How Many Query Letters Before Admit Defeat

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Cochinay

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I know my story is good. I believe my characters are strong. But I admit I'm a novice and could improve a lot--and have much to learn.

But not a single response to 20 query letters mailed 6 weeks ago? How many more before I decide to abandon this silly dream?
 

James D. Macdonald

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Write something new, different, and better. You admit you're a novice and need to improve. Very well, then: improve.

No response to your query letters may mean that the query letters themselves need work. Engage with the other folks here at AW. In time, visit Query Letter Hell to work on that letter.

Meanwhile, go over to Query Shark and read the archives there. You might find it illuminating.

As to your question: Twenty queries is not nearly enough to give up.
 

Erin Latimer

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Twenty query letters? That's not much. I got 130 rejections back before I threw my first book in a drawer. But that did include some partial rejections.

I second Mr. Macdonald here, your query itself may be the problem.
 

Old Hack

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Six weeks isn't long enough to hear back. Twenty rejections isn't enough to indicate that there's a problem with your book.

Learn more about querying. And meanwhile, write another book.
 

Phaeal

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Well, it took me 281 queries to find my agent, who has turned out to be the exact right fit for me. And I'm far from the AW record holder on number of queries submitted before agent obtained.

My philosophy was that I would query until I ran out of agents to bother, then lie in wait for new agents to bother. Meanwhile turning out new novels with which to bother agents.

Wrote a long rant about subbing recently, so to put it succinctly:

Make subbing a routine and stick to schedule even if you have to do it raving and sobbing. As long as you don't get tears or booze on the paper or in the keyboard, no one needs to know about your emotions. And keep writing new stuff. New stuff is the hope-generator that will get you through the rejections and no-responses.
 
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Putputt

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What others have said is right. 20 queries isn't much to base anything off of. But I highly recommend going to Query Letter Hell, reading the queries, and critiquing them. Then, when you get above 50 posts, you can post your own query up there for critique. You may very well find out there's a problem with your query that's turning agents off.
 

beckethm

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I know my story is good. I believe my characters are strong. But I admit I'm a novice and could improve a lot--and have much to learn.

But not a single response to 20 query letters mailed 6 weeks ago? How many more before I decide to abandon this silly dream?

I note that you refer to mailing query letters. Are you using snail mail? If so, that may be part of the problem, as most agents these days prefer email. Make sure you're following the submission guidelines on the agent's website.

Those same submission guidelines should tell you when to expect a response. I think the standard is around 90 days. Also, as everyone else has said, 20 queries isn't enough to come to any conclusions, except possibly that your query letter needs work.
 

Cwright

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It is certainly tough! I'm in a similar boat. I've just started a new novel, and I've already seen improvement. I find that reading is the fastest way to learn mistakes in my own writing. Then I take each chapter at a time because going through your entire work to add that 'something' that seems to be missing can be overwhelming.

I struggle with not knowing if it is the 1st chapter that's hung up or the query letter itself.
 

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If you're getting no requests for fulls and partials, your query letter needs work.

If you're getting requests for fulls and partials but only rejections after that, AND you're sure you've sent your query out to good agents who are looking for books in your genre, then either your writing needs work or your premise is problematical.

Spend some time in Query Letter Hell: it's in our Share Your Work room. You can't start your own threads anywhere in SYW until you have at least 50 posts and have interacted with the community here (which means, don't pad your post-count just to get to 50), but helping others with their queries is the best learning-tool there is. And when you post your own work for critique, you'll probably get a few reciprocal comments.
 

Jamesaritchie

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Query letters have nothing to do with your novel. The best novel ever written won't be read, if you have a poor query letter.

But six weeks is not long enough to start worrying. Give it three months, and then you'll know whether you have a poor query letter.
 

freelancemomma

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Make subbing a routine and stick to schedule even if you have to do it raving and sobbing. As long as you don't get tears or booze on the paper or in the keyboard, no one needs to know about your emotions. And keep writing new stuff. New stuff is the hope-generator that will get you through the rejections and no-responses.

Perfectly put! Thanks.
 

Cochinay

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Query letters have nothing to do with your novel. The best novel ever written won't be read, if you have a poor query letter.

But six weeks is not long enough to start worrying. Give it three months, and then you'll know whether you have a poor query letter.

Can someone try to state what the three or four most important elements of a first rate query letter would be? I've read quite a bit on this forum, including in QLH.

