• Guest please check The Index before starting a thread.

Mundania Press / PhazE / New Classics Press

priceless1

Banned
Joined
Feb 15, 2005
Messages
1,622
Reaction score
446
Location
Somewhere between sanity and barking mad
Website
www.behlerpublications.com
Is there such a thing as an "indie" ebook/pod publisher? I'd be interested in hearing what everyone thinks about that.
This is shaky ground and one that PODs use to their advantage. They all call themselves indie presses, which gives the notion that they're an indie trade publisher with all the bells and whistles. All "indie" means is that they aren't part of a conglomerate like the large NY publishers. PODs, as has been mentioned to ad nauseum are just that; Print On Demand business plan, where all the risk is placed on the author. No print runs, no distribution, no promotion, blah, blah, blah. That is not an indie trade press.
 

victoriastrauss

Writer Beware Goddess
Kind Benefactor
Absolute Sage
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Messages
6,704
Reaction score
1,314
Location
Far from the madding crowd
Website
www.victoriastrauss.com
The only meaning of "independent" used in connection with "publisher" is to signify that it isn't part of one of the big conglomerates (such as HarperCollins, which is owned by News Corp, or Simon & Schuster, which is owned by Viacom). An "indie" publisher is simply an independent company.

So just about any publisher that doesn't have a corporate parent is an independent publisher. Like "traditional publisher," the term doesn't tell you anything about the publisher's reputation, focus, or business practices.

Tor and DAW are both part of conglomerates; they aren't independent by any stretch of the imagination. Baen is still independent--but as is true of many of the larger independents, it is as difficult to access as any of the imprints of the conglomerates

Unfortunately, "independent" or "indie" seems to be coming into use to signify "bold new alternative," as in "not your grandpa's elitist, conventionally-minded, dinosaur, old-guard publisher that excludes talented new writers because it's too scared of change to accept how fantastic they are." Usually, this means some kind of micropress, often fee-based. I've also seen the term "indie author," which mostly seems to be a euphemism for "self-published." It's all part of the eternal drive to find nicer or more official-sounding ways of saying things.

It's true that spec fic authors have fewer alternatives than authors in other genres. The spec fic genre is one of the smallest of all genres, except maybe for literary fiction. That lack of options exists on all levels of the market. At the big-house end of the spectrum, there are only maybe 10 worthwhile imprints (compared with dozens for commercial or mainstream). At the other end of the spectrum, there are a limited number of small but reputable specialist publishers, some of which, like Wheatland Press, don't have commercial-style distribution, but have a good reputation within the spec fic community because they're run by people who actually know how to select good fiction, and do a lot of their marketing and selling at SF/fantasy cons (Locus Magazine hosts a list, though it's out of date--some of the listed publishers no longer exist). In the middle of the spectrum--the midsize and larger independents that market and distribute to the book trade--there's practically nothing.

- Victoria
 

priceless1

Banned
Joined
Feb 15, 2005
Messages
1,622
Reaction score
446
Location
Somewhere between sanity and barking mad
Website
www.behlerpublications.com
But you're doing it without specific reference to this particular genre, and by stubbornly "refusing," as you put it, to believe that spec fiction authors don't have lots of options if only they would look for them. They don't, and they have.
Sigh. Phoenix, it appears that we've reached an impasse. My reason for coming to the Mundania thread is to discuss POD, not SF/F, something I've already said I know squat all about. If you say there are no SF/F indie publishers, then I guess there are no SF/F indies - I can't argue the point since this is not my expertise. All I know is what I hear from the hundreds of authors I speak with every year - some who write in SF/F. If you say it's hopeless, then it's hopeless. I happen to hear otherwise.

I certainly wouldn't take my work to POD unless I had absolutely no other options.
And this is the reason why I came to this thread. Why would anyone want to go the POD route? If the work isn't acceptable by mainstream large and small presses, then I think the message is pretty clear. The only other assumption I'm left with is that you're determined to see your work in print come hell or high water. If that's your main goal, then be my guest. My opinions are immaterial. I warn against the likes of Mundania and every other POD because they don't operate in the best interests of the author. Sure, they crank out a book and, hey, you may even sell a few copies. But you'll never really get what you want; respectability of being with a good publisher and real distribution.

