Feeling Uneasy About My Agent

Toothpaste -

I would totally agree with you except, as described by Undercover, everything from the phone call on seems to undermine that.

If the communication was the biggest issue, it should have been discussed. And the desires/demands outlined here (how often she expects to hear from the agent while on sub, what she expects the agent to do while on sub) seem to emphasize the unrealistic expectations more than the agent's crappy communication style.

I certainly don't disregard the notion that both things are in play. But I sincerely hope, for Undercover's sake, that she's just venting here and comes across very differently in interactions with the agent in question.

Because, in all honesty, if I felt like I was being badgered by someone so angry and with such unrealistic standards, I'd start dodging e-mails and calls, too.

I don't say that to be mean. I say that because it's human nature. I don't want to answer the phone when I think the person on the other end's going to scream at me.

Toothpaste said:

I dunno, I get the impression from Undercover in this thread that the issue isn't the glacial pace of publishing, but when she has questions and emails them to her agent she never hears back. To me Undercover hasn't been complaining that things take time, she's complaining that when she DOES have a question, she's ignored.

To me there is no excuse for that. If the agent is getting tired of Undercover's impatience, she shouldn't be ignoring her, she should email and say, "Okay, look, you gotta take a chill pill." But there is a distinct lack of communication going on here.

Now, I, like others in this thread, am disappointed Undercover didn't discuss the communication concerns over the phone when she had a chance, that's a whole other thing. But I really think the key issue here is a lack of communication - on both sides quite frankly.

So let's not all dog pile Undercover. She's trying to figure this out like the rest of us, and it's really hard to just chill when you are feeling ignored by someone who is meant to be your team mate.

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The thing is, Undercover screwed up. She even admitted to copping out on the conversation. Why? Well having a conversation about one's relationship is a lot more difficult than having one about business. It doesn't mean she'd rather talk about business, it simply means that she was too scared to talk about the relationship. Just because we choose one thing doesn't mean we'd not rather focus on the other.

We make mistakes, hopefully she will try to remedy this one.

I think enough people in this thread have explained the glacial pace thing, and Undercover has come back to thank everyone. Even said she's trying to just chillax though it's hard.

The thing is, then people come along telling her she shouldn't expect to hear back from her agent when she's emailed her, and that's just wrong.

Yes it's important to set realistic expectations, and Undercover's are likely unrealistic as far as the submission process goes. But it doesn't mean she is also wrong about wanting her agent to reply to her.

As Ice Cream so neatly posted: there are two issues going on here. And if one is wrong about one of them, that doesn't necessarily mean one is wrong about the other.

Also any agent who would respond as you have said you would to being inundated by emails from a client with ignoring them is not the kind of agent I would want to work with. The professional thing is to email your client and explain how the business works, how you would prefer not to hear from her everyday etc. After all, authors are new to all this. We don't necessarily know how things work, and if our agent isn't helping us out educating us, then how can they expect us to always do the right thing?

Ignoring a problem never solves it.

*kanyeshrug*

I'm not disagreeing with you. I think the communication issue is a serious one, but I'm concerned that Undercover's most recent posts mean the issues are still getting conflated.

And quite frankly, as long as she stays anxious and angry about expectations not being met, that's going to aggravate things on the communication front.

I really have no vested interest here, but like many others have said: This isn't a one-sided problem.

I think we're all basically saying the same thing.

She's had the agent 3 months, after splitting with her first after 6, and in that time, she's submitted 3 books, the first of which is on submission and the 3rd of which is in the "to read" queue. The agent's had the 3rd book for 3 weeks.

She's said 2 weeks is the longest it's ever taken to hear back from the agent, but when she emailed about a phone call, she got an answer within 24 hours.

These are not unreasonable time frames, so unless the issue directly addressed, the agent has no way to know that her client thinks they are. Undercover's apparently a fast writer, so she's turning in novels faster than her agent can evaluate or sell them because they're all in the same/similar genre and can't go out at the same time without competing with one another. She's also nervous because of a bad experience with the agent that she had prior to this one.

Yes, it's hard to wait for feedback on new material, but it takes time. My agent tweeted a few days ago that of 150+ submissions she'd read, she requested more than 10%. Those are full requests. Without knowing who Undercover's agent is, I can't say if her work load is similar, higher or lighter, but 15-16 full requests takes a long time to read. She's also got my MS to read, several other clients' work, and who knows what else. All of that is just the reading of pages, no contract stuff. No speaking to editors. No setting up auctions.

Undercover said:

Well she/he can pitch it to other places while these months goes by, or think of a new strategy to make a sale happen. I don't think an agent should wait indefinitely to hear back. Some editors never respond back. I think in those cases the agent should persue other publishers.

