Does anyone use a Outline?

[Carimel]

Hi,

I was just wondering if anyone uses a outline before they start writing. I have been thinking about using one because it might be helpful. I was just wondering everyone's input? Thanks!!!

[Mel]

Sometimes I try. I'm working at getting better at using them but it's been an uphill climb for me.

[Pike]

For long works, yes. I really need to establish goals and effects character have on the novel in a whole. It helps me stay on track but if something comes along that feels more enticing I'll revise it to suit the current mood.

Pike

[dizz]

I created an outline for my current WIP but I did not really stick to it all that well.

[bubbagringo]

I create one afterwards so I can keep up...

[Ravenlocks]

I don't use one, but I think it's always worth trying to see if it works for you. There are also all different types. One type of outline might work for you, another might not.

Btw, and I say this only because we're all writers and we're here to improve, you should correctly say "an outline." Since "outline" starts with a vowel, you need to use "an" instead of "a." :)

[~grace~]

I outline in my head. Which doesn't work so well when I forget things. Which defeats the purpose of outlines I guess.

I guess what I'm saying is I more or less know what my story's going to do but I'm open to change.

[Birol]

Yes. Keep in mind, the outline for my current novel consists of only 9-10 bullet points.


ETA: Moved from Novels to BWQ.

[GerriB]

I am uber outliner woman.

My current project has many layers of outlining.

* Determining amount of books and overall story
* Getting beginning and end of each book worked out
* Spew outline for first book, i.e. spew out the story into a file
* Scene by scene outline for first book
* Expand scene outline with plot, character, and theme emphasis
* Detailed scene outline (sometimes)
* Write novel

Yes, I'm insane. But if I don't do most of these steps, I can't write. I'm exactly the opposite of people who say they lose interest in a story if they do any kind of outlining. The more I outline, the more I want to write the story. I have to know where I'm going and what I'm doing. And yes, even with all that planning, I still get surprised by what happens in my scenes.

I've actually tried the organic method, i.e. sit and write. Doesn't work for me. More power to those it does work for. So please, no "OMFG I can't write like that" responses. It's ok. I'm just insane with my detail work.

There is no one true way. Take what works and run.

[ClaudiaGray]

I do. Sometimes I have very detailed outlines; sometimes they are looser. And even when I have a detailed one, I may end up deviating from it somewhat as I go through the book. But I find it helpful to know the emotional arcs, the plot points and the basic pacing of what I'm about to do.

Outlining doesn't work for everyone, but if you feel drawn to it, definitely give it a try. It works for me.

[Sage]

I tried to write down what was going to happen in my first novel (not exactly an outline, but notes on what HAD to happen), but having the written plan kept me from exploring possible detours my novel might have taken, and it may have suffered for it. I plot my stuff in my head, and usually know what has to happen before I write very much, but I've found I'm more flexible if it's not written down for me, and anything I happen to forget, probably wasn't important enough to keep in the first place.

[Mumut]

I just let it happen. There are so many possibilities, I can't afford to lose a chance for better things by placing a straight-jacket around my imagination. I have a general idea in my mind, of course. That's why I eat green veges - to try to put off the onset of alzheimers!

[Queen of Swords]

Always, for novels. I learned the hard way that jumping feet first into a novel and just writing is fun and exhilarating, but the results are not as good for me as they are when I outline. The novel doesn't always stick to the outline, but the outline provides a structure and a scaffolding for it.

[blueobsidian]

Personally, no. I've tried and it just doesn't work for me. You should give it a shot, though! What works for any of us may not work best for you. Everyone's mind works so differently.

-Kim

[Linda Adams]

I've tried in the past, mainly because everyone (the books, friends, family) all said I should. I've found, I think, that I really can't write with an outline--it's a little too structured for me. What I did instead was to write my hook for the book first and identify what makes it different from the other books in the genre. However, I'll probably do a scene-by-scene outline on the book after I finish it. This was something I saw at a workshop, and it might help with identifying problems during the rewriting process.

This is the scene by scene outline, if anyone is curious: http://www.margaretfisk.mmfcf.com/writing/writing_tools.html It's an Excel file.

Also worth looking at is The Marshall Plan for Novel Writing by Evan Marshall. It has a step-by-step procedure for writing a book, including an outline. It might not be for everyone, but I found that I still got things out of the book anyway.

