Are Books Becoming Obsolete?

Old Hack said:

If you don't care enough to find out for yourself, why should anyone else find out for you?



Frequent readers make up only a small percentage of the population as a whole: I remember reading some time ago that less than 30% of the UK's population had ever been inside a bookshop.

But this doesn't suggest to me that "our society is becoming less intelligent as a whole", and I find that claim to be both patronising and offensive. What does it say about our children, and all the hard work that they put in every day?

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If someone asks "are books becoming obsolete?" And someone answers, I expect them to have some data backing up their point. And lol that you posted a statistic right after saying "why should anyone do it for you?"

But this doesn't suggest to me that "our society is becoming less intelligent as a whole", and I find that claim to be both patronising and offensive. What does it say about our children, and all the hard work that they put in every day?

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In the immortal words of Nigel Powers "Got an issue? Here's a tissue." I don't see what was so offensive about what I said. Maybe "less intelligent" is too strong, what I meant it most people prefer to sit around and watch an episode of pawn stars than read a novel. To me this is a stupid way to waste your time but then again here I am arguing over meaningless issues with a stranger over the internet.

Alpha Echo said:

I'm ordering through Amazon (yes, I do, sorry) or Literary Guild when they have sales.

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Yes sorry if I want print I order through Amazon too (ironically) because when I tried a book depository here in New Zealand.
The book took longer to get to me than it takes Amazon to send from the USA. It took ridiculously too long, and the last time I tried to order a book from a store's system the person behind the counter fiddled around and couldn't find it on their system. Like it or not Amazon has been reliable for print books every time. Even when they didn't turn up, which might have been something to do with the post or people stealing from the post they replaced the missing books. I can just rely on them to get whatever I want. I don't have any book stores with a really wide range of books near me. I used to go to Borders but they died.

DeadCities said:

I work, go to school, and write for two hours a day, I don't have time to go through every single post on a thread before I respond.

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I work, look after my children, look after my home, project-manage a large renovation job, spend a ridiculous amount of time reading, and still take the time to read threads before I post in them.

It's a matter of courtesy, which we're pretty keen on at AW.

Also, you might like to re-read Medievalist's comment. I think you missed her joke.

DeadCities said:

If someone asks "are books becoming obsolete?" And someone answers, I expect them to have some data backing up their point. And lol that you posted a statistic right after saying "why should anyone do it for you?"

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Lol indeed.

You're very good at missing the point.

But that has nothing to do with you telling us you're too lazy to look things up for yourself then asking us to do that work for you.

In the immortal words of Nigel Powers "Got an issue? Here's a tissue."

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In the immortal words of Mac in the Newbie Guide (which I strongly suggest you read), we have one rule here: respect your fellow writer. If you don't understand what that entails it can be distilled down to this: don't be a jerk.

You're breaking our one rule.

Read the Newbie Guide before you post here again. There's a link to it at the top of the page.

Old Hack said:

I work, look after my children, look after my home, project-manage a large renovation job, spend a ridiculous amount of time reading, and still take the time to read threads before I post in them.

It's a matter of courtesy, which we're pretty keen on at AW.

Also, you might like to re-read Medievalist's comment. I think you missed her joke.



Lol indeed.

You're very good at missing the point.

But that has nothing to do with you telling us you're too lazy to look things up for yourself then asking us to do that work for you.



In the immortal words of Mac in the Newbie Guide (which I strongly suggest you read), we have one rule here: respect your fellow writer. If you don't understand what that entails it can be distilled down to this: don't be a jerk.

You're breaking our one rule.

Read the Newbie Guide before you post here again. There's a link to it at the top of the page.

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I apologize if you thought I was being a jerk, I was always bad at inferring the tone of what I try to say through messaging. I wasn't asking people to do research for me, I MEANT that if anyone had relevant info I would be interested in it. You ignored everything else I had to say contributing to the conversation and accused me of being offensive (for example, if instead, you had said "I disagree, why do you think people are less intelligent? I could have given you a thought out answer. However nope, I was "patronizing" and "offensive" I like to think of myself as a nice guy, it is not my intention to be patronizing, thus if that comment had been less provocative I would have expounded on what I meant.) , so I guess I got my back up. I suppose then, that I will not be posting very much since that is too much of a time commitment that I could be spending writing! Sorry for the misunderstanding. (is it possible to delete these? I feel bad for hijacking this thread.)

