Hair in SFF?

I definitely mention hair in my books, lol. I'm a hairdresser's daughter and I put a TON of attention/care into my own (very very long, thick) hair. It's a significant part of my daily routine and it generates a fair bit of discussion (friends commenting or asking questions, strangers fawning, etc.), so. I have a scene where two characters are treating wounds/getting dressed, and one of them puts her hair in a braid as they're talking before they leave (expecting to be outside/dirty/exposed to the elements for several days). Long hair has to be confined or it gets damaged and/or is just a pain in the ass (I would go crazy with my hair down and blowing everywhere and caught in my car door all the time) and I think there are definitely ways to use that to enhance characterization; ex. a more physical character is probably going to be more likely to either keep her hair cut off or in a braid/bun.

Roxxsmom said:

I suspect classical conditioning is responsible for more of what we consider sexy than we like to admit. .

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I used to do re-enactment - and there were quite a lot of broad women - the beer tent contributed to that. This was emphasised by the period fashion of upraised bosom, lower neckline, big skirts. I remember once chatting with a guy who commented that he'd been re-enacting for a couple of years now and he'd suddenly realised that he no longer focussed only on slim women. That being surrounded by larger women, dressed in a fashion that was good for large women, had basically rewired/broadened his fancy.

Bolero said:

That being surrounded by larger women, dressed in a fashion that was good for large women, had basically rewired/broadened his fancy.

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I had a similar experience from observing regency dancing where everyone was in period costume. Here were all these larger women, dressed to set off rather than conceal, and hot damn they looked good!! I hadn't really had any fancy at all before that, but I do now.

Bolero said:

I used to do re-enactment - and there were quite a lot of broad women - the beer tent contributed to that. This was emphasised by the period fashion of upraised bosom, lower neckline, big skirts.

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This is enough to make me want to take up re-enactment!

It was a lot of fun. There are a lot of different periods and sorts. Broadly divided by military or civilian living history. Different societies take it more or less seriously - as in how well researched and how strict each is. Some will be period perfect, others have the odd pair of plimsolls hidden under long skirts (which might be acrylic not silk......)

One gold standard place, which is also a lot of fun, is Kentwell Hall. I've never done it, just know lots of people who do. See:

http://www.kentwell.co.uk/

Lots of events for public to come and see for the day.

Bolero said:

http://www.kentwell.co.uk/

Lots of events for public to come and see for the day.

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Not being a Brit, I knew about the National Trust but hadn't heard of the Historic Houses Association, to which Kentwell belongs. Nice!

Good grief, Kentwell. I went there 30 years ago and the memories linger. It didn't exactly start me off down the historical/fantasy route, but it definitely played a massive part...

Bolero said:

One gold standard place, which is also a lot of fun, is Kentwell Hall. I've never done it, just know lots of people who do. See:

http://www.kentwell.co.uk/

Lots of events for public to come and see for the day.

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That looks awesome!

You have to audition to get in and your costume is inspected well before the event - all visible stitching has to be hand sewn, everything in period cloth, patterns and colour - but there is help. Events for newbies well in advance of the actual re-enactment.

They do it in period - I've done some of that. If you are playing 28th May 1612, then you don't know what happened on 29th May 1612. So you are not standing there saying to the public "and in olden times people did xxx". If you are asked "what do you think about the events of 10th June 1612" then according to your fancy and whether you are playing peasant or noble, you have a variety of answers from
"Whens that then?"
"Gentle sir, today is 28th May 1612, surely you mean 10th May?"
through to
"I am no witch/soothsaying is against the law, I cannot tell the future. Be off with you!"
Or of course you could decide you are a soothsayer and take them off to a quiet corner for a bit of naughty soothsaying.

I do know that Kentwell Hall has historic records from the periods they cover and that Guy Fawkes was a guest in the house - before the dread 5th November events. They have actually done the year with someone playing Guy Fawkes who of course got asked lots of times about blowing up Parliament and got very upset his plans were so well known before the event........... (Which come to think about it, is historically accurate really.... lots of people knowing I mean. )

Sometimes, you can get the set-up so right that you look around and it is like being in an old Dutch master oil painting. Can give you the shivers.

Doing it well is time consuming and costs a bit (less if you are peasant). Its what you do instead of going abroad for a holiday.

Mr Flibble said:

Men's hairstyles have changed VASTLY in the last hundred years. (It;s changed a heck of a lot in the last fifty!) Not many mohicans in WWI. Or men with hair down to their arse,

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That reminds me of a friend who came to Colorado back in the '90s and was appalled at seeing men walking around in three-piece suits with cowboy boots and a ponytail halfway down their back.

He went from outraged to speechless when I told him that, given the time and location, most of them were probably local bankers and lawyers out at lunch.

Haha.... reminds me of the first time I ever saw (via the telly) a group of Australian businessmen in three-piece suits ... that included not trousers and wingtips, but sandals and shorts.