[L M Ashton]

This is a frequently asked question. I'd suggest you do a search.

[onlyhere]

I hate outlines and haven't done one since forced to in school.:P

[Bufty]

Hi Carimel,

For every person who uses an outline there will be another who doesn't. If you find it works for you, use it. If it doesn't....

[jenngreenleaf]

Hi,

I was just wondering if anyone uses a outline before they start writing. I have been thinking about using one because it might be helpful. I was just wondering everyone's input? Thanks!!!For larger projects, I do. Then, that outline is converted into a working table of content. I write non-fiction, so I'm thinking that might be easier to transpose than with fiction work. I use them when outlining goals and lists of things I want to accomplish from month to month also.

[Expanding Ink]

I write fiction, and mostly short stories. Sometimes I create a proper outline, but more often I just jot down a few ideas on a scrap of paper. I also do a lot of brainstorming, though, which sometimes ends up more like an outline than anything else.

Give it a try if you want. If it doesn't work for you, just scrap it. Every writer's different.

[Scrawler]

My outline is done using a 36x36 piece of paper tacked to the wall with brief chapter outlines about the action, plot, characters involved, scenes, etc. I like my storyboard technique because I can easily see the flow.

[Aggy B.]

I use outlines. Just how detailed depends on the project. And they are never set in stone. If I get a better idea about the direction something should take I write a big "OR" beneath the current outline and set out the new storyline.

For me an outline just helps me keep track of where I'm going for those points when I get really frustrated/blocked. It also means that when I get a good idea for part of a chapter I haven't reached yet I don't have a problem sketching it out because I know that I won't forget where I'm at or how to get from there to the later stuff.

However, the end section of my outline tends to be much more vague. Then as I get closer to finishing I'll flesh it out more. That helps keep me from working on the outline so long I lose interest in the story.

[Chasing the Horizon]

I always have a detailed scene-by-scene outline before I start writing. It never occurred to me in the beginning to even try to do it any other way (later I did try to write a book without an outline. One of these days I'm going to make sense out of that 15,000 word mess I ended up with as a result). Without a detailed outline I will write in hopeless, meaningless circles until I'm both nauseous and dizzy.

A lot of the story elements other people work out during the first draft I work out during the outlining, which is one reason my first drafts require so little revision when I finish. For me, writing the outline makes me more excited about the story, rather than less. I'm still frequently surprised by how scenes end up turning out, and I always end up changing some parts of the outline to match with unexpected turns the story takes. I always joke that I can't think and write at the same time, so all the thinking has to have already been worked out before I start.

That's just how I do it. Some people are happy with a one page general outline, and others do best with no outline at all. Try the different approaches, then do whatever works for you. I think the key to using an outline successfully is to not treat it as a set-in-stone path that the story must never deviate from.

(I will say that I don’t think doing a detailed outline means more work. The time I spend outlining is more than saved during revisions.)

[KikiteNeko]

Yes. And it expands as I write. Some things also get deleted. If I didn't use an outline, there's no way I could keep up with all the events of a 300 page story.

[MoonWriter]

Only when I'm coloring with my crayons.

[Varthikes]

Yes, I use an outline for my works. It helps me to organize my plot points and to keep me more or less on track.

[XvDragonvX]

For me, I only outline the major attributes of the characters and that's it. Other then that, I write everything freely. The only reason why I do that, by the way, is simply because that's what I was taught. Honestly, I've noticed very good results too.

[talkwrite]

I am huge on outlines. As a series editor, I require them from all novice writers along with their book queries/proposals. The outline should be flexible and you can expect it to change as you see what changes need to take place in your book. An outline can teach you about your own writing habits too. I use them in my article writing.

[TheSauce]

I don't use them for short stories, but when I'm working on something longer, I like to use them to keep myself on the rails, so to speak.

[Riley]

Unless it's a short story, article, or poem, I always use outlines. Without them, I go off on tangents (well, I still go off on tangents with them, but I do it less) and get lost. Then, in despair, I drop the story. If you're having trouble completing novels, you might give outlining a try. It really does help in some cases.

