Cacoethes Publishing House, LLC

shawnrohrbach said:

Also it is a small, new publishing house making all the small new publishing house mistakes.

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Actually, as someone who's been involved in both small press and micropress (as well as publishing with two of the Big Five), I have to tell you that not listing a book on Amazon and Barnes and Noble.com is a fatal mistake, not an ordinary mistake.

It is not a mistake that anyone I've published with as a writer, or advised as a consultant, has ever made. Nor is it a mistake I would have dreamt of making in my own micropublishing experience.

I mean, seriously, listing books on Amazon.com and Barnes and Noble.com are the minimum level of publishing competence. If your publisher can't do that, they aren't providing the basics.

I don't say this to lecture you, Shawn, because you may well be doing this for love rather than money. But people who are trying to make a living out of this stuff need to know which publishers are doing the fundamentals in marketing their work, and which aren't.

a know...

pretty tired of being lectured by anonymous people who then say they are not lecturing me.

can't say I wasn't warned though...

...in an email from a person who uses his real name here about the children who hide behind the bushes and throw rocks at passing cars.

Shawn, I know it's upsetting to post about a publisher that has accepted your work and to then be told that the publisher probably isn't so great after all. But no one here is "hiding in the bushes and throwing rocks at cars." Yes, some of us choose to be anonymous (though you can often find out who they are just by clicking on their profiles and following the links), but many of the people who've posted in this thread have done so under their real names.

More than that, there's a good deal of knowledge and expertise here. Some of us are small press published. Some of us are large press published. One of us is a publisher. That's where the criticisms are coming from--not from a desire to shoot you down, though I can understand that it may feel that way.

I don't know who contacted you in email, but I'm guessing he has an agenda, and whatever it is, it doesn't really involve helping you. Yeah, we can be pretty hard on small presses here--here's just one example of why--but writers need to ask the hard questions. If the press is doing right by its authors and their books, it can certainly survive them.

- Victoria

valid points are being made here.

disregard them at your own risk...

shawnrohrbach said:

pretty tired of being lectured by anonymous people who then say they are not lecturing me.

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I'll be happy to send you my full name and address--I'm dropping you a PM with it right now. I don't choose to share it on Internet message boards for extremely good personal reasons, but if you had contacted me directly instead of griping here, I would have shared it, along with links to the large, small, and micropress publishers I've published with and worked with.

And you can turn a blind eye to what I'm saying if you like, but what you're saying about "this is just the way things work for small publishers" is false and I correct it because I don't want other people reading the thread to be misled.

There's a huge difference between "throwing rocks" and having stats and experience to back up claims. Just because you may not like what you hear, doesn't necessarily mean the speaker is out to get you or cut you down.

Disregarding the advice of people here who've had much, much more experience than most people -- including you or me -- is unwise.

*sigh*

We use these boards in Bewares and Backgrounds for one purpose--to educate writers about the companies that he/she works with.

To EDUCATE.

Although you are publishing with this company, this thread is not specifically about you. No one has thrown any rocks at all--and to infer that they have is completely unfair.


No anonyminity here, my friend.

Hi...I hope no one minds me bringing this topic back up. I was looking around at ePublishers and saw this one mentioned, and I thought maybe my experiences might be helpful to anyone who might be looking into them.

I was actually contacted by the owner of Cacoethes last summer, before they'd actually launched. They found work of mine on the internet and expressed interest in it. I was told a lot of things, including royalties for both print books and eBooks, and I was given the impression that they were looking to do print books.

While trying to work with both the own and the editor, both of whom tended to have some misspellings and other grammar problems, I was given another story on the matter: That the site was strictly eBook. Confused, I ask for clarification, and was told yet another different story, this time that the site was mostly eBook with some printing, and that they would use the eBooks to gauge (or "gage", as the owner put it) whether or not it would be worthwhile to print the books.

Even more than that, the contract made me leery as well. Among other things, one of the stipulations in the contract was that the author must do their utmost to market their work. Yet there was no mention in the contract of what the publisher would do to market the work as well, and little to no mention of it from the owner. It sounded very much like they were taking 60% for doing very little.

In the end, though I would love to be published, I decided it was just better off to stay away.