And here's a little sample of the latest fashions!

http://www.businessinsider.com/mens-suits-with-short-2014-6

This thread has inspired me to take note of the hairstyles in the place at which I work. For what it's worth, here are the hairstyles at a retail store in the semi-rural south:

older women: a lot of short hair, often down to the top of the neck; some longer hair (of note, there are some women with butt-length hair that always wear skirts and, often, glasses - for the 1950s librarian look; probably religious reasons; they also make their daughters dress this way)

younger women / girls: mostly long hair; sometimes short, which is a nice treat (I like girls with short hair)

boys: mostly short; sometimes long in a rocker/surfer sort of style

men: varies wildly - long, short, bearded, shaven, goatee (it's rare to see a mustache without a beard, though)

Dave Williams said:

That reminds me of a friend who came to Colorado back in the '90s and was appalled at seeing men walking around in three-piece suits with cowboy boots and a ponytail halfway down their back.

He went from outraged to speechless when I told him that, given the time and location, most of them were probably local bankers and lawyers out at lunch.

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I lived in Colorado in the 90s, so I loled when I read this. It's amazing how quickly you get used to it.

This is interesting from a fashion standpoint:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breeching_(boys)

Having seen re-enactment kids of all ages, I can say that it is possible for them to crawl in the long white robe/nightdress - quite a surprise the first time a crawling kid motored past in a long robe doing a perfect look-alike for Sweetpea from the Popeye cartoon. Says how old that cartoon is.......

Bolero said:

They have actually done the year with someone playing Guy Fawkes who of course got asked lots of times about blowing up Parliament and got very upset his plans were so well known before the event........... (Which come to think about it, is historically accurate really.... lots of people knowing I mean. )

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"When four men sit down to talk conspiracy, three are government agents and the fourth is a fool."

Bolero said:

Sometimes, you can get the set-up so right that you look around and it is like being in an old Dutch master oil painting. Can give you the shivers.

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Those old paintings, with their photographic reality, give me the shivers, like I'm looking into the past for real.

cant give descriptions on everything without slowing the pace. I've mentioned hair a few times in my novel but only when its worth it.

Try reading Barbara Hambly for how she handles descriptions while not slowing the book - go for the historical vampire series starting with Immortal Blood. It is more a historical novel than modern mainstream vampire - but she makes it very vivid, spooky, atmospheric, tense - and has beautifully placed details that illuminate and don't hinder.
Part of the trick is using one line for several purposes. Descriptions are more than "she had falls of long blond hair" or "her long blond hair was in multiple tiny plaits, all looped up around her head, bedecked with many coloured ribbons" (made up by me) - so using a description for several purposes would be "a skilled ladies maid had dressed her long blond hair in a complex of looped plaits and silk ribbons" (also made up by me) - so you have a feel for the social class of the character, and there are hints of offstage characters.

Bolero said:

Try reading Barbara Hambly for how she handles descriptions while not slowing the book - go for the historical vampire series starting with Immortal Blood.

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But fer ghu's sakes, don't insert a whole slew of it in the middle of something else, which Hambly does all the bloody time, so when we finally resume the action, I have to go back to the beginning of the paragraph to remember what was going on before we got diverted to description. Argh!!

Reziac said:

But fer ghu's sakes, don't insert a whole slew of it in the middle of something else, which Hambly does all the bloody time, so when we finally resume the action, I have to go back to the beginning of the paragraph to remember what was going on before we got diverted to description. Argh!!

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Yes, she does do this. I love her way with words (though I haven't read anything by her in years), but she does tend to slow down dialogue scenes to a crawl by inserting wodges of stuff between spoken lines.

Hhm. I'll look next time I re-read, but I've never found her dialogue slowed by wodges of inappropriately placed descriptions. I can bring to mind a scene from one of the later vampire books that I rather admired, where two characters are walking down a busy street, having a conversation, which is interrupted by having to dodge round people, passing groups of loud people etc.
Also, I don't find that conversations actually necessarily do flow smoothly as seamless dialogue. I do know that I notice things while listening to the other person talking. So a couple of sentences of dialogue, noticing an especially outre hair-do (as a nod to the original topic of this thread ) and either the conversation continues on track or there is an interruption of "seen that hair-do?"

I didn't notice it until the SunCross duology, which have other issues that kinda exacerbated any deficiencies. (Tho Barbara told me she didn't get to edit them as she'd have liked.) After that, I noticed it in all her books. Guess I had to get sensitized to see it.

I've only ever read Sun Cross the once and many years back - and it was supposed to be a trilogy I thought? I remember some clever ideas, but getting a bit bored at times as I read, then at end of book 2 was one heck of a "wow" cliff hanger - and there was never anything after it. So am I wrong and that was the ending? (The only Hambly I've never been moved to re-read - rather sketchy on the details now.)

Bolero said:

I've only ever read Sun Cross the once and many years back - and it was supposed to be a trilogy I thought? I remember some clever ideas, but getting a bit bored at times as I read, then at end of book 2 was one heck of a "wow" cliff hanger - and there was never anything after it. So am I wrong and that was the ending? (The only Hambly I've never been moved to re-read - rather sketchy on the details now.)

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Same here. I don't remember how it ended but I do recall becoming a bit bored with it. I don't know if it was meant to be a trilogy or not -- at the time it didn't occur to me to ask, and Barbara didn't say. But now that you mention it, I wonder if Stranger at the Wedding started life as part of SunCross.

I don't see how - it is very much a spin-off of a minor character from the Silicon Mage series. (All of which I re-read end of last year and was pleased to enjoy as much as ever.)

Sun Cross, starting Rainbow Abyss, had a Hitler link in.

(And cool you got to talk with Barbara - a small fannish twirl...... )