The 2015 Hugo & Other SFF Awards Eligible Works Thread

Filigree · Apr 23, 2015

I agree as well. There have been several blogs I've earmarked as even-tempered guides through this debacle, and his is one of the best.

With a couple of weeks to think about it, I've come to two conclusions.

This may be the Best Thing Ever to happen to the Hugos - it at least shakes things up and gives them wider and more sympathetic exposure.

Re: VD & Co's dominionist bent. Exposure is not always the best form of advertising, which Correia and Torgersen must surely be learning right now. From its POV, a cancer cell might think it is pure and good, worthy of spreading through its entire environment and pushing aside all challengers. That can be rather fatal to said environment, which is why we tend to think of cancer cells as dangerous interlopers that must be halted and destroyed.

I think that the larger social environment will evolve more-or-less benign ways of tempering that ideological cancer. But vigilance and early detection is the key; in many ways, it's good that VD took over this party as loudly as he did. We can see him and his friends in the brightest daylight, not hiding in diplomatic shadows.

Alessandra Kelley · Apr 24, 2015

A funny and insightful comment by Laura Resnick on Melinda Snodgrass' post, "Puppies! -- My Two Cents." (The comment was quoted on Mike Glyer's terrific "File 770" news site.)

Actually, I have decided I am totally on board with 100% RELIABLE & COMPREHENSIVE PACKAGING as a standard for book covers. I think this is a great idea!

Yes! I advocate packaging of books to warn me that the female characters in a novel are all coat-holding carboard cutouts and the male characters address them as “cupcake” and “baby doll” and “cutie.” Packaging that would warn me that the writing is so convoluted and pretentious, or so clumsy and tepid, one can only wonder at what the English language ever did to make the author hate it so much. Packaging that would alert me that the characters are all stereotypically tedious action heroes who shoot everything in sight and make “clever” puns after killing someone. Packaging could warn me that every black character in the book is a servant, every Hispanic person a criminal, every woman a sex object, and every atheist an Evil Marxist Villain.

This would be a GREAT system, and I fully support it!

(This reminds me of some of the classic old MAD Magazine "Truth In Advertising" satires and warning labels.)

Alessandra Kelley · Apr 24, 2015

Ooh, and in that same post's comments Melinda Snodgrass quotes a short essay by Heinlein himself speaking disdainfully of certain critics of his work:

He will permit any speculation at all — as long as it is about gadgets only and doesn’t touch people.He doesn’t care what mayhem you commit on physics, astronomy, or chemistry with your gadgets… but the people must be the same plain old wonderful jerks that live in his Home Town. Give him a good ole adventure story any time, with lots of Gee-Whiz in it and space ships blasting off and maybe the Good Guys (in white space ships) chasing the Bad Guys (in black space ships) but, brother, don’t you say anything about the Methodist Church, or the Flag, or incest, or homosexuality, or teleology, or theology, or the sacredness of marriage, or anything philosophical! Because you are just an entertainer, see? That sort of Heavy Thinking is reserved for C. P. Snow or Graham Greene. You are a pulp writer, Bud, and you will always be a pulp writer even though your trivia is now bound in boards and sells for just as much as Grace Metalious’ stories… and you are not permitted to have Heavy Thoughts. Space Ships and Heavy Thinking do not mix — so shut up and sit down!

The rule is: Science Fiction by its nature must be trivial.
This of course rules out… a large fraction of my work — and all my future work, I think.

CrastersBabies · Apr 24, 2015

I'm cool if Heinlein wanted to write that way. I think every writer has to make that choice (for the "Captain Obvious" response here).

But other "classic" storytellers also addressed race and differences and politics. Bradbury, for example, was one of them. Some of his short stories were pretty dang powerful and had some interesting subtext.

So, these guys hemming and hawing over "classic/traditional science fiction and fantasy" simply don't strike a chord in me. Comic books could be considered "fancy free" and pulpy, but that doesn't in any way diminish the darker/grittier pieces that might have come later.

The genre does go through transformation at times. As stated in SFF threads about grimdark and dark trends, I feel the pendulum swings back and forth on this stuff.

For me, the problem is when the pendulum goes the other way (that you don't like), I'm not sure I agree that holding the Hugo Awards hostage is the way to go about communicating that disappointment.

