Captain America lives?

[PeeDee]

I realize we already have a number of Captain America threads, which I don't really mind, since he's been on my mind quite alot since his death.

A lot of people say that he's not really dead, or that even if he is dead, he'll be resurrected or cloned or un-killed in typical Marvel fashion, if not sooner than eventually.

So, here's my theory on how Captain America comes back, and how he's not really dead.

The assassination was not totally unplanned for, predicted not only by S.H.I.E.L.D but by Nick Fury and probably Iron Man too. The problem with freedom fighters, like Captain America in this case, is that once they make themselves a symbol, they can only go for so long before someone tries to bring them down.

Therefore, Nick Fury (in my mind most especially good ol' November Foxtrot, though perhaps someone else was involved) arranged for Captain America to go down in the assassination attempt without actually dying. He's proclaimed dead to most everyone (except perhaps the Illuminati? Hmm...) and then smuggled into seclusion, overseas.

Prior to Civil War, he did spend a good deal of time overseas. There are connections I'm sure he has. And not just him, but again, Nick Fury.

And thus, Steve Rogers is alive and hidden and awaiting his return. What will trigger his proper return as Captain America, I don't know. In the Ultimate Universe, Captain America was key in bringing down the Hulk every time he went bonkers, but I don't think in the 198 Universe they'll bring him back that quickly to help in World War Hulk (I hope not.)

So, I don't know what'll bring him back quite yet.

But that's the theory I got in my head yesterday, and I quite like it.

[wordmonkey]

I like this idea.

Unfortunately I suspect it is too simple. Why have a character use his brains when we can have a mutant-esque plot device or something else out-there?

One thing I think they will play on though is what you highlighted. The Symbol. Cap is more than a man, more than a superhero, more than what fills the costume.

I'd be looking out for a new villain though. Perfect way to get him undercover with the bad-guys is to "kill him."

If ya know what I mean?

[PeeDee]

I don't know. The trick is to bring him back without fan outcry. I mean, fans were already screaming when in the Captain America comics they brought back Bucky, and it took a lot of really good writing before they accepted that.

(And it was really well written, I thought it was great.)

If they come out with a "Captain America isn't dead...because he's a MUTANT!" it's going to get the same outcry as "Captain America survived because he's Wolverine's BROTHER and has a HEALING FACTOR!"

Whereas my solution gets them nothing more than the lambasting they got for that really horrible Secret Wars storyline... :)

[jnesvold]

Remember how happy fans were when Steve Rogers retired and was replaced by John Walker/Jack Daniels, aka the Super Patriot? I hope they don't go that route again.

[Bravo]

i was confused about civil war confessions where-


SPOILERS!




they had iron man talking to the corpse of steve rogers.

so i dunno...

but i still say that if he's dead, they wont keep him that way.

[PeeDee]

Remember how happy fans were when Steve Rogers retired and was replaced by John Walker/Jack Daniels, aka the Super Patriot? I hope they don't go that route again.

God that was terrible....

A lot of people are thinking that Bucky is going to fill in for the Captain. Steve Rogers is dead, but they say the regular comic is going to continue anyway.

I liked it when Steve Rogers went as "The Captain" for awhile and had that cool black costume. I don't know if anyone else remembers. I keep trying to find a picture of it online and fail miserably.

[Inkdaub]

Cap will not stay dead and your theory, Peedee, sounds as good as any. I am in the 'the dead guy isn't really Cap' camp most days. I do believe Fury will be involved and so will Bucky/Winter Soldier. I also can't help but remember Paladin shooting Daredevil with a sniper rifle not too long ago. Also Cap pretended to be Paladin once when the capekillers closed in on him. I don't know. Cap has contacts. The Punnisher and Cap have a strange relationship as well.

As an aside...I loved Secret Wars. Well, I loved it when it came out in the eighties. It didn't stand up to a re-read too well. Also it gave us Venom.

[jnesvold]

God that was terrible....

A lot of people are thinking that Bucky is going to fill in for the Captain. Steve Rogers is dead, but they say the regular comic is going to continue anyway.

I liked it when Steve Rogers went as "The Captain" for awhile and had that cool black costume. I don't know if anyone else remembers. I keep trying to find a picture of it online and fail miserably.

And then Walker/Daniels used it as USAgent. I remember that, and still have a bunch of books from that series.

[PeeDee]

I liked U.S. Agent. I just got him as an unlockable costume in Marvel: Ultimate Alliance and I was through the roof. I liked him a great deal.

And that brings me to my next point....

S.H.I.E.L.D or whomever declares that the position of Captain America will continue to be filled, although the mantle and name of Captain America will no longer be used in Steve Rogers' memory and because of its association with the Civil War.

THUS, they fill the role with U.S. Agent, who stood for all the things that Captain America did.

But no one knows who is inside U.S. Agent. It's kept quiet, for security and military purposes.

It could still be Steve Rogers.

That's my theory #2.

So, if you reading this, mister Joe Quesada, want me to write up a quick six-issue U.S. Agent mini-series, let me know. :)

[Vanatru]

Cap is dead. Till Thor comes back.........and revives him. Then the two of them, in super pissed the F'off mode will go kick Ironman's lead ass.

