Jodie Foster finally comes out - publically

[cornflake]

Originally Posted by nighttimer

Hah! Anyone who watched Set It Off where she lip-locked another woman knew she was basing it upon real-life experience.

But Latifah has tried too often to fake the funk with lame rom-coms like Just Wright where she tried (and failed) to convince anyone she was hot and bothered for Common and not Paula Patton. I call bullshit on taking the down low to those sort of extremes.

I don't understand. She's an actor.

What the heck 'extremes' is taking roles in which you play someone unlike yourself?

Was NPH 'taking the down low to ... extremes' by taking the role on HIMYM?

Was Foster in any role she's taken post-puberty that's had a romantic element?

Same for every gay actor taking straight roles or straight actor taking gay roles who has not come out and specified their sexual preference in some sort of on-the-record declaration?

[nighttimer]

Originally Posted by cornflake

I don't understand. She's an actor.

What the heck 'extremes' is taking roles in which you play someone unlike yourself?

Was NPH 'taking the down low to ... extremes' by taking the role on HIMYM?

Was Foster in any role she's taken post-puberty that's had a romantic element?

Same for every gay actor taking straight roles or straight actor taking gay roles who has not come out and specified their sexual preference in some sort of on-the-record declaration?

You are missing my point, Cornflake. Black actors and actresses are not often allowed or permitted to explore certain roles or when they do it is extremely rare and often confined to independent films, not mainstream Hollywood.

Here's IMDB's Top 100 Gay, Lesbian and Transgender Film Recommendations (all lists are subjective, but work with me here). Where are the Black GLT folks at? The Color Purple? The Crying Game? Paris Is Burning?

Why hasn't there been a good biopic about James Baldwin, Lorraine Hansberry, Bayard Rustin, Langston Hughes, Sylvester, Alice Walker, E. Lynn Harris, Angela Davis, Barbara Jordan, Audre Lorde, Bessie Smith, Josephine Baker, or Octavia Butler? How about one that doesn't tip-toe around their sexual orientation or sugarcoat it entirely?

If I wanted to really raise some blood pressure in the Black community, I'd announce I was making a movie based on the late Manning Marable's biography of Malcolm X with the focus on the author's claim prior to his conversion to Islam, Malcolm worked as a gay hustler for White men.

Forget Django. That would make Spike Lee's head explode.

You can go down IMDB's list and the number of mainstream Hollywood movies depictions of the LGBT community is painfully small. Throw in the LGBT people of color and it dwindles into almost complete insignificance.

The day when a Halle, Denzel, Morgan, or Will hoist an Oscar for playing an openly gay person is unlikely. Not in my time and probably not in the foreseeable future.

[Diana Hignutt]

Originally Posted by nighttimer

You are missing my point, Cornflake. Black actors and actresses are not often allowed or permitted to explore certain roles or when they do it is extremely rare and often confined to independent films, not mainstream Hollywood.

Here's IMDB's Top 100 Gay, Lesbian and Transgender Film Recommendations (all lists are subjective, but work with me here). Where are the Black GLT folks at? The Color Purple? The Crying Game? Paris Is Burning?

Why hasn't there been a good biopic about James Baldwin, Lorraine Hansberry, Bayard Rustin, Langston Hughes, Sylvester, Alice Walker, E. Lynn Harris, Angela Davis, Barbara Jordan, Audre Lorde, Bessie Smith, Josephine Baker, or Octavia Butler? How about one that doesn't tip-toe around their sexual orientation or sugarcoat it entirely?

If I wanted to really raise some blood pressure in the Black community, I'd announce I was making a movie based on the late Manning Marable's biography of Malcolm X with the focus on the author's claim prior to his conversion to Islam, Malcolm worked as a gay hustler for White men.

Forget Django. That would make Spike Lee's head explode.

You can go down IMDB's list and the number of mainstream Hollywood movies depictions of the LGBT community is painfully small. Throw in the LGBT people of color and it dwindles into almost complete insignificance.

