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[Agency] WordWise Media Services

Undercover

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I submitted to him and had an odd (if not bad) experience.

While I was submitting to him I had a publisher interested in my novel and wanted to see revisions. He was interested (of course after I told him that) and was going to give me a contract and everything. But as I was waiting to hear back from him, my revised ms. was already sent and had gotten a response already. The publisher passed and he didn't want anything to do with me anymore. I thought this was only one publisher that passed on it and showed no interest in still taking it on and sending it to other places, which led me to believe he doesn't have the connections like he portrays.

Most of his stuff is from publishers you can already submit to yourself. You don't need an agent for it.
 

Old Hack

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The comment I found very telling was this one:

"Don't most authors want to buy a bunch of their own books anyway? 100 copies is not a lot."

An agent who apparently sees nothing wrong with publishers requiring writers to buy their own books in bulk is not the kind of agent I would want.

Wowsers. That's a huge red flag.

Looking at the client list on his website - http://www.wordwisemedia.com/clients1.html - I found the following:

<snipped>

Search shows Higherlife Publishing - A “pay to play” publisher - http://ahigherlife.com/publishing-services Companies pointing out their "unique publishing model" make my teeth itch.

<snipped>

Two books listed/no publisher. Search shows Strategic Book Publishing and Eloquent Books. Third book published by Astraea Press. Strategic/Eloquent, no comment needed. Astraea again- E-publisher, no agent needed.

<snipped again>

Vanity (no agent needed) - 3

<and again>

If Mr. Hutson handled the two by Strategic/Eloquence, there is no excuse. If he didn't, he shouldn't be listing them on his page as if he did.

He submitted his clients' books to Strategic? And to another pay-to-play publisher?

There's no excuse for that. None at all.
 

FluffBunny

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Wowsers. That's a huge red flag.



He submitted his clients' books to Strategic? And to another pay-to-play publisher?

There's no excuse for that. None at all.

I don't know if he did or not. The book titles are listed on his site with his client. I've seen other agents say, "best-selling author of four books and Title Blah Title, where the titled book was handled by the agent in question. In this case, three book titles are given, but no publisher is listed for the Strategic/Eloquence books. That's why I said, "If Mr. Hutson..." There's no way of knowing whether all the titles listed were agented by him or not which is another problem.

ETA: Higherlife looks like a "back-end" vanity to me. From their website - http://ahigherlife.com/our-unique-collaborative-publishing-model

You pay no publishing fee, your only cost is to purchase an initial order of books from the first press run…and this cost typically amounts to a 60%-80% discount off retail!

(bolding added) Oddly *cough*, they don't say exactly how many books that is.
 
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Old Hack

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Thanks for the clarification, Fluff.

His suggestion that 100 copies is not a lot for an author to buy (quoted by Queen of Swords on the previous page) does make it look possible that he was involved in those deals, but as you've pointed out, we don't know that for certain. I do hope he'll drop in and let us know what his involvement was in those deals.
 

LeslieB

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I think it would be nice if Mr. Hutson went into his background a bit more. After poking around a bit, it seems he has a book published with a specialized micro/small press. Amazon also lists a book with the same author name and similar content that was published by Tate. If he is indeed the author of those books, it might go a long way in explaining his views on publishing. If his only experience is in small press and vanity, he might think the entire industry works that way. Either way, I would want to know more about what industry experience he has that would benefit his clients.

ETA: And I just realized that a link to the first book I mentioned has already been posted. I shouldn't post until I've had sufficient caffeine.
 
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FluffBunny

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Ah. Not so much a problem, but a bad assumption on my part. Dutton, as such, requires an agent. The book Noir(ish) that was submitted to Dutton actually went to Dutton's Guilt Edged Mysteries, a digital-only publication that does not require an agent for submission. http://www.us.penguingroup.com/static/pages/duttonguiltedged/

The count for agent-needed-submissions is down to (possibly) 1, depending on if the Thomas Nelson Publishers submission was to the commercial branch or the self-publishing branch.

ETA: One I had listed as "book in progress" is actually self-published. I've added that to the original post.
 