Actually, we don't delete messages on AW - unless they're spam - we're writers; and we own our words - as I've learned the hard way, sometimes. Picking up tone is often difficult, especially over the wild-n-woolly 'net, that's why it's so important to write what you mean and mean what you write.

You'll get the lay of the land, DeadCities. Hang in there; read the Newbies Guide OldHack referred you to; visit the rooms and threads that interest you. You'll become an ol' hand around here in no time. AW's folks are some of the best folks in the world - and unsurpassed when it comes to helping writers do everything from knit a sweater to cook a kick-ass souffle. We even, occasionally, help out with things like writing, crafting the perfect query letter, and arguing about commas and grammar. Welcome to AW.

Now... carry on.

It's all good, Taylor. All a misundersanding. A sure thing to happen on the interwebs

I never thought I'd read an e-book. Then I got a Samsung Note tablet. And--wow! Now, I can't imagine reading a book any other way.

One of the annoyances I hated when reading a paper book was that at a certain point in my life I began needing to use reading glasses to read. I've never needed glasses in my life (and my non-reading vision is exemplary.) Reading on my tablet solved that.

To be honest, having a tablet or e-reader is just so convenient that I have no desire to read a paper book again. All day now, I can read research, articles, web posts and blogs and books - all on one handy convenient device that changes the font size and the lighting to suit my particular situation.

I can read them all in the car, in my bed, on the couch, in the bathroom, at the counter, at the dinner table, on a plane, on a train or bus - all while scouring the web, answering emails, making notes and hell - even writing.

All without the awkwardness that comes with maneuvering a hardcover or the sore thumb that comes with holding open the pages of a paperback. Not to mention the volume and weight of carrying around all those books and magazines.

As for bookstores, it was in the mid 2000's that I noticed that they were already disappearing from a lot of malls. A very, very small percentage of youth today are interested in reading, and the percentage declines as they get older and have less leisure time.

My family is filled with intelligent, savvy people - yet hardly any of them read books. Not because they're stupid, but because they're just too busy with the many parts of life - working, raising kids, trying to have family time, etc.

Anyway, I read somewhere recently that the sales of e-books have evened out and paper books are still alive and well.

Will ye all stop with the 'serious reader' thing? I don't know if you mean to tell me I'm stupid for reading ebooks but that's the inference I'm taking.

Anyway, I used to think I wouldn't buy an eReader - until I won a gift card and did just that. I love it - I read much more than I used to because I can increase the text size and it's so much easier on my eyes It's backlit so I can read away to my heart's content while hubby is snoring away beside me. Plus - books are cheaper, and I'm only a click away from my favourite authors.

Honestly, for anyone who thinks they're past it or above it or whatever, just try it - I think you'll be surprised. Merry Christmas.

In the past seven years, I have moved twelve times (soon to be thirteen). I've lived in different parts of four states and two countries. Many of these moves have been via airplane, which required whittling down my possessions to the bare minimum. I'm single and have proven inept at finding an actual career thus far, so I've spent the first half of my twenties traveling and taking temporary jobs. Periodically, I return to my childhood home before heading out again. I'm here now until my next move (to a new job) at the beginning of March.

Here, where I grew up, I have five plastic tubs full of books. I wouldn't give them up for anything, and I always take a few favorites with me, but my Kindle finally makes it possible to move frequently without reducing my reading options. I'm the kind of reader who can finish four average-length novels on one long flight. I read hundreds of books every year. My Kindle makes that possible.

I respect everyone else's right to feel otherwise--it's entirely subjective--but I love e-books and print books equally. I hope they can co-exist and thrive. I don't think print books are obsolete, nor that they are likely to be anytime soon.

Noniej said:

Will ye all stop with the 'serious reader' thing? I don't know if you mean to tell me I'm stupid for reading ebooks but that's the inference I'm taking.

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I second this. I read ebooks, and am a serious reader, but I don't have the same easy access to books as others.

I buy ebooks because the ones I'm interested in are cheaper, more widely available, and make it much easier to read more often. What I could have spent on a printed book, I could instead get two or more ebooks. That is a huge matter to me, as I have neither funds nor nearby bookstores.

