I Absolutely LOVE My Agent, But...

Two things about your agent bother me:

"...while the feedback she gives me is great, it's sparse and spread out over months" and ..."she has a full time job other than agenting and has her own books to write/publish."

For one thing, why is she spreading out her sparse feedback over months? Sounds unprofessional. The most my agent ever takes for revisions is two months, and her notes are extensive and cover the entire book.

Secondly, while it's not unusual for an agent to also be an author, having a full-time job is. Most every agent I've heard of does the agent thing full-time, with few exceptions. But even that wouldn't be so bad if she was giving you the time you deserve as a client. What is her experience in the industry? Has she sold anything to a Big 5 publisher? I hope and pray that you're not paying her an up-front fee.

If I were you, I would begin the hunt for another agent, and make sure you vet them here on AW first by looking at the various threads and seeing if he/she has legit experience and legit sales in your genre. Good luck!

My agent has been pretty quick with suggestions for revisions. I think the first novel (the one he signed me for) he took about a month to read through, then we talked on the phone. Once I finished the revisions it was a couple of weeks while he read the new draft.

Book two was similar. A couple of weeks for him to read, then another couple while we set up a phone call.

Book three went through four drafts after the first one, but was still pretty quick. I finished the first draft beginning of November and finished the fifth/last draft mid-January.

However, as far as I know, agenting is his only job and he is not an author on the side. I also let him know when I start a new project, give him an informal pitch on it so I can be certain it is something he wants to rep, and usually provide a tentative deadline for when I think it will be finished. That way he can plan to look at it instead of working it into his schedule.

Naturally, each agent and author will work differently, but long wait times and sparse notes would make me think long and hard about whether an agent was working for me. I would suggest scheduling a call to talk things over.

Luzoni said:

Aggy, that sounds awesome! Have all your books sold?

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Not yet. Book One has been out a little over a year. Book Two has been out since August, 2014. Book Three is actually in a holding pattern while we wait for responses on the other two.

Waiting is frustrating but we started at the top and we're still getting responses back from the bigger houses on the first book so we've got a ways to go yet before we're done.

It does sound weird to me that your agent has another job in addition to agenting, buuuut long in my experience, long wait times occur even with agents who don't have another job. My personal experience with my old agents:

-With the book they signed me for, they were VERY excited and I got extensive feedback every 1 month or so, for 5 rounds of editing total. I thought the month-long waits were reasonable given that with each round of edits, they sent me in-MS crit which was very thorough.

-However, that book did not sell.

-With subsequent books... Book 2 took the agents about 3 months to read, and Book 3 took about 2 months for them to get to. After reading both books, they asked me to come in to the office to discuss both of books. We decided to work on Book 3, but this time, their feedback was shorter. No in-MS feedback. I did the edits. It took over 2 months for them to get back to me. And when they did, they said they no longer wanted to go with Book 3. It just doesn't work, they said. How about going with Book 2, or an entirely different book? I said let's go with Book 2. I waited another 2 months before they sent me their feedback on Book 2, and when it finally arrived, it was even vaguer than their feedback on Book 3.

-I had a decision to make. By this time, I was already unhappy with their treatment of Book 3, because they basically told me that I had followed their edits to a T, which ruined the book. I asked them if I made more edits on Book 3, would they give it another chance? They said ehh. So finally, we parted ways.

-I queried Book 3 and signed with a different agency, and they sent me pretty in-depth notes even before we signed. It's been a bit over 1 month since I sent them my revisions and they told me they'll have more notes for me by early next week. So this timeline is more reminiscent of the timeline I had with my old agents when it came to my first book.

I've noticed the same pattern with a couple of friends I have whose first books didn't sell. First book was revised extensively and efficiently, and if it doesn't sell, the following books aren't given as much care. Mind you, that's literally only two people I know of other than myself who've had that happen, so I'm not saying that's the norm, but it makes sense to me. The agents just might not love the subsequent books. They see potential, but maybe it's just not quite their cups of tea, and it's not even the book they signed the client on for.

