby to be.