How to Identify Passive Voice - picture

guttersquid · Nov 3, 2014

I can understand why passive sentences can be confusing for some people. They are taught the whole "was" and "by" thing, and just when they're getting a handle on it, they encounter a sentence like:

Joe was tired by noon.

Goodness gracious, that's the same structure as "The ball was thrown by Joe," which is passive. So "Joe was tired by noon" should be passive too, right?

Uh no . . .

Ken · Nov 3, 2014

With all due respect, Bufty, you need to quit telling people what they can post. You're not a mod in charge here. So knock it off. You're discouraging participation and stymying discussion in this forum.

You've got a lot to offer in way of knowledge. Focus on that instead.

evilrooster · Nov 3, 2014

With all due respect, Ken, you are not a mod here either.

I am.

I don't see Bufty telling people what they can post. I think that "humph" was an...infelicitous description, but I also think that escalating from that moment was (and continues to be) wildly inappropriate. There are a number of people in this thread who, while their comments have not been deleted, have failed to impress me with their constructive spirit in the conversation.

There is a "report post" button. I expect people here to use that if they feel that a comment is problematic rather than bickering at one another on-thread.

blacbird · Nov 3, 2014

guttersquid said:
I can understand why passive sentences can be confusing for some people. They are taught the whole "was" and "by" thing, and just when they're getting a handle on it, they encounter a sentence like:

Joe was tired by noon.

Goodness gracious, that's the same structure as "The ball was thrown by Joe," which is passive. So "Joe was tired by noon" should be passive too, right?

Uh no . . .

It's really not that confusing. "Object" was done to "by subject" is by far the most common form of passive construction. In your second example, "noon" is neither object nor subject.

I think most people are misled by having, somewhere, been given the erroneous information that "to be" verb forms are inherently passive. At least that's what crops up here in every "what is passive voice" thread I've ever seen.

Any decent grammar/style guide will explain this matter clearly, usually with good examples. It really isn't as abstruse as cosmological physics.

caw

Ken · Nov 3, 2014

evilrooster said:
bickering

A PM probably would've been a better way to go, in retrospect, now that you've put things in perspective. Apologies.

guttersquid · Nov 3, 2014

blacbird said:
It's really not that confusing. "Object" was done to "by subject" is by far the most common form of passive construction. In your second example, "noon" is neither object nor subject.

Yes, James. My intention was to show that the noun-was-verbed-by-noun combination doesn't always signify a passive sentence, and applying that as a test can sometimes fail, which muddies the waters for people trying to figure it all out.

Ain't language fun?

blacbird · Nov 3, 2014

guttersquid said:
Yes, James. My intention was to show that the noun-was-verbed-by-noun combination doesn't always signify a passive sentence, and applying that as a test can sometimes fail, which muddies the waters for people trying to figure it all out.

Okay. But my name isn't James.

caw

guttersquid · Nov 3, 2014

blacbird said:
Okay. But my name isn't James.

caw

Scrolls up, sees his mistake, and says, "Oops."

blacbird · Nov 3, 2014

guttersquid said:
Scrolls up, sees his mistake, and says, "Oops."

For a look at your work, I'll tell you what my name is, but your gotta promise not to tell it to anyone else. Okay?

caw

Susan Anwin · Jan 15, 2015

not sure where to put a question about a passive sentence, so im giving it a go in this thread;
this sentence "His attention was engaged..." is it correct this way? or what do you use? 'taken?' His attention was taken? grabbed? what?
thanks for any replies

King Neptune · Jan 15, 2015

Susan Anwin said:
not sure where to put a question about a passive sentence, so im giving it a go in this thread;
this sentence "His attention was engaged..." is it correct this way? or what do you use? 'taken?' His attention was taken? grabbed? what?
thanks for any replies

That sentence is correct as written.

You probably should have started a new thread.

Bufty · Jan 15, 2015

Any of these word choices could work in a sentence beginning that way.

I'm not really sure what the issue is.

Susan Anwin said:
not sure where to put a question about a passive sentence, so im giving it a go in this thread;
this sentence "His attention was engaged..." is it correct this way? or what do you use? 'taken?' His attention was taken? grabbed? what?
thanks for any replies

TessB · Jan 15, 2015

I've taught in the past and used the 'by zombies' trick for my freshmen to great effect. No, it's not foolproof, and yes, it's a silly gimmick, but it does one thing better than any specific and in-depth grammatical review will do: it gets a laugh in the classroom, it wakes them up to the lesson, and reminds them that passive voice is a thing to watch out for.

They may not remember all the details of transitive verbs when they sit down at the exam, but if even half of them have a moment of "right - zombies!" and it triggers a correct answer / sentence rewrite, it's worth it.

tl;dr: sometimes gimmicks are useful as mnemonics, even if they're not perfect.

Spy_on_the_Inside · Jan 15, 2015

I learned an amazing trick for seeing if a sentence is written in passive voice. At the end of the sentence, add "by zombies". If the sentences makes grammatical sense, then it's written in passive voice.

Bufty · Jan 16, 2015

Go directly to post #1 - Do not pass Go - Do not collect $200. :snoopy:

I learned an amazing trick for seeing if a sentence is written in passive voice. At the end of the sentence, add "by zombies". If the sentences makes grammatical sense, then it's written in passive voice.

Chase · Jan 16, 2015

Bufty said:
Go directly to post #1 - Do not pass Go - Do not collect $200.

Methinks those zombies post among us. :popcorn:

Ravioli · Jan 16, 2015

So you can't have the same narration containing "He walked to the corner store and saw the most beautiful lump of pork" as well as "He had been drawn there by the powerful scent of bacon and was transported back to his childhood when his dad used to spank him so hard his ass smelled like fried pig" ?

Bufty · Jan 16, 2015

Of course you can.

If a deliberately constructed sentence says what you wish it to say - use it.

NaeimGiladisLegacy said:
So you can't have the same narration containing "He walked to the corner store and saw the most beautiful lump of pork" as well as "He had been drawn there by the powerful scent of bacon and was transported back to his childhood when his dad used to spank him so hard his ass smelled like fried pig" ?

How to Identify Passive Voice - picture

guttersquid

I agree with Roxxsmom.

Ken

evilrooster

Wicked chicken

blacbird

Ken

guttersquid

I agree with Roxxsmom.

blacbird

guttersquid

I agree with Roxxsmom.

blacbird

Susan Anwin

deep blue electric angel

King Neptune

Bufty

Where have the last ten years gone?

TessB

The Boxing Baroness

Spy_on_the_Inside

Bufty

Where have the last ten years gone?

Chase

It Takes All of Us to End Racism

Ravioli

Crazy Cat Lady

Bufty

Where have the last ten years gone?