I'm not saying that this means that they're absolutely bad news. But these things were warning bells to me, and I thought they might be something other people would like to know.

brightlyiburn said:

I was actually contacted by the owner of Cacoethes last summer, before they'd actually launched. They found work of mine on the internet and expressed interest in it.

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So was I, but i didn't have any work posted. They sent me a message through MySpace asking me to send them a sample of my writing for consideration.

More than reason enough for me to not consider them.

I just got a contract to write for Cacoethes Publishing House, and they seem okay but they asked for my social security number. I'm really new to writing and the contract came as a bit of a shock for me- can any authors who have published for Cacoethes tell me if the asking for the social security number is normal? Also, I'm not sure how to tell Cacoethes that I'm fourteen years old, or if I should tell them at all. Or even if it's a big deal, but everyone else who has written for them has gone to college. Thank you!

Rachel

Thanks for the advice. I just kept thinking that Cacoethes was a scam because they weren't in Writer's Market, but I suppose they're a recently established company and this year's Writer's Market was published before they had gotten started. Also, they spelled my story incorrectly in the contract, which freaked me out a bit. However, it was an understandable misspelling... They do have good books out there, and I'm happy that a company is interested in publishing my work so early in my life.
And I apologize for the general statement that "everyone went to college", I guess I was overwhelmed by the credentials of the few authors I looked at.

If you're only 14, your parents must sign the contract.

Not being included in Writer's Market is not a sign that a publisher is a scam. On the other hand, being included isn't a sign that it's legit. Never assume that a publisher (or literary agency) is reputable just because of its inclusion in a popular writers' guide.

rgallagher, I suggest you carefully read this entire thread, and spend some time exploring this forum and the rest of Absolute Write, before deciding to publish your work with Cathcoethes.

- Victoria

I heard about Cacoethes Publishing through MySpace. They sent me a friend request. When I pulled up the profile, at first, I thought it was a young woman looking for a sugar daddy, which is one of the things I explicitly say I am NOT looking for on my bio. I almost sent it to junk. The fact that the page is plastered with romance novels and images didn't help either. However, since I saw several mentions of "publishing," it made me curious and I looked at their regular web site and decided the "profile" was just for the head of the company. Okay, I can deal with that. There still comes the question of how they heard of me. I guess it was through some author friends that they found my name, or maybe my bio.

Anyway, the thought of submitting to them was tempting. I've been at this since 1994 and have 595 rejections so far (but who's counting). I've written 9 complete novels and am working on two more at the same time. I've written dozens of short stories and have seen four of them published, but no novels. It's hard not to be cynical about this whole game, especially after how we're told to write, and then a piece of garbage like The Ruins comes out.

I digress.

Like I said, it's tempting to submit to them as it sounds like I might actually have a chance to get a foot in the door. Then I ran across the Water Cooler and all of your comments. I wrote P&E and asked if they had anything on these people. I got a prompt reply that they didn't and even asked me if I had anything to tell them!

At this point, it's hard not to look at them with extreme caution. Of course, by the time they prove themselves, it will be too late to submit because by then, if they prove themselves to be a good company that is, they will be flooded with submissions.

I don't get a warm fuzzy off of them yet, especially since it seems they push their romance and erotica to the forefront. Also, they have a long list of authors on their site but very vew of them, so far, have anything out yet, and only a couple are on Amazon.

Also, their logo bothers me. At first I thought it was a bullet hole, but on closer examination, it looks like two guys looking at something. It is so small, I can't tell much about it.

So, as much as I'm tempted to submit, I'm not sure it's a wise choice yet.

Feidb

I submitted my novel and they have accepted it. They are a new publisher. However, I am willing to give them a chance. They may not be Random House. However, we all know how difficult it is to get into a publisher like that. I emailed authors from their website and have not had any negative comments. Their books are available at Amazon, Barnes, and even Target. Books go into print shortly after ebook release. It didn't take long for them to create my beautiful cover art. They have been very accomodating to my questions. And, as with any publisher I would sign with, the big houses or not, I am already laying out my marketing plan. Cacoethes is doing their part as I am doing mine.

If you want to give a small epublisher with a romance focus a chance, why not look at them all? This is not specific to Cacoethes but it seems risky to chose a publisher based on them finding you. Publishers actively soliciting authors are not necessary the pick of the bunch. And there are at least 50 epublishers out there in a similar niche. Some of them older and selling greater volume.