So what does this mean for you? Hell if I know. I don't know if there's a right answer. One of the friends I mentioned who's in a similar situation decided to stick with her current agent since she's also busy with her own business and doesn't mind the extra wait time for her subsequent books to be read. I think it's been like 6 months and no word yet from her agent about her latest book. I'm not really in touch with the other friend who was in that position, so I don't know what she decided to do. For myself, I decided that I needed a fresh start and an agent who's as enthusiastic about Book 3 as my old agents were about Book 1.

It was scary as hell to jump ship though. When the rejections rolled in, I did wonder whether I'd made a huge mistake. Maybe they were right, maybe I should've moved on to a different project. But I reminded myself that if I didn't take that chance, Book 3 would just get buried, and I didn't want that. When I asked the agent I'm interning for for advice, he said, "Which one do you believe in more: your agents or your MS?" The answer made my choice a lot clearer.

Holy crap, this has been an essay. I hope it helps!

I am not convinced that an agent can be effective as an agent when working full-time at something else. How can your agent speak to editors, to publishers, go to meetings, chase up foreign rights co-agents and so on?

I'm also concerned that your agent is taking far too long to get back to you. The time-frames you describe are not acceptable.

I'm not happy with this agent, whoever she is: but if I knew who she was I might be able to give you more specific advice. Feel free to PM me the name of the agent, in confidence of course. I'll let you know if I've heard anything significant.

I have heard it isn't uncommon for newer agents to keep their jobs initially, and then gradually start cutting back into part-time work then into full-time agenting, if they're at smaller agencies that don't pay them an assistant salary while they build their client list. I interned for an agency for about six months, and it wasn't uncommon practice there. They have to live and eat, and if they live in NYC, that's really not a cheap task.

However, after a few years in the business, the fact that she still works full time AND is a writer in her own right does seem like she has a lot going on? Writing is a part-time job in itself for most authors (if they can't yet afford to write as their 9-5). Since I started working full-time, my own writing time has lessened. Effectively it sounds like this agent has 2 full-time jobs, whatever she does 9-5, agenting, as well as a part-time job, writing. THAT IS CRAZY.

Add another voice saying that an agent working another full time job is weird. It's not just the time it takes, but also the logistics.

I mean, is her other job at night, or is she working somewhere else during the day? I know my agent does a lot of her initial communication with editors/publishers by phone, and that would be a bit hard to manage if she were working somewhere else during their business hours.

I think my agent is a bit of a superstar with her response times (like, responding to e-mails within the hour, getting revision suggestions to me within the week), so maybe she's not a fair comparison, but I really don't think it should be months and months. That doesn't sound right at all.

oceansoul said:

I have heard it isn't uncommon for newer agents to keep their jobs initially, and then gradually start cutting back into part-time work then into full-time agenting, if they're at smaller agencies that don't pay them an assistant salary while they build their client list. I interned for an agency for about six months, and it wasn't uncommon practice there. They have to live and eat, and if they live in NYC, that's really not a cheap task.

However, after a few years in the business, the fact that she still works full time AND is a writer in her own right does seem like she has a lot going on? Writing is a part-time job in itself for most authors (if they can't yet afford to write as their 9-5). Since I started working full-time, my own writing time has lessened. Effectively it sounds like this agent has 2 full-time jobs, whatever she does 9-5, agenting, as well as a part-time job, writing. THAT IS CRAZY.

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I agree.

An agent who hasn't managed to become a full-time agent after a few years of working at the job is either not very good at the job, or doesn't actually want to commit to it.

Neither of these two reasons is good for her clients.

Luzoni said:

Thank you all for the feedback. Unfortunately it's confirming what I'd feared.

PuttPutt, your bravery in jumping ship astounds me! I'm so glad it worked out for you! I'm not sure I could handle it, especially since I do love and totally agree with the feedback she gives me and the work she did with my first book really helped it. And I think the rewrite she pushed me to do with the second project helped it too, though I need that confirmed from her.

I just don't know what to do, other than wait, which has been what I've obviously been doing.

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Has waiting got you anywhere?

I don't mean to be snappy. I am worried for you. Where's your work going while your agent ignores you?