The suggestion that the opening sentence must be some kind of electrifying "hook" just seems a bit overstated, and some agents flat-out insist that a grabby first sentence is a turn-off.

So much that is said seems like basic common sense. And, when I look at successful query letters, it's not that easy to see they were so good. I've shown them to other neutral readers. Some successful letters just did not seem all that compelling or grabby.

It seems to me, an admitted novice here, that for the recipient, they know it when they see it, and for the writer, you either have common sense and a bit of talent, or you don't.

Is it really possible to write a good novel, but be so incompetent on basic query letters that you lose your potential audience altogether?
 

CathleenT

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As I understand it, the elements that need to be in a query letter are the MC(s), what (s)he/they want and what stands in their way, and what the stakes are if they don't succeed.

Added to that, if there's a decision involved, other than to not quit, the decision can't be a no-brainer. Frodo has to decide if he can make the journey to Mordor or watch the Shire and all he holds dear destroyed, for instance. Not the best example of a no-brainer, but it's one most of us are familiar with.

As opposed to: Letitia must decide between the career she's always wanted and the love of her life.

It's said better than this in the stickies in QLH, but I thought I'd throw it in here.

And I sympathize. I'm head-banging my query through QLH still. I've had a lot of help, but it's a very confusing process for me. Still, I think it's getting better. :)
 

Drachen Jager

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Can someone try to state what the three or four most important elements of a first rate query letter would be? I've read quite a bit on this forum, including in QLH.

Query letters are overrated. You'll get lots of rejections on a good one and some interest in a bad one. You can improve your request rate slightly by spending days on it, but really, it's the manuscript that counts. Write a query that really represents your manuscript, ultimately that's what agents want, so they can quickly decide if they're interested or not.

Also, if you have a bad manuscript, it's hard to write a good query, if you have a good manuscript it gets a lot easier.

Judging from Query Tracker, an average response rate is around 2%, but keep in mind, those are QT users, so already more engaged than many queriers. Realistically, the actual request rate is probably around 1%.

Ultimately, if there's no interest, it's probably not the query. Agents have some practice at this after all. But the good news is you can always write something new.
 
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Putputt

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Can someone try to state what the three or four most important elements of a first rate query letter would be? I've read quite a bit on this forum, including in QLH.

The suggestion that the opening sentence must be some kind of electrifying "hook" just seems a bit overstated, and some agents flat-out insist that a grabby first sentence is a turn-off.

So much that is said seems like basic common sense. And, when I look at successful query letters, it's not that easy to see they were so good. I've shown them to other neutral readers. Some successful letters just did not seem all that compelling or grabby.

It seems to me, an admitted novice here, that for the recipient, they know it when they see it, and for the writer, you either have common sense and a bit of talent, or you don't.

Is it really possible to write a good novel, but be so incompetent on basic query letters that you lose your potential audience altogether?

The most important bit is probably clarity. Your query just needs to show the premise and the obstacles clearly. For example:

"John needs to uncover the dark secrets of his family history in order to save the person he loves" is really vague and probably won't get you many bites at all. On the other hand,

"When John discovers that his sweet, old grandmother is a real-life assassin who has pinned her latest kill on his dad, he needs to outsmart the woman with over 70 years of experience in the field to prove his dad's innocence."

Okay that was actually a really shitty example which won't get you any bites either :D, but it's a bit more specific than the first one and shows you more of the premise of the story. So the agent knows exactly what your story is offering and can decide whether to request or reject.

In my experience, it does seem like premise is key. The agent I'm interning for has requested MSs based on all sorts of queries, some of which I thought were awful, but they all show the premise very clearly, and he requested based on the premise, not how beautifully-written the query was.
 

Katrina S. Forest

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I know my story is good. I believe my characters are strong. But I admit I'm a novice and could improve a lot--and have much to learn.

But not a single response to 20 query letters mailed 6 weeks ago? How many more before I decide to abandon this silly dream?

Keeping working on your next project, sure, but don't stop sending on this one. So you're a novice. You could be a really, really good novice for all I know. I say query until your agent list is exhausted. Also note there are a few agencies who are perfectly fine with you querying another agent at that same agency after one has passed.

It's important to know that silence is considered the form rejection of queries. The query that came close to a request gets the same non-reply as the one that's barely in coherent English. I actually get a bit excited when I see a reply to a query because there's decent odds that it's a request. (Not great odds, mind you, but decent.)