And that's sad. Ironman has become such a government punk.

[PeeDee]

I know! I used to really like Iron Man. Him and Cap were my favorite Marvel characters. But recently, Iron Man's definitely a punk and Cap is...

...is...

*sniffle*

[wordmonkey]

That's my theory #2.

So, if you reading this, mister Joe Quesada, want me to write up a quick six-issue U.S. Agent mini-series, let me know. :)

I like that.

However, as resident mouthy-egotist, I think I can speak for Joe Q and tell you you're too bitter and twisted to write for such an up-lifting and patriotic character.

[PeeDee]

I'm not bitter, and I'm not mourning.

BECAUSE HE'S NOT DEAD.

*SOB*

[Vanatru]

Cap is dead...........but he can be avenged.

[PeeDee]

Damn well better be.

Except if it weren't for Civil War, my money on who would avenge him would have fallen squarely on Tony Stark. Now, not even close.

[wordmonkey]

Damn well better be.

Except if it weren't for Civil War, my money on who would avenge him would have fallen squarely on Tony Stark. Now, not even close.

Howard the Duck.

NO ONE will see that coming.

Well, except me.

...and now you guys, obviously.

...and anyone else who stumbles upon this thread.

...and anyone who googles anything we've discussed here.

...but besides us, and them, and them, NO ONE will see it coming!

[PeeDee]

Even with you telling me, I STILL don't see it coming. Lunatic. :)

[Excelsior]

Cap's "death" is so transparent as to be ridiculous. There will be no "resurrection", because the man isn't dead. It's a SHIELD ploy to mislead the public.

(And an equally transparent ploy on the part of Marvel to drum up interest in the character).

Whether or not he's US Agent I don't know, but I doubt it - it's just too dang obvious. Observant bystanders would pick up on their identical styles in a heartbeat, though packing him off to Canada was an interesting choice.

[PeeDee]

Cap's "death" is so transparent as to be ridiculous. There will be no "resurrection", because the man isn't dead. It's a SHIELD ploy to mislead the public.


Isn't that what I said in my first post? :)

[Excelsior]

Yeah. Just venting my own spleen.

[PeeDee]

Yeah, yeah, I know. But you were supposed to praise my visionary genius, THEN vent your spleen!

;)

I'll complain if he comes back, because it's definitely a cop-out then, but that said, I wish Captain America weren't dead. I really do.

Iron Man, maybe. I fell out of love with him a few years ago, and he hasn't gotten better since.

[Excelsior]

Honestly, I'd have more respect for the company and the character if he actually stayed dead. Is there any contrivance more overused than the resurrected comic book hero?

[PeeDee]

It's a piece of irony. They kill the character to show that this crisis is serious, that heroes really can die.

Except that they've brought so many heroes back, it doesn't work to have anyone die.

So dying doesn't work. Which means killing them is pointless.

Which means threatening them in a dangerous situation is meaningless.

Which means being threatened by and fighting super villians is pointless....

And so on.

[Inkdaub]

Well I haven't even read Cap 25 yet. I went to the shop today, though, so I'll be reading it in a little while. Maybe I'll have a decent theory after reading the issue.

[PeeDee]

I agonized about this thread being a spoiler, but decided that it had been trumpeted across so much media now, it was a moot point. I hope I didn't ruin it for you. It's still a good issue. :)

[Inkdaub]

No you didn't. I already knew he had been shot by a sniper and had been killed. That was in the newspaper before the issue even came out as I recall. The issue itself was actually far more interesting than I anticipated...meaning I didn't know what actually happened.

Peedee...how does Bucky know that who he thinks he is talking to is really who he is talking to?

[The_Grand_Duchess]

Personally I think that Steve Rogers is dead but the costume will live on. Like how long has that dude been Captian America, a long time. It's time for some new blood in the suit.

[Scotty519]

I'm sure Captain America will be back soon in one form or another. Anyway, you were looking for pictures of USAgent, here's his wikipedia profile, featuring a pretty good picture from the upcoming Omega Flight:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USAgent

And here's a picture of the new Punisher costumethat makes me want to puke:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Cap_punish.jpg

If that's how they plan on keeping Captain America going they might as well claim he's Wolverine's brother while they're at it... ugh.

[Turtle07]

Huh? There's still Captain America?! Whoa, I thought his comics stopped selling years ago. Then again, I'm not really a (Marvel? DC?) fan so I'm not up to date on those things. My dad loves Captain America, I think he may like to hear this tidbit of info if he hasn't already.

[Shadow_Ferret]

OK. Has anyone been following Captain America Reborn? I'm a little lost. It started out at a 5 issue series. But now I look at issue 5 and it says 5 of 6! And the ending says, "To be Continued."

WTF? Is that kosher? To turn a planned 5 issue series into 6 issues?

And I have a copy of Captain America: Who will wield the shield #1 that says, "The stunning aftermath of Captain AMerica Reborn." So is it safe to read it before I ever see issue #6 of Reborn?

Help me out here, true believers.