How Many Query Letters Before Admit Defeat

luked said:

It has to do with probability.

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The problem with this is that not all queries are made equal; not all books or queries have the same odds of succeeding. So probability has only a glancing relationship with each individual book's chances, because each individual book is different.

Some are guaranteed to never be published by a good publisher, because they're just not good enough. Some books are so good they're almost guaranteed to be published. And all books sent to a vanity publisher by an author with money to spend and no understanding of how publishing works are guaranteed to make it into print.

Most of the time, agents are (unconsciously) looking for particular characteristics in a query. The chance that your story will match any particular agent's interest is of course small. So, it makes sense to email many, many agents since the chance increases. A rejection could mean that your story or query was bad. But it could also mean that the interest was not lined up.

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Good agents know exactly what they're looking for in the slush pile: a book which is well-written, and which they think has strong commercial potential.

It doesn't make sense to "to email many, many agents". That doesn't make your chance of publication increase: it just makes the number of emails you send out increase.

To improve your chances of finding representation, your best bet is to write a better book, not send your book out to more agents.

I am trying to start a query newsletter. It will basically have good queries. Then I email it to a number of interested agents. Agents like it because it will save them time and it would benefit authors too, I think, because they are exposed to many different agents. It is of course free for authors.

Would you be interested?

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Don't use AW to pimp your services. It will get you banned for spamming.

You're welcome to put a link to your website into your signature, and I've allowed you your one thread to discuss your idea: but beyond that, you don't get to use AW to advertise your services.

I hope that's clear.

luked said:

It has to do with probability. Most of the time, agents are (unconsciously) looking for particular characteristics in a query. The chance that your story will match any particular agent's interest is of course small. So, it makes sense to email many, many agents since the chance increases. A rejection could mean that your story or query was bad. But it could also mean that the interest was not lined up.

?

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No, this simply isn't how it works. Probability has almost nothing to do with it. Nor does "unconsciously" looking for particular characteristics. Most query letters are simply poorly written, or boring as dish water, even if they are well-written.

If you write a bad, or boring, query, chances are no agent anywhere will want it. If you write a really good, exciting query, chances are very, very few agents will say no.

Agents know exactly what they're looking for in a query, and very, very few writers deliver it. Agents are looking for talent, for originality, and for excitement.

All queries are not equal, anymore than all manuscripts are equal. Most queries are simply bad. They're poorly written, they're boring, and they read just like every other bad query that comes it. Send a query like this to a thousand agents, and all will say no.

All you're talking about is shotgunning queries, something that almost never works. Too many writer do just as you suggest, and send the same query to a hundred, or two hundred, agents. Then they're surprised when all they receive are rejections.

On top of being well-written, original, and exciting, a really good query is, to some degree, personalized, and you can't personalize shotgunned queries.

It's simply not true that the best way to get an agent to say yes is to send to as many agent s as possible at once. Agents are not dummies, they;r every good at what they do, they know exactly what they want to see in a query, and a good writers knows, as well.

The simple fact is that the chances
you query matches an agent's interest is entirely up to you, and if you're doing your job, the match is going to approach 100%.

If you aren't doing your job, the chances will drop all the way down to zero.

The only thing sending to a large group of agents all at once does is let you build a huge collection of rejections in record time.

Putputt said:

"When John discovers that his sweet, old grandmother is a real-life assassin who has pinned her latest kill on his dad, he needs to outsmart the woman with over 70 years of experience in the field to prove his dad's innocence."

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Call me unsophisticated, but my first thought was: "Where can I read this killer Grandma story?" Which just goes to show that we all have different tastes. That´s why we query widely. Hopefully that way, if your work is good enough, you´ll have a chance of getting it into the right hands.

You might also want to try online critique forums, pitching in different ways, and entering contests. Don't give up.

xDream said:

You might also want to try online critique forums, pitching in different ways, and entering contests. Don't give up.

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We have an excellent critique section here at AbsoluteWrite.

In most cases, pitching on Twitter etc only gets you a slightly better place in an agent's query-queue.

Contests only help their winners.

You can try these things but querying is the way the huge majority of writers find representation.
http://absolutewrite.com//www.pinterest.com/pin/create/extension/

Cochinay said:

I have a big concern right now. I was advised on this Forum to format my Query letter with hard breaks and spacing, and not to use any special formatting. I did so, but now I'm noticing that on the last ten I sent starting about a month ago, the formatting looks great in Outlook but is a disaster on my Iphone. The sentences break at random points and the headings are all offset incorrectly.

