Rejectomancy

defcon6000

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I understand your sentiment, Izz. I had a similar R from them with poor grammar. I also don't bother with them anymore.

Would it be so awful to start a "Beware" thread on Washington Pastime in the hopes of flushing out some of their editors--as those threads have a habit of doing. :D
 

Izz

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You could, but it'd run the risk of sounding like a whole lot of rejected writers whining. :)
 

defcon6000

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I'll take that chance!

(Actually, I'll simply phrase it that we've been discussing Washington Pastime quite a bit and have noticed some interesting trends.)
 

Deb Kinnard

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Stop me if I've told this story before: I once got an "R" on "your books." Mind you, I hadn't submitted anything to that particular house. I'd met their editor at a conference and once he found out what I write, and I found out what he was looking for, we agreed that we wouldn't be a fit, and parted on most amicable terms.

Two months later I get a rejection from an individual at that house, a name I'd never heard of, for "your books." I immediately told my crit partner.

Her words: "You're the only writer I know who can get Rs on things you never sent them. Most of us have to actually sub something in order to gain the R."
 

Izz

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Oh, and just to add to my snark: They spelled my name wrong, and there was a bit below the slushee signature saying they were "happy to know that you would still like for our magazine to consider your story." They then referred to a completely different story (and definitely not one of mine) and said they'd read it and review it soon.

I figure that last must be leftover from other correspondence with someone else, but i'm not sure how it ended up on my R.

:Shrug: Maybe the slushie was having a late night reading session and got himself all mixed up.
 

defcon6000

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Oh, and just to add to my snark: They spelled my name wrong, and there was a bit below the slushee signature saying they were "happy to know that you would still like for our magazine to consider your story." They then referred to a completely different story (and definitely not one of mine) and said they'd read it and review it soon.

I figure that last must be leftover from other correspondence with someone else, but i'm not sure how it ended up on my R.

:Shrug: Maybe the slushie was having a late night reading session and got himself all mixed up.
Reminds me of those outsourced help services where the individual on the other line can barely speak/write English. Is it possible that they outsource their slush readers? :O
 

defcon6000

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Stop me if I've told this story before: I once got an "R" on "your books." Mind you, I hadn't submitted anything to that particular house. I'd met their editor at a conference and once he found out what I write, and I found out what he was looking for, we agreed that we wouldn't be a fit, and parted on most amicable terms.

Two months later I get a rejection from an individual at that house, a name I'd never heard of, for "your books." I immediately told my crit partner.

Her words: "You're the only writer I know who can get Rs on things you never sent them. Most of us have to actually sub something in order to gain the R."
That does sound odd. Have you ever emailed them before?
 

Sai

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I'll take that chance!

(Actually, I'll simply phrase it that we've been discussing Washington Pastime quite a bit and have noticed some interesting trends.)

If you do start a thread, please post a link. I'm also less than impressed with them.

'R' from Analog, which isn't much a of a surprise. It's more of a horror story than sci-fi. I sent it to 'Horror on an Installment Plan,' a new market (to me at least).
 

Marzioli

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'R' from Analog, which isn't much a of a surprise. It's more of a horror story than sci-fi. I sent it to... a new market (to me at least).
That makes two of us (out of the three current duotrope subs)! The editor seems nice, and was pretty quick to send confirmation to me. But as a new pro-market planning 52 releases a year (that's a deep pocket!), I'll be surprised if he doesn't buckle under the submission pressure. That is, unless he has more automation and help than is currently indicated. (I also hope he gets professional artists. If you look at his own self-published works, I think we can assume he did them himself).
 

mhaynes

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'Horror on an Installment Plan'...

Hmm... Is it me, or is their contract a bit convoluted? The parts about rights and payments, in particular, seem open to all sorts of interpretation.

First, note that in their writer's guidelines the very first sentence is: "This is a weekly subscription-based ezine." Nothing about print at all. In fact, there is nothing about print anywhere in the guidelines.

"2. Rights Granted. You grant to Publisher the following intellectual property rights in the Work:

A. Worldwide First Serial Rights (exclusive first publication of the Work ina [sic] print periodical). If, however, Publisher does not publish the Work within twelve (12) months of acceptance, this right shall revert to you.

B. For a period of three (3) years from the date of' [sic] this Agreement, the nonexclusive right to publish the Work on Publisher's World Wide Web site and sell the Work throughout the world in digital format (digital format includes Internet, disk, electronic download, CD, or any other digital format known or unknown at this time). Publisher shall publish the Work only in secure and/or
password-enabled electronic formats that protect the Author's copyright as far as is reasonable and possible using current encryption methods, except with the prior
written agreement of the Contributor.

[...]

4. Compensation.

(a) First Serial Rights. Within thirty (30) days of receipt of the Work, Publisher shall notify you whether it accepts or rejects the Work for publication. If the Work is accepted for publication, Publisher shall pay you the sum of $ (the "Payment") in compensation for the rights granted Publisher under Section 2A above. Such payment will be made to you within thirty (30) days of acceptance. If Publisher finds the Work is not acceptable for publication, Publisher shall pay you a "kill fee" equal to 25% of the Payment within thirty (30) days of notice of such rejection. In such event, all rights shall revert to you.

(b) Electronic and Digital Rights. If Publisher publishes the Work in digital or electronic form in a product of the Publisher for which the customer is charged a fee,
Publisher shall pay you 10% of the Payment within thirty (30) days of such publication."

So, it seems like a possible interpretation of this is...


  • They accept your story.
  • They run it on their fee-charging website and send you 10% (half a cent a word) within 30 days.
  • They never do a print publication. And then... What? You get a 25% kill fee at some point in time, bringing you up to almost two cents a word (not bad, but not pro rate)? Or, since the piece was "published", a kill fee isn't applicable and your half cent a word is all you get.
Now, let me be clear. I don't think that the most likely explanation is that these people are out to screw over writers. I think the most likely explanation is that the sample contract doesn't sync up with the current reality of what they plan to do ("This is a weekly subscription-based ezine.") and that everything will be hunky-dory in the end.

But...

With the ambitious (to say the least) publication schedule and the afore-mentioned need for deep pockets.
And the also afore-mentioned questionable quality of the cover art.

I would be very leery of publishing with these people until I saw a revised/clarified contract.

Feel free to tell me I'm nuts, ya'll. It's what I'm good at.
 

poeticjustice_2001

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Hey so I sent out my first short story ever (to a BDSM vampire anthology). Got a rejection from them today and it´s a first too. I was actually pretty happy to get it; I feel like I´m a ¨real¨ writer now :)
But since this is my first rejection letter, I am very interested in other writers opinions on it.

¨
Dear WRITER,

Thank you for submitting Her Vampire Master for consideration for *********** anthology.

While you have a fluid written style and good sense of pacing, the vampire nightclub-owner angle has been done by quite a few authors already, and Tanya seems to react fairly extremely to having Phineas killed in front of her, considering that she’s already killed several vampires herself. Bearing this in mind, as well as the high number of submissions we’ve received from BDSM-specialist writers, I’m afraid the story has not made the final cut for the anthology.

I’d like to encourage you to continue to submit work to us, however – though this story was not for us, other stories might be.

Kind regards,
EDITOR
 

MeretSeger

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Well, PJ, I would say your first R is a very personal one. This is most impressive. Your style is not a problem, some details are. They liked you!

congrats on a 'good' rejection.
 

alexshvartsman

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Hey there, everyone.

On my way back from a 4-day long conference in Las Vegas. Got a few rejections while I was busy with work stuff - a nice personal from DSF (with actual several sentences of comments which is very rare, and very nice of them), and form Rs from Unstuck, Goldfish Grimm and Penumbra (final round of Fairy Tales issue)

Did I mention how much I hate form Rs? I mean, they're fine if they reject your stuff outright, but if it makes the final round, or if they hold on to it for a long time, or if you have a prior relationship with the editors, a few words of what didn't work for them isn't too much to expect, is it?

On the bright side, I made it to round 2 of ASIM. Again. Never made it to round 3 yet though.
 

Sai

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Hmm... Is it me, or is their contract a bit convoluted? The parts about rights and payments, in particular, seem open to all sorts of interpretation.

First, note that in their writer's guidelines the very first sentence is: "This is a weekly subscription-based ezine." Nothing about print at all. In fact, there is nothing about print anywhere in the guidelines.

"2. Rights Granted. You grant to Publisher the following intellectual property rights in the Work:

A. Worldwide First Serial Rights (exclusive first publication of the Work ina [sic] print periodical). If, however, Publisher does not publish the Work within twelve (12) months of acceptance, this right shall revert to you.

B. For a period of three (3) years from the date of' [sic] this Agreement, the nonexclusive right to publish the Work on Publisher's World Wide Web site and sell the Work throughout the world in digital format (digital format includes Internet, disk, electronic download, CD, or any other digital format known or unknown at this time). Publisher shall publish the Work only in secure and/or
password-enabled electronic formats that protect the Author's copyright as far as is reasonable and possible using current encryption methods, except with the prior
written agreement of the Contributor.

[...]

4. Compensation.

(a) First Serial Rights. Within thirty (30) days of receipt of the Work, Publisher shall notify you whether it accepts or rejects the Work for publication. If the Work is accepted for publication, Publisher shall pay you the sum of $ (the "Payment") in compensation for the rights granted Publisher under Section 2A above. Such payment will be made to you within thirty (30) days of acceptance. If Publisher finds the Work is not acceptable for publication, Publisher shall pay you a "kill fee" equal to 25% of the Payment within thirty (30) days of notice of such rejection. In such event, all rights shall revert to you.

(b) Electronic and Digital Rights. If Publisher publishes the Work in digital or electronic form in a product of the Publisher for which the customer is charged a fee,
Publisher shall pay you 10% of the Payment within thirty (30) days of such publication."

So, it seems like a possible interpretation of this is...


