ISIS beheads journalist, James Foley

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He's been missing since 2012. The video is not shown in this CNN clip, but you can find it if you go looking. I wanted to hear their full statements (Foley and his executioner) but I stopped it just before the beheading. It was going to be horrible. Let's just say it wasn't quick. I couldn't watch it.

A video released by ISIS shows the beheading of U.S. journalist James Foley and threatens the life of another American if President Barack Obama doesn't end military operations in Iraq.
In the video posted Tuesday on YouTube, Foley is seen kneeling next to a man dressed in black. He reads a message, presumably scripted by his captors, that his "real killer'' is America.

They showed another missing journalist in the same position as Foley, warning that he's next.

The journalist is believed to be Steven Sotloff, who was kidnapped at the Syria-Turkey border in 2013. Sotloff is a contributor to Time and Foreign Policy magazines.
 
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JimABassPlayer

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Let's just say it wasn't quick. I couldn't watch it.

It's my impression that when most people (myself included) hear "beheading" they imagine a guillotine, or perhaps the hooded, axe-wielding executioners of the Middle Ages.

While I am by no means privy to the particularities of decapitation as utilized by terrorists, I would be fairly certain such is nothing close to either of the aforementioned images.

Probably a sword not chopping, but cutting (as through bread). Not quick, painless or merciful.

Those who resort to such are inexcusable, barbaric and wholly without honor.
 

William Haskins

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the statement these knuckledragging death cultists coerced out of him:

I call on my friends, family, and loved ones to rise up against my real killers, the US government. For what will happen to me is only a result of their complacency and criminality.

My message to my beloved parents, save me some dignity, and don't accept some meagre compensation, for my death, from the same people who effectively hit the last nail in my coffin with their recent aerial campaign in Iraq.

I call on my brother John, who is a member of the US air force. Think about what you are doing, think about the lives you destroy, including those of your own family.

I call on you John, think about who made the decision to bomb Iraq recently and kill those people, whoever they may have been. Think John, who did they really kill? And did they think about me, you, our family when they made that decision?

I died that day John, when your colleagues dropped that bomb on those people they signed my death certificate. I wish I had more time. I wish I could have the hope of freedom and seeing my family once again. But that ship has sailed. I guess all in all I wish I wasn't American.
http://www.buzzfeed.com/jtes/isis-appears-to-behead-american-photojournalist-in-youtube-v
 

raburrell

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I don't have anything eloquent to say on this, only that I've been following Foley's capture for a while now and though I rarely cry for people I haven't met, I was in tears earlier today. RIP.

To those who did this, I sincerely hope there's a hell.
 

William Haskins

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About two minutes and 20 seconds later, the man is apparently beheaded. His executioner, whose face is covered, has what sounds like a British accent and threatens that “any attempt by you, Obama, to deny the Muslims their rights of living in safety under the Islamic caliphate will result in the bloodshed of your people.”
.
 

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While I am by no means privy to the particularities of decapitation as utilized by terrorists, I would be fairly certain such is nothing close to either of the aforementioned images.

Probably a sword not chopping, but cutting (as through bread). Not quick, painless or merciful.

Those who resort to such are inexcusable, barbaric and wholly without honor.

They are monsters. It was a knife. You probably have more stout cutlery in your kitchen. It's horrible.

I rarely cry for people I haven't met, I was in tears earlier today. RIP.

To those who did this, I sincerely hope there's a hell.

I did, too. And yes. Just the bit I did watch made me miserable for what it was and what it stood for.
 

Magdalen

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Not up to viewing a beheading just now.

These guys are really pissing me off. Otherwise I find it useful to withhold any other emotions concerning the whole bloody mess - it's hard enuf just keeping the facts & sources straight.
 

Prozyan

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Nick Berg was beheaded by what was basically a butcher knife. And no, it wasn't fast either.

Its when they do shit like this and posting pictures of a 7 year old posing with a severed head that makes it hard to argue with the crowd that advocates bombing them back into the stone age.
 

JimABassPlayer

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Trouble is we have either completely forgotten the concept of total war, or we have chosen weak, incompetent leaders entirely devoid of decisive leadership.

Before anyone accuses me of being a bloodthirsty hawk (which could not be further from the truth), I despise war.