The day when a Halle, Denzel, Morgan, or Will hoist an Oscar for playing an openly gay person is unlikely. Not in my time and probably not in the foreseeable future.

Good post. I would like to point out the the English soldier who gets Stephen Rhea to go to his "girl's" place of work is a person of color and probably GLBT, in The Crying Game. It's a fairly small role, but extremely important. And, frankly, it doesn't dismiss your larger point.

[Elaine Margarett]

Jodie Foster is gay!? I'm shocked, I say. Shocked! <g>

[cornflake]

Originally Posted by nighttimer

You are missing my point, Cornflake. Black actors and actresses are not often allowed or permitted to explore certain roles or when they do it is extremely rare and often confined to independent films, not mainstream Hollywood.

Here's IMDB's Top 100 Gay, Lesbian and Transgender Film Recommendations (all lists are subjective, but work with me here). Where are the Black GLT folks at? The Color Purple? The Crying Game? Paris Is Burning?

Why hasn't there been a good biopic about James Baldwin, Lorraine Hansberry, Bayard Rustin, Langston Hughes, Sylvester, Alice Walker, E. Lynn Harris, Angela Davis, Barbara Jordan, Audre Lorde, Bessie Smith, Josephine Baker, or Octavia Butler? How about one that doesn't tip-toe around their sexual orientation or sugarcoat it entirely?

If I wanted to really raise some blood pressure in the Black community, I'd announce I was making a movie based on the late Manning Marable's biography of Malcolm X with the focus on the author's claim prior to his conversion to Islam, Malcolm worked as a gay hustler for White men.

Forget Django. That would make Spike Lee's head explode.

You can go down IMDB's list and the number of mainstream Hollywood movies depictions of the LGBT community is painfully small. Throw in the LGBT people of color and it dwindles into almost complete insignificance.

The day when a Halle, Denzel, Morgan, or Will hoist an Oscar for playing an openly gay person is unlikely. Not in my time and probably not in the foreseeable future.

Not permitted to explore certain roles? What's stopping them?

That there aren't a lot of gay, black roles.

There aren't a lot of roles for strong female characters of any colour or sexual persuasion.

There aren't a lot of roles for deaf people, especially men.

There aren't a lot of roles for gay Jews.

There aren't a lot of roles for women of a certain age.

There aren't a lot of roles for transvestites.

There aren't a lot of roles for women of a certain size.

I could go on, obviously, to the point of absurdity.

I don't see, first, why that'd mean Latifah is doing something someone would call bullshit on for taking a role that's not matched to her personal sexual orientation any more than anyone else doing the same thing (taking roles that don't match their personal feelings).

I don't see, second, what it is that'd be a solution. You're not apparently suggesting more random gay roles go to black actors that were theoretically written with white ones in mind (replacing Eric McCormack with a black actor), but making films about gay black historical figures.

Just btw, are all of those people self-proclaimed gay individuals? That's quite the lengthy list.

As to the Malcolm X thing, of course that'd raise blood pressure. As it would if a white producer announced he or she was making a movie based on the book claiming Abraham Lincoln, or <insert historical figure of note> was gay. No one is making these films because it's ridiculous to make films based on thin allegations about who long-dead people were theoretically sexually involved with or attracted to. It's not only ridiculous, but a moot point.

I'm pretty sure Washington, Berry, etc., would be up for an Oscar for playing a gay role - same as Sean Penn, Tom Hanks, Jake Gyllenhal (I think there are more 'a's in there someplace), Heath Ledger, PSH, etc., etc.

[nighttimer]

Originally Posted by cornflake

Not permitted to explore certain roles? What's stopping them?

Two things. One, is Hollywood doesn't like putting Black actors in lead roles without a White co-star. There is a belief the international market isn't all that hyped over Black leads unless their name is "Will Smith."

