Gardeners of AW, unite

Vortex Theory

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jan 2, 2013
Messages
68
Reaction score
5
Location
The Vortex
Blacbird, I do try to research my plants, but there is sometimes so much information out there that it becomes a lack of information, you know? Funny that you mention lilacs, though, as I happen to have a lilac bush in one corner that doesn't seem too happy. Maybe some lime will perk it up again!

I also have a HUGE Meyer lemon tree and a plum tree (the fruit are the big red kind) as well... do you know if they prefer lime or eggshells or coffee grounds or what? I don't do much other than water them, as they both seem well-established and provide plenty of fruit regardless of how I treat them. But I would like to make sure they're getting whatever nutrients they need, and so far I haven't been able to find much other than the basic information to plant them... not necessary since both are at least two or three decades old, at least!
 

Shadowflame

Gametrovert
Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 19, 2010
Messages
3,873
Reaction score
543
Hello all.
after last year's heat and drought I have decided to do something different this year.

I have a small garden about 6 foot by 12 foot. It did okay considering the deer and the heat, but I want MORE!
So once we have it tilled we are digging it out for 2 reasons.
1) we tore down a rotting mimosa tree and I want to put the smaller limbs (less than an inch across) as an organic base.
2) allows me to mix in peat moss, manure and sand to counter the clay of the soil
Also, I'm going to try to establish a "no till" garden. This is going to require a few truck loads of old hay- Luckily I can get that from my parents pole barn. From what I've read, 6-8 inches of hay, straw, yard litter over the soil. Since I've already got some of my plants started, I won't have to worry much about healthy established plants.

Yea it will be some hard work, but the potential payoff I think will be worth it.
 

Fenika

Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 3, 2007
Messages
24,311
Reaction score
5,109
Location
-
Are you planning to use wood in your soil? It binds nitrogen so its best to let it compost until it's totally soil... Mixing it in or layering it is bad.

I am going to start lettuce this week with a row cover. I think I may keep the peppers to a minimum this year as they don't ripen fast in this climate. Celeriac, squash, and more berries are definitely going in.
 

Shadowflame

Gametrovert
Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 19, 2010
Messages
3,873
Reaction score
543
Actually no,it isn't that bad. The small limbs are already decomposing, they will just be slower about it.
The main reason I want them in the soil is the clay we have here. The ground isn't bad on Nitrogen, but it packs like a brick. And even if I put compost and sand in the soil, it still cakes up horribly. I've done my research, and while Hugelkulture isn't popular here in the states, it is practiced.
With the compost both on top and bottom, this should improve the texture of the soil and allow deeper roots and better plants.
:D
 

Hip-Hop-a-potamus

My rhymes are bottomless
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jul 28, 2009
Messages
1,695
Reaction score
327
Actually no,it isn't that bad. The small limbs are already decomposing, they will just be slower about it.
The main reason I want them in the soil is the clay we have here. The ground isn't bad on Nitrogen, but it packs like a brick. And even if I put compost and sand in the soil, it still cakes up horribly. I've done my research, and while Hugelkulture isn't popular here in the states, it is practiced.
With the compost both on top and bottom, this should improve the texture of the soil and allow deeper roots and better plants.
:D

Do you drink coffee? One of the absolute best things I've ever used in nasty clay soil (I'm from Texas, where it's pretty dense...) is coffee grounds. The acid tames your base-type soil, providing a balance. Definitely use compost too, but add the grounds and mix everything together really well.

I have my husband save our grounds every day during the spring and summer, and when Starbucks puts their big bags out, I always grab some.

I had a clematis in Texas that was basically dying on the vine. I had just about lost it. But then I started digging coffee grounds into the soil around it, and pouring leftover coffee onto it, and that sucker almost took over our backyard.

P.S. Dump the sand. What I heard from professionals at garden centers was that when the clay packs down, it only gets worse if it has sand mixed in. Stick with peat moss, coffee, and regular compost. I used to get some at the garden center I liked outside Dallas that was broken-down cotton burrs.
 
Last edited:

shakeysix

blue eyed floozy
Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 1, 2007
Messages
10,839
Reaction score
2,426
Location
St. John, Kansas
Website
shakey6wordsmith.webs.com
Coffee grounds do work, at least many people swear by them here. I don't because I drink tea, but my neighbor used them on a beautiful blue hydrangea. I tried that cotton burr compost last year to mellow out some new soil that I was loading into box planters. It seemed to work okay but I hated the smell and texture. I'm going back to manure this spring. I did have great Baby's Breath with the cotton seed hulls but maybe that was just coincidence.--s6
 

ishtar'sgate

living in the past
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 23, 2007
Messages
3,801
Reaction score
459
Location
Canada
Website
www.linneaheinrichs.com
Actually no,it isn't that bad. The small limbs are already decomposing, they will just be slower about it.
The main reason I want them in the soil is the clay we have here. The ground isn't bad on Nitrogen, but it packs like a brick. And even if I put compost and sand in the soil, it still cakes up horribly. I've done my research, and while Hugelkulture isn't popular here in the states, it is practiced.
With the compost both on top and bottom, this should improve the texture of the soil and allow deeper roots and better plants.
:D