I despise war because (while mercifully never a soldier), I have seen what it has done to people on a personal level (my uncle was a charter member of the U.S.'s first paratrooper unit ever to see combat), as well as to strangers, to nations and the world. War is a horror which, in a perfect world, would never be waged.

However, living in a fallen, vastly imperfect world as we do, there will always be bullying, antagonistic aggressors who hate others and want to destroy them. Whatever their supposed reasons, unequivocally, they would annihilate every single one of those who do not conform to the standards of the sick and twisted dogma* they espouse.

* Newsflash, people of the world: Obligatory compliance compelled by the barrel of a gun (or edge of a sword) is not faith, and belief which relies upon intimidation, oppression and fear is not belief.

Given that such hateful, odious people exist in this world, who stop at nothing to destroy those with whom they disagree, the rest of the world is compelled to maintain armed forces for the protection of those targeted by these animals.

Never meant to be pretty, clean or cheap, war is something which should only be used as a last resort to defend oneself (or another) from oppression, infiltration and/or destruction. However, once implemented, it must be resolutely and comprehensively executed until fully concluded and the enemy no longer poses a threat -- apparently, a concept well beyond the astuteness of many of the world's current leaders.

As borne out by the entire history of mankind, an enemy is never defeated through appeasement. Likewise, ignoring one's enemy will only assure the greater the injury when the attack finally strikes home.

We ignore this threat to our own peril.
 

JimABassPlayer

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P.S. This is the reason I write comedy. For me, personally, there's enough real misery in the world, why would I ever want to write/read/watch fabricated misery for entertainment purposes?

Not criticizing those who do, but such is definitely not my cup of tea.
 

William Haskins

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president obama deserves credit for ordering the airstrikes that drove these assholes from the dam near mosul, control of which would have meant genocide of thousands.

it was a huge strategic loss for ISIS and so they took an action that was both revenge and propaganda.

but they've headchopped their way across both iraq and syria, so there's nothing uncommon about this beheading, save for the fact that the guy's a westerner.
 

mccardey

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Nick Berg was beheaded by what was basically a butcher knife. And no, it wasn't fast either.

Its when they do shit like this and posting pictures of a 7 year old posing with a severed head that makes it hard to argue with the crowd that advocates bombing them back into the stone age.

Them?

That's where it all goes wrong.
 

William Haskins

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Them?

That's where it all goes wrong.

it's pretty obvious that prozyan was referring to islamic terrorists, and not them-ing the entire muslim world.

and, really, it all goes wrong when you start sawing at an innocent person's neck.
 
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Haggis

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it's pretty obvious that prozyan was referring to islamic terrorists, and not them-ing the entire muslim world.

and, really, it all goes wrong when you start sawing at an innocent person's neck.
Bad enough when they're a journalist. A bit worse when they are reportedly children.
 
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mccardey

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it's pretty obvious that prozyan was referring to islamic terrorists, and not themming the entire muslim world..

Yes, thank you William - I got that. I was making a more specific point, suggesting that bombing them would include collateral damage which would only increase the insecurity and hate and danger. It's a thing that's happened recently in Israel and Gaza, among other places. There should be better tools for dealing with this sort of thing than bombing.

Prozyan - I wasn't assuming that you were themming the muslim world. :) .

and, really, it all goes wrong when you start sawing at an innocent person's neck.

No. I think it had gone wrong well before then.
 

JimABassPlayer

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Them?

That's where it all goes wrong.

Yes, them. The persons who did this -- those who cut off the heads of other human beings with kitchen knives -- the people who do not want to live in peace with anyone with whom they are not in 100%, perfect agreement.

They are definitely in a class of their own.

Pretending that reason will prevail with such is naive. Appeasement doesn't work, neither does sticking one's head in the sand like an ostrich. I see nothing wrong with the pronoun used by Prozyan. Such is certainly both technically and behaviorally accurate in differentiating between those who conduct themselves within the reasonable bounds of human decency, and those who most emphatically do not.
 

mccardey

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Yes, them. The persons who did this -- those who cut off the heads of other human beings with kitchen knives -- the people who do not want to live in peace with anyone with whom they are not in 100%, perfect agreement.

They are definitely in a class of their own.