Two, is there doesn't seem to be much interest from Black audiences for Black actors playing gay roles. Look down the list and there aren't a lot of parts played by top Black actors where they aren't playing it "straight" in every sense of the word.

Tyler Perry can dress up in drag and it has made him a millionaire, but a same-sex kiss by Madea? Uh-uh. That ain't happenin'.

Originally Posted by cornflake

That there aren't a lot of gay, black roles.

There aren't a lot of roles for strong female characters of any colour or sexual persuasion.

There aren't a lot of roles for deaf people, especially men.

There aren't a lot of roles for gay Jews.

There aren't a lot of roles for women of a certain age.

There aren't a lot of roles for transvestites.

There aren't a lot of roles for women of a certain size.

I could go on, obviously, to the point of absurdity.

Yes, you could, so let's not do that. Let's stay on point here and while it comes as no surprise that race, age, physical attractiveness, gender, body image and more factor heavily into who gets to be in front of a camera and who doesn't, there are still certain roles set aside for Blacks.

The angry Black guy. The hip Black guy. The sassy Black woman. The comedy relief. The best friend of the lead actor/actress. The one Black kid in the woods with all the other White kid who gets butchered by the mad killer. The Magic Negro. The muscular body beautiful. The tough kid from the wrong side of the tracks who needs a loving White family to turn his/her life around. The sexy Black chick who's the girlfriend of the White actor. The authority figure. The sexy Black dude who's the boyfriend of the White actress. Morgan Freeman as the sidekick/wise old dude/President of the United States/God.

It's a pretty narrow field to choose from.


I don't see, first, why that'd mean Latifah is doing something someone would call bullshit on for taking a role that's not matched to her personal sexual orientation any more than anyone else doing the same thing (taking roles that don't match their personal feelings).

I don't see, second, what it is that'd be a solution. You're not apparently suggesting more random gay roles go to black actors that were theoretically written with white ones in mind (replacing Eric McCormack with a black actor), but making films about gay black historical figures.

Originally Posted by cornflake

Just btw, are all of those people self-proclaimed gay individuals? That's quite the lengthy list.

Yes, most are and isn't it though.

Originally Posted by cornflake

As to the Malcolm X thing, of course that'd raise blood pressure. As it would if a white producer announced he or she was making a movie based on the book claiming Abraham Lincoln, or <insert historical figure of note> was gay. No one is making these films because it's ridiculous to make films based on thin allegations about who long-dead people were theoretically sexually involved with or attracted to. It's not only ridiculous, but a moot point.

Nothing is "a moot point" where there's a dollar to be made from it and Hollywood is first, last and always about making money.

Originally Posted by cornflake

I'm pretty sure Washington, Berry, etc., would be up for an Oscar for playing a gay role - same as Sean Penn, Tom Hanks, Jake Gyllenhal (I think there are more 'a's in there someplace), Heath Ledger, PSH, etc., etc.

They might be so, IF they ever played a gay role. Look at the filmography of a Washington, Freeman or a Berry for that "gay role" and you won't find it. Even in The Shawshank Redemption it's Tim Robbins who is unsuccessful in fighting off the "sisters" in prison, not Freeman (though it might be suggested that by the end Andy and Red are heterosexual life partners).

Far more common is when a young Will Smith objected to a same-sex kiss in Six Degrees of Separation. What followed has become an urban legend:

Will Smith refused to actually kiss Anthony Michael Hall just before their kissing scene so a camera trick was used showing only the back of their heads. In an interview, Smith stated that Denzel Washington advised him not to kiss a man on-screen for it would harm his career. Smith stated that he regretted not going through with it saying "It was very immature on my part."

This story has been passed down and around as proof of Smith’s timidity and Washington’s “homophobia.” However, speaking to USA Today, the former Fresh Prince said about his decision not to do the same-sex kiss, “I’ve seen the film. It shows. I’ve cheapened myself as an actor…I’ve spoken to Denzel Washington and he said if you’re going to take a role, do what the role calls for.”

