The New Never-Ending PublishAmerica Thread (NEPAT)

Prozyan said:

Eh, doesn't take much to hit ctrl-c, ctrl-v, then the spell check.

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Are you suggesting, kind sir, that PA doesn't really edit?

PA lurkers. Here's a way to see if they actually do any editing beyond a spell check.

Throw in a few "it's" that should be "its," and vice versa, a few "their" or "there" or "they're" and my personal favorite, "your" or "you're."

See if they catch any of those. If they do that's editing--or at least proofreading. If not, mindless spell check, which won't typically catch any of that. (Okay, if you have word grammar checking for colloquialisms it might ask you about changing "it's" to "it is," but that still won't distinguish between "it is" and "its.")

"Hey, fellow PA family--is anyone else concerned about PA books being higher priced than the ones in the stores? I'm sure people will pay extra for quality writing, but my 200 page book is 24.95, and the same length at the store is only 13.95. That's the retail price. They're even cheaper on Amazon. Any thoughts?"

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A publisher is expected to pay more for quality writing. To the author. Usually more than $1, too.

You know, they're partially right in that readers will pay more for quality. I enjoyed Tanya Huff's Valor novels so much that I was willing to pay for the hardcover of her latest novel rather than wait for it to come out in paperback.

Of course, that was an author that I already liked, whose quality I found by picking up her previous books from a bookstore in cheaply priced paperbacks. In fact, the reason why I first picked her novels up was because the first book was an omnibus containing two of her books in one volume, for a price only slightly higher than a normal paperback. So price did play a role in my choice of books.

I'm not going to pay ridiculous sums of money for a short novel written by an unknown author that isn't in a bookstore-if I can even find it.

megoblocks said:

Are you suggesting, kind sir, that PA doesn't really edit?

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Suggesting, no. Flat out saying they don't, yes.

Yes, I will pay a bit more for high quality writing. Recently I cashed in an B&N gift card. For my $25, I got two trade paperback anthologies from a reputable small press. One was 500 pages, the other 400 pages.

For any PA lurkers:

Difference between these books and a PA book:

1. Price. I got 900 pages for the price of 200 PA pages and that included shipping.

2. Editing. My books were professionally edited by people who understand the process.

3. Presentation. Format was beautiful. Perfect style binding was indeed perfect. Printing was uniform and flawless. Again, produced by professionals, not a clerk balancing the printer manual in one hand while he pushes buttons with the other.

4. Cover Art. Professionally rendered art that is unique to these books done by the staff artist. He's been nominated for an award for one of the book covers. No clip art. No photoshopping, and for heaven's sake, no stock images from Jupiter.

5. Quality. Stories written by professionals who were paid to write them. And paid more than $1.00. I know there may be some quality hidden in the PA slushpile, but I neither the time, nor the disposable income to ferret them out. Even if every story isn't my cup of tea, I know I can trust the anthology editor to have sorted out and chosen quality and professionalism for the anthology.

6. Professional Reviews. I discovered these books through reviews in a very small, yet very well respected newsletter that I subscribe to. The small press staff (not the writers) seek out and cultivate relationships with those involved in the genre and send out an adequate number of review copies to generate buzz and interest in the works.

Note, the writers are not at all responsible for marketing the book. Not one author in the book is out hawking the book with a website and/or a lollipop tree. The publisher handled all press, reviews, publicity and sending out review copies. Neither of these books are available in mainstream bookstores, just a few niche marketers and on-line.

So, yes, small presses with higher than mass market prices are flourishing. However, the good ones understand that the bar is set very high for them and their quality, professionalism, and presentation has to be top notch to justify the higher price.

Compare the list above and then ask what PA has done for you today . . .

Compare the list above and then ask what PA has done for you today . . .

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Broken a few hearts, and given out at few hundred million gallons of false hope.

Note, the writers are not at all responsible for marketing the book. Not one author in the book is out hawking the book with a website and/or a lollipop tree. The publisher handled all press, reviews, publicity and sending out review copies. Neither of these books are available in mainstream bookstores, just a few niche marketers and on-line.

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The Pipe is raking us over the coals on another forum over this very thing. So very sad.

Then the fact that he won't say anything here speaks louder than his words.

Well, there's marketing and then there's promoting. All authors SHOULD promote -their books, and if they have several, themselves as an author. At the bare minimum they should have a website that's Google-able.

People go to college and get degrees in marketing.

Dick might be saying it's all the author's job - and I don't think he really knows the difference between marketing and promotion - but he is also the one who previously said that agents don't want their authors blogging. Which is part of promotion. So take from that what you will.

Someone said agents don't want writers blogging???


What about all the agents who blog themselves--including my own?

EVERY writer I know has a blog. They help sell books.

'Nuff said.

Gillhoughly said:

Someone said agents don't want writers blogging???

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Probably the Pipe, since he has some.... unusual and inaccurate... ideas about agents. On more than one occasion, he has claimed that querying legitimate agents can attract predators (no explanation given as to how).

It's all part of the "stay with PA, don't try for anything better" approach.

Well, for all those who are confusing marketing with promotion (such as Pipe)...

Promotion - doing a book signing in a Barnes and Noble, Borders, WaldenBooks (if there are any left.)

Marketing - encouraging a B&N, Borders, Waldenbooks, to stock an author's books. Commercial publishers do this by making sure their titles are including in a catalog that book buyers can order from. PA does this by putting the onus on the author to go into each store and ask and beg and plead.

