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Old 11-25-2009, 12:27 AM   #1
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Wolf Hall by Hilary Mantel - Great book with a big problem
I'm reading the Man Booker prize winner Wolf Hall by Hilary Mantel. I love it because it deals with the Tudor period, one of my favorites, and it focuses on Thomas Cromwell and Wolsey with few face to face meetings with over-exposed Henry and Anne in literary works. I hate it because it's a hard read only because the writer uses pronouns without discrimination. By that I mean if two or three males are in a scene, I have to reread to determine who is the antecedant of the he and exactly who is the subject of the conversation. Has anyone else reading this superb novel, with breathtakingly evocative metaphores this same problem.? It's a big novel, but worth every hour it takes to read it to the end --my opinion with the pronoun confusion its only draw back. I'd love to hear from someone finding the same problem. Or am I too critical? Doc
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Old 03-29-2010, 01:19 AM   #2
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Wolf Hall
Has anyone else read this one yet?

I love my literary fiction, but I'm really struggling with this one.

Is it just me, or did anyone else find it difficult?
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Old 03-29-2010, 01:32 AM   #3
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Difficult? Well slow and boring. I haven't finished reading it yet. And I love LF too.
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Old 03-29-2010, 01:36 AM   #4
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I tried, got around 30 pages into it and gave up.

It's a shitstorm of pronouns and it made one of the most fascinating periods of English history boring.
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Old 03-29-2010, 01:40 AM   #5
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Page 24.

Please God let something happen! I don't need the social commentary!!
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Old 03-29-2010, 01:47 AM   #6
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Page 24.

Please God let something happen! I don't need the social commentary!!
Wont for another many pages.
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Old 03-29-2010, 01:43 AM   #7
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Holy hell, I was worried it was just me! I should have loved this book( the Tudors intrigue me) but instead I'm seriously struggling. I keep picking it up and putting it back down again.

Glad to know I'm not alone.
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Old 03-29-2010, 01:49 AM   #8
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I'm gonna stick to my Tudors box set.

Complete wank when it comes to historical inaccuracy but JRM takes his clothes off a lot.
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Old 03-29-2010, 01:51 AM   #9
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I tried to start it, but I'm afraid the style isn't to my taste. Very glad it won the Booker, though. Gives a little more "cred" to historical fiction.

Though, I admit I haven't read any of the other books nominated for the Booker that time around (yet.) Maybe something else was more deserving.
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Old 03-29-2010, 02:42 AM   #10
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I did enjoy Little Stranger by Sarah Waters.

Okay, I'm going to read something else now.
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Old 03-29-2010, 02:54 AM   #11
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Have to say I loved it and read it as straight through as was possible given its size. I loved its immersive quality, the fact that it took me somewhere else. I got lost in it for a good long while.
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Old 03-29-2010, 12:11 PM   #12
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I read it and enjoyed it a lot, but I was also massively irritated by a lot of things--for instance, the pronouns. Just tell me who the hell is speaking, Hilary Mantel. And I'm amazed anyone could get very far without having an intricate knowledge of Tudor history--there are so many in jokes and people who pop up but aren't explained. Still, I stuck with it to the end and really liked it.

I wrote a nice, long reaction to it here:

http://queensransom.wordpress.com/20...all-reactions/
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Old 03-29-2010, 12:59 PM   #13
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I read it and enjoyed it a lot, but I was also massively irritated by a lot of things--for instance, the pronouns. Just tell me who the hell is speaking, Hilary Mantel. And I'm amazed anyone could get very far without having an intricate knowledge of Tudor history--there are so many in jokes and people who pop up but aren't explained. Still, I stuck with it to the end and really liked it.

I wrote a nice, long reaction to it here:

http://queensransom.wordpress.com/20...all-reactions/
Thanks, I'll have a read.

I think once something starts irritating me, the critical part of my brain kicks in.
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Old 03-29-2010, 05:57 PM   #14
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I loved it. One of the best historical novels I have read in years. I thought her period sense was impeccable and her revision of Cromwell's character was both fascinating and justified by evidence. I loved her novel about the French Revolution too.
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Old 03-30-2010, 02:19 AM   #15
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I'm currently reading it, not getting any of the Tudor in-jokes, irritated at the pronouns, but enjoying it a lot. I love the characters, her style (apart from the pronouns) and the jokes I can understand. It took a while for the story to suck me in, but it was worth it.
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Old 03-05-2011, 09:28 AM   #16
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"Wolf Hall" - Hilary Mantel
Is anyone else reading "Wolf Hall" and loving it to absolute bits?

I don't want it to end....
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Old 03-05-2011, 09:43 AM   #17
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I've tried twice to get through it and would like to know how the hell Mantel manages to bore me with one of my favourite periods of English history?

Oh, I know - probably something to do with overuse of third person personal pronouns, necessitating constant backtracking to find out who the hell she's referring to.
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Old 03-05-2011, 09:50 AM   #18
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I've tried twice to get through it and would like to know how the hell Mantel manages to bore me with one of my favourite periods of English history?

Oh, I know - probably something to do with overuse of third person personal pronouns, necessitating constant backtracking to find out who the hell she's referring to.

"Him" is Cromwell. Most of the time
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Old 03-05-2011, 09:52 AM   #19
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No, really. It isn't. 'He' refers to whichever person Mantel last named (as far as I can tell) and it jumps from Cromwell to Wolsey to who-the-hell-else she features in the damn book.

I can't figure out how this won the Booker.
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Old 03-05-2011, 09:56 AM   #20
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You're a hard woman, Scarlet... I'll grant you teensy bit of toing and froing, but I'm loving it. And He is mostly Cromwell. At least - if you assume He = Cromwell, there's much less to-age and fro-age...

Admittedly, it doesn't help that everyone else in the book was named Mary. Or, you know, Thomas.
Last edited by mccardey; 03-05-2011 at 10:08 AM. Reason: having enormous difficulty working out how to spell to-age and fro-age. I may have made them up....
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Old 03-05-2011, 11:00 AM   #21
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I loved it. Love the opening especially, and the writing. I don't know if it deserved to win the Booker because I have never read, if anything, its competition. But I loved it and I read a few scenes again, but only because I thought it was written so well.
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Old 03-05-2011, 11:01 AM   #22
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...and cause occasionally I forgot who we were talking about
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Old 03-05-2011, 01:57 PM   #23
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Agree with Scarlet Peaches but it was a minor annoyance for me. The story and the writing more than made up for it. I really LOVED, and couldn't put it down. At least not until I re-read certain parts to be clear about what was going on. Hard to resist anything to do with Cromwell especially with brilliant dialogue.
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Old 03-05-2011, 02:41 PM   #24
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I'd never read Mantel before - as soon as I finish this I'll have to go and read everything else she's ever written. Suggestions, in order of stonkingly goodness?
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Old 03-05-2011, 09:20 PM   #25
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I'd never read Mantel before - as soon as I finish this I'll have to go and read everything else she's ever written. Suggestions, in order of stonkingly goodness?
A friend of mine absolutely insisted I read A Place of Greater Safety, which I did about seven years ago. It's the story of the French Revolution, with Danton, Robespierre and Desmoulins as the principal characters.

She's also written contemporary fiction. I've heard good things about Beyond Black, but I haven't got to it yet.
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