I think some queries do well with a hook and others don't. I think if you're going to use one, it should feel essential, like the query would sound really weird without the hook there.

SYW is an amazing place to get feedback on queries, but it's not the only tool. One exercise that helped me* was pretending to be an agent. I printed out twenty query letters (from AW and similar boards) and read each one until I either finished or lost interest. When I did lose interest, I noted why. I set aside the ones I would ask for pages from. A lot of queries weren't bad. They just blended in with the crowd too much. Then, when I went back to my query, I had a much stronger handle on what parts made it feel unique and what parts made it feel like every other query out there. Maybe the same exercise would work for you.

Good luck!

*When I say "helped", I mean I got a better feel for how to write queries, not "hey, I got an agent and my book sold instantly and now everyone loves me." Though that would've been cool.
 
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Dennis E. Taylor

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I got my first partial request after changing this:

Outland is a complete novel, with series potential, at 81,000 words. It is Science Fiction, with Tech and Post-Apocalyptic elements.

to this:

Outland is a complete novel at 81,000 words. It is Science Fiction with Tech and Post-Apocalyptic elements, and a slightly tongue-in-cheek tone, despite the subject matter.

The rest of the query was unchanged.

So, was it losing the series reference, or adding the tongue-in-cheek comment, or just coincidence? Damifino, but I'm going with the new version from now on. I'll also be wearing the same socks whenever I send one out. ;)
 

JanetW

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I have to agree with Drachen Jager query letters are so over rated. I have sent silly letters and received a response and my best query showed nothing. It's the story you need to sell. I think it's easier to find a publisher than an agent. With new writers you are selling yourself first. Don't give up, 20 letters is just the beginning, stay positive, there is someone for everyone.
 
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Thomas Vail

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I disagree, because first impressions are vitally important. It is the story you need to sell, but in most cases, you're going to be part of crowd you're trying to distinguish yourself from, and you need to get the queried's attention so move on and read it.

Query Shark is an excellent resource, as it shows for what pushes a particular agent's buttons, what gets a good response and what immediately turns them off.

SYO is another good resource, because then you can directly find out what intrigued someone, or why another person would pass it by.

For example-
So, was it losing the series reference, or adding the tongue-in-cheek comment,

-your little alteration describes two very different stories. You want to get as much as you can to distinguish your story, without getting too verbose. Your first description very well could've been for another novel like, The Road and I'm really not interested in reading that again, good as it may be.

Your new line only adds a few words, but it completely alters how I'm going to picture that tale you want to tell, and that grabs more interest than your original.
 

Chris P

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I'm of two minds here, and remember my response rate is abyssmal on queries.

No, I don't think query letters are overrated. Your story does not sell itself. I have yet to see anyone for whom this was true. Not all agents want the first XX pages with the query, and many agents who do accept the first XX pages say they will not read them if the query isn't compelling.

On the other hand, I think we can get too analytical and formulaic on queries. 251 words can't possibly by itself sink your query, nor can not completely and perfectly capturing the voice or putting the word count in the wrong place. Agents who've posted here at AW say they look at the overall feel they get from the query and not how well it follows some formula. That said, being too left field is a turn off since there is a way these things are typically done.
 

Ken

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It's probably more about ratios than sheer numbers. A query letter should get X amount of requests for every Y amount you send out. One tactic is to send out a certain number. Six say. If you get nada then you may want to revist your query.

Sending out twenty at once seems a bit much to me. Personally, I would go with single-digit batches. Also, you won't even know if your ms is any good until it gets read a few times. Getting partial or full requests is really the only way to find out. Otherwise there's always a chance that your query just rots. If so, you'll be trunking a manuscript that might actually be good.

Ineffective queries can be about the manuscript of course. If your story or characters are lacking the query will reflect that. Am sure that's not the case with you. My two cents.
 

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It has to do with probability. Most of the time, agents are (unconsciously) looking for particular characteristics in a query. The chance that your story will match any particular agent's interest is of course small. So, it makes sense to email many, many agents since the chance increases. A rejection could mean that your story or query was bad. But it could also mean that the interest was not lined up.

I am trying to start a query newsletter. It will basically have good queries. Then I email it to a number of interested agents. Agents like it because it will save them time and it would benefit authors too, I think, because they are exposed to many different agents. It is of course free for authors.

Would you be interested?
 
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