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There are legitimate reasons (already listed) as to why an agent might not want to submit to more editors at one time. I also think it's very rare that editors don't get back ever. Yes, for an author they might not reply, but most agents will receive a reply from editors they submit to. I've heard of some cases in which it can take many months, but that's no different than waiting six or eight months to hear back from an agent on a full manuscript.

I'm not trying to sound rude when I say this, but you aren't an agent. While you might have been the type to throw out extra queries when you weren't hearing back (so was I, for what it's worth), that may not be the best strategy for submitting to editors. Some agents might do that, but not everyone does.

You still don't know the reasons because you didn't ask the questions concerning this initially, but she could very well have good reasons for waiting. I still think you should just ask her to explain her logic behind the submission process. Right now, it sounds like you're presuming to know better than your agent, but she's the one who does this professionally, and if she's a good agent with good sales to back up her experience, she's the one I'd go with in terms of expertise.

At the very least, until you understand her reasoning you shouldn't complain about this, IMO. You have an idea of how you think things should be done (which honestly sounds like it's more the result of impatience than anything else), but unless you've heard her logic and you have a valid reason to disagree, how can you really be pissed at her about this? You're making assumptions and getting angry based on assumptions rather than facts. I'm sure getting burned in the past doesn't help.

Now, you might have a legitimately non-communicative agent when you are someone who needs to have someone more hands on, and that can be a problem, but again, you've done nothing to solve this and your agent may not even be aware of the issue. And honestly, in my opinion, it's not fair to be upset about something like this when you haven't done what you can to fix it.

In this case, the answer is simple: you explain that you would like a little more in the way of information, that it might be beneficial for you to have specific times arranged for updates, and that it concerns you that your messages go unanswered (while obviously not contacting her every day). You ask how she decides to do submissions and tell her that you don't quite understand the process and would like to. You do all of this in a non-confrontational manner.

If her answer is that this is just how she is and if you aren't happy deal with it, obviously that's good reason to move on to someone else with the next book. If you aren't satisfied with her explanations for submissions and still feel mistreated, you can move on.

However, most likely you'll be able to find a compromise that will make you both happy. Maybe she'll agree to answer emails within 48 hours, or to update you every two months whether there is news or not. The problem here is that this is a relationship, and the only way for two parties in any relationship to both be satisfied is for there to be communication, and to be honest, I feel like you have not communicated your problems or needs in a way that is fair to her, either.

Undercover, something hasn't been sitting right with me as this thread progressed, so I went back through and found another thread you started. One comment you made there is quite worrying.

Undercover said:

I have another question. Out of the three novels I have now, she was sold on the second one. She told me it needed to be formatted better and that it had some minor editing issues that she'd help me with. It didn't take long for her to want to pitch it. She started after about a month of us being together. But I never saw the clean copy of my ms. We just started talking about where it would go and that was it. Then she told me on the places she sent it to, so I assume she did the formatting and cleaned up the script on her own.

She said she is going to help me on the third one, but I'm not sure if she just means to do the same as before, just clean it up and format it. That's if she likes it. I don't know, should I be concerned with this?

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This IS NOT NORMAL for editing. YOU do the edits, not someone else. If she's sending out something you haven't even seen the final draft of, you have no idea how many changes, if any, were made, or what the final content of the MS is. This IS NOT NORMAL. This is a huge flapping RED FLAG.

And this:

Undercover said:

Hey, yeah...she finally got back to me. She was busy working on another project. I think she is with AAR, but I am not sure. I asked her about the changes and she just formatted it and fixed the typos, that's it.

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doesn't excuse it. If her "typo-fix" involved running spell check, that can introduce new errors to a MS, if you have anything Word doesn't recognize as "normal" spelling -- including character names. We see it all the time here with presses that claim to edit, but only run spell and grammar check. If I ran them on my MS right now, it would be a wreck because of some of the names. (One example would be a child calling a character "M'winna" for Marina, which Word could change to "Minnow" if I let it.)

I seriously doubt any AAR member would take it upon herself to introduce changes to a manuscript without the okay of the author.

Undercover said:

Not necessarily. If you don't have a right author/agent match up, it can be a nightmare. Having an agent doesn't mean all peaches and cream afterwards either. There's a chance your agent might never sell your manuscript too. It's not once you reach the agent goal, it's all grand and everything. Not at all. It's just passing another hurdle during a track race.

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I need a *facetious* smiley. It can of course have its ups and downs, and you DO need a good fit. And even after all of that she might not sell the ms. It happens.