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Terie

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I think it would be nice if Mr. Hutson went into his background a bit more. After poking around a bit, it seems he has a book published with a specialized micro/small press. Amazon also lists a book with the same author name and similar content that was published by Tate. If he is indeed the author of those books, it might go a long way in explaining his views on publishing. If his only experience is in small press and vanity, he might think the entire industry works that way.

This would go a long way in explaining the wodges of misinformation he posted last night, that's for sure!
 

Steven Hutson

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Ah. The book Noir(ish) that was submitted to Dutton actually went to Dutton's Guilt Edged Mysteries, a digital-only publication that does not require an agent for submission.

Ah, but you might be surprised at the deal we negotiated. It ended up very different from the boilerplate. That's where an agent comes in handy.
 
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Steven Hutson

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I submitted to him and had an odd (if not bad) experience.

Undercover, I explained my reasons for backing out. It's because you didn't honor our deal. Hit me up privately if you don't remember.
 

CAWriter

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Just a point of clarification about Thomas Nelson and traditional or self-publishing...

Thomas Nelson is a traditional (commercial) publisher. Any book that says 'Thomas Nelson' on the spine and the copyright page was not self-published.

Westbow is now the self-publishing company owned by Thomas Nelson (now owned by Harper). Any book that says Westbow (with a copyright newer than 2010) is self-published.
 

Stacia Kane

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Ah, but you might be surprised at the deal we negotiated. It ended up very different from the boilerplate. That's where an agent comes in handy.

Mr. Hutson, you've mentioned this several times in various discussions, that an agent comes in handy or is helpful with contract negotiations even with small or no-agent-required or micropresses.

The problem is that's not really the point being brought up when we mention sales records/lack of sales to agent-only imprints. No one disputes that an agent who knows what s/he is doing can be helpful in contract negotiations even with a house where agents are not required to submit. The concern, and the reason why this point comes up in threads, is that--not discounting the other benefits agents provide--writers seek agents because agents have connections with publishers that writers cannot themselves reach. (There's a whole subset of points there, too, like how the reason they have those connections with editors is because the agent has a reputation for submitting solid commercial work, etc. etc.) But in the main, writers seek agents because agents can get them past the door at large publishers, and the reason those agents can do that is because the agents know those editors, have worked with/sold to them in the past (or worked with an agent who does/did), are known to those editors as representing commercial work, and have reputations among industry professionals for being themselves professional and skilled.

If an agent has no sales to agent-only publishers or imprints, it's a sign that the agent in question does NOT have those connections, does NOT have the ability to select work publishable by the Big 5, does NOT have a positive reputation or any real standing among industry professionals, and therefore does NOT actually provide one of the major benefits an agent is supposed to provide an author.

Editors ignore submissions from agents they don't know just the same way they ignore submissions from unagented writers. Sure, they *might* give it a slightly closer look because it's from an agency, but it's not remotely the same as being contacted by an agent they know who says, "I have something for you." What's worse is that if those submissions are substandard (which they often are), then the next time that editor sees that agency's name, chances are they'll skip it altogether; they already know that agent isn't someone they take too seriously.

What kind of royalty rate an agent managed to negotiate with a publisher so small that sales are likely to be <250 copies is nice, but not really that meaningful. A good publishing lawyer can do the same a'la carte, and many do. An agent is supposed to have the industry knowledge and connections to get his or her clients' work right under the noses of editors at agent-only houses, to offer sound and knowledgeable advice, and to help guide the writer's career.

All the "better contract terms" in the world aren't really going to make much difference if the agent isn't capable of performing the chief job of an agent: to submit their clients to editors who only read agented submissions. An agent without those connections hasn't spent enough time in the world of commercial/trade publishing to be familiar with how it works, and is thus likely unable to perform another chief job of an agent, which is to provide sound and knowledgeable advice.

That's why "hasn't sold to any agent-only imprints" is an issue. It's not about contract terms. It's about connections.
 

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All the "better contract terms" in the world aren't really going to make much difference if the agent isn't capable of performing the chief job of an agent: to submit their clients to editors who only read agented submissions. An agent without those connections hasn't spent enough time in the world of commercial/trade publishing to be familiar with how it works, and is thus likely unable to perform another chief job of an agent, which is to provide sound and knowledgeable advice.