[MrWrite]

I'm writing my first screenplay and yes I have written an outline. And now I'm just waiting for my story to go off in an unexpected direction that will render my outlining useless lol

[Tnonk]

For short stories I generally just reference whatever notes I may have made about the story. Not really an outline though.
For my novels I generally outline loosely chapter by chapter. I know where I'm going with the story but, because I'm off & on with my writing quite a bit, I need an outline to reestablish my connection with that particular storyline.
I generally have several WIP going on in my head at any one time. So, to keep what little sanity I have left, I have to let the ideas out in the forms of outlines, synopsis, notes etc.

Adrian

[inkkognito]

On the non-fiction side of things, I can see their value for a book-length work. I don't use them for my magazine articles, but as I play around with book topics I find that I am doing a form of outline even without formally planning to do it. It helps me to organize the topics more logically and to make sure I include all of the points that I want to cover.

[Medievalist]

Here's a good post in the FAQs from author J. M. McDermott, aka Bad Ducky, on using a spreadsheet to outline (http://www.absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=79297).

And there are a couple of super posts in Macdonald's Uncle Jim thread on outlining, but I can't seem to find them right now . . . maybe some kind soul can link to them?

[Mel]

Found this one on Outlining (http://www.absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?p=82324#post82324)from Dawno's Index (http://www.absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8754)for that thread.

[Autodidact]

Yes, since Mrs. Brumfield in 4th grade, I have thought and written in outlines. Using an outline and a modern word processor, you can get down whatever thoughts you have to begin. Then, when you have another thought, you have a place to stick it in order. When it's time to start a frirst draft, you're halfway there.

[DragonHeart]

I don't usually start with an outline. I can be easily sidetracked at times and before I realize it, I'll have written two pages about an ultimately insignificant detail that will probably only show up in one scene, or I'll start working out entire histories of things just to see where they lead. This is not a particularly productive path for me.

I reserve outlining for when I get stuck instead. Knowing the next logical move is often enough to get things going again.

I do keep a general overview that I write while working the first draft, though. Important characters, events, etc, so I keep everything straight. Most of the time, anyways.

~DragonHeart~

[Kasi]

I always have an outline once I hit the third chapter. Otherwise I'd get horribly lost. I think I approach it differently from other writers. I sit down with a notebook and let my imagination run wild. I make a quick note of every interesting scene I want to include. Then I write 'B' next to them if they should appear in the first third of the book. I put 'M' if it should be in the middle third and so on. Then I put them in order. I don't stick to the outline though. I only use outlines as a rough map of where I'm heading. As you know sometimes your characters will change paths for reasons only they know. I love it when that happens, even if it does mess up my vision of what should happen.

[Dave.C.Robinson]

Some do, some don't. It really doesn't matter in most cases.

The only catch is that sometimes a publisher will offer a multi-book contract, but want outlines of the as-yet unwritten books. If that happens it can be helpful to know how to outline even if you don't use them normally.

[Elidibus]

I never outline. I hated it when teachers forced me to outline every single thing I did and I never forgave them. Now, I just wing it. All the time, 100% of the time. I actually tried an outline on one of the very first books I tried as a college student, but I failed so hard at it, I buried the papers and started on my way.

I'm sure it's been said, but I'll reiterate. Try it. I at least tried outlining once. It wasn't for me. But it may be your thing. So give it a try and see what happens =-)

[donroc]

I outline with pencil, make notes between in ink, then create on the computer and often deviate.

[Carole]

I loathe outlines. I detest outlines. I never used an outline successfully . . . until my English Comp class this year. *le sigh* I have to say that I can understand why they are useful, especially when writing on a deadline. Although outlining takes what seems to be a huge chunk of creative time away from real writing, It does help an ADD person like me stay focused and on track. Fewer tangents. Plus, also being OCD, it's good to see the chunks of organized thoughts.

Basically, when I write just to get something out of my system, I don't outline. If I am working on a real project, I do.

[mario_c]

At first I don't outline, because I'm writing on the raw ideas popping out of my head. Then what I get in the file is a pile of scenes and dialogue going nowhere. Or I just get tired of writing nonsense.
Then it's time to write a Beat Sheet, character bios, list the Seven key scenes (ETA Stanley Kubrick called these Non-Submersibles, the 6 OR 7 plot points that your WIP simply cannot operate without), write the treatment, and get these scenes back in line marching to the end. If it's not too late...