But I think you're misunderstanding or unintentionally misrepresenting the market in speculative fiction by making it appear as if there is this huge middle ground between Mundania and Tor, and that's just not accurate.
Careful, Phoenix, you're borderline insulting. I may be accused of eating too many Twinkies or being a tad passionate about author's interests, but don't ever accuse me of intentionally misrepresenting anything, ok? As I said earlier, yes, there is middle ground. No, I don't know where it is because I don't do SF/F. I hear this from the mouths of other published authors. I think we've taken this discussion off topic. This is about Mundania, not a particular genre.
 

veinglory

volitare nequeo
Self-Ban
Registered
Joined
Feb 12, 2005
Messages
28,750
Reaction score
2,933
Location
right here
Website
www.veinglory.com
Just to inject a middle ground message, I went e/POD do to laziness (I am not and do not want to be a full time writer) and also format and content (i.e. novella length gay erotic romance). Was I desperate to be in print? Meh--it was gratifying enough. But over 3 years I also made US$20,000--which in my world is not pocket change.
 

Saskatoonistan

Still the wrong side of Saskatoon
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 14, 2008
Messages
620
Reaction score
101
Location
The Bad Part of Saskatoon
Website
sean-cummings.ca
That lack of options exists on all levels of the market. At the big-house end of the spectrum, there are only maybe 10 worthwhile imprints (compared with dozens for commercial or mainstream).

See, in Canada it is the opposite. We are a fart in the breeze compared to US publishing houses, hence, significant government subsidy through the Canada Council for the Arts to our publishing houses. Moreover, genre-fiction geeks like me are pretty much hooped when it comes to getting published by a Canadian publisher because their lists are big time literary fiction and non fiction.

I guess we have a tendency to label things and I find it ironic (ha ha ha I am soooo laughing right now) that an American literary agency is reading my genre fiction novel about a Canadian protagonist that takes place in a Canadian city and is FULL of Canadian-isms when Canadian publishers who are terrified of the big bad US publishing industry coming in here and contaminating the clean, pristine and snooty Canadian publishing world, won't give it the time of day.

I am now stepping off my soap box and exhaling slowly.
 
Last edited:

Mark Wakely

Still working on that second novel
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 14, 2005
Messages
201
Reaction score
14
I write YA spec fiction too, Christine, and you’re absolutely right about the shrinking markets. I put together a list of potential publishers for my novel several years ago, and since then more than a third have either gone out of business or dropped their YA or spec fic line, so I can attest to what you’re saying.

There’s a bigger question everyone in publishing has been ignoring, an 800 lb. gorilla in the room no one wants to acknowledge, and that’s the horrible waste and inefficiency of the “traditional” publishing model. By waste I’m referring to the books that never get sold and end up in the landfills. Determining print runs- especially for new authors- seems more art than science, and way too often publishers get it way wrong. Unsold books returned to publishers, remainders that nobody wants even at 90% off, the stacks of mass market paperbacks with their covers torn off that get carted away with the trash…it’s not exactly an ecological disaster, but the truth is few manufacturing processes pollute more than the paper mills, primarily water pollution. (U.S. paper mills have cleaned up their act somewhat, but not so the growing number of foreign paper mills, where there ain’t no environmental laws.) The “traditional” way of publishing only ensures that this waste continues.

I’ll give you an example that really struck home with me.

I went into one of these remainder “bookstores” where everything’s at least 50% off. Perhaps you’ve seen one in your neighborhood. They typically take over a vacated store, roll out a banner over the door, and get books delivered by the skid. They’ve got everything- textbooks, dictionaries, fiction galore, you name it. (No publisher is immune to significant returns, apparently.) Sometimes they make an effort to sort things out on folding tables, and other times patrons have to dig through giant boxes of jumbled books to find something of interest. Either way, these books are the orphans of the publishing industry that have gone begging, profiting no one but the somewhat fly-by-night “bookstore” owners. (These stores typically disappear overnight when a long-term tenant finally signs a lease.) I had a conversation with the operator of one these stores last year, and the short version of the conversation went something like this:

Me: “What happens to all these books when you have to move out? Do you take them with you?”
She: “Sure, if I have another place to sell them. Sometimes it’s cheaper to toss them than store them, especially the duds. (Her word exactly.) I can always get more.”
Me: “You throw them out? Don’t you recycle them?”
She: “I don’t know what the garbage company does with them. Maybe.”

Ouch.