Pretending that reason will prevail with such is naive. Appeasement doesn't work, neither does sticking one's head in the sand like an ostrich. I see nothing wrong with the pronoun used by Prozyan. Such is certainly both technically and behaviorally accurate in differentiating between those who conduct themselves within the reasonable bounds of human decency, and those who most emphatically do not.

I'm sorry, you're putting words into my mouth that seem to be based on William's misinterpretation of my point. Which was that bombing is going to kill more than the people you want dead.

That's all I'm saying.

I'm not arguing with Prozyan. I'm saying that even bombing is not going to help. The things that might have helped need to have been put into the process a long time ago. Bombing is the sort of thing that creates the space for this evil to grow exponentially.

That's all I'm saying. I don't know what the answer is. I'm not putting an answer out there. I was just adding on to Prozyan's thought.
 

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I don't see this horror ending without serious U.S. military engagement. We went into Iraq eleven years ago on the blatantly false pretext of Saddam Hussein having "weapons of mass destruction." This is part of the fallout, and we will have to deal with it.

caw
 

William Haskins

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A message from Jim's mom, Diane Foley:

We have never been prouder of our son Jim. He gave his life trying to expose the world to the suffering of the Syrian people.

We implore the kidnappers to spare the lives of the remaining hostages. Like Jim, they are innocents. They have no control over American government policy in Iraq, Syria or anywhere in the world.

We thank Jim for all the joy he gave us. He was an extraordinary son, brother, journalist and person. Please respect our privacy in the days ahead as we mourn and cherish Jim.
https://www.facebook.com/FindJamesFoley/posts/492189054249429
 

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I don't see this horror ending without serious U.S. military engagement. We went into Iraq eleven years ago on the blatantly false pretext of Saddam Hussein having "weapons of mass destruction." This is part of the fallout, and we will have to deal with it.

caw
I'm not sure whether this is fallout or something entirely different, but I don't see any way of dealing with it other than boots on the ground unless you don't give a rat's ass about civilian casualties. And that majorly sucks.
 

JimABassPlayer

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Firstly, I don't want you to think my previous post was aimed at you. It wasn't. I was only trying to point out that I did not find Prozyan's use of that specific pronoun to be in any way intentionally derogatory to anyone but the specific persons to whom he was referring. (Naturally, others beat me to it, expressing such in far fewer words, I might add.)

I was making a more specific point, suggesting that bombing them would include collateral damage which would only increase the insecurity and hate and danger. It's a thing that's happened recently in Israel and Gaza, among other places. There should be better tools for dealing with this sort of thing than bombing.

That's where we disagree. We can shower every conceivable treasure of the earth on these people (those who cut off peoples' heads with kitchen knives), as well as remove every single person with whom they disagree from the territories in which they live, and still they will never love us. They will never even tolerate us. They despise the very fact that we exist in disagreement with their view of the perfect world.

As full and complete compliance with their every demand will never change their attitude toward us, how can anything we do in defense of ourselves (and the others whom they are unmercifully butchering) possibly make them hate us anymore?

I don't see how it can. They will always hate us and want to destroy us.
 
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mccardey

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JimABassPlayer

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I don't see this horror ending without serious U.S. military engagement. We went into Iraq eleven years ago on the blatantly false pretext of Saddam Hussein having "weapons of mass destruction." This is part of the fallout, and we will have to deal with it.

caw

I fully agree. As I just posted today in the politics thread, I was against both actions in Iraq. That being said, that was then, this is now. No one can undo what was done yesterday (or even earlier today -- as I just attempted in my previous post :cry:). There is a problem there today which needs to be resolved today.

Sadly, no one seems to have the stones to do what unfortunately needs to be done -- and soon. There is no easy way out of this. In my view, it's better to suffer a little inconvenience now, than a lot more down the road.
 
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mccardey

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That's where we disagree. We can shower every conceivable treasure of the earth on these people (those who cut off peoples' heads with kitchen knives)[/B], as well as remove every single person with whom they disagree from the territories in which they live, and still they will never love us. They will never even tolerate us. They despise the very fact that we exist in disagreement with their view of the perfect world.

As full and complete compliance with their every demand will never change their attitude toward us, how can anything we do in defense of ourselves (and the others whom they are unmercifully butchering) possibly make them hate us anymore?

I don't see how it can. They will always hate us and want to destroy us.

Why on earth would we shower treasure on people who cut off people's heads with kitchen knives? Who's suggesting that?