You may have already seen this but there's a fairly lengthy film at http://backtoedenfilm.com
and the guy had some pretty crappy soil to deal with. He composted ramial wood chips and used them with terrific results. We just moved to a 5-acre property that's never been gardened and the ground is hard and ugly so I'm going to have my husband bring me home a few loads of chips. He works for BC Hydro pruning trees alongside power lines and taking out hazard trees so his truck is frequently full of chipped fresh wood he needs to do something with.
As we live in cold northern BC I envy all you guys that can start gardening now. We're still deep in snow and our growing season is a long way off but wood chip composting can sure be done now so I'm giving it a try.
 

Chris P

Likes metaphors mixed, not stirred
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Nov 4, 2009
Messages
22,617
Reaction score
7,295
Location
Wash., D.C. area
What hip-hop said about the sand: here, they mix sand and clay to make bricks. Not quite what I want to be digging into.

And I can't sing the praises of mulching (putting dried slash on the soil surface). I'm experimenting with a "dry season garden" at my farm here. My seeds are coming up and thriving through a 1 inch layer of dried grass while the rest of the farm had to be replanted when all the seedlings sprouted then died. The soil beneath the mulch stays wet, but is bone dry under bare soil.

And I'm glad I remembered this thread! Lots of good tips. And I used to have the Back to Eden book. Nice to know that's still being used.
 

sunandshadow

Impractical Fantasy Animal
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 17, 2005
Messages
4,827
Reaction score
336
Location
Pittsburgh, PA, USA
Website
home.comcast.net
First garden-work day of the year here. We pulled out left over carrots and sticks from okra and beans, clipped dead bits off roses, and spread fertilizer. I'll have to go around tomorrow and wax the roses before the cane borers get to them Maybe two more weeks to wait before I start any seeds indoors; I can't keep them inside long, because a plague of fungus gnats arises ever time I have an indoor plant, but I can't just put the seeds outdoors because they get eaten. *sigh*
 

HistorySleuth

Researching History's Mysteries
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 1, 2008
Messages
3,791
Reaction score
855
Location
Western New York State
Website
www.gahwny.org
OK, I'm used to having ladybugs in the house start to appear this time of year BUT this is the is time I've had squash bugs. I talking the last 2 months dead of winter. Mostly in my bedroom. Kind of creepy when they land on us when sleeping.
 

Fenika

Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 3, 2007
Messages
24,311
Reaction score
5,109
Location
-
Sun- row cover?

And for stinkbugs, I hear the traps are effective and all the goo stays in the plastic.
 

Shadowflame

Gametrovert
Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 19, 2010
Messages
3,873
Reaction score
543
YEA! we will at lest start on the garden this weekend--meaning finish cutting up half the tree that has been laying across it since early November and pulling up the dead tomato stalks and such. Of course, since it rained/snowed again last weekend it's still too wet to till. But hopefully in another few weeks.
Hopefully next year I won't have to worry about tilling again,

And yes I have plants started. Or at least attempted. Old seeds from, eeesh don't remember. Have a few sprouts. I'll be able to put the temporary greenhouse outside this week so they should really take off now.
 

shakeysix

blue eyed floozy
Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 1, 2007
Messages
10,839
Reaction score
2,426
Location
St. John, Kansas
Website
shakey6wordsmith.webs.com
I've become the Mother Teresa of indoor plants, buying them from bargain baskets at the grocery stores in poor but salvageable health. My latest finds are two bromeliads marked down to 1$ each. The leaf tips are brown but I think that is due to over watering, not under watering, so I want them in a soil with good drainage. I plan to pot them up for the porch this weekend--should I use a cactus soil mix? --s6
 

Fenika

Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 3, 2007
Messages
24,311
Reaction score
5,109
Location
-
Question: What are good, preferably native (For PA, USA) flowers or bushes that are shade and part shade tolerant (need something for both) AND attract butterflies, bees, hummers, etc.

I have enough room that I could do a three season patch, so the more the merrier.

I have another corner that gets midday and afternoon sun for a bit, so some part shade bushes and trees and stuff there would be good. There's already a mulberry for the birds there, and my neighbor wants to give me another paw paw or two...
 

aliwood

Penmonkey Contrarian
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 21, 2011
Messages
8,581
Reaction score
1,563
Location
UK Cantina
Website
truckloadofart.wordpress.com
Question: What are good, preferably native (For PA, USA) flowers or bushes that are shade and part shade tolerant (need something for both) AND attract butterflies, bees, hummers, etc.