So Denzel is off the hook for supposedly advising Will, "don't be kissing no man." However, Denzel has his own line he rarely crosses: romancing his White female co-stars. Just ask Julia Roberts or Kelly Lynch about that.

I said, “Denzel, what is it? Why don’t you believe that the man you’re playing couldn’t be attracted to me?” I mean, it wasn’t a cheesy love story. It was actually really well-written and moving. And he said, “You know what, Kelly? I hate to say it, but, you know, white men bring women to movies, and they don’t want to watch a black man with their woman.” I was like, “What? No. Really?” He said, “No, I’m sorry, but that’s truly what it is. That’s what the audience is.” I’m like, “But how about The Bodyguard? That was a huge hit movie.” “Well, that’s different. That’s a white man. It’s different.” I said, “So that’s your main motivating factor on this?” He said, “Yes.” So the love story wasn’t a love story anymore. So I said, “Okay.”

It's a different standard for Black actors. Some limits are generated by the industry. Others by their own reluctance.

[mirandashell]

I just wanted to pick up on the above:

Two, is there doesn't seem to be much interest from Black audiences for Black actors playing gay roles.

Does this mean it's the homophobia of the potential audience that stops black actors playing gay roles?

[Gale Haut]

Originally Posted by MacAllister

Seriously speaking, though, because we move in very different political circles -- does anyone really think that Queen Latifah is in the closet?

I think the celebrity rule of thumb is that you're not officially out until you've done your interview with Oprah. Tom Cruise being the exception.

[SWest]

Ms. Foster has publicly recognized Ms. Bernard by name, with love and appreciation, in the past. So her opening had me hooked!

And the hope that, perhaps, we're turning a cultural corner made me keep watching.



When a heterosexual person finds themselves with an ended personal partnership, it is assumed they will want to meet Someone New. That they will need to be supported in the cultivation of fresh and lasting companionship.

A part of life where queer people are ignored by society and their families. Just as they are excluded from spiritual practice, politics, and autonomous exercise of fertility/adoption (family building).

Celebrity openness can serve to provide a social template. For many it is still terrifying (and realistically unsafe) to disclose. Heterosexual people possessed of empathy should never look away from or down-play these disclosures.

For others who may be politically more secure (can't be fired, can marry, can get benefits, etc.), there are still social impediments to full Human inclusion. They may want to find and attend an open house of worship; they want to meet singles who share their interests and values.

Chely Wright came out as a Methodist, and immediately began to receive death threats. She could have kept her spiritual practice to herself. But the centrality of her beliefs is what she holds in common with the majority of her (former) listeners and fans. It is part of her Human identity.

It is intolerable for queer people to hear "OK, be as gay as you like. Just keep out of the Reserved Seating Section."



I found Ms. Foster to be of particular courage, vulnerability and insight to come out as Lonely.

[Pup]

Originally Posted by cornflake

As to the Malcolm X thing, of course that'd raise blood pressure. As it would if a white producer announced he or she was making a movie based on the book claiming Abraham Lincoln, or <insert historical figure of note> was gay. No one is making these films because it's ridiculous to make films based on thin allegations about who long-dead people were theoretically sexually involved with or attracted to. It's not only ridiculous, but a moot point.

But here's the difference. A film about Lincoln's supposed love for Joshua Speed would be a film about Lincoln's supposed homosexuality.

A film about Lincoln's supposed love for Anne Rutledge would be a film about Lincoln's supposed love for Anne Rutledge.

[dfwtinman]

Originally Posted by Gale Haut

I guess we are all entitled to our opinions. Mine: that's a lot of overly harsh, overly judgmental bullshit.

Hmm... I wonder why else an actress who had at least two failed assassination attempts from "fans" wouldn't feel safe totally coming out to the public before now.

There are a lot of things I don't care for in that article.

This.