So have to combat this inefficiency and waste? Well, I think it’s already starting to change, and the POD technology (if not the business model) is helping. Since I write spec fiction, here’s my vision for the brick-and-mortar bookstore of the future:

You walk into a store with several kiosks. In each kiosk is a computer and monitor connected to a database of all books in print. You look up what you’re interested in either by title, author or subject, and you can read most (if not all) of the book to see if it’s what you’re looking for. (The database can even suggest similar books based on content or style.) There might even be a knowledgeable, real live person there who can help you find what you’re looking for if you need the help. After you make your selection, you make your payment and the file for that book is downloaded to an unattended machine by the exit that will print the book in any format you specify. In just a few minutes, your book slides down a chute into your waiting hands and away you go, a happy new book owner. No fuss, no muss, no waste.

You can even make you purchase from home and have the book printed locally for pickup or delivery. (Kind of like buying locally grown produce to cut down on your carbon footprint.)

This doesn’t eliminate waste entirely, but it sure reduces it. Truth be told, the current, antiquated method of “traditional” publishing with it’s wasteful, speculative print runs is nothing but a sorry dinosaur, and the sooner it rides off into the sunset, the better off we’ll be.
 
Last edited:

priceless1

Banned
Joined
Feb 15, 2005
Messages
1,622
Reaction score
446
Location
Somewhere between sanity and barking mad
Website
www.behlerpublications.com
Just to inject a middle ground message, I went e/POD do to laziness (I am not and do not want to be a full time writer) and also format and content (i.e. novella length gay erotic romance). Was I desperate to be in print? Meh--it was gratifying enough. But over 3 years I also made US$20,000--which in my world is not pocket change.
Veinglory, I've always considered you the wonderful exception to the rule, both in niche and content, and I couldn't be happier for you.
 

CaoPaux

Mostly Harmless
Staff member
Super Moderator
Moderator
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 12, 2005
Messages
13,952
Reaction score
1,746
Location
Coastal Desert
Returned books are first sent to discounters. Those that are returned to be pulped are just that: pulped, then recycled into Kraft paper, cardboard, insulation, etc., etc. Just as bemoaning the death of trees to produce books ignores the fact that paper trees are farmed, the hand-wringing over books in landfills ignores the entire sub-industry built on recovering and recycling both pre- and post-consumer paper.
 

Mark Wakely

Still working on that second novel
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 14, 2005
Messages
201
Reaction score
14
Sure, recycling is preferable to landfills, but the three R's of conservation are Reduce, Reuse and Recycle, with recycling the last (and least preferable method) on the list. Recycling a product still creates pollution. Reducing is still the best thing to do. A different mindset is needed in the publishing industry for that to happen. More likely, printing and distribution costs will continue to rise until environmentally friendly practices make better economic sense.

Farmed trees don't harvest themselves, by the way. There's just as much pollution created harvesting and processing them as any other tree.
 

CaoPaux

Mostly Harmless
Staff member
Super Moderator
Moderator
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 12, 2005
Messages
13,952
Reaction score
1,746
Location
Coastal Desert
Sounds like your concerns revolve on the energy and engineering sectors, then. Industries' efforts to go "green" are limited until they develop hydrogen cranes and the like.
 

priceless1

Banned
Joined
Feb 15, 2005
Messages
1,622
Reaction score
446
Location
Somewhere between sanity and barking mad
Website
www.behlerpublications.com
Reducing is still the best thing to do. A different mindset is needed in the publishing industry for that to happen. More likely, printing and distribution costs will continue to rise until environmentally friendly practices make better economic sense.
I've seen this same argument from PODs many times. It's effective because it makes the author think happy happy thoughts about saving the Earth and makes them forget that stock is needed to fill the shelves, hence print runs.

As green as we all try to be - printing on recycled paper, for instance, the facts are that we need those large print runs in order to fulfill orders. Since publishing is an inexact science because we're slaves to the public's tastes, there is a lot of waste in unsold books. It's a travesty and bites at our bottom line in the worst way. With the economy taking a huge chunk out of the publishing industry, I daresay the large publishers will adopt more effective print run policies, just as the small trade presses have done for years.
 

Mark Wakely

Still working on that second novel
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 14, 2005
Messages
201
Reaction score
14
One of my areas of responsibilities at the college where I work is the recycling program, which I started back in 1987. The more I've learned about pollution and its consequences, the more concerned I've grown over the years.

Despite all the supposedly heightened awareness, there's a lot of misinformation (and deliberate disinformation) out there, primarily from the polluters themselves. Even the spin doctors for the paper industry have put a false happy face on their industry with tree farms and the like. What they used to do (and some still do) to the environment is brutal.

But I guess that's a topic for a different thread or board. Enough here.
 

Mark Wakely

Still working on that second novel
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 14, 2005
Messages
201
Reaction score
14
With the economy taking a huge chunk out of the publishing industry, I daresay the large publishers will adopt more effective print run policies, just as the small trade presses have done for years.

I hope you're right. Too bad it took a sour economy to make a positive change.

BTW, I also hope you understand I wasn't knocking Behler or any specific publisher. I guess you have to play by the current rules if you want to be in the game, even if those rules are in need of serious revision.
 

Unimportant

No COVID yet. Still masking.
Staff member
Moderator
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 8, 2005
Messages
19,519
Reaction score
22,755
Location
Aotearoa
Careful, Phoenix, you're borderline insulting. I may be accused of eating too many Twinkies or being a tad passionate about author's interests, but don't ever accuse me of intentionally misrepresenting anything, ok?
P1, if you check Phoenix's post -- which you quote -- you'll see the s/he suggested you were "misunderstanding or unintentionally misrepresenting the market the middle ground".

(some of us consider that UN to be pretty important :) )

No one's questioning your integrity. What Phoenix and Victoria and others have pointed out is that your assumption that there are lots of good indie SF/F publishers out there is, in fact, incorrect.
 

Unimportant

No COVID yet. Still masking.
Staff member
Moderator
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 8, 2005
Messages
19,519
Reaction score
22,755
Location
Aotearoa
Just to inject a middle ground message, I went e/POD do to laziness (I am not and do not want to be a full time writer) and also format and content (i.e. novella length gay erotic romance). Was I desperate to be in print? Meh--it was gratifying enough. But over 3 years I also made US$20,000--which in my world is not pocket change.
V, you're a legend. (And an awesome writer. And a terrific author advocate.)

Would you say your situation is the exception to the rule, as Priceless1 noted? If a writer can't get in with a Tor or DAW type publisher, but writes well and can find a home for their work with an e-press or POD press, are the odds still overwhelmingly high that they'll sell poorly, make little money, and gain no respect from the writing community?
 

priceless1

Banned
Joined
Feb 15, 2005
Messages
1,622
Reaction score
446
Location
Somewhere between sanity and barking mad
Website
www.behlerpublications.com
P1, if you check Phoenix's post -- which you quote -- you'll see the s/he suggested you were "misunderstanding or unintentionally misrepresenting the market the middle ground".

(some of us consider that UN to be pretty important :) )

No one's questioning your integrity. What Phoenix and Victoria and others have pointed out is that your assumption that there are lots of good indie SF/F publishers out there is, in fact, incorrect.
Heh...note to self: do not try to rush a post when trying to leave for Palm Springs seminar. Duly noted, Unimportant - many thanks.
 

Phoenix Fury

From the ashes, baby!
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 10, 2005
Messages
115
Reaction score
40
Heh...note to self: do not try to rush a post when trying to leave for Palm Springs seminar. Duly noted, Unimportant - many thanks.

Thanks as well for pointing out the "UN-" distinction, Unimportant. The last thing I want to do is insult anyone, with the possible exception of the founders of Publish America. ;) As for your larger point, Priceless, I'll just refer you to what Victoria said earlier in this thread--there just isn't that middle ground in speculative fiction. I do agree with you that POD isn't (generally) the way to go for serious writers, and my argument isn't that the situation is hopeless. I've just been trying to make the point that this idea that fantasy/sci-fi authors try querying five or ten agents, then give up and send their manuscripts directly to Tor or Del Rey, then give that up in turn and go running to the Mundanias of the world is a ludicrous one, with the ever-present exceptions duly noted. Most authors in the fantasy / sci-fi genre are as responsible as authors in any other field, and do their due diligence. But when no other options present themselves after years of work, and when a given manuscript might be good enough to publish but not marketable enough for the big sell-through required by the big houses, I'm not sure that it's fair to tell those authors to throw their books in a drawer so they can feel good at having been unwilling to "lower" themselves to a micropress.

I haven't (fortunately) had to face that situation myself. But I'm not going to condemn other authors for whatever choice they make when in that situation. That said, I know you're only trying to help, and it really is much appreciated! (You know, if you really wanted to step up to the plate, you could start accepting fantasy / sci-fi again. Some of it might even involve a personal journey with social relevance. ;) )
 
Last edited:

Christine N.

haz a shiny new book cover
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 12, 2005
Messages
7,705
Reaction score
1,336
Location
Where the Wild Things Are
Website
www.christine-norris.com
If the work isn't acceptable by mainstream large and small presses,

That's a disingenuous statement, Lynn. You and I both know that sometimes good books are passed over. Just bought one like it, no more slots open, etc...are all legitimate reasons for agents and publishers to pass over a good book. Doesn't mean it's not a good book. That's not to say that ALL of them are - we also both know that most novels submitted to publishers quite frankly suck. 95% suck, another 3.5% are decent but you could take them or leave them, and the other 1.5% are in the running. .5% get bought and published.