[MDei]

I never outline. I write better not using one. I think about my story so much and toss around ideas so, it would be impossible for me to stick to one. When I get the idea and I'm ready to put it on paper (or the computer) I just start and by the time I get to the end, I've had so many original thoughts and ideas. I'll jot done details and events at the end to write the synopsis, but that's not an outline really.

[NeuroFizz]

The goal is to FINISH your story and get on with polishing it. Who gives a darn how you get to the FINISH? Just use whatever tools are necessary to accomplish the goal. To say that one way is better than someone else's way is arrogant grandstanding. Preen about the product, not the process.

[alyssalynne]

I outline but don't force myself to follow it if I feel the story needs to go in a different direction. I like having an overview of the plot progression before I start writing the draft. I think everyone should do what works for them and their projects whether that's outlining or not.

[skyscrape32]

Outlines for me makes my explanation of ideas easier so I make sure that all my points are bulleted in my paper.

[Corpus Thomisticum]

I definitely outline, especially for more formal pieces. I don't write down every single detail of what I want to include, just a general tree on which to hang my prose. With an outline, I am better able -- with my feeble memory -- to make sure I hit on every salient point I wanted to make in each paragraph, so it helps me control the flow of the discussion.

[Mythical Tiger]

I don't outline:tongue

[WireHair]

I outline because as I think of new elements, I find sometimes I need to foreshadow them. Reminding myself in an outline is easier than trying to edit in-between action and dialogue later.
I find that my stories develop much further with an outline than in the past where I would write 8 pages and not know where to go from there. I never finished those unplanned ones.
Also, an outline affords me the ability to roughly make dialogue as it comes to me. It's fresh and realistic the first time I imagine it- so I save it in the outline for later.

[brad_b]

My first outline lasted for about three chapters and then the book decided to head elsewhere. With only a general idea of where I wanted it to go I followed and ended up liking the book's path better than the original outline. A lot of it had to do with getting to know the characters better as it progressed, I realized some reacted to things differently than I expected. Sometimes a book follows a logical progression as it grows. On some chapters I started with an idea of where I wanted it to lead and by the time I finished found it in a completely different county, but it's direction set up the next chapter nicely with twists I didn't realize were there. Evolution of a story is a good thing, just as too much structure can inhibit creativity. In the end I kissed the outline goodbye and followed the inner voices - they all told me I was just fine. Like most say, do what works for you but stay flexible whichever path you take.

[Pamster]

I like to outline sometimes. Not consistently though. Sometimes a story will move in another direction entirely and that's just how it goes. :)

[ellisnation]

I outline sometimes. I use it when I have an idea or get inspired by something random and want to get something down on paper. It's not exactly pretty or organized, but it keeps me from losing it and has proven to be helpful.

[Pragmatic_Dreamer]

I can't function without outlines. I desperately need to know how my story is going to end and that all loopholes and loose ends are appropriately taken care of before I can start composing the actual prose. I have pages and pages of notes on character outlines, world details, social hierarchy, etc that I am constantly adding to or remodeling. My outline is not static though. I make changes to it all the time. I guess you could say that half baked plots are one of my not so secret pet peeves.

[Carole]

That's how it works for me too. Sometimes I think maybe I outline too hastily or something, but other times I think that the way my outlines mutate is just part of the process. At any rate, I still hate outlines, but I am trying to use them to make myself a more disciplined and focused writer.

[Horserider]

I never use outlines. Whenever I try to start a story with an outline I get carried away, bored and never even start the book. It's better if I just start writing. I like to have a seperate page of notes with lists of characters, things I need to go back and change, and things I need to remember for future parts.

[The Kidd]

If I made an outline I would never get words on the page. What i've learned is that if I plan a WIP, the ideas is quickly ditched. I can't say why either. Maybe its because i'm so un-organized.

[scarletpeaches]

I have a theory, The Kidd - it could be because in outlining, you're telling the story. So why write it again? The tale is told.

Sure, one could say that about a first draft, but in writing a first draft you're closer to the end product than you would be if you'd written a sketchy outline, so the end is in sight.

[minervaK]

I create one afterwards so I can keep up...

Oh my god! I do this too. I thought I was the only one.

MK

[minervaK]

My outline is done using a 36x36 piece of paper tacked to the wall with brief chapter outlines about the action, plot, characters involved, scenes, etc. I like my storyboard technique because I can easily see the flow.

This sounds interesting. Mind if I steal it?

MK