At what point is a novel 'ready' for beta readers?

Status
Not open for further replies.

Isilya

Rogues, thieves, and knaves abound
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
555
Reaction score
91
Location
Ontario, Canada
I've found what most people (who haven't read the beta reader thread) refer to as beta readers mean something closer to alpha or first readers.

For myself, I use these two definitions:

Alpha reader - Reads finished story polished to a readable level. Story is definitely not ready for publication yet. Some one to tell me if the story is full of holes/ doesn't makes sense. Looks at plot, tension, basic structure, consistency, character arcs, etc.
As long as its not terrible, grammar is a secondary concern at this stage for me.

Beta reader - Reads a polished and, what I delusionally think is, ready to go out to the world story. Someone to nitpick consistency, dialogue, character voice, and grammar.
 

Roxxsmom

Beastly Fido
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 24, 2011
Messages
23,122
Reaction score
10,882
Location
Where faults collide
Website
doggedlywriting.blogspot.com
I think you'd be better off using alpha readers, or a writing partner for this. Or, hell, even SYW so long as you've proofread for grammatical/punctuational errors.

I've always thought of beta's as the people you go to once you've run out of ideas to make it better.

Or in my case, when I'm worried that all those ideas that keep popping into my head for yet another revision might be bordering on the obsessively neurotic, and I could go on second guessing myself or thinking of cool things to add forever. At this point, I need a couple of people to read it like it's a finished novel.

If their ideas about what's still needed mesh with my own, then I know I wasn't neurotic after all.

Note, I do have a circle of "early" critters, with whom I swap feedback on works in progress. A few ended up being "final" beta readers, but I made sure I found a couple who hadn't been early readers too. Someone who's been reading chapters as you write them won't have the same perspective as someone reading a more polished version from beginning to end.
 
Last edited:

VeryBigBeard

Preparing for winter
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jan 24, 2014
Messages
2,449
Reaction score
1,505
I think you'd be better off using alpha readers, or a writing partner for this. Or, hell, even SYW so long as you've proofread for grammatical/punctuational errors.

I also use an alpha/beta system, which is pretty similar to the testing systems Maryn mentioned, though I'm less thorough than most tech studios.

I need someone I trust intensely to look at it first and find anything I've said that I should not have said (bad sex scenes, faux pas, really offensive description or inappropriate mythological appropriation). This really helps with my nerves, and it lets me write that first draft with a clean slate to take any risks. I can count the people I trust to do this on one hand. They would not fit the objectivity bill, but I don't expect them to or take their feedback that way. They're closest to writing partners. I know their tastes, I can get a pretty good sense of their biases, and so on.

I'm also a pretty stern self-critic. Maybe too much so sometimes.

Then I use betas and critique to find those things the alphas wouldn't tell me or that I've gone blind to. This always turns up a lot more than I bargained for but I operate with a couple of rules. First, betas don't write my book--that means I don't take plot suggestions or drastic character personality changes from them; "character doesn't feel like someone who would say that" is fine, "character would say this instead" is out. Both of those statements tell me the same thing: character isn't right in this scene for one reader. That leads to the second rule: I tabulate all suggestions, cross-reference to the alphas and other betas, and dive in to diagnose the problem.

I used to allow critique earlier because I find when I leave it so late I run the risk of having too much committed to the story and I end up not wanting to make changes. I had a few really bad experiences sharing work that I hadn't been able to pick apart myself first. I found that I wanted more understanding of my own piece before I had to consider why it wasn't working for someone else. I need to know what I did to fix what I did, if you know what I mean.

I may change this, though. I've learned a lot about testing games recently, which came with a bunch of background about how unbelievably awful we are at saying what's wrong with something. We invent reasons and don't know any better. The only thing we can learn from a test is that something didn't work. The best example of this in action is the (award-winning) video game Gone Home, which is a really cool piece of experimental interactive narrative that's flawed in all kinds of wonderful ways but never the ways any of the myriad reviewers who hate it ever give. People can play the game, fail to get the atmosphere and point of it at all, blame the controls and dialogue, and the problem is actually caused by unspoken narrative created by the skybox, the sound effects, and the level design. That whole effect is, arguably, what the game set out to experiment with. To actually analyze it you have to almost turn your brain off or else your inherent biases about what games are or are not will entirely influence what you think is wrong with it.
 

pixydust

Mother Flippin' Rhymnosorous
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jul 28, 2007
Messages
1,562
Reaction score
280
Location
Winchestertonfieldville
Website
www.shadowofthewood.com
I usually have two sets of eyes. One for story continuity and character thoughts, and a second round of readers once I've fixed things (these would be my favorite helpers that I save for this round). They give me a fresh eye from the initial set of readers.

I also agree, don't waste your beta readers. Whatever you send out make sure its the best you can make it on your own first.

Good luck!!!
 

Kessar

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jan 29, 2015
Messages
175
Reaction score
8
Location
Guam...for the time being
Website
www.facebook.com
In my opinion, the time is when you feel the manuscript is ready. If you feel like there's still more to fix, change, add, delete, I say wait.

I finished my manuscript at 59k. I was informed by a few beta readers it needed to be longer. So now I'm currently in the process of lengthening it.

When you feel it is ready, that is when you should find the beta readers.
 

andiwrite

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jul 9, 2012
Messages
1,482
Reaction score
140
Location
In constant transit
I pretty much agree with everyone else. It also depends on how many quality beta readers you have access to. It takes a lot of time to read a novel and give a thoughtful critique, and you don't want to use up all your betas and then end up with a different version you still need critiqued.

That said, I usually put my opening sentences in the critique thread very early on. The opener is important, and I want to make sure that the angle I'm taking has a strong impact. That is the first thing an agent or publisher will read, after all. The "First three sentences" thread has been incredibly helpful for me.
 
Last edited:

greendragon

Registered
Joined
Jan 20, 2015
Messages
4,217
Reaction score
475
Location
Beacon Falls, CT
Website
www.greendragonartist.com
I am new to this game, but was told (by my publisher, who I am friends with and is also a writer) that you write your first draft, put it away, read it through for a first (or more) major edit, then let it get critiqued by alpha readers. Then edit again, read it through again, and then, when it's pretty and polished, send it to several beta readers. THEN, after editing some more, it goes to the publisher.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.