I'm concerned any agent looking on his or her Iphone will be disgusted. What is the deal now?

When imbedding your Query into an email text, how do you format to meet the requirements of a standard Iphone.

Thanks again for the help. I'm feeling a bit inept.

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Just make sure you are sending the e-mail in plain text with only hard returns in between the paragraphs. (In other words, don't hit "return" after every line; just hit it twice when you need a paragraph break.) Don't try to customize it to look good on a particular device; you don't know what it's being read on.

I don't know how to switch to plain text mode in Outlook. On Gmail, it's in the "more options" menu right below the text box.

I've just started querying for the first time. Sent to two agents so far. Although I've no experience at querying, my instinct is to have the same query saved to word and then alter it slightly depending on who the agent is.

For instance, the first person I contacted was a woman who in her bio expresses an interest in female leads. So, I added a line making it quite clear that four of the six main characters in my novel are female. Just a small detail, but you never know, could be important.

(I accept I could secretly have a terrible novel and all this is pointless, but let's pretend I don't for a moment).

Old Hack said:

If you're getting no requests for fulls and partials, your query letter needs work.

If you're getting requests for fulls and partials but only rejections after that, AND you're sure you've sent your query out to good agents who are looking for books in your genre, then either your writing needs work or your premise is problematical.

Spend some time in Query Letter Hell: it's in our Share Your Work room. You can't start your own threads anywhere in SYW until you have at least 50 posts and have interacted with the community here (which means, don't pad your post-count just to get to 50), but helping others with their queries is the best learning-tool there is. And when you post your own work for critique, you'll probably get a few reciprocal comments.

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ahh, thanks, I'm just learning the ropes as well, that was helpful.

Cochinay said:

I have a big concern right now. I was advised on this Forum to format my Query letter with hard breaks and spacing, and not to use any special formatting. I did so, but now I'm noticing that on the last ten I sent starting about a month ago, the formatting looks great in Outlook but is a disaster on my Iphone. The sentences break at random points and the headings are all offset incorrectly.

I'm concerned any agent looking on his or her Iphone will be disgusted. What is the deal now?

When imbedding your Query into an email text, how do you format to meet the requirements of a standard Iphone.

Thanks again for the help. I'm feeling a bit inept.

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I always converted my Word query to plain text by saving it as such in TextEdit, then pasted it into my mail program. I didn't use any headings, just the salutation, and didn't attempt to center or indent anything, even when pasting the first 10 pages. I figured, all that matters is whether it's readable, and the most basic formatting generally is.

I have around fifty rejections and another thirty no-responses. I'll just keep querying until A) The manuscript is finally accepted or B) I've finished my next novel, at which point I will direct all submissions efforts to that. Good luck!

Just for some perspective, from one agent, I heard back 5 months after I sent out the query with a request for the full. (At the time, I was actually already agented and the ms was already being bandied about by editors at various houses.) So, you know. Things can move fast or they can move slow, sometimes at the same time. Good luck to you and I hope you hear back soon! But while you wait for that, I hope you're continuing to query and/or write!

Query Shark is a wonderful place to learn about the dreaded query letter. That's what helped me. And 20 query letters is like looking at 5 houses and thinking you'll never own a house. I had around 80 queries before someone snagged me. The first step to becoming a great writer is to realize you're not a great writer after all and you need help. If I had done that earlier, I would have been published earlier. I know so many writers who think they know what they are doing when they have no clue and they never make it. You're on the right track. And use this wonderful, delightful time to learn, learn, learn. Because once you are published, it won't come around again.

James D. Macdonald said:

Write something new, different, and better. You admit you're a novice and need to improve. Very well, then: improve.

No response to your query letters may mean that the query letters themselves need work. Engage with the other folks here at AW. In time, visit Query Letter Hell to work on that letter.

Meanwhile, go over to Query Shark and read the archives there. You might find it illuminating.

As to your question: Twenty queries is not nearly enough to give up.

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Billions times YES!!!! James hit it on the mark. THink of a query letter as a resume. You don't send the same resume to a hundred different employers, but instead personalize them to the job opening.

When I sent my query to anyone who wanted Christian Fantasy, they looked at me as if I had three heads. Then I found a publisher who was looking for my kind of writing and well, it's been a relationship made in heaven. She wants the same things I want. It's like meeting a potential mate. You have to kiss a lot of toads before you find your princess/prince.

