Elon Musk: "AI is akin to Summoning the Demon"

This was the field I was studying, and the whole fear of AI is one of my biggest pet peeves ever, lol

I do 'fear' technology for critical systems in general, but the AI-as-science-fiction part really irks me for some reason

backslashbaby said:

This was the field I was studying, and the whole fear of AI is one of my biggest pet peeves ever, lol

I do 'fear' technology for critical systems in general, but the AI-as-science-fiction part really irks me for some reason

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Actually. I quite agree with the man.

We have little understanding of what self awareness consists of, esp as a philosophical concept. Who knows what strides may be accomplished in fifty years. Quantum computers? Biologically based computer-like devices?

An artificial self-aware entity is definitely in the realm of science fiction, but it's also in the realm of near future science fiction. We have not a clue as to what such things would be like.

As a side note, Elon Musk's ex, Justine Musk wrote urban fantasies involving demons -- and not half bad books, either.

Perhaps some of that rubbed off on him.

I've long believed that it is Human Intelligence which is becoming artificial.

Intelligence doesn't automatically come with a conscience, and that's what freaks people out, I think. Something with the computational capacity of a computer, but the reasoning capacity of a human that has no empathic or sympathetic capabilities is a scary thought. You'd literally be building sociopaths.

Here's something I've never understood about AIs and the Musk-like fear of them:

How do AIs solve the halting problem?

I thought about Isaac Asimov's 3 laws for robots (guiding principles for roboticists):

A robot may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.

A robot must obey the orders given to it by human beings, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.

A robot must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.

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http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Laws_of_Robotics

But then there are physicist Mark Tilden's "three guiding principles":

A robot must protect its existence at all costs.

A robot must obtain and maintain access to its own power source.

A robot must continually search for better power sources.

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http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tilden's_Laws_of_Robotics

humankind has much to fear from engineering logic with the capacity to destroy us.

nothing would be more logical.

dfwtinman said:

I thought about Isaac Asimov's 3 laws for robots (guiding principles for roboticists):

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fermi paradox, see also

"No more strings on me."

Am I the only one who thinks that everyone else has watched the newest Avenger's film trailer a few too many times?

While the potential for AI's taking over and eliminating us 'inferior' hoomans is constantly being tossed in, keep in mind that AI's are way off in the future. We're having a hard enough time understanding what makes the human mind work much less building a positronic brain. And considering we've created nuclear weapons and there's ISIS running around, it's a safe bet that mankind if REALLY good at killing itself...we don't need a Terminator for that...

Unimportant said:

Oops, I read the thread title and thought AI meant artificial insemination, and thought WTF?

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I did the same thing.
Reading too much about raising pigs I guess.

Diana Hignutt said:

http://www.cnbc.com/id/102121127#.


Ah, it warms my robophobic, neo-Luddite heart to hear such a tech savvy guy say such things...

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They made several thought provoking documentaries on this.

Unimportant said:

Oops, I read the thread title and thought AI meant artificial insemination, and thought WTF?

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And there was one on this too.

J.S.F. said:

Am I the only one who thinks that everyone else has watched the newest Avenger's film trailer a few too many times?

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it's entirely possible.

J.S.F. said:

keep in mind that AI's are way off in the future. We're having a hard enough time understanding what makes the human mind work much less building a positronic brain.

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Rudimentary versions are already in (test-stage) service as companions or helpers for grief sufferers and chronic (emotional) loneliness.

William Haskins said:

fermi paradox, see also

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Not to mention the absence of evidence for extraterrestrial artificial intelligence. As Fermi says: "where are they?"

J.S.F. said:

"No more strings on me."

Am I the only one who thinks that everyone else has watched the newest Avenger's film trailer a few too many times?

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Either that or that Transcendence movie. Or Kairo. Or Pulse (Wes Craven's remake of Kairo.) Or I, Robot (specifically the movie, because every faithful adaptation of Asimov's stories is distinctly pro-robot--see also: Bicentennial Man.) Or that one episode of Doctor Who. Or that one episode of The Twilight Zone. Or that other episode of The Twilight Zone. Or the Digimon movie. Or The Matrix. Or about a hundred different Creepy Pastas.

Seriously, the Evil Technology Is Evil trope is as old as the invention of the wheel.

My thoughts: 'Demon,' singular? Just one? Pfft. Don't be so pedestrian, guy. If AI were capable of summoning subterranean beasties, there would be hordes. HORDES, I TELL YOU.

rugcat said:

Actually. I quite agree with the man.

We have little understanding of what self awareness consists of, esp as a philosophical concept. Who knows what strides may be accomplished in fifty years. Quantum computers? Biologically based computer-like devices?

An artificial self-aware entity is definitely in the realm of science fiction, but it's also in the realm of near future science fiction. We have not a clue as to what such things would be like.

As a side note, Elon Musk's ex, Justine Musk wrote urban fantasies involving demons -- and not half bad books, either.

Perhaps some of that rubbed off on him.

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It's an interesting philosophical or sci-fi question, and it's cool enough for folks to discuss it that way

But in nearly all of the applications of AI in the real world, self-awareness is not ever going to be anything to worry about. The field of AI is not really about all that, if that makes sense. Awareness is not the goal, except for those with more of a philosophical/completely theoretical bent. That's really cool as its own goal, for its own reasons, of course

More practically, there are huge ethical considerations about critical systems and almost all programming. It's always a problem, and it is even more so the more automated the system is designed to be. Those arguments interest me much more (but I'm not very philosophical).

I don't mean to disparage the more fun debate at all, though, y'all It's just not my thing, and it's the very first thing everyone always mentioned when they learned what I was going into That's why it started bugging me, lol.

Seeing that after millennia of philosophy and a century of modern neuroscience we still can't effectively define self-awareness, let alone understand how the brain produces it, I'm skeptical there's much chance of self-aware AI hitting the shelves any time soon.

quiet, you. sci-fi fans are tired of it. it's moot.

Not to mention the hundreds of millions of generations of slow, meandering evolution it took to get here.

I tell you, my car is self aware and its intent on driving me insane. It's insidious.

Albedo said:

Not to mention the hundreds of millions of generations of slow, meandering evolution it took to get here.

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Which is where the Fermi Paradox that William mentioned comes into play.

it will be a meeting in the middle of increasing artificial AI self-awareness and (rapidly) declining human self-awareness.