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Just wanted to jump in to say that this is not always the case. Rick Yancey's THE MONSTRUMOLOGIST has a twelve-year-old protagonist and that book is definitely YA.
As to the thread as a whole, I agree with pretty much what everyone else has said. Advice re: the query fourthed.
I don't want to evoke Charles Wallace; his character is a subversion of that trope. But he was originally 11, and I changed him to 12 to see if that would make a difference. I should change him back to 11.So maybe age him *down?
I'm not. But I think this novel has crossover appeal. I've had a bunch of beta readers on the whole series, and teens seem to love it as much as adults. Also, my style is minimalist rather than prose-heavy, so the story has a YA pace to it.Why are you so married to the YA label?
Yes, done it. I've rewritten the query about 108x, and the first three chapters more than 150x. I've gotten loads of feedback--enough to realize that his age is one of the major factors leading to auto-rejections.But, more importantly than that, like people have said, if you are consistently getting rejected from your query, take a look at your query again. Have you posted it on QLH? Also, if you're pasting the first ten pages of your MS onto the body of the e-mail, maybe try posting them on SYW.
Agents don't offer feedback when they auto-reject. However, I've had a lot of feedback on the first three chapters from industry professionals. The age thing is consistently mentioned by them.
Former assistant editors (at major publishers, such as Tor and Daw), and agented and published novelists.
Working literary agents and editors generally don't have time for beta reading. If you know one who's willing, please let me know.
Does he *start* the book as a 12-year old? because that's pretty much the midpoint for boys to hit puberty (between 9-14).
I'm not sure that 12-year-olds are all that innocent, either. (Unless you're strictly talking sexual innocence. Then sure. Especially if puberty hadn't hit.)
Sure, they don't have all the emotional and decision-making capacity of adults, but they can lie. And cheat. And steal. And hurt people. And bully.
I'd actually buy it more if he were... I don't know... a six-year old. A kind of Charles Wallace (Wrinkle in Time) type character.
Presumably by the end of the series, he'll be older? So if you *do* have him as 12 now, in later books, he'll be older so... you're going to lose that visual child-like impact anyway. (Not that 12-year-old boys are exactly child-like.)
So maybe age him *down?
Why are you so married to the YA label?
I would call it adult. Have you read Room? It's an adult novel written from the PoV of a five-year-old. So you can go young in adult novel.
But, more importantly than that, like people have said, if you are consistently getting rejected from your query, take a look at your query again. Have you posted it on QLH? Also, if you're pasting the first ten pages of your MS onto the body of the e-mail, maybe try posting them on SYW.
I don't want to evoke Charles Wallace; his character is a subversion of that trope. But he was originally 11, and I changed him to 12 to see if that would make a difference. I should change him back to 11.
I think this novel has crossover appeal.
I'm not. But I think this novel has crossover appeal. I've had a bunch of beta readers on the whole series, and teens seem to love it as much as adults. Just to play devil's advocate, I read several books by King before I was ten. My daughter, in the same age group, read Twilight. My son read Phantoms. Help me out, where are those shelved? Oh, that's right....adult, YA or whatever the fuck Twilight is, and adult again.
The simple truth is, most folks read more than one genre or age grouping. They just do. At the same time, MOST books get shelved in a single spot.
You aren't in Marketing, particularly not of books. What sounds lovely to you ("I can sell to tow or three groups, and get my jet-money twice as quickly!") may not to folks who have to 1) sell the book as effectively as possible and 2) deal with you, the author, who is possibly already coming off as a snowflake at worst, and naive at best, with this line of argument. I get where you're coming from, but your logic is flawed. Pick the correct genre, and stop muddying your own waters.
Also, my style is minimalist rather than prose-heavy, so the story has a YA pace to it. aaah, like famed YA author Ernest Hemingway. Yeah....prose style does not automatically determine where it goes either. My prose is also sparse, but writing about 30-ish people fucking and killing and loving and hating doesn't turn it into YA because I don't write purple.
I'm considering changing his age to 18 in the first three chapters, just to see if that leads to a full manuscript request. I doubt it will, fwiw. you can certainly try, but I really think this is like suggesting you could take a car with a flat tire and make it run by replacing the muffler. If it does, then ... I'll panic? I can change his age in this novel, to the detriment of the story [see my post #23]. Maybe it will make the difference between getting the mss read or not.
Yes, done it. I've rewritten the query about 108x, and the first three chapters more than 150x. I've gotten loads of feedback--enough to realize that his age is one of the major factors leading to auto-rejections.
There's another major factor, as well, which is trope assumption. It seems that many readers (and about 100% of industry professionals) assume that this character is going to follow the typical child-genius-saves-the-day trope. My novel takes an unexpected twist and subverts that trope, but the agent isn't going to read far enough to see that. So I'm working on figuring out a way to signal the trope subversion in chapter 1, and/or in the query letter.
You've mentioned these industry professionals before: I wonder who they are, and where you've found them.
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I don't want to evoke Charles Wallace; his character is a subversion of that trope. But he was originally 11, and I changed him to 12 to see if that would make a difference. I should change him back to 11.
I'm considering changing his age to 18 in the first three chapters, just to see if that leads to a full manuscript request. If it does, then ... I'll panic? I can change his age in this novel, to the detriment of the story [see my post #23]. Maybe it will make the difference between getting the mss read or not.
There's another major factor, as well, which is trope assumption. It seems that many readers (and about 100% of industry professionals) assume that this character is going to follow the typical child-genius-saves-the-day trope. My novel takes an unexpected twist and subverts that trope, but the agent isn't going to read far enough to see that. So I'm working on figuring out a way to signal the trope subversion in chapter 1, and/or in the query letter.
The audience will determine whether there's crossover appeal.
Sounds like a grownup book to me. Plenty of teens read grownup books, that doesn't mean you have to call it YA.
PROBLEM SOLVED.
I'm feeling marginally ignored. OP, are you interested in writing into your query about subverting tropes? I notice nowhere in your query do you even hint at the fact that this is a subversive story.
Sounds like a grownup book to me. Plenty of teens read grownup books, that doesn't mean you have to call it YA.
PROBLEM SOLVED.
Wasn't Harry Potter 12? I'm pretty sure it was all adults that bought those books and read them.... So I always say Harry Potter is an adult book. I wouldn't change the age.
Just ask any parent!Young kids can be terrifying. Just ask any horror novelist.