Me? I don't mind the first one. I look forward to it. As for the second one? Well, I don't really have to worry about it because my publisher makes sure that's already taken care of. But, if I did have to worry about it, I'd be very unhappy because I am not a salesperson and have no desire to be one.

PA lurkers, that's the difference. Marketing is selling, Promotion is just helping it along.

Queen of Swords said:

It's all part of the "stay with PA, don't try for anything better" approach.

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Misery and failure loves company. Gotcha.

PA Lurkers-- be careful of breathing in second-hand smoke. It can lead to a stagnated literary career.

Gillhoughly said:

Someone said agents don't want writers blogging???

​

What about all the agents who blog themselves--including my own?

EVERY writer I know has a blog. They help sell books.

'Nuff said.

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What about all the agents whose blogs have links to their clients blogs? At conferences, I've heard several agents and editors say that writers' blogs are part of their platform.

Gillhoughly said:

Someone said agents don't want writers blogging???

​

What about all the agents who blog themselves--including my own?

EVERY writer I know has a blog. They help sell books.

'Nuff said.

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I don't know if that's his current opinion, but it used to be - he said as much on the PAMB. That if you get an agent, they want you writing all the time, working like a slave, never wasting time on blogging.

Guess he missed the memo.

I got my PA royalty email today, and I'm happy to say that I still have a perfect record--I still have not sold (or bought) a single book. That means that neither I nor my loved ones have been ripped off by PA's ridiculous prices, and that PA has not made a single penny off of me. The royalty email will be posted on my web site within a few days, along with the others. <Sniff> I'm so proud.

Don Davidson said:

I got my PA royalty email today, and I'm happy to say that I still have a perfect record--I still have not sold (or bought) a single book. That means that neither I nor my loved ones have been ripped off by PA's ridiculous prices, and that PA has not made a single penny off of me. The royalty email will be posted on my web site within a few days, along with the others. <Sniff> I'm so proud.

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Congratulations?

Way to go, Don!!! Sounds odd to be congratulating you on NOT selling a book, but with PA, everything is a bit backward.

From PA's Facts and Figures page (bolding mine):

FACT #3: Again, unparalleled among all traditional book publishing companies, each day an average 15 times a PublishAmerica author appears in the news media, in newspapers, magazines, radio or TV. The authors of this book publishing company have been interviewed, reviewed or introduced in literally thousands of newspapers across the country, from the Washington Post to the Clackamas County News, from the Kingwood Observer to the Los Angeles Times to Women's World Magazine. They have made appearances on local TV, and on national ABC, CNN, MSNBC and FOX TV. They also have been interviewed by radio shows hosts such as Rush Limbaugh, Don Imus, Diane Rehm, and Oliver North.

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At first glance an average of 15 publicity spots a day sounds like a lot. Then I did the math. I multiplied that 15 average times 365 days per year. 5,475 was the total. 5,475 of the 35,000 "happy authors" receive some kind of publicity in the course of one year. What about the 29,525 other PA authors? And the question begs to be asked, who arranged all this publicity? My bet is on the author, not PA. So why does PA take the credit?

merrihiatt said:

From PA's Facts and Figures page (bolding mine):



At first glance an average of 15 publicity spots a day sounds like a lot. Then I did the math. I multiplied that 15 average times 365 days per year. 5,475 was the total. 5,475 of the 35,000 "happy authors" receive some kind of publicity in the course of one year. What about the 29,525 other PA authors? And the question begs to be asked, who arranged all this publicity? My bet is on the author, not PA. So why does PA take the credit?

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PA not only takes the credit, but they get almost all of the money, too, while the PA author spends time and money spinning his wheels trying to promote an overpriced book. No wonder there are so many "happy" PA authors.

"Happy" is such a subjective term...

I'd like to know where they got their statistics or did they just pull them out of their arse hat?

Unless those are 15 (happy, dammit!!) writers who figured out they'd been badly used and are making complaints in public about what a bad idea PA is.

:snerk:

merrihiatt said:

. . . an average of 15 publicity spots a day sounds like a lot. . . .

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That might include obituaries, crime reports (loitering in front of retail outlets? littering by dropping bookmarks?), and so on.

--Ken

ResearchGuy said:

That might include obituaries, crime reports (loitering in front of retail outlets? littering by dropping bookmarks?), and so on.

--Ken

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CNN Reports...

Police in Houston, Texas, arrested a highly agitated person going only by the name of "Gillhoughly" who was the central participant in what they described as a "drive by bookmarking" incident.

Gillhoughly allegedly stormed the city's largest Barnes and Noble outlet, shrieking "I'm a happy, dammit, Published Author!" and forced bookmarks upon customers there.

Several store employees tackled and restrained Gillhoughly until police arrived.

No one was injured, but bookmarks wound up as coffee stirrers in the in-store Starbucks. Customers were advised that the ink, not Gillhoughly's prose, might be toxic.

"We see this all the time," said store manager Guy Caballero. "Usually it's Publish America victims, and they're better behaved. They're content to pretend to drop their purse or backpack and use that an an excuse to pass out bookmarks to anyone who makes eye contact. We're on to it, of course, and have a special register down front just for them so our customers can continue with their check out. I can't explain this Gillhoughly though. Maybe too much caffeine?"

Police say charges are pending depending on the outcome of a psychiatric examination.