I am particular bemused the someone put of by romance novel cover art would then consider publishing with what is, predominantly although not exclusively, a romance publisher. Romance is how they are branded and, as epublishers sell mainly from their own site and established customer base, what they will sell best. Also, marketing plans are all very well, but sales volume per ebook title seems to be determined almost entirely by publisher, secondarily genre and author, with author marketing normally having a minor or even negligible effect.

veinglory said:

Also, marketing plans are all very well, but sales volume per ebook title seems to be determined almost entirely by publisher, secondarily genre and author, with author marketing normally having a minor or even negligible effect.

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this last part needs repeating for everyone looking at a small press publisher.

it doesn't matter how much you flog yourself to the newspapers, the local library, the local radio station and how you harass the friends and family you have to buy your book or give it a try - without the PUBLISHER doing their part to get it out there you're dead in the water.

the author plays an important part in marketing but it shouldn't be left up to him/her to get the book into stores or to do EVERYTHING. The publisher should be sending out ARCs, review copies and getting all the promotional things done that only a well-established and competent sales force can do.

without it you might as well have gone to your local copy center and taken the money you'd put into promotion to run off a few copies for friends and family - 'cause they're the only ones who will see and buy it.

been there, done that.

I refuse to dwell on such negativity. I never said this company will not do their share of marketing. And...I didn't choose the publisher because of their cover artistic abilities. I believe that success is in the attitude one has when approaching the project. Let's face it, if you want your book on shelves of book sellers, everyone of the publishers talked about in this website will not be doing that for you. Only, the Random Houses of the business and such. And, if our books were with the "big" houses such as Random, we wouldn't be bothering with websites such as this one. Every book I publish is a stepping stone, which is better than hiding my manuscript in my laptop. We all need to start somewhere, and be willing to work for it!

Dreamer said:

I believe that success is in the attitude one has when approaching the project.

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I guess it depends on how you define "success".

If it’s defined as making lots of sales, I’m not sure how a good atttitude on the author’s part compensates for a lack of publicity, distribution, reviews, etc. on the publisher’s part. I’ve read about other authors who also thought their own efforts and positivity would be all they needed to make sales; they all learned differently in the end.

Every book I publish is a stepping stone, which is better than hiding my manuscript in my laptop.

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It's better to be unpublished than to be published badly. A manuscript that is on your laptop can be reworked and sold to a good publisher. Once you've used up the right of first publication, though, there's not a lot that can be done with it - especially if the publisher isn't helping with regard to sales.

We all need to start somewhere, and be willing to work for it!

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An author does the bulk of the work by writing the manuscript. The author should not be responsible for advertising, distribution, sales and reviews as well.

I was also offered a contract, but decided to decline. First off, their site seems to be overly focused on erotica, which was not what I was writing. There was also something in the contract that I found disagreeable. If you write for them, you have to grant them future rights to all of your novel's characters. Didn't like that one single bit!

Dreamer said:

Let's face it, if you want your book on shelves of book sellers, everyone of the publishers talked about in this website will not be doing that for you. Only, the Random Houses of the business and such.

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Only the Random Houses get books on the shelves of booksellers?

And, if our books were with the "big" houses such as Random, we wouldn't be bothering with websites such as this one.

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If I'm not mistaken, there are a number of posters here who have had their book or books published or accepted by the "big" houses.

Dreamer said:

I refuse to dwell on such negativity.

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I hope you do not think I am negative. I publish exclusively with epublishers, but I didn't chose which ones arbitrarily or based on their attitude or the assumption all that matters is my attitude, or even theirs. I choose epublishers based on their based on expertise, relevance to my genre and sales volume. Not necessarily in that order.

This not about being negative, it is about knowing you are making a choice and choosing carefully. I am very positive about epublishing, when it is done well.

Richard Martin said:

If I'm not mistaken, there are a number of posters here who have had their book or books published or accepted by the "big" houses.

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My novel is published by a small press that is less than two years old, but I have had at least some book stores spontaneously stock it and have it on their shelves--and I see books by this press in every bookstore I go into.

Even with very small presses there are differences in the capacity to distribute and to sell. And some epublishers have almost no hardcopies distributed but sell into the thousands per title in ebook form.

But 99% of small e/POD publishers do neither. That is what authors should be aware of. Aim as high and low as you like, but do it as a conscious choice.