Stephen King's advice on seeking an agent

rosehips

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Hi,
I just read this article: http://www.greatwriting.co.uk/content/view/312/74/

And among other advice to hopefuls, Stephen King states:
An agent? Forget it. For now
Agents get 10% of monies earned by their clients. 10% of nothing is nothing. Agents also have to pay the rent. Beginning writers do not contribute to that or any other necessity of life. Flog your stories around yourself. If you've done a novel, send around query letters to publishers, one by one, and follow up with sample chapters and/or the manuscript complete. And remember Stephen King's First Rule of Writers and Agents, learned by bitter personal experience: You don't need one until you're making enough for someone to steal ... and if you're making that much, you'll be able to take your pick of good agents.


So... what's your take on this advice?

I'm probably two weeks to a month away from finishing my fourth cycle of revisions, and I think I'll be ready to start querying then. It's hard to be sure right now, but that's the goal. Anyway, I've been reading a lot of articles and blogs, and it seems like the prevailing wisdom is to query agents (intelligently) whether one has had anything published before or not. I've read that it is a bad idea to 1) query publishers first and 2) self-publish first. King's advice seems to fly in the face of that. I'd really like to have the right idea before I start going about all of this.
 

Tromboli

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I remember reading his advice that writers don't need agents until they are making money and asked a different writers forum what they thought. Most of what I heard was that Stephen King started writing when the writing industry was completely different.

Now, more and more people are trying to get published so the publishing companies are getting more and more over loaded with queries making it much more difficult for unknown writers to have their voices heard. This is where agents come in. More and more Publishing houses are relying on agents to find the good writers out there. when they work with agents they know that the novels they are looking through will be professional and they no longer have to deal with reading manuscripts from people who have no idea how to write a successful novel. A lot of the bigger publishing companies don't take unsolicited submissions any more-- because of this. Therefore if you want to get to the point that he is talking about, where you are "Making enough money for someone to steal" you need an agent.

This makes complete sense to me but it is second hand information. So if I'm wrong feel free to correct me.
 
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Becca C.

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I remember reading his advice that writers don't need agents until they are making money and asked a different writers forum what they thought. Most of what I heard was that Stephen King started writing when the writing industry was completely different.

Now, more and more people are trying to get published so the publishing companies are getting more and more over loaded with queries making it much more difficult for unknown writers to have their voices heard. This is where agents come in. More and more Publishing houses are relying on agents to find the good writers out there. when they work with agents they know that the novels they are looking through will be professional and they no longer have to deal with reading manuscripts from people who have no idea how to write a successful novel. A lot of the bigger publishing companies don't take unsolicited submissions any more-- because of this. Therefore if you want to get to the point that he is talking about, where you are "Making enough money for someone to steal" you need an agent.

This makes complete sense to me but it is second hand information. So if I'm wrong feel free to correct me.

I totally agree with this. You're not going to be making any money until you're published with a big publisher, but since they don't take unsolicited queries anymore, you're not going to get there without an agent! I love Mr. King but this advice is pretty outdated now.
 

MissMacchiato

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I agree. From what I understand, very few reputable publishing houses accept unsolicited queries.

Not to mention, I am not knowledgeable enough to navigate the terms of a contract with a major publishing house, even if I was lucky enough to be accepted. That's what I want an agent for -- to deal with that stuff.
 

mscelina

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You don't need an agent--if you want to e-publish or self-publish. You don't even have to have one to submit to small, independent presses most of the time and even some big houses like Tor. BUT, be prepared to wait in a slush pile with thousands of other unsolicited manuscripts for upwards of two years.

If you want to submit to--and be seen by--editors at big print publishers, you're going to need an agent. The difference? In 1998, I submitted my first fantasy novel, unsolicited to Tor. I got a rejection two years, three months and 26 days later. I signed with my agent in late December of 2010, and my manuscript was sitting on a NY editor's desk six weeks later.

So there are your options. Take King's advice, and maybe your submission will be looked at in a couple of years. Find representation, and that submission will be looked at in a couple of months. The choice is yours.
 

Dr.Gonzo

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This is like listening to an aged rock star sing about real life. You can't sing about the cold hard streets when you haven't walked them in decades. Stay in your limo with your dietition. I know you mean well but, guy, this ain't the glory days.
 

