Math, Guns, and Snark: SLHuang's Self-Publishing Thread

usuallycountingbats

Procrastinating on the net.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 5, 2013
Messages
732
Reaction score
168
Location
UK
Thanks for the update and for *finally* checking your sales!!

Huge well done - to break even on a SP mathS thriller as a debut novel has to be considered a success I think? I'm not surprised you have interest from a trade publisher.

Are you looking for an agent/do you have an agent alongside that trade interest?

I have no ebook reader, so I'll continue to wait for the paperback.

Really Donkey? What is wrong with you? *shakes head sadly* You know they give away e-reader apps for free, right?
 

LAgrunion

not to be taken seriously
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
Messages
1,114
Reaction score
354
Location
Los Angeles
Really Donkey? What is wrong with you? *shakes head sadly* You know they give away e-reader apps for free, right?

Heh heh … Yeah, I know ... I have the Kindle app for the PC, but I really hate computer screens, especially reading words on them. Very fatiguing. When I beta MSs, I always print them out.

I'll probably end up buying a Kindle Paperwhite one day, though, since its e ink technology closely mimics texts on paper. People say it’s almost as good. I wish they would make an e ink display for PCs so I could write on it. I have a nice 23" LED now, but after a couple of hours my eyes feel like the hippo sat on them the whole time. But I don't think there's much of a market for a grayscale monitor optimized for text.

I'm probably more sensitive than most re readability as I have horrible eyes (-12 myopia plus astigmatism). *sighs*

And I'm a durty old man; I just like to grope physical books. Also, I figured if I hold out for the paperback, Lisa can sign it and maybe doodle something nasty in color pensils. If I hold out long enough, maybe I can get the platinum box set of the entire series that comes with a "making-of" blu-ray, a t-shirt with Lisa’s mug, a Cas action figure, and whatnot. ;)
 

J. Tanner

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 10, 2011
Messages
1,245
Reaction score
99
Location
San Francisco bay area
Website
authorjtanner.wordpress.com
--Typesetting? I don't know anything about publishing a hard copy, as my knowledge about self-pub in general is pretty minimal. I assumed that it was pretty turnkey, like you just upload your MS and the vendor just prints it. I don't even really know what typesetting entails, really. Is typesetting expensive?

Typesetting is a detail-oriented skill with some artistic elements as well. It's not even close to the "follow these steps" concepts that you can get by with formatting a self-pub ebook. No idea about the cost for an experienced typesetter though.
 

Polenth

Mushroom
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 27, 2007
Messages
5,017
Reaction score
735
Location
England
Website
www.polenthblake.com
--Typesetting? I don't know anything about publishing a hard copy, as my knowledge about self-pub in general is pretty minimal. I assumed that it was pretty turnkey, like you just upload your MS and the vendor just prints it. I don't even really know what typesetting entails, really. Is typesetting expensive?

When you get to the point of having a book file, you do just give them the file and they print it. Typesetting is about getting the file together in the first place. It's more complicated than ebook formatting, as with ebooks you purposefully don't set a lot of things. You let the person's ereader decide where page breaks go, what font to use and so on. With a physical book, this is all set, so you have to make sure page breaks are in sensible places, chapters start on the right page, and everything else that goes into making it look nice on the page. How it looks in your file is how it will be printed.
 

Mutive

Blissfully Clueless
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 8, 2011
Messages
5,287
Reaction score
3,269
Location
Seattle, WA
I love this response! Also, I am eagerly awaiting books 2-whatever.

Also, so jealous on the Comic Con thing. :( Oh well. Someday...maybe...
 

Mclesh

It's too hot
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 18, 2010
Messages
4,526
Reaction score
1,804
Location
Southern California
Website
www.storyrhyme.com
Great post! The joys of being a self-publisher; right? I couldn't agree more about the social media/socializing aspect. I completely tune out the marketing posts, but interact with me as a human being, and you just might interest me in your book. Funny how that works, huh?

Have a blast at Comic Con! :)
 

slhuang

Inappropriately math-oriented.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 11, 2012
Messages
2,906
Reaction score
1,140
Website
www.slhuang.com
Thanks for all the lovely words and enthusiasm! :D

--Typesetting? I don't know anything about publishing a hard copy, as my knowledge about self-pub in general is pretty minimal. I assumed that it was pretty turnkey, like you just upload your MS and the vendor just prints it. I don't even really know what typesetting entails, really. Is typesetting expensive?

I'll just point to what J. Tanner and Polenth said. ;) There's quite a lot to typesetting, and personally I'm one of those people who gets very annoyed by bad typesetting, so I wouldn't be able to bear putting out a poorly typeset book!