Amadan · Apr 24, 2015

CrastersBabies said:
I'm cool if Heinlein wanted to write that way. I think every writer has to make that choice (for the "Captain Obvious" response here).

But other "classic" storytellers did address race and differences and politics. Bradbury, for example, was one of them. Some of his short stories were pretty dang powerful and had some interesting subtext.

Er, I think you missed Heinlein's point. He also addressed race and differences and politics, and was complaining that he was criticized by fans and other writers because science fiction was supposed to be about rocket ships and aliens.

CrastersBabies · Apr 24, 2015

No, I got it, I just did a poor job at making it clear. LOL.

eyeblink · Apr 25, 2015

A long discussion on the Hugosplosion on the Hugo-nominated podcast Galactic Suburbia. The Hugo discussion starts about twenty-eight minutes in and lasts just under an hour.

RedRajah · Apr 27, 2015

http://aletheakontis.com/2015/04/in-which-edmund-schubert-withdraws-from-the-hugos/

Dmbeucler · Apr 27, 2015

Althea's site is having issues due to volume (Scalzi tweeted a link and crashed it), so with permission he copied the post here: http://whatever.scalzi.com/2015/04/27/in-which-edmund-schubert-withdraws-from-the-hugos/

Alessandra Kelley · Apr 27, 2015

Dmbeucler said:
Althea's site is having issues due to volume (Scalzi tweeted a link and crashed it), so with permission he copied the post here: http://whatever.scalzi.com/2015/04/27/in-which-edmund-schubert-withdraws-from-the-hugos/

That was very well said.

Filigree · Apr 27, 2015

That was very well said. I've been one of the authors who shied from IGMS because of Card's politics. I'll give the magazine another look.

ULTRAGOTHA · Apr 27, 2015

http://sasquan.org/hugo-awards/voting/

Online Hugo ballot is live.

zanzjan · Apr 27, 2015

ULTRAGOTHA said:
Online Hugo ballot is live.

Yeah, just heard that. Interesting that there's been no tweets, emails, or anything announcing it... Nor has there been info about the Hugo packets.

Roxxsmom · Apr 27, 2015

Filigree said:
That was very well said. I've been of the authors who shied from IGMS because of Card's politics. I'll give the magazine another look.

It is indeed a nice post. And yes, I've always assumed that even if the magazine wasn't about favoring stories with right wing themes, they probably weren't going to be the best place to submit stories that have sympathetic LGBT characters or strongly non-traditional takes on gender either.

Nice to know that this isn't true, but that this misconception is common also indicates something about name association and branding.

zanzjan said:
Yeah, just heard that. Interesting that there's been no tweets, emails, or anything announcing it... Nor has there been info about the Hugo packets.

I got an email from Sasquan about the voting for the 2017 Worldcon site selection today, but nothing about Hugo ballots or packets yet. They never even sent me my pin when I registered, though I was able to get it sent by using the pin lookup feature on their site.

zanzjan · Apr 28, 2015

Anyone figured out how to get the reading packet? I didn't see an obvious download, and at work so can't spend forever looking.

ULTRAGOTHA · Apr 28, 2015

I doubt the reading packet is available yet.

We have The Goblin Emperor checked out from the library now, with Ancillary Sword and The Three Body Problem on reserve. (I had previously read TGE and AS, my wife hasn't (I don't think our Novel nominations had a single book in common!) neither of us has read TBP.)

Most of the short fiction is on line already. You can google it.

There are also some reviews of it popping up.

zanzjan · Apr 28, 2015

Yeah, I just have dialup internet at home, so it's easier to download the packet while at work and then take it home on a USB stick to read at my leisure.

I have TBP and AS already, GE is apparently on deep backorder on Amazon.

Filigree · Apr 28, 2015

I've been reading library versions on my tablet, when I can.

Alessandra Kelley · Apr 28, 2015

A good general overview article on the situation on Vox.com*:

http://www.vox.com/2015/4/26/8495415/hugos-sad-puppies-controversy

*Absolutely nothing to do with Vox Day.