Old Hack said:

Has waiting got you anywhere?

I don't mean to be snappy. I am worried for you. Where's your work going while your agent ignores you?

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This was my thought as well. It doesn't sound like she's nearly as keen on your second or third books. If the first were to sell, that *might* change, but it seems unlikely that she'll be more interested in your other work if the first one doesn't go anywhere. And really, the last thing you want is an agent tying up a MS they aren't invested in.

I've been very fortunate to find an agent who seems equally keen on everything I've shown him. He's not been hesitant about reading or responding to any of the four books I've worked on over the past year and a half. But if he had only shown interest in the first one, I would be a lot less zen about waiting for him to decide if he might be interested in repping the others.

If your agent isn't really interested in the other things you've written, it's in your best interest not to let her try and rep them. You want someone who will give all your work it's best shot.

Again, I would suggest a phone call to hash all this out. Ask her what her plans are for the other books. Ask her if she's slow in responding because she doesn't have the time to work on them, if they need more work than the first time, if they're too far outside her interests. You can be firm without being rude.

Luzoni said:

This is so scary...and depressing! I seriously dread trying to arrange that sort of phone call, Aggy. We've not had a call since she called to offer to rep me, so if I make that kind of request she's going to know something's up.

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Of course it's scary. You have a lot of hope pinned on your agent, and the questions you're asking here are challenging whether or not she's going to make your hopes a reality.

But asking your agent those questions isn't going to change whether she sells your books or not. It's going to clarify what's happening here. You might have to find a new agent: but if that's the case, it would be the case whether or not you have that discussion. You'd just know it sooner if you have that discussion.

(That's a very convoluted response. I hope it makes sense!)

Out of curiosity, I can't help but wonder if there's a way to possibly not jump ship, exactly, but to see if maybe a different agent at her agency would be interested in my other novels. Except I wouldn't want to ruffle any feathers in a transfer and I don't know if that sort of thing is even feasible. Plus I wouldn't know how to suggest it.

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I wouldn't try for this. If you're going to break with her, then a clean break is probably better. I doubt that the other agents at the agency would be willing to take you on, too: there would be a few conflicts of interest there, I fear.

If I did jump ship I don't know what would happen to my first book, still in submissions. I'm guessing it'd stay with her?

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If you decide to break your relationship with your agent then she would probably pull any submissions which are still out there.

Which brings me back to your first post in this thread:

Luzoni said:

I have a few questions about what's a normal timeframe for revisions of secondary novels with an agent. I have a wonderful agent who is a fabulous editor and we spent about 4-ish months revising my first novel, the one she signed me for, about a year and a half ago. Unfortunately it's not sold yet and I'm eager to put another novel on submission because I'm a prolific writer and I love the work and I love working with her.

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Your book has been out on submission for a year and a half. Do you know who it's been sent to? How many publishers have seen it, and what their responses have been?

Ask your agent for this information if you don't have it already. It could be that there are common reasons behind the rejections it has received, which you might be able to resolve; or it could be that she's not sent it out to many people, or to the right people. If that's the case, you have to know.
http://absolutewrite.com//www.pinterest.com/pin/create/extension/

I kind of want to know how you've tried to approach your issues with your agent in the past. You say you've only ever had one phone call with her. This also seems a bit weird to me. I would have thought that a frank conversation with her should precede the actual break up, just to check in and see what the deal is and why she's behaved the way that she has?

I totally stand by my original comment that I think she has too much on her plate to be an affective advocate for you, but I also think you've been a little passive with regards to actively pursuing communication with her. Maybe something to think about with your next agent? Maybe work at keeping communication channels open from the start?

Obviously take what I say with the caveat that I don't have an agent myself, so haven't had to manage that working relationship. But I do work with a lot of people at my day job! And I definitely wouldn't be shy myself about asking the staff at Harmony Ink (my publisher) what was up if I hadn't heard from them for a while.

oceansoul is spot-on. You must have a discussion with your agent prior to ending your relationship with her: it could be that this is all the result of a misunderstanding, rather than her lack of ability. Good luck.