I often rely on the growing availability of ebooks to finally have access to the more analytic and academic books I could not otherwise hope to get hold of. As much as said books may help me with my current writing project, poverty makes it impossible to plonk down $100+ every time I want one.

Not to mention that many sf/f books on my wishlist have ebook editions that are 1/3 of the price of their print versions.

This is not to say that I am against print books. I do try to purchase physical copies when I desperately want to show support for the author, but life circumstances make it difficult to obtain things others take for granted.

I don't think books are dead yet. It's true... a lot of people like to read books on electronic devices, but I also know so many people who claim that nothing beats the experience of reading an actual book.

I've never read an e-book, or read on a kindle or iPad so I can't compare. But I love the feel of a book, and I love being able to annotate them with my own illegible notes.

I don't think that will ever go out of style completely.

I have searched the thread and nobody has mentioned the October issue of the Scientific American. There is an article about why the brain prefers paper over electronics. Results are preliminary, but studies seem to indicate that the brain remembers more information from paper books because it can better "map" the locations of facts or ideas inside a physical stack of paper.

I don't buy ebooks but I do download them from the library. I dislike reading them, even on my notebook and handheld computers. I think they are just a pain in the neck. I only read them this way because the library doesn't have the paper versions.

I find an e-reader most valuable for obtaining/reading out of print books.
Recently, for example, I was able to do research on the Boer Wars (both of them) by reading (then current) publications that would otherwise be unavailable to me. The books and peridocials were obtained at no cost via the Web. Amazing.

Alaska is so isolated from many research resources that e-books present a viable means to do that research.

Paper books are nice, if you can find them or if they even still exist...

E-books also present an excellent tool and a way to read older works at low to no cost - opening reading to many on a tight budget.

Old Hack said:

I'm not sure that sales of print editions are declining in any significant way.

And if they are, then how can you be sure they're declining "due to the ease and comfort of simply buying one online from any wifi capable device"? (I assume you mean digital editions.)

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Book stores in general have been "going under" for years now, i.e. borders book store, and those that aren't completely bankrupt are heading that way. Everything: book stores, video companies, and now even schools. Think of how many online classes there are available now, from grade school on up. DVD players are discontinued because you can download your favorite movies( to rent or own) straight from iTunes. I'm not saying I know exactly what's happening around the nation but it seems obvious enough(to the point of assumption) that this is the way life is heading.

That would be sad if bookstores became obsolete.

PhoenixFlames said:

That would be sad if bookstores became obsolete.

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I agree! But I love my Kindle. Sometimes, I just need a paper book. I usually need them when it is a book I'm not reading for pleasure, but reading so it can help me. Examples: how to, family tree and game guides.

My hubby asked me if I wanted a Kindle a few years back. I half way smiled at him thinking he meant well. Then he started talking about how many books I could keep on one.

I went ahead and got it. After having my Kindle for about three weeks, I would never want to be without one. I would carry two books around with me. The one I'm reading and the one I will start next. Sometimes I was in places where the book covers would not be good to show around...ahem pulled out my Kindle. I drive a distance to work and want something interesting to pass the time. I pull out my Kindle and plug it up to my vehicle and let it read to me.

So from a reader's stand point, it is more convenient to have the majority of my books on a Kindle. For the other 10% of my books, it is imperative that they are in physical form.

I think that eBooks are actually going to bring up the amount of people who read for entertainment.

Books have been getting more and more expensive, ($8.99 for a freakin' paperback? Why don't you just rob me?) and many are getting thinner and thinner. They involve a significant amount of investment as far as time and effort, and nobody likes going to the bookstore any more.

When was the last time you were in a bookstore? Finding the book you're after is a PitA at the least, and if you're lucky and what you are after is the latest and greatest book then they'll have a couple of copies, and you can get out of there. Many places, here in the states, the book stores are full of calenders, games, and other crap.

Electronic book readers make it so I can sit right there, without bothering to go to the bookstore and put up with all the crap involved in going to the store. I can hit it up, do a quick search that doesn't involve others, download the book instantly, then kick back and read it.

It doesn't take up the limited space I have in my house, I don't have to worry about losing it or forgetting it in the car, or whatever. Sure, there's some of that with the book reader, but all in all it's more convenient (and serves more purposes then one book) and easier to carry around.

Which makes people more likely to read. They don't lose their place, they don't have to worry about how long they have. They can just knock it right out.