That's why "hasn't sold to any agent-only imprints" is an issue. It's not about contract terms. It's about connections.

This is really important. It's not like negotiating terms is rocket science. But having a solid reputation with editors who only take agented mss. is important. It's not something that happens magically when you declare yourself an agent.
 

FluffBunny

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Just a point of clarification about Thomas Nelson and traditional or self-publishing...

Thomas Nelson is a traditional (commercial) publisher. Any book that says 'Thomas Nelson' on the spine and the copyright page was not self-published.

Westbow is now the self-publishing company owned by Thomas Nelson (now owned by Harper). Any book that says Westbow (with a copyright newer than 2010) is self-published.

Having looked at several Westbow and TNP published books, that certainly seems to be the case. My original post has been updated. Correct count of publishers submitted to that required an agent is 1.
 

FluffBunny

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Huh? Nope, never submitted to those.

Thank you. That's very good to know. If you'd like to read more about Strategic/Eloquence/Other Pseudonyms - http://absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101448 and you'll understand the horror expressed.

Reference the book submitted to HigherLife, a publisher that requires authors to buy X number of their own books, did you broker that deal?

Reference Dog Ear Publishing, a self-publisher, did you direct your client there?

My apologies for all the questions, but it's difficult to tell from your website exactly which books you made deals for and which are just previous publishing credits by your clients.
 

Undercover

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Undercover, I explained my reasons for backing out. It's because you didn't honor our deal. Hit me up privately if you don't remember.

Yes, Steve, you did explain the reason for backing out, that the publisher was no longer interested, so you were no longer interested. Then you were trying to push your editing services after that which was a real turn off.

In the end, it worked out for me anyway.
 
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Dessie

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Thanks very much for the discussion. You all saved me the time and energy of submitting to Mr. Hutson at Wordwise. He was listed as an agent seeking new clients in Writer's Digest's Guide to Literary Agents newsletter this week. The quickest and biggest red flag for this agency is the dreadful website, which inspired me to go to Absolute Write for confirmation of my first impression.
 

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Just want to say how grateful I am for Absolute Write for their honest reviews. Something seemed fishy about the website when I got a PitMad request. This entire thread confirmed my suspicions.

So, seriously, thank you.
 

Tromboli

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A new agent at this agency has popped on twitter and caused quite a stir, giving some controversial advice to writers and blocking anyone who disagreed with her then finally deleting her tweets. This is all second hand info but I have a couple screen caps (sorry, I don't know how to make them bigger) .

 
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Aggy B.

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A new agent at this agency has popped on twitter and caused quite a stir, giving some controversial advice to writers and blocking anyone who disagreed with her then finally deleting her tweets. This is all second hand info but I have a couple screen caps (sorry, I don't know how to make them bigger) .



o_O

Yeah. Telling someone they don't need to think over an offer of rep? That's not only ridiculous but highly arrogant. What if you aren't certain your personalities click? Or that you will communicate on the same kind of schedule? Or have the same vision of the book?

I love my agent and felt like we clicked from the first time we talked on the phone, but it still wasn't an instant "Oh, god, yes! Take all my books, please!" (That, of course, came later. ;) )

ETA: And she offers "line editing" services. Not developmental or copy edits - line edits.
 
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Chumplet

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I saw that today and checked out her page. Really, if people ask if you're a member of AAR, simply say no. Don't give a detailed explanation/diatribe. Many reputable agents are not members of AAR.
 

DanielaTorre

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A new agent at this agency has popped on twitter and caused quite a stir, giving some controversial advice to writers and blocking anyone who disagreed with her then finally deleting her tweets. This is all second hand info but I have a couple screen caps (sorry, I don't know how to make them bigger) .


I tried to play the devil's advocate on that discussion. Thought it might have been easier for her to simply have said "exclusive" in lieu of her ill-received comment. Now, after discovering that she's censoring people, I see that I was wrong.

Pred & Ed doesn't seem to have any gripes with this agency, and Publisher's Marketplace shows verified sales. Their website, however, leaves much to be desired. They have a big red link for a legal disclaimer at the bottom.

ETA: "When I offer, take it." ??? Is she serious? What's the point of multiple queries if you MUST take her if she offers?
 
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