And I get it. I do. You want a certain level of communication, the agent hasn't been giving it to you.

Wait, was that MY comment about months and months waiting to hear back? I have to go back and look. I was referring to months and months of waiting from an editor, not an agent. Personally I'm good with every two months if nothing's happening - obviously more if something IS happening. Sorry if that started the next go-round.

When you signed with this agent, what did she agree to do? Did she agree to give you progress reports and how often? Did she mention strategies? Etc. If you have went over this, she mentioned a plan to you, and she is not following it, I would contact her and ask her why concerning the deviation.

If none of this was talked about before you signed, then you can still play some catchup. Ask for information on her strategies and ask her when she'd be able to give you progress reports--that is, on what kind of schedule. Also bring up your concerns.

But do so as politely as you can. Don't demand, "Why aren't you doing this?" That will put her on the defensive. Instead state it is a concern you have and you'd like to speak with her about it.

Hopefully that helps,

Jodi

Cyia said:

But if there's no news, then what's she going to do? Email you "nothing yet" every week?

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I'd love it if I were kept informed like that. No small talk needed, pure info, those two words are enough. I'd feel like I'm keeping a finger on the pulse, not just floating around waiting for stuff to happen.

But I guess it's just a matter of both personality and experience. I used to deal with a kind of consulting business where not having an update every couple days would make everyone run around in circles screaming omg wtf what's going on it's been 24 hours no email he must be dead!

Publishing is so slow, I doubt I'll ever get used to it completely. I can understand not dealing quickly with queries, because they take the back seat, but if my own agent was taking months to get back to me on something... I dunno I'd just feel like drowning in molasses and talking to a blank wall at the same time.

Windcutter said:

I'd love it if I were kept informed like that. No small talk needed, pure info, those two words are enough. I'd feel like I'm keeping a finger on the pulse, not just floating around waiting for stuff to happen.

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I completely agree. I know this topic is old and has run its course, so I'm not commenting on the OP's specific situation, and I can't since I'm not published nor agented. But, this is one thing I'll remember to ask about if I ever get offered rep by an agent. Personally, I'd want an update every now and then, even if it's a "still waiting" type of response. Anything to let me know that I haven't been forgotten or fallen though the cracks. this is my preferred communication style and I'd need an agent who doesn't mind updating me every two months to let me know if anythings happening, even if nothing is happening. I'm not keen on the 'no communication means nothing is happening' type of (non)response. That's my preference as a writer and I want an agent who's okay with that.

Good topic, btw, Undercover.

I, too, would've loved it if my agent had shot me an e-mail, oh, say, once every 8-10 weeks to tell me she hadn't heard from so-and-so yet, but it was still out at such-and-such and she planned to noodge...

She didn't. That's only part of the reason she's now my ex-agent. Since then I've sold the three book series she claimed was unsellable. She refused to sub to small presses, and that's where I sold it.

I found I didn't agree with her stance that a MS is better off sitting, doing nothing, on your disc drive than going to a smaller house. We parted ways quite amicably. I'm 110% sure that for the right author, who writes the right things in our niche market, she's effective as all get out.

For me, not so much.

Undercover. Sounds like the best decision. Best wishes in finding a new agent, one who will communicate better!

Undercover said:

Just an update. I have parted ways with this particular agent I was talking about in this thread being that was one big reason. The poor communication was too stressful for me and no one deserves to be treated like that, especially if you're a client.

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Sorry to hear things didn't work out, but I hope you find a good match soon!

I'm sorry to hear that, Undercover. I do hope you find an agent who will be a better fit for you soon.

Sorry to hear about that, but I think you made the right choice. I wouldn't have been happy with such a low level of communication, and while others might be, as individuals we need to work in an environment that suits us and with people we feel understand our professional needs.

Onwards and upwards!

Well, I only read the first few comments, so what I'm saying has more than likely already been said.

If you've never been published, I doubt you'll have 3-4 books come out at once, or even close together. They want to make sure you sell. I remember hearing Dead Koontz say that he was writing so many books that his editors had him start writing under a pen name, because people might think that if he's churning these books out they may not have much substance.

Undercover, it sounds like you followed your intuition on this.

Sounds like you made a good decision.

In case you haven't already thought of this, it's important to get a list of the editors she submitted to and pass that on to any agent who makes an offer.

Good luck!

I came here to suggest BethS above me's comments...but she beat me to it. ^ What she said. Good luck, Undercover!

Since then I've sold the three book series she claimed was unsellable. She refused to sub to small presses, and that's where I sold it.

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Deb, I hope you don't mind my asking, but did you place these yourself, or did you get a new agent?