Find a publisher who publishes the kind of books that you write. Mention those books:

Dear Mr Ritchie,

I noticed you publish Zombie Love stores as in the example of Zombies in Love which you published last year. My novel too is a Zombie love story in which I think you would be interested in. But here's what sets my book apart from Zombies in Love.

(I got this from Query Shark: Who is the good guy, who is the bad guy, what are the choices that the good guy has to make in order to win against the bad guy OR what are the choices the Good Guy has to make in order to save whomever? So I wrote down my Good Guy, then the Bad Guy, then what the Good Guy had to do to save everyone from the Bad Guy. Bingo!)

You need a killer opening sentence, then go into the good guy who fights against the bad guy. If good guy doesn't do this, bad guy will win. Or These are the choices Good Guy must make if he is to win. If he doesn't do them, this is what will happen to him and those he loves.

Short, sweet and to the point. That is a killer query letter.

Now why James publishes Zombie Love stories is beyond me but each his own. haha!

Jamesaritchie said:

No, this simply isn't how it works. Probability has almost nothing to do with it. Nor does "unconsciously" looking for particular characteristics. Most query letters are simply poorly written, or boring as dish water, even if they are well-written.

If you write a bad, or boring, query, chances are no agent anywhere will want it. If you write a really good, exciting query, chances are very, very few agents will say no.

Agents know exactly what they're looking for in a query, and very, very few writers deliver it. Agents are looking for talent, for originality, and for excitement.

All queries are not equal, anymore than all manuscripts are equal. Most queries are simply bad. They're poorly written, they're boring, and they read just like every other bad query that comes it. Send a query like this to a thousand agents, and all will say no.

All you're talking about is shotgunning queries, something that almost never works. Too many writer do just as you suggest, and send the same query to a hundred, or two hundred, agents. Then they're surprised when all they receive are rejections.

On top of being well-written, original, and exciting, a really good query is, to some degree, personalized, and you can't personalize shotgunned queries.

It's simply not true that the best way to get an agent to say yes is to send to as many agent s as possible at once. Agents are not dummies, they;r every good at what they do, they know exactly what they want to see in a query, and a good writers knows, as well.

The simple fact is that the chances
you query matches an agent's interest is entirely up to you, and if you're doing your job, the match is going to approach 100%.

If you aren't doing your job, the chances will drop all the way down to zero.

The only thing sending to a large group of agents all at once does is let you build a huge collection of rejections in record time.

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There is some really good advice in here for a newbie like me. Thanks! Phaeal 281 queries, wow impressive persistence! Well done.

When I run out of names I start from the beginning of the list if I have new projects to present. I don't give up generally unless I'm told to not contact them again.

Keep writing! Don't give up! Never give up on your dreams. It can just take some time , but keep pushing.

Admit defeat whenever you want to. I'm not real sure why rejections factor into your intended goal or purpose.

A rejection is just a buyer telling you they don't want what you're selling. If you don't get offended when you run a garage sale you shouldn't be with this.

I wouldn't really focus on rejections at all. I always seemed to get rejections with referrals and praise. It doesn't make it any less of a rejection but it's nice when NYC agents take time out to respond to my mass query.

A buyer will come along. It took me since 1995, 4 agents, about 3,000 rejections and a block of jail time to get one to like me and one that I liked. Be confident. It will all work out. I believe in God, but there is something to be said about the laws of attraction. Keep going full speed ahead and you'll get to where you're going.

I removed myself from the process and I saw it like a business. I saw querying and sending my proposal package for 7 different novels, both fiction and non fiction and also 2 screenplays and some volumes of impossible to sell poetry as my job. I was acting like an agent for myself and it worked for me. I left no stone unturned, I knocked on doors, met with people, got out there and sold like any other thing it's a business of sales. These people are going to cut you a HUGE check that will more than likely let you quit your day job so seeing it from both ends helps you formulate your sales package because that's what it is, it's a sales package.

And for humor, there's jerks too, Whimsy Agency sent me an email asking me why was I submitting to them when I should be watching the Oscar coverage once. And at first I was like WTF but then I thought, you know what, I'm tired, I've been up all night and agents are always whining about professionalism and this was their response? I opted for telling them off. I felt better. Burned a bridge. Moved on. Move on. You have to move on and move on and let the rejections fall to the side. Move on.

Luvspaghetti said:

I wouldn't really focus on rejections at all. I always seemed to get rejections with referrals and praise.

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I imagine that helps a bit.

But I can only imagine.

caw