Purple Rose

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I'll take the agent route. It seems to be the way to go these days, and reading all the forums, it's easy to see why.
 

aruna

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What they all said. Things are completely different now to when Kind started out, and his bitter personal experience is totally irrlevant to the publishing world today.
 

LawlessLara

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This is like listening to an aged rock star sing about real life. You can't sing about the cold hard streets when you haven't walked them in decades. Stay in your limo with your dietition. I know you mean well but, guy, this ain't the glory days.

True, I like Stephen King but since he knows all he has to do it put his name on a child's scribble and it will get published.

Self publishing is a place to start but even if you are not in this for the money seems like it leaves a lot of the hard work to you. The beauty of an agent is the connections and industry knowledge.

Get an agent, two heads is better than one.
 
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Torgo

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True, I like Stephen King but since he knows all he has to do it put his name on a child's scribble and it will get published.

Well, maybe so, but he never actually does, does he? He tends to put his name to excellently crafted 1,000 page novels.

I'm sort of split on the advice actually. You do need an agent to look after your interests, but if I were starting out as a novelist I'd send my work directly to publishers whenever possible. If and when I got an offer of publication, I would then seek representation.
 

LawlessLara

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Well, maybe so, but he never actually does, does he? He tends to put his name to excellently crafted 1,000 page novels.

Excellent at 1000 pages, consistently? .... I think the jury is still out on this one.

That still doesn't negate my point. Stephen King has got to the point in his career where he could churn out 1000 pages of drivel and his agent/editor/publisher -the entire Stephan King dream machine- will cough and splutter and churn out a best selling book.

Note what came first, the agent. In an age where publishers are spending less on editing and are being drowned with submissions having an agent on your side is invaluable.

Well a good agent at least.
 

Torgo

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Excellent at 1000 pages, consistently? .... I think the jury is still out on this one.

Well, I've read almost every novel he's ever published, and I do think he's consistently excellent, yes. Oh, actually, Insomnia was kind of crap, but everyone is allowed an off-day.

I'm not arguing against agents per se, and I don't think King is either. He's saying you're less attractive to agents when you're just starting out and you might as well shop your work directly to publishers yourself rather than shopping it to agents first. I agree with that, where possible; it saves time. But of course this assumes that publishers are reading unsolicited unagented manuscripts, which I concede is far less common now that when King was starting out.
 

Corinne Duyvis

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You do need an agent to look after your interests, but if I were starting out as a novelist I'd send my work directly to publishers whenever possible. If and when I got an offer of publication, I would then seek representation.

Keep in mind, though, that doing this will likely minimize your chances of publication. For one, most agents are pretty good at picking up on publishable work -- if you can get in with a major publisher, the odds are excellent you'll be able to find an agent. Agents take on debut novelists all the time.

For another, if you send your work to a major publisher, it's likely to languish on their desk for years. An agent not only speeds up the process by a large amount, agents also know which editors and imprints to target -- they'll know if Suzie is overwhelmed with dystopian YA at the moment, or if Peter is specifically looking for it, or if Angela recently left for another publisher so you can give her old imprint another shot, or if Brian is new and eager to fill up his Fall '12 list.

Writers don't have access to that information, so you might end up having a manuscript rejected at a publisher an agent might've been able to sell to.

And that's not even getting to the fact that most major publishers won't even accept unagented submissions. (Which also means that even if you *do* get an offer from publisher A, you won't be able to take that offer to publisher B and C and potentially hold an auction for your work, which means the deal won't be nearly as sweet.)
 

Torgo

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Keep in mind, though, that doing this will likely minimize your chances of publication. For one, most agents are pretty good at picking up on publishable work -- if you can get in with a major publisher, the odds are excellent you'll be able to find an agent. Agents take on debut novelists all the time.

Not knocking agents at all, and I'm well aware that they take on debut novelists. I just think there's no harm in submitting directly to publishers where that option is available.

For another, if you send your work to a major publisher, it's likely to languish on their desk for years. An agent not only speeds up the process by a large amount, agents also know which editors and imprints to target -- they'll know if Suzie is overwhelmed with dystopian YA at the moment, or if Peter is specifically looking for it, or if Angela recently left for another publisher so you can give her old imprint another shot, or if Brian is new and eager to fill up his Fall '12 list.

Writers don't have access to that information, so you might end up having a manuscript rejected at a publisher an agent might've been able to sell to.