As green as we all try to be - printing on recycled paper, for instance, the facts are that we need those large print runs in order to fulfill orders.

Yeah, and then places like Borders artifically inflate their orders, which leads to publishers running massive print runs, causing massive returns and credits on the store's accounts so that the store doesn't actually ever have to pay for inventory. Hence the reason Ellora's Cave is suing Borders.

Look, we all know that returns are sucking the life out of the publishing industry. Stores are already reducing their orders. It's only going to get worse before it gets better. POD has potential (wait, wait, before you jump all over me) but it's going to take the re-education of the industry. IF you can convince stores to order fewer copies, promising they can get more at almost a moment's notice, then you will be able to do smaller print runs on POD machinery. Fewer returns is better.

I'm not saying that MP, et al the other companies that run their publishers like a hobby are the next-gen of publishing. Without marketing to support their books, their reach is minimal. They don't get the numbers most authors want. Absolutely true. But the use of POD by actual indie presses, like Samhain, isn't out of the realm of possibility. EC uses their own printing facility, obviously digital. SP uses Lightning Source.

The difference between these two publishers and a place like MP is that EC and SP are more of a hybrid. They HAVE distribution and they TAKE orders, but they FULFILL those orders with books printed on digital presses. It's possible to merge the two worlds and still be successful. They have returns, but buyers know that they won't need to order hundreds of thousands if they don't expect to sell them, and if they need more they can be gotten easily.

This is not an either/or situation. The industry is slowly changing.

BUT...and this is what I tell everyone. It all depends on what YOU as the author will be happy with. If you know everything about a press like Mundania, and you'll be happy with it, then go for it. Why would people want it? Who knows, but some don't mind the lack of distribution. Some like VG just write and publish for fun, with no desire for the rest. (VG has a lovely niche and has a following - she makes it look so easy! :) ). For those people, places like MP are far, far better than a PA or an Xlibris. It all depends on what you want out of it.
 
Last edited:

victoriastrauss

Writer Beware Goddess
Kind Benefactor
Absolute Sage
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Messages
6,704
Reaction score
1,314
Location
Far from the madding crowd
Website
www.victoriastrauss.com
I agree that the industry is changing. But no one can yet see where that change is taking us, and I get impatient with prognosticators, whose prognostications too often seem to be a reflection of what they think should happen, or what they want to happen, rather than an objective effort to figure out what might happen.

The discussion of how POD is going to save the industry by reducing waste etc. etc. has been going on now for years. Those rosy visions of kiosks popping out instabooks are all very well--but realistically, what manufacturer of a product it wants to sell in volume can make money by selling one item at a time? This model may work fine for backlist books that people know to seek out, but for the frontlist, it doesn't make any kind of economic sense.

- Victoria
 

herdon

What's up?
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Sep 9, 2006
Messages
1,129
Reaction score
78
Website
ipad.about.com
I don't think it is at all a stretch to declare eBooks to be the future. Whether that future will hit in 5 years, 50 years or 250 years is more of a guess, but print will eventually die out as a wholesale industry for books, newspapers and magazines -- probably when the generation used to reading everything on the computer are becoming grandparents.

But I don't think PoD will ever become mainstream. As Victoria mentioned, it just isn't a way to sell in volume, and so long as books are being sold in bookstores, they are going to have true print runs.
 

Mark Wakely

Still working on that second novel
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 14, 2005
Messages
201
Reaction score
14
Havlen-

You might well be right about ebooks in most genres, but I think there will always be book collectors even if what they collect is mainly used. Print book could be expensive novelties in the distant time frame you mention.

Victoria-

Gosh, sorry my prognosticating made you impatient. As Havlen suggests, the print book might well be a rarity in the not too distant future. As for instabooks making economic sense, I guess it all depends on how many thousands of instabook machines are out there whether or not enough books can be printed in sufficient quantity to satisfy demand, and how fast they can do the job. I certainly don't think that's going to happen overnight- as the instabooks machines shrink in size and price, their growing numbers will start to chip away at the current "travesty" (as priceless1 put it, and she's right) of overprinting to meet a non-existent demand. That can only be a good thing for publishers. And if as Havlen predicts, ebooks are favored over print in the future, then dwindling demand will meet instabook capacity a lot sooner than anyone might imagine.
 