--Have you played or will you play around with the retail price and see how that affects sales?
I haven't yet. I probably should. Though that would mean I would need to pay attention to my sales . . . heh.

It's on my list to try eventually. Changing the price across all sales channels is a bit of a pain, so I've been spending my effort/attention other places for the moment, but it's something I do feel I should experiment with at some point.

Are you looking for an agent/do you have an agent alongside that trade interest?

I have not queried agents yet -- I figured I should wait on either a substantive offer or enough sales to justify it. I *have* done preliminary investigation on what agents might be a good fit just in case I find myself needing to query quickly.

And I'm a durty old man; I just like to grope physical books.

I confess I'm the same! I don't think I've ever bought an ebook when the paper one was available. Maybe once. I much prefer reading on paper! (Also, I have, er, philosophical issues with paying for a license rather than for ownership . . . but that's a whole 'nother thang. ;))

Also, I figured if I hold out for the paperback, Lisa can sign it and maybe doodle something nasty in color pensils. If I hold out long enough, maybe I can get the platinum box set of the entire series that comes with a "making-of" blu-ray, a t-shirt with Lisa’s mug, a Cas action figure, and whatnot. ;)
Anything for you, Donkey. :D

I love this response! Also, I am eagerly awaiting books 2-whatever.

Aww, thanks, Mutive!!

Also, so jealous on the Comic Con thing. :( Oh well. Someday...maybe...
I should have researched ways to promote my book here . . . heh.

Great post! The joys of being a self-publisher; right? I couldn't agree more about the social media/socializing aspect. I completely tune out the marketing posts, but interact with me as a human being, and you just might interest me in your book. Funny how that works, huh?

WHO WOULDA THUNK. :D

Have a blast at Comic Con! :)
Thanks!!

Thanks for the update. I love reading these kinds of posts and learning from what is working or not working for other SP'ers.

Congrats on your success so far!

Thank you so much!! :D
 

Old Hack

Such a nasty woman
Super Moderator
Absolute Sage
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 12, 2005
Messages
22,454
Reaction score
4,956
Location
In chaos
There are several discussions in which typesetting has been discussed, which might be of interest: look out for posts by Medievalist, who has some experience in this area.
 

slhuang

Inappropriately math-oriented.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 11, 2012
Messages
2,906
Reaction score
1,140
Website
www.slhuang.com
Quick note in case I forget later -- I just got an opportunity for my book that (AFAICT) requires it to have an ISBN.

More on this later once it goes through, but I just wanted to stick this here in my thread in case I forget this point later. I remember that as a self-publisher I wasn't sure if I should purchase ISBNs, and the general (excellent) advice of people here was that it isn't necessary but that not having one might preclude future opportunities, and it's no easy thing to attach an ISBN to a book after the fact (I definitely wouldn't want to unpublish/republish and lose all my reviews). Now I'm finding that wonderful AW wisdom to be absolutely correct. :)

tl;dr: I decided it was important to me to attach ISBNs and I'm very glad I did. Even if I didn't want to take advantage of this particular opportunity (and I do), I'm guessing this isn't the only thing that might require one, so having ISBNs is keeping more options open to me in general.
 

K.B. Parker

I've lost my mind
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 7, 2013
Messages
612
Reaction score
62
Quick note in case I forget later -- I just got an opportunity for my book that (AFAICT) requires it to have an ISBN.

More on this later once it goes through, but I just wanted to stick this here in my thread in case I forget this point later. I remember that as a self-publisher I wasn't sure if I should purchase ISBNs, and the general (excellent) advice of people here was that it isn't necessary but that not having one might preclude future opportunities, and it's no easy thing to attach an ISBN to a book after the fact (I definitely wouldn't want to unpublish/republish and lose all my reviews). Now I'm finding that wonderful AW wisdom to be absolutely correct. :)

tl;dr: I decided it was important to me to attach ISBNs and I'm very glad I did. Even if I didn't want to take advantage of this particular opportunity (and I do), I'm guessing this isn't the only thing that might require one, so having ISBNs is keeping more options open to me in general.

You definitely made the right decision, purchasing your own ISBN'S. But you don't have to lose your reviews when you switch ISBN's. It's not the easiest procedure in the world, but it's also not difficult.
 

RevanWright

inconveniently drunk
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 5, 2012
Messages
332
Reaction score
21
Location
Fort Worth, TX
Website
www.andreatheend.com
tl;dr: I decided it was important to me to attach ISBNs and I'm very glad I did. Even if I didn't want to take advantage of this particular opportunity (and I do), I'm guessing this isn't the only thing that might require one, so having ISBNs is keeping more options open to me in general.

