Rejection question

281 here, then great agent who got me a three-book deal in only 6 tries. I know there are others at AW who have even higher numbers of rejections pre-success.

Only running out of agents was going to stop me. My credo: There's no time for despair -- you need that time to be working on the NEXT book.

The first time round it took me 47 queries. Second time round...hmm, I didn't really count...I would guess around 40 as well?

Miss Snark said to query 100 before questioning your MS, but I suggest getting your query letter looked at over on QLH to make sure it's working. As for where to find agents...I found most of the US ones on Query Tracker and UK ones no Wiki.

No rejections for me, but I have a friend who received nearly a hundred before he landed an agent. The interesting thing is that he completely rewrite his query right before sending it to that agent, and she commented that she loved it.

Before that rewrite, almost every rejection he received was a form.

mommygoth said:

So, next question, where did you find all of them?

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Yeah, I'd like to know that, too. If I look on QueryTracker for agents in the US handling SFF, it gives back 183 total. That includes some with extremely negative reviews on the Bewares forum here, and duplicates at some agencies who will send a rejection for the entire agency.

So where else are you guys finding that many agents?

Although we're publishers rather than agents, we've recently taken on a book that had been hit with a big fat "no" about 300 times before it came to us.

If it's good, it's good and somebody somewhere will agree, it's just a case of getting talking to that person who agrees with you. Don't despair and don't give up.

mommygoth said:

Just a question for those of you out there who've managed to land an agent. How many rejection notices did you rack up before you managed it? 10? 50? 100? I'm trying to figure out when is the right time to despair.

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I got about 100 rejections on my first book before finally getting it published by an indie press. Same with my second and third books. It wasn't until my fourth novel that I got an agent AFTER landing a four-book publishing contract with a medium-sized house. All in all, about 5 years of sending out queries and getting rejected, but some very close calls.

I'm only submitting to magazines with poems and short stories so far, but I've racked up into the double digits. If nothing else, I have a consistent streak going. Whoo! (Sigh).

I think the key is to not despair. It's hard, it takes time, and at the end of the day, landing an agent comes so much down to timing and things outside your control, it's inadvisable (I think) to wallow because of rejection. I really think the people who land an agent were the ones too stubborn to give up.

Which is not to say never revise. If your query isn't getting a decent respond rate, it probably needs revision. If your partials aren't getting a decent rate of request for fulls, then there might be something wrong with the MS. But don't arrive at those conclusions after a handful of rejections (or even a a couple dozen?).

Don't suppose anyone's ever put a number on it? Like, an effective query should get a 40%-ish request rate? Doubt it, because this business is so unquantifiable.

I've sent out 7 queries. Gotten one partial, two passes, and four servings of resounding silence. Should I rework my query? Haven't decided yet. I think, at the end of the day, be resilient and self-aware and do what makes you happy and comfortable.

I might also add to work on another book while waiting to hear back from your queries. Sometimes its not the first book that gets published. for me it was the third.

First book and agent: 75 queries. That was over a period of years during which I revised the book from adult SF to YA. The request rate increased dramatically with the last query go-round, but the book didn't sell in the number of subs the agent chose to make. (And I overhauled it yet again, because I'm stubborn like that and still have hopes for it.)

Second book and agent: 26 queries over three months. A respectable number of requests, but not a ton. I queried slowly because I was terrified of running out of options, though I had a list of about 85 potential agents from Agent Query, and undoubtedly could have found more. I had zero requests from a Twitter pitch contest, and that spooked me. I'd reached the point where I'd normally take the ms. back to the shop for repairs when I got an unexpected request from the person who's now my agent!

If I were doing it again, I think I might pay for Publishers' Marketplace and use that as a tool. But AQ has served me well and contains some of the same info on sales and preferences. I haven't tried paying for QT.

sbz314 said:

I think the key is to not despair. It's hard, it takes time, and at the end of the day, landing an agent comes so much down to timing and things outside your control, it's inadvisable (I think) to wallow because of rejection. I really think the people who land an agent were the ones too stubborn to give up.

Which is not to say never revise. If your query isn't getting a decent respond rate, it probably needs revision. If your partials aren't getting a decent rate of request for fulls, then there might be something wrong with the MS. But don't arrive at those conclusions after a handful of rejections (or even a a couple dozen?).