More people reading, means that more people are likely to spree buy a book in the checkout line for the supermarket, more likely to pick up a book at a yard sale or in the airport gift shop, or even order one online because it's preorder and the book doesn't come out on ebook for 3 months after the hardcopy comes out.

With movies becoming more of the same ol' same ol' (Come on, they made a movie based on the game Battleship, does anyone trust Hollywood any more?) people are finding that buying books for their Kindle (which can be charged in the lighter of their car, making it a must-use accessory now) is cheaper and last longer than a movie.

A Blu-Ray or DVD costs between $15 and $40, you can get an easy dozen quick and cheap eBooks for that price, or a handful. Hey, you can grab a trilogy off of Amazon for $5.99 of complete books available at the book stores.

I don't think books are becoming obsolete, any more than the VCR or DVD or cable made the big 3 networks obsolete.

I think that it'll actually cause a resurgence in reading.

It is indeed quite interesting to read everyone's comments here about eBooks -- in most cases, I can relate to many of the comments. I, too, never considered buying an e-reader, but won one in a contest -- and absolutely loved it. I think one of my favorite things about eBooks is the quantity -- there are so many more eBooks that will never see physical print. While that does give rise to some quite horrible writings, it also lets even more authors suddenly show up on the scene. And no, I'm not saying that because I'm bitter because no one would publish my book (seriously, I've only written magazine articles so far).

It is interesting to compare the change to other changes in history. As for me, I see it as just that -- it's a change. Will physical books ever go away? Who knows? I bet at one time people could never imagine life without horse plows, either!

I'm sure there will always be people who enjoy reading and escaping regular life through stories. I personally, have tried and hate reading on my phone or other devices. I prefer holding a copy in my hands, seeing it on paper.

T-Willard said:

Books have been getting more and more expensive, ($8.99 for a freakin' paperback? Why don't you just rob me?) and many are getting thinner and thinner. They involve a significant amount of investment as far as time and effort, and nobody likes going to the bookstore any more.

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Not sure what you're talking about here, but…okay. I personally still like going to the bookstore, not only because I like physically shopping for books (also, I kind of like the smell of bookstores), but also because I don't have an e-reader. I'm old-school. I still like to hold my books and feel the paper in my hands. That said, I probably will get an e-reader one of these days.

http://www.offthemark.com/System/2013-08-16

On the other hand, I don't see an 8-track cartridge sitting at the bar.

I still buy print books but I also use e-books and audio books. They all have their advantages and disadvantages, so whatever works best for people is cool with me, as long as they keep supporting books. I personally love the e-books because of how easy they are to get and carry around. On my nook, which is smaller than many hardcovers I own, I can carry hundreds, probably thousands, of books anywhere I want. It makes it a lot easier when traveling or moving. Almost all of my books are purchased at Barnes and Noble, Amazon, or when the local library has a book sale.

I got a nook last fall, mostly so I could access technical libraries that have online presences(Safari Online) on the bus. My work reading is all technical and requires a great deal of skimming and searches, things which e-readers excel at(much better than indexes). The same is true for fun reading, easier to find quotes. If it is a quick series(ie Hunger Games), it's very practical to just buy the next in the series directly on the e-reader.

If it's a more involved book, something to spend time on, it is nice to have a physical copy. Its batteries don't die. It doesn't strain your eyes. You can lend it out. It looks nice on the bookcase. Though the last part is a double edged sword. When my wife and I move, half our boxes are of books, and we get rid of a fair number. If we had e-readers from the beginning, we would still have all of those books, ones we look for before realizing that we got rid of, and much easier moves.

Honestly, I'm still on the edge about digital vs physical copies of books.

I'd say book will be around until printable material runs out. Trends in digitization will likely continue, elevating the exclusivity of physical books and upping their status as gifts.
That said, nooks, tablets and phones will ultimately merge into heritage items, which will level the distinction somewhat.

Personally, I love my Kindle Fire HD. It felt so good when I finally got to buy it after saving up the money (cheaper than an iPad but still kinda pricey).

That being said, I will always have a spot for physical books, and I suspect that most other readers do, too, so I don't see them going anywhere anytime soon. I'll fill my Kindle with loads of ebooks, and then buy my favorites in print format so I can have them forever. Saves up on room, too, since I already have a ridiculous amount of books. We move around quite a bit.