Christine N.

haz a shiny new book cover
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 12, 2005
Messages
7,705
Reaction score
1,336
Location
Where the Wild Things Are
Website
www.christine-norris.com
I agree Havlen. Well, I'll say the micropress won't change the industry, and not PoD. PoD could change the industry. Nearly everything is digital now, publishing is just a slow business in general. I think they'll change over. Digital printing will eventually become more cost effective. Tomorrow, next week or next year, I can't see publishers continuing to use offset presses for all eternity. They can still print in bulk, just not as large a bulk as they do now. (Personally I think it's a terribly wasteful system they have now, between remaindering and pulping and shipping back and forth. Wasteful of time, money and resources. Horribly inefficient.)

It's the SUPPORT, not the printing process, that's important. Micropresses just don't have the ability/money/whatever, to support their books in a large market.

No, you probably won't see your book on store shelves with Mundania.
No, you won't sell a fifty thousand copies
No, you won't see your book advertised or in a catalog.

Again, if you know all that and can accept it, there's nothing wrong with Mundania Press. I've met authors both happy and not happy with this publisher. I've sort of teamed up with one of their authors, and we do a lot of events together. She does well at these events, her books are well done and a good read. She's happy with them.

If you can't accept what MP is and is not, and you want more, then I wouldn't submit to them. Plain and simple.
 

priceless1

Banned
Joined
Feb 15, 2005
Messages
1,622
Reaction score
446
Location
Somewhere between sanity and barking mad
Website
www.behlerpublications.com
That's a disingenuous statement, Lynn. You and I both know that sometimes good books are passed over. Just bought one like it, no more slots open, etc...are all legitimate reasons for agents and publishers to pass over a good book. Doesn't mean it's not a good book. That's not to say that ALL of them are - we also both know that most novels submitted to publishers quite frankly suck. 95% suck, another 3.5% are decent but you could take them or leave them, and the other 1.5% are in the running. .5% get bought and published.
I don't think anyone can quantify the suckiness or greatness of published books because opinions are subjective. I'm probably the only person with a heartbeat who hated Bridges of Madison County. I wouldn't have published this if my life depended on it. See? Big mistake that would have been!

I've had to pass on manuscripts that I loved because I knew there was too small an audience, or the author didn't have a platform. Since I'm investing thousands into every title, I have to make a profit, which means sales. So I guess it depends on our definition of "great works." If I can't get anyone to buy it, does that mean the work is still "great"? Great according to whom?

And this is why Mundania and other PODs clean up. They don't care whether something is terribly marketable because they don't have the amount of risk that we do. They make most of their money from authors buying their own books. It's a false market.

I've passed on works because I already have a very similar work. But chances are that if the work is that marketable and the author has a good platform, they're going to find another home for it. Is that a guarantee? No. There are no guarantees.

Over the years I've seen many authors trying to push a literary peg in a round hole for years. It's not my place to say, "Dude, your writing will never be publishable," but I feel that authors need to take a look at that possibility when they have had every door closed in their face - hence my posts.

I don't see anything disingenuous about that. My only comment is that if the best you can do is to go with Mundania or any other POD, then does this serve your ultimate goals, or is it better to write a better book?

Yeah, and then places like Borders artifically inflate their orders, which leads to publishers running massive print runs, causing massive returns and credits on the store's accounts so that the store doesn't actually ever have to pay for inventory. Hence the reason Ellora's Cave is suing Borders.
Nope, this isn't the case at all. You need to hear an insider's view on that whole debacle.

I agree that the industry is evolving and no one knows where things will shake out. PODs like Mundania have severe problems, and I only want to bring those problems to light in order to help authors make educated decisions. Because of their business plans, I don't believe PODs will be the future of the industry.
 

herdon

What's up?
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Sep 9, 2006
Messages
1,129
Reaction score
78
Website
ipad.about.com
Havlen-

You might well be right about ebooks in most genres, but I think there will always be book collectors even if what they collect is mainly used. Print book could be expensive novelties in the distant time frame you mention.

Certainly, there will likely always be print books. But they won't drive the industry.

I should also note that -- while eBooks will likely replace print books -- that doesn't mean eBook publishers are going to rise to the top. It's likely going to be the same companies driving the print industry. And they'll no doubt be just as selective as they will still need to plunk down the dollars on marketing even if some of the other costs go down. In other words: this isn't something that is going to spring current eBook publishers and eBook writers into the mainstream. It'll be a slow transition of the big publishers selling more and more eBooks.