Don't suppose anyone's ever put a number on it? Like, an effective query should get a 40%-ish request rate? Doubt it, because this business is so unquantifiable.

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All great points! Re: request rate, though, I've usually heard that 20 percent means your query is decent, maybe even 10 percent if you write literary fiction. I'm sure people have snagged 40 percent and more, but 25 or 30 is as high as I've gotten on any given query.

mommygoth said:

You are my new best friend. Seriously. That is extremely reassuring. So, next question, where did you find all of them? I have pretty much plowed through AgentQuery and there just aren't that many left that are accepting submissions that work in middle grade. Is Publishers Marketplace a good place to go next? I keep hearing that bandied about, but I'm still such a newbie.

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I was looking for YA agents, then a hot market (still is.) I found them on AQ, PM, QueryTracker, trolling author blogs and acknowledgments, right here on AW in the Bewares thread.

Probably thirty of the 281 were requeries after a major rewrite of the MS.

Hmm, I suppose that might work with YA, even if they don't focus on the book's genre. I don't think I'll be able to do it that way for adult sci-fi, though.

JJ: fellow Austinite, high five.

I sent out about 20 queries before I was agented, but I didn't get representation by querying--at least, not directly.

My agent worked as a reader for the first agency I queried (got an R&R from them, and the book didn't make it past the pitch meeting). When she became an agent herself, she emailed me to request the manuscript.

I feel like someone who found a winning lottery ticket in some secondhand jeans.

Wow, that's very lucky indeed!

Btw, I'd like to ask those who has different agents for 2nd / 3rd book, why is that?

Wow, notveryalice, that's awesome! And great to find another Austinite here.

cwschizzy said:

I'm only submitting to magazines with poems and short stories so far, but I've racked up into the double digits. If nothing else, I have a consistent streak going. Whoo! (Sigh).

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I've been submitting short stories, poems, articles, essays, and you name it to magazines for thirty-five years. My rejections hit the triple digits long ago, and I now have just over 300 rejections, though one single story received twenty-four rejections before selling.

Zenning said:

Btw, I'd like to ask those who has different agents for 2nd / 3rd book, why is that?

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In some cases, it's because the first book didn't sell and the agent decided to move on rather than represent the second book. (They do a lot of work on spec, so at a certain point they may decide to cut their losses rather than putting effort into another book that may not sell. Not fun for the author, but understandable.) In other cases, the author and agent may have had differences of opinion on preferred communication style or other matters, and just decided they didn't work well together. You'll find lots more specific info in the Ask the Agent forum.

JJ Litke said:

And great to find another Austinite here.

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Same! I'm only here for another few months until I move back home to London but if you're down we could get coffee sometime.

I never actually submitted. Oh, I've written the books, but I never had the guts to send them out. I got lucky and somehow ended up with a contract for one of them, but without Lady Luck shining down on me, my book would still be languishing in a drawer.

I am determined to submit in future, though. Let me tell you, the thought still terrifies me. I don't think it's rejections that bother me, though. At least not as such. In fact, my fear might be entirely irrational. But I know I'm not alone. No writer I know, after finishing her book, rubbed her hands in glee, proclaiming, "So glad that's out of the way. Now for the fun stuff. Racking up rejections. Woot! Woot!"

Anyway, my point: you're doing what to my mind is one of the most terrifying things I can imagine. You've put yourself into book form, and you're asking people to like that book. Don't give up.

If you like, try out your query letter on Evil Editor (I assume he still offers that service). He and his minions will be tough, but they're usually right. Enter a few contests to get your first few chapters into the best shape of their, erm, lives. Just keep trying. You've taken the plunge. All those rejections you've received are your battle scars. You give up now, you got them for nothing.

If you believe in your book, someone else out there will, too.

I'm WELL past 100 queries for one project this past year. I've had 7 positive replies for fulls/partials(mostly for the final 50 after I rewrote the query letter), 4 of which I'm still waiting to hear back on. It's getting on close to 18 months of querying. NOT GONNA STOP.

Thanks for taking the time in answering me, Fuchsia. And I got a giggle from your laptop-hybrid quip.

Well, this is obviously scary because I, too, also just revised my QL and Synopsis in the weekend. It is now very tempting to send them out, but I think I'd wait up a bit till my eyes clear of the fogs of seeing them being perfect.