Possibly, but then I do edit books at a major publisher, and when unsolicited manuscripts come in I find that they get to the right people just as efficiently as ones that come in via agents - more so, in fact, because they're being routed around the company by people who know the editors and their situations even better than agents.

I'm not sure there's much of a benefit in that sense. What representation will definitely get you is a prompter response (but then you may have spent a lot of time getting an agent in the first place.)

And that's not even getting to the fact that most major publishers won't even accept unagented submissions.

There's the rub, as I said - increasingly publishers don't.
 

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I'm not arguing against agents per se, and I don't think King is either. He's saying . . .
He's not saying . . . (present tense); he said . . . (past tense). The web page is dated 2005, and at the bottom it says the article was originally published in The Writer in 1986. So, that advice is 25 years old. Publishing has changed considerably since that article was published, as others have said. Even King might have changed his views since 1986.
 

Susan Coffin

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True, I like Stephen King but since he knows all he has to do it put his name on a child's scribble and it will get published.

So not true on the bold part, and pretty much a generalized judgment. Have you read On Writing. He does care about the words he puts on paper.
 

Susan Coffin

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He's not saying . . . (present tense); he said . . . (past tense). The web page is dated 2005, and at the bottom it says the article was originally published in The Writer in 1986. So, that advice is 25 years old. Publishing has changed considerably since that article was published, as others have said. Even King might have changed his views since 1986.

Now I know why I recognized that article. Maybe in 1986 he didn't believe in agents. Gosh, I'm sure the publishing world was different than it is now. I wonder what advice he would give on agents now.
 

Torgo

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He's not saying . . . (present tense); he said . . . (past tense). The web page is dated 2005, and at the bottom it says the article was originally published in The Writer in 1986. So, that advice is 25 years old. Publishing has changed considerably since that article was published, as others have said. Even King might have changed his views since 1986.

Ah, that makes a lot more sense then. I didn't notice that.
 

Chris P

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I finished reading On Writing last night. The query letter example he presented would be torn to shreds in QLH, although I admit QLH isn't the final word on the subject by any means.

My objection to the advice is it goes against the "start at the top and work down" strategy for getting published. I used to think starting low and building up would work better, but it wasn't producing any better results than I'm getting now with starting at the top.
 

Chris P

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Well, the top publishers will not accept unagented work. Therefore, you need to get a top agent in order to submit to a top publisher with the huge distribution networks and full-time marketing departments. Once you have worked through the agents with no deal, then start submitting to the smaller publishers until all of them have given rejections or not responded. Then go the self-publishing route. [There is an assumption here that good publishers only take agented work; that's not true, of course, but this is the strategy]

Starting at the bottom, a small publisher with a poor distribution network or poor marketing might cause a good book to languish in obscurity when it might have done very well with a bigger publisher.

The same is true for short stories. Make the high-payers turn you down first. Why sell a story to a mag with a circulation of 300 that pays 3 contributor copies and when you might get 5 cents or more per word to a big-name publication?

The merits of this method are debatable, of course, and by no means the only way to do it. It's just the approach I'm taking now.
 
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Jamesaritchie

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Excellent at 1000 pages, consistently? .... I think the jury is still out on this one.

That still doesn't negate my point. Stephen King has got to the point in his career where he could churn out 1000 pages of drivel and his agent/editor/publisher -the entire Stephan King dream machine- will cough and splutter and churn out a best selling book.

Note what came first, the agent. In an age where publishers are spending less on editing and are being drowned with submissions having an agent on your side is invaluable.

Well a good agent at least.

Nonsense. The jury returned that verdict long ago, and continuing sales numbers verify it over and over. Bestselling novels happen only because millions of readers LOVE the books. This does NOT happen with drivel. I doubt any writer out there relies more on good editors, and I know of no other bestselling writer who actually had an editor replaced because the editor wasn't doing his job.

It's a slap in the face to writers, and even more to readers, when you say a writer could churn out drivel and have it be a bestseller. It just does not work this way. Writers who do this watch their careers die quickly.

Nor are publishers spending less time editing, and they certainly are not drowning in submissions. Agents are drowning in submissions, not publishers. First you hear people say that publishers won't accept submissions unless they come from agents, and then they say that publishers are drowning in submissions. It can't be both ways.