Exactly! Well done and congrats, by the way. Following your thread with interest.
 

Mutive

Blissfully Clueless
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 8, 2011
Messages
5,287
Reaction score
3,269
Location
Seattle, WA
Oooh, grats on the offer! I will eagerly await more details. :)
 

Captcha

Banned
Joined
Jan 27, 2010
Messages
4,456
Reaction score
637
I've been taking a bit of an AW vacation, so I missed a lot of this, but it's very exciting to go back and read about your adventure! Thanks for sharing it.

And I just picked up a copy of the book, so now I'm all set for reading this weekend.

What a useful thread!
 

JennTX

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 26, 2012
Messages
109
Reaction score
8
I just wanted to stop in and say that I have been hearing a lot of buzz about this book. I'm pretty active on Goodreads and Booklikes, and it's been recommended by several people, some of whom don't normally read in your genre. So, that is huge!

Good job and congratulations! I purchased the book last night, because so many people were raving about it.
 

slhuang

Inappropriately math-oriented.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 11, 2012
Messages
2,906
Reaction score
1,140
Website
www.slhuang.com
Thanks everyone for all your continued good wishes!!! I LOVE YOU ALL :heart: :heart:

I just wanted to stop in and say that I have been hearing a lot of buzz about this book. I'm pretty active on Goodreads and Booklikes, and it's been recommended by several people, some of whom don't normally read in your genre. So, that is huge!

Whaaaaat....what! *is inarticulate*

Thank you so much for telling me. That is thrilling. :D :D :D

I so hope you enjoy it! And you too, Captcha! Thank you guys so much. :heart: *melts into puddle of delight*

Ha! I knew I wasn't the only one. Don't worry, Donkey; when the apocalypse comes, we'll have the last laugh. ;)

Bwahahaha! I confess I prefer only buying paper books myself. ;) Well, you'll be happy to know I've started looking into typesetting. It will happen. Maybe slowly. But happening!
 

RevanWright

inconveniently drunk
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 5, 2012
Messages
332
Reaction score
21
Location
Fort Worth, TX
Website
www.andreatheend.com
Well, I typed Zero Sum Game into a popular *ahem* disreputable reputable website in which...hmm...how shall I put this...a certain dishonest honest type of people like to upload and download things free of any copyright or capitalist law...

Let me just say: don't do it. I got four search results. The Sum of All Fears and 3 things I won't mention in polite company (I can't decide which is worse).

The good news is that your book seems to be doing well without a large amount of piracy!
 

Captcha

Banned
Joined
Jan 27, 2010
Messages
4,456
Reaction score
637
Bought it, read it, loved it!

And now I'm waiting for the next instalment...
 

Little Ming

Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 5, 2011
Messages
3,001
Reaction score
753
Bwahahaha! I confess I prefer only buying paper books myself. ;) Well, you'll be happy to know I've started looking into typesetting. It will happen. Maybe slowly. But happening!

Yay!

Future books in the series: Book 2 is in beta, book 3 has a completed rough draft, and I'm 1/4 of the way through book 4. If I can get my editing ass in gear I'm hoping to put books 2 and 3 both out in 2015, one early in the year and one later.

Missed this before in the llloooonngggg post.

I'm curious how this will work out, since the prevailing self-publishing advice (I think?) is to release books closely in time (a few weeks/months?) so you can keep readers aware of your existence. Almost an entire year in between books, and three years (?) to put out four books--why, that's almost big-trade-publishing slow. :D
 

slhuang

Inappropriately math-oriented.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 11, 2012
Messages
2,906
Reaction score
1,140
Website
www.slhuang.com
The good news is that your book seems to be doing well without a large amount of piracy!

Interesting! *collates data* Thank you for letting me know!

Of course, this may just mean I'm not popular enough to pirate. ;) (Yet!)

Bought it, read it, loved it!

And now I'm waiting for the next instalment...

:D :D :D

*dies of the flattery*

Thank you, Captcha. :D

I'm curious how this will work out, since the prevailing self-publishing advice (I think?) is to release books closely in time (a few weeks/months?) so you can keep readers aware of your existence. Almost an entire year in between books, and three years (?) to put out four books--why, that's almost big-trade-publishing slow. :D

Yes, yes, yes, I know. :D A-book-every-couple-months is indeed the prevailing SP wisdom.