  • They accept your story.
  • They run it on their fee-charging website and send you 10% (half a cent a word) within 30 days.
  • They never do a print publication. And then... What? You get a 25% kill fee at some point in time, bringing you up to almost two cents a word (not bad, but not pro rate)? Or, since the piece was "published", a kill fee isn't applicable and your half cent a word is all you get.
Now, let me be clear. I don't think that the most likely explanation is that these people are out to screw over writers. I think the most likely explanation is that the sample contract doesn't sync up with the current reality of what they plan to do ("This is a weekly subscription-based ezine.") and that everything will be hunky-dory in the end.

But...

With the ambitious (to say the least) publication schedule and the afore-mentioned need for deep pockets.
And the also afore-mentioned questionable quality of the cover art.

I would be very leery of publishing with these people until I saw a revised/clarified contract.

Feel free to tell me I'm nuts, ya'll. It's what I'm good at.

I have to admit, in my rush to send the story out again I only read the Writer's Guidelines and not the sample contract, so thanks for going over this. I really hope it's not a case of them paying pro for print and peanuts for online, since they paint themselves to be a purely online publication and to advertise rates that don't really apply is disingenuous, to say the least. I'll wait and see what happens: if they actually accept my story then I will talk to the editor (who as Marzioli said, seems like a nice guy) about what is actually being bought and sold here.


Hey so I sent out my first short story ever (to a BDSM vampire anthology). Got a rejection from them today and it´s a first too. I was actually pretty happy to get it; I feel like I´m a ¨real¨ writer now :)

Congrats on your first personal rejection! It is a milestone, so be proud.
 

Sai

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Hey there, everyone.

On my way back from a 4-day long conference in Las Vegas. Got a few rejections while I was busy with work stuff - a nice personal from DSF (with actual several sentences of comments which is very rare, and very nice of them), and form Rs from Unstuck, Goldfish Grimm and Penumbra (final round of Fairy Tales issue)

Did I mention how much I hate form Rs? I mean, they're fine if they reject your stuff outright, but if it makes the final round, or if they hold on to it for a long time, or if you have a prior relationship with the editors, a few words of what didn't work for them isn't too much to expect, is it?

On the bright side, I made it to round 2 of ASIM. Again. Never made it to round 3 yet though.

Welcome back Alex! Good luck with your ASIM sub.
 

Lillie

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And I got one from Apex. But it did last longer there than anything else I've ever sent them.

Damned if I know where to send it now.
 

pangalactic

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Did I mention how much I hate form Rs? I mean, they're fine if they reject your stuff outright, but if it makes the final round, or if they hold on to it for a long time, or if you have a prior relationship with the editors, a few words of what didn't work for them isn't too much to expect, is it?

I'm right with you there. That's what's putting me off submitting to Fantastique Unfettered again; I made it to the final round to get a form R that basically said "All the stories that got this far are good. We didn't want yours, but we won't tell you why."
 

O'Dandelo

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Ack, Marzioli! I was pulling for you with Shock Totem! I haven't gotten mine yet, but I see three have been reported on Duotrope this morning so I'm on edge. Sorry about the R, man.
 

O'Dandelo

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Marzioli (and anyone else interested in Shock Totem), I found this interview that sheds some light on how the submission process works with those guys, from slush to response.

http://www.toasted-cheese.com/ab/11-05.htm

Ken's answer to the fifth question in particular. Their process seems to have picked up speed, so I'm not sure if everything he says in this interview still applies.

But, Marzioli, if nothing else I have a feeling that you definitely got the thumbs up from at least one of the team, considering the rejection reports from the last 8 days.
 

mhaynes

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I have to admit, in my rush to send the story out again I only read the Writer's Guidelines and not the sample contract, so thanks for going over this. I really hope it's not a case of them paying pro for print and peanuts for online, since they paint themselves to be a purely online publication and to advertise rates that don't really apply is disingenuous, to say the least. I'll wait and see what happens: if they actually accept my story then I will talk to the editor (who as Marzioli said, seems like a nice guy) about what is actually being bought and sold here.

Like I said, I suspect that the most-likely explanation is that it's an honest mistake/disconnect between their documents. I don't write enough horror to feel a strong need to bug the editor with it myself, especially since I don't have anything I'd be ready to submit assuming I "liked" the answers.

But I'll definitely be interested to hear what you and others have to say from your own experiences.

Thanks!
 

Marzioli

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Ack, Marzioli! I was pulling for you with Shock Totem! I haven't gotten mine yet, but I see three have been reported on Duotrope this morning so I'm on edge. Sorry about the R, man.
Still rooting for you too, O'Dandelo! Hope you make it to the end. Meanwhile, I got to find another home for this piece. Maybe Apex when it opens in April.

And I read that article. Very interesting. I'd like to think my story made it past the slush; there was a bizarro genre fan there that might have helped it stay longer. But since they didn't mention, I may never know. I really like these guys, very nice people and very good product. This is probably the only genre market that I actively buy (besides Apex anthologies). So one day I have to break in!

Also, welcome back Alex! Sorry for the R's and congrats on the successes. I've had an ASIM sub out for 17 days with a first round reader. They're really dragging their feet trying to read that thing.