Old Hack said:

Of course it's scary. You have a lot of hope pinned on your agent, and the questions you're asking here are challenging whether or not she's going to make your hopes a reality.

But asking your agent those questions isn't going to change whether she sells your books or not. It's going to clarify what's happening here. You might have to find a new agent: but if that's the case, it would be the case whether or not you have that discussion. You'd just know it sooner if you have that discussion.

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This makes a lot sense. When I asked the agent I'm interning for for advice, he said to let my ex-agents know all of my worries. I am super averse to conversations like these, so he suggested approaching it very gently, you know, stuff like "I'm concerned regarding the time-frame of our editing process and was wondering if there's anything I can do to help speed it up a bit" sort of fing. Make yourself sound proactive while still letting her know that her slowness is not working for you.

It was still a terrible thing (gawd, I haaaate these conversations so much) to have to do, but better to do it sooner than later.

I wouldn't try for this. If you're going to break with her, then a clean break is probably better. I doubt that the other agents at the agency would be willing to take you on, too: there would be a few conflicts of interest there, I fear.

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I know of one instance where something similar-ish happened. The client wasn't happy with her agent and I guess the other agents somehow knew about it (I have no idea how they found out). One of them offered to represent the client (if she wanted to stay with that agency, of course). She accepted and afaik she's happy with the new arrangement. BUT this was proposed by the agency. She wasn't the one who asked about it, and I'm under the impression that her old agent was aware of it from the very beginning. I just don't see a good way of the author suggesting it. "I'm not happy with you, but maybe your colleague...?" OH is right, a clean break's probably best.

And yeah, I hpoe she's been keeping you updated with the MS that's been in subs! If not, definitely ask where she's subbed to and whether there's been any feedback etc.

It is a decision you have to make, but if you feel like her promise to read over Easter is already thin and your gut says get out, that's probably what you need to do.

I don't always get a response back from my agent exactly when he promises to get back to me, but he doesn't say "I'll get to this by Monday," and then still not be in touch months later. That's a huge problem and if she's already made a promise to read a MS and still hasn't gotten to it after several months, I would be concerned. Especially if she's saying a similar thing about a different MS now.

You'll need to decide what to do about the first book though. Whether you let the rest of the submissions come back or pull it from wherever it's still under submission. And get the full list of every place it's been subbed for future reference.

I know it's a scary thing, but you really can't wait for years to be getting new manuscripts out on submission.

Luzoni said:

Well, I composed an email telling her that I am concerned about the length of time reading and revisions have taken, and I wondered if there was any way to help. I told her I need more communication from her on the submission process, as it's been almost a year since I received feedback without asking for it first. I said I was concerned because I'm prolific and have a backlog that I was afraid it'd take years to get to. I also asked her if the second and third novels were outside her interests.

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Go Luzoni! That sounds like a super progressive email!

Her response was prompt and she apologized and told me she has some time off work for Easter and she would try to get through reading my second novel then. She did admit she's not as emotionally invested in the characters of the other novels, but they're not outside her interest. She then asked me what sort of other projects I had that I was working on.

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Heh, when I saw this I was all, "Yay!" But then I got to the next part...

So...here's the part I see in big glaring red letters: She's going to TRY to get through my novel over Easter. Back around Thanksgiving she told me she'd read my other book over Christmas. She didn't. Also missing from this email is any kind of promise that I may expect a more rapid response going ahead.

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AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA. This sucks. Sorry, Luzoni. I think it's understandable to get sidetracked by stuff happening, but all the way from Christmas to Easter? That's a heck of a long time to not have a chance to read a client's book.

So my gut says I need to get out. She isn't promising to change, just dangling hope in front of me. Would you guys agree?

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I can't answer this for you. :-/ I am an impatient hippo, so I would get out, but Easter's less than a week away, so you could also wait and nudge after Easter break. If she still hasn't gotten to your book by then, it's pretty clear what you need to do.

Sorry to hear you're in this position.

Popping in to say- give Easter a chance. After that all bets might be off the table. Until then, trust.

Let the decision answer itself.

Gringa