_Sian_ · Apr 28, 2015

Is it stupid of me to think that the Sad Puppies, regardless of good intentions etc, probable shouldn't have associated themselves with VD and co? I mean, how does anyone ever look at that, and go "this will portray me and my cause in a good light"

I just don't understand how they thought it was a good idea. I understand how they could have thought their own slate a good idea, especially if they were under the conception that others were doing the same with other slates (just like to point out that I don't think that was happening, but I can see the connections made).

But who looks at VD and his "lets burn everything to the ground" and thinks that it's a good idea?

RedWombat · Apr 28, 2015

_Sian_ said:
But who looks at VD and his "lets burn everything to the ground" and thinks that it's a good idea?

The enemy of my enemy is my friend, according to some. (As some clever soul said, "the enemy of my enemy is the enemy of my enemy, nothing more," but not everyone holds to that.)

If you think John Scalzi is All That Is Wrong With Modern SF, it may be easier to see VD as a lovable contrarian who just really loves to play the devil's advocate, and to assume that those claiming to be offended by him are just claiming it for the sweet social justice points.

I think the internet's pretty good at creating echo chambers. Perhaps the various Sad Puppy organizers did not realize that distaste for VD was so widely spread, because their readers didn't express that to them. And some of them apparently knew VD personally, and there's a tendency to dismiss the internet personas of those we know as unreal--look at all the people saying "I love Adam Baldwin, he's just an ass on Twitter, but he's really a good guy!"*

Those are my guesses, anyway, which are pretty much worth what you're paying for them.

*I recently had to explain to a very nice man on Twitter that I felt unsafe if he tagged us both in on the same conversation, and he was very understanding about it, but I've seen this more than once. And to be absolutely fair, I've got at least one friend who is a stand-up guy who has helped me move and who should Never Ever Ever be allowed to talk on the internet, ever, so it may be hypocritical of me to judge.

jchines · Apr 28, 2015

RedWombat said:
As some clever soul said, "the enemy of my enemy is the enemy of my enemy, nothing more," but not everyone holds to that.

Howard Tayler, I believe? Wasn't that one of the maxims from Schlock Mercenary?

zanzjan · Apr 28, 2015

I think so, yeah? Or at least I've heard it attributed to him before.

Roxxsmom · Apr 28, 2015

RedWombat said:
I think the internet's pretty good at creating echo chambers. Perhaps the various Sad Puppy organizers did not realize that distaste for VD was so widely spread, because their readers didn't express that to them. And some of them apparently knew VD personally, and there's a tendency to dismiss the internet personas of those we know as unreal--look at all the people saying "I love Adam Baldwin, he's just an ass on Twitter, but he's really a good guy!"*

Those are my guesses, anyway, which are pretty much worth what you're paying for them.

I found myself nodding as I read your post, which may prove your point, actually

But seriously, I think what you say makes sense. And I've got a couple of relatives I am pretty sure spend a lot of time on Reddit reading and posting what is, at best bile, and at worst hate. They're nice enough people (even to woman, LGBT people, PoC and Jews) as long as the subject of politics or anything related to what is sometimes called social justice doesn't come up. And it's not even about agreeing or not, it's about how they go about doing it. But I wouldn't be super surprised to find out that one or both were MRAs, gamergaters, or SPs, even VD fans (if they were into heavily gaming or SF/F).

I remember reading a really sad account by a guy who was being harassed, stalked and threatened by someone in internet chat rooms and twitter, and how it escalated to threatening materials being left on his porch (it was anti-Semitic in nature). It turned out that the culprit was the 16 year old son of a family friend. Can't find the link now, darn it, but the internet does enable real Jekyll and Hyde personalities to develop sometimes.

RedWombat · Apr 28, 2015

I tracked it down, and yes! That's one of the maxims.

Howard Tayler, for the record, is a stand-up guy.

The 2015 Hugo & Other SFF Awards Eligible Works Thread

Mildly Disturbing

Sophipygian

Sophipygian

Burninator!

Burninator!

Barbara says hi

Special Snowflake? No. Hailstone

Sophipygian

Mildly Disturbing

Merovingian Superhero

killin' all teh werds

Beastly Fido

killin' all teh werds

Merovingian Superhero

killin' all teh werds

Mildly Disturbing

Sophipygian

Ooooh, pretty lights and sirens :D

Runs With Scissors

Got the hang of it, here

killin' all teh werds

Beastly Fido

Runs With Scissors