Unfortunately, I can't write that fast to the quality I'd want to release under. (I can type that fast, sure, but I can't plot that fast, usually, and I certainly can't research or edit that fast . . .)

It's (potentially) a problem.

I'm hoping that by writing to a niche, I'm writing books that are not interchangeable -- that people are willing to wait for and not forget about. I'm a smidge faster than "fast" trade publishing schedules, and in SFF I think that may be okay -- as a SFF reader I consider "a book a year" in a series to be UBER FAST, and I remember being impressed by Robin Hobb and Jim Butcher before I got into self-publishing and everyone was like, "a year, oh no, you're dead in a year!" ;) This is another part of the reason I'm aiming my promotion at general SFF readers and reviewers and not at people who specifically read SP work: the former are likely to be delighted with my release schedule; the latter would likely forget about me. :)

The question of whether to release faster is sort of moot because I'm not willing to release something I'm unhappy with. But I'm kicking around ideas to start building my business plan around my turtle-like speed more. For instance, maybe I can write two books a year if they're in different series -- if unsnarling plot is what's slowest for me, maybe writing another book in parallel won't slow down this series, and will give me another release. I've been playing around with a few ideas for another series, though I probably wouldn't be able to get a new series off the ground till 2016, if then, since I'd probably need at least a year for the first book. Maybe I should look into short stories / novellas / novelettes as a way to stay on people's radars (though is the ROI for cover art / editing worth it to self-publish at that length? Would I forgo that level of production quality for shorter works? I don't know). While editing books 2 and 3 I'm starting to write more shorts and submit them to trade markets; if I get some traction there maybe it'll help my name stay on people's minds in between. :) And I can SP them under CC once the short story contract lapses.

So, yeah, that was a very long answer. ;) But yes, most SPers who make a living do put out a book every few months, and rely on fewer sales each over a vast number of titles to make decent money. It's not a bad business plan, considering how hard it is to write a single book that takes off (and how impossible it is to plan for a single book or series to take off). To be honest, I can't think of a single financially successful self-publisher who doesn't have a release schedule that's faster than mine is! Which certainly makes me a less-ideal self-publisher, so I AM looking for ways to mitigate my slower speed. :)
 

slhuang

Inappropriately math-oriented.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 11, 2012
Messages
2,906
Reaction score
1,140
Website
www.slhuang.com
I put up a campaign on Unglue.It this week. Basically, it allows people to download my book for free under the CC license, but asks downloaders to donate the list price to support the book (and support me :D).

Unglue.It tweeted my link a little while ago today, and then Creative Commons picked it up, and my Twitter mentions have been going crazy. I've had over 30 downloads so far, of which 1 person has bought. I'm really eager to see where this goes. Obviously I'm hoping everyone loves the book so much that they decide to come back and give me the $5 for it. ;) But even if I maintain at a 3% buy rate, if I get enough word of mouth this might help . . . what was the analogy someone used a few pages ago in this thread? Increase the size of the pizza to a degree that the total revenue becomes exciting? :D *crosses fingers and toes* *waits for ALL THE MONEY* ;)

Unglue.It's going to promote me to their newsletter, too, and I have an interview with Creative Commons pending that should go live soon (they're drawing a cartoon character me -- OMG, CARTOON ME, I AM SO EXCITED GUYZ). I'm eager to explore what marketing to the CC crowd can do for me. :D

By the way, if anyone's interested in Unglue.It, they have a few different types of campaigns, including one where the work starts out non-CC but then when enough people buy it, it "unglues" and becomes CC. So if you're thinking about eventually releasing your work under CC, it might be a good avenue to give you a bump. :) They also have a "pledge to unglue" campaign, which is I *think* is something like rights holders asking for Kickstarter-esque pledges for the license release of a copyrighted work. I'll continue to report back, but so far they've been delightful to work with.
 

onesecondglance

pretending to be awake
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 2, 2012
Messages
5,359
Reaction score
1,664
Location
Berkshire, UK
Website
soundcloud.com
Yes, yes, yes, I know. :D A-book-every-couple-months is indeed the prevailing SP wisdom.

Unfortunately, I can't write that fast to the quality I'd want to release under. (I can type that fast, sure, but I can't plot that fast, usually, and I certainly can't research or edit that fast . . .)

It's (potentially) a problem.

This is among the reasons I am not planning to SP - I also simply cannot write that fast.

Will be really interested to follow your journey and see how you get along with this aspect!

I would say "good luck", but I think a "good book"* is far more to do with your success... :)

*: it helps if you have the kind of accent where "luck" and "book" at least partially rhyme. Otherwise my weedy attempt at a joke fails.