Euro 2012 [congrats to España!]

No, I read it.

Priene said:

Most England players are far from world class. I'll give you Ashley Cole. Gerrard and Terry, though aging. Rooney at club level, but never at international level. A couple of others are promising, but the likes of Young, Milner, Johnson, Wellbeck, and Carroll are journeymen. Well, journeymen-millionaires.

Hodgson did the best with what he had, but last night was England getting exposed for what they are: defensive and unimaginative. Thank God it wasn't the Germans. I haven't lived down the last fiasco against them.

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waylander said:

Seconded.
Wouldn't have wanted to watch us against Germany on Thursday, would have been humiliating

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Had to laugh at Lineker's comment at the end.' if there's anything good to take from this - at least we weren't beaten by the Germans'

ah, the old emotions....are best. lol.

Think I'm fed up with football now. Let's talk about Wimbledon. I reckon that Andy Murray's a dead cert this year.

mirandashell said:

Not sure I could take seriously anyone who calls it 'soccer'.......

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Ha, have played/coached for 42 years ... no choice but to call it that here My own father still doesn't trust me since quitting the "football" team to play "soccer" when I was but a tyke. His tough luck. At least Mom took me to watch Pele and Beckenbauer. And has loved me without many conditions.

12 hrs. 40 min. to a match for the memories!

colealpaugh said:

At least Mom took me to watch Pele and Beckenbauer.

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That's nothing. I used to watch 'Disco' Dale Gordon and Greg Downs at the height of their, erm, powers.

mirandashell said:

Trevor Francis and Kenny Burns from my local team. Never went to an England game. Not until I was in my late thirties. Saw the last Brasil v England game at the old Wembly

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Jumpers for goalposts, isn't it, mmmm?

Regular time between Spain and Portugal was awful. There goes my prediction that it'd be match of the whole Euro 2012 tournament. But when extra time came, the Spaniards turned it on and looked spry.

Cesc Fàbregas, you beautiful man, thank you.

Also: who on the Portuguese side decided Ronaldo would take the fifth penalty kick? Terrible strategy.

Barcelo said:

Also: who on the Portuguese side decided Ronaldo would take the fifth penalty kick? Terrible strategy.

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Agreed with that.

Bit of an upset yesterday. I really thought Germany would easily outplay Italy.

I'm cheering for Spain in the finals.

I find Spain impressive but horribly boring. Italy have been the stars of this tournament.

Priene said:

I find Spain impressive but horribly boring. Italy have been the stars of this tournament.

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There are many people who think Spain's boring on the pitch.

Don't get me wrong: I see why you'd think so. Tiki-taka. Dominance of time of possession. Yeah, yeah, yeah, all that good stuff -- they play a beautiful game, in my opinion. What strikes some as boring is that, because of Spain's long streak of international brilliance (as well as club-level brilliance, seeing as the majority of the team plays for either Real Madrid or Barcelona), their opponents have become rather wait-and-see . . . rather reactive, really.

They let Spain control the tempo and hope against hope that someone makes even a slight miscalculation on a pass or in defense that'll provide a flash-in-the-pan spark to score. But Spain's very, very technical, and rarely afford their opponent that opportunity.

If they don't have to do a damn thing and have the advantage more or less handed to them due to the above reason, then why should they press to be more exciting?

When opponents actively attack Spain . . . now that's how to get the men in red moving. They looked tired against Portugal until extra time came around, at which point they really started gunning for Patricio in the net. The pressure was on then.

With a chance to repeat as Euro champion -- and against a confident Italy, who'll go for the throat -- I imagine the pace will be more to your liking.

Barcelo said:

If they don't have to do a damn thing and have the advantage more or less handed to them due to the above reason, then why should they press to be more exciting?

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Because football is about entertainment, and the greatest sides should be great entertainers. Spain aren't. It's all about domination and winning, and if they have to bore the pants off everyone while the opposition goes chasing shadows in midfield, that's what they do. That's why probably 80% of neutrals are going to want Italy to win. Spain are the better side, but Italy have made football fun again.

Priene said:

Because football is about entertainment, and the greatest sides should be great entertainers. Spain aren't. It's all about domination and winning, and if they have to bore the pants off everyone while the opposition goes chasing shadows in midfield, that's what they do. That's why probably 80% of neutrals are going to want Italy to win. Spain are the better side, but Italy have made football fun again.

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I don't have anything to disagree with here, but bear in mind perspective -- of the fans versus of the athletes.

Barcelo said:

I don't have anything to disagree with here, but bear in mind perspective -- of the fans versus of the athletes.

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If England had played incredibly dull football -which they did - and got to the final, I'd be...well, pretty happy right now. But they didn't, and I'm glad they didn't, because England's tactics made Spain's look like the Netherlands' c1974.

Barcelo said:

Also: who on the Portuguese side decided Ronaldo would take the fifth penalty kick? Terrible strategy.

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Perhaps that was Ronaldo. If it came down to the final kick, he wanted to be the one who took it, to revel in the moment as if he, single handedly, (or footedly) won the game for Portugal. That fits in with his character -- preening, petulant, desperate to be recognized as the best player in the world. (Sorry, bud, not while Messi's alive.)

Don't get me wrong -- he's a great player with unbelievable skills. I'd guess he works incessantly to improve his game and fitness, even in off season. But his character leaves something to be desired, to say the least.

Priene said:

Because football is about entertainment, and the greatest sides should be great entertainers. Spain aren't. It's all about domination and winning, and if they have to bore the pants off everyone while the opposition goes chasing shadows in midfield, that's what they do. That's why probably 80% of neutrals are going to want Italy to win. Spain are the better side, but Italy have made football fun again.

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Having played much of my life, coached, and even reffed a few games (what a horrible experience) I love Spain's game. Don't find it boring at all. Sure, much of the time they're simply passing to the open man -- but have you ever wondered why there always seems to be a man wide open? They are masters.

That said, I think Portugal exposed a weakness. Other teams have laid back, given the Spanish all the time in the world, waiting to intercept the final pass toward goal and institute counter attack.

Portugal pressured them at every opportunity, even high on the pitch. Spain certainly did not look as fluid and confident and sharp as they had in previous games. Of course, you need skilled players to do that, and you need the ability to hold the ball once you get it.

But was Spain having an off day, or was it due to the Portuguese pressure?

I think if Italy takes a lesson from that and applies constant pressure, they have a good chance. If they lay back and absorb pressure, like Italian teams in the past have done so often, I think they'll lose.

rugcat said:

I love Spain's game. Don't find it boring at all. Sure, much of the time they're simply passing to the open man -- but have you ever wondered why there always seems to be a man wide open? They are masters.

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I didn't say I didn't understand Spain's tactics. I do. I didn't say they weren't masters. They are. I said they were tedious, which they are. Last time they played Italy, they picked a 4-6-0 formation.

Forza Italia. I'm tired of Spain's style - football is a contact sport, and too much passing back and forth is just plain tedious, IMO.

Shocked Germany lost to Italy - but then, so were they.

Impossible to call the final. Be good for Italian football in Italy win, and Spain already have two titles, so....

I'll cheer for Italy.

Phew. Glad that's decided.

I went to see Garbage play instead. Mr Crunchy is very glad he came along instead of watching the final.

Italy got mullered. Didn't help that their players kept limping off, though.

mirandashell said:

Trevor Francis and Kenny Burns from my local team. Never went to an England game. Not until I was in my late thirties. Saw the last Brasil v England game at the old Wembly

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