In the early part of the year (like now), my local insects tend to go for the bulbs because that's all that's around. Not sure about your native types if there are any, but they are shade tolerant obviously, and can be underplanted with something taller.

Roses are partial shade tolerant, if you have a native type. The wilder sort can grow into good bird and insect nesting places.

Ivy has flowers - they're not obvious as they are green, you might want to see if you have a native creeper you can grow.

Only suggestion I have, if you have time to do your own research, or even when you take the horse for a walk. Check out your local undergrowth near hedges and fences. Whatever's growing there may be your answer.
 

sunandshadow

Impractical Fantasy Animal
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 17, 2005
Messages
4,827
Reaction score
336
Location
Pittsburgh, PA, USA
Website
home.comcast.net
Question: What are good, preferably native (For PA, USA) flowers or bushes that are shade and part shade tolerant (need something for both) AND attract butterflies, bees, hummers, etc.

I have enough room that I could do a three season patch, so the more the merrier.

I have another corner that gets midday and afternoon sun for a bit, so some part shade bushes and trees and stuff there would be good. There's already a mulberry for the birds there, and my neighbor wants to give me another paw paw or two...
I'm in Pittsburgh and my bee balms (monarda) are very attractive to bees and such and are native to North America.
 

Fenika

Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 3, 2007
Messages
24,311
Reaction score
5,109
Location
-
Ali- good ideas. My boarding stable is too well kept, but I'll prolly find something by the river at the edge of the property.

And bee balm sounds good. I'll look into it :)
 

Fenika

Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 3, 2007
Messages
24,311
Reaction score
5,109
Location
-
Those are lovely!

Also, my non-creeping strawberries are coming in in force. I havent done a thing with them all winter. Yay spring :)
 

ElaineA

All about that action, boss.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jan 17, 2013
Messages
8,555
Reaction score
8,433
Location
The Seattle suburbs
Website
www.reneedominick.com
I was so excited to see the gardening thread going!

Fenika, I have a hummingbird that hasn't left since last summer and he/she's feasting on my pulmonaria (lungwort) flowers right now. They are super hardy, early bloomers. I have the ones with large, spotted leaves so they keep interest all growing season and they do re-bloom, sometimes 3 times a season. Mine are evergreen but that's Seattle. Not sure they would be in your zone. The hummingbird prefers the pink flowered ones over the blue flowered. They do prefer some shade or growing under a larger plant. Mine grow in pretty moist soil and I have to cut them back a lot and divide them every 3 years to keep their size in check, although they always stay low and mounding. You might want to give them a look. There are hundreds of varieties. I imagine there's something for your zone. :)

ETA: Yes, bee balm sends the hummers into ecstasy but they need to be somewhere moist or they get powdery mildew.
 

Fenika

Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 3, 2007
Messages
24,311
Reaction score
5,109
Location
-
Lungwort sounds nice too, though I'll have to make sure it won't take over too much. OTOH, I can mix it with the ivy and that might mix in well.

I saw Bee balm needs moist, so I don't think that will work where I had in mind. I have an area downhill of the house I could put some even though it's not one of the more visible spots.
 

ElaineA

All about that action, boss.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jan 17, 2013
Messages
8,555
Reaction score
8,433
Location
The Seattle suburbs
Website
www.reneedominick.com
Lungwort sounds nice too, though I'll have to make sure it won't take over too much. OTOH, I can mix it with the ivy and that might mix in well.

I saw Bee balm needs moist, so I don't think that will work where I had in mind. I have an area downhill of the house I could put some even though it's not one of the more visible spots.

My pulmonaria variety doesn't spread, it just keeps putting leaves on top of leaves but at its biggest, it's only 12 in. high and maybe 16 in wide. As the top leaves grow, the bottom gets sort of mushy and black and that's why I just cut it back and let it start fresh in spring and mid-summer.

Bee balm is so, so fragrant, you'll probably want it somewhere you'll brush by it occasionally. And it spreads, which is awesome if you've got the room for it. Unfortunately I have it confined. I've seen it in huge swaths in English gardens.

One other plant I thought of was evergreen huckleberry but I'm not sure it grows in your area. It can handle sun or shade, likes dryish conditions. It's a good background shrub and the flowers attract bees and some hummingbirds. Mine don't fruit (I guess I got two of the same sex or whatever you call it in the plant world) but if you get one that does, the birds love them. And people, too.
 

blacbird

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Mar 21, 2005
Messages
36,987
Reaction score
6,158
Location
The right earlobe of North America
We got a foot of snow yesterday at my house.

We're supposed to get 6-12 more inches tonight, with more predicted for Wednesday. It's not supposed to get above 23F for the rest of the week.

April showers bring . . . what, exactly?

caw
 
Last edited: