The Tobermory Cat-Troll

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MacAllister

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I have a dozen questions for Tobermory Cat:

1) Did you, or persons encouraged by you, post on Facebook that Ms. Gliori is a thief, or words to that effect?

2) Did you, or persons encouraged by you, post messages to libraries where Ms. Gliori was scheduled to appear, on the subject of copyright and theft of intellectual property?

3) Did you, or someone encouraged by you, Tweet to the Edinburgh Book Festival on the subject of copyright or theft of intellectual property?

4) Did you, or someone encouraged by you, post defamatory material on Amazon discussion pages of Ms. Gliori's books?

5) Did you, or someone encouraged by you, attempt to destroy Ms. Gliori's livelihood?

6) Did you, or someone encouraged by you, threaten violence against Ms. Gliori?

7) Did you, or persons encouraged by you, call Ms. Gliori's publisher on the phone to make threatening and/or obscene suggestions?

8) Did you, or persons encouraged by you, edit the Wikipedia page concerning Ms. Gliori?

9) What is your understanding of the term "cyberstalking"?

10) What is your understanding of the term "trolling" as it relates to the Internet?

11) What is your understanding of the term "cyberbullying"?

12) What is your understanding of the term "extortion"?

Signal boost.
 

Bogna

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Deleted member 42

The U.S. application is far more recent.

I suspect that they're not going to be able to adequately cope with the corpora part of the application.

And then there's the issue of prior art.
 
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Ketzel

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One of Mr. Stewart's supporters wrote to the owner of a blog that promotes tourism in the area to ask for assistance in publicizing the "robbery" of his work and rallying public support for him. The blog owner has posted the request, and the response from the publisher, a crisply written and perfectly cogent rebuttal of the claims:

http://www.isle-of-mull.net/tobermory-cat-the-claws-are-out/
 

Polenth

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One of Mr. Stewart's supporters wrote to the owner of a blog that promotes tourism in the area to ask for assistance in publicizing the "robbery" of his work and rallying public support for him. The blog owner has posted the request, and the response from the publisher, a crisply written and perfectly cogent rebuttal of the claims:

http://www.isle-of-mull.net/tobermory-cat-the-claws-are-out/

Something not highlighted in the publisher's reply (as he may not know what we know) is the trademark issue. It isn't the publisher who is trying to register the cat as a trademark. The publisher's book won't stop anyone doing anything with the cat. People can make postcards, sell their own paintings of the cat or write their own story where the cat becomes a ninja zombie detective. The current situation is the cat is in the public domain, so any individual can produce something.

It's Angus Stewart (the artist) who is trying to register a trademark. If he succeeds, it will stop anyone else from producing Tobermory cat products, including the other residents of Tobermory. Anyone who wants to would have to get permission from him.

As the supporters appear to be under the impression it's the book that'll stop others producing things, not the trademark, it's an important thing to get crystal clear. It's Angus Stewart who is trying to restrict other people's use of the cat, not the book publisher.
 

Deleted member 42

I knew that this had been going on for a while, but not that long. You'd think that Mr. Troll would have figured out by now that he's wrong.

I don't think Mr. Stewart cares; bullies and trolls rarely do.

They want what they want, and aren't really interested in legalities or right and wrong.

And he's so very very wrong.
 

Terie

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When did you apply, and was the trademark granted?



Tobermory Cat, your answer contains an important omission: You might have applied for the trademark in March 2012, but it hasn't granted yet, and according to a search on 'Tobermory' and 'cat' on this page at the Intellectual Property Office, the status is 'Process Delayed'. The search results also show that you made a second application in September 2012, one whose status is still 'New Application'.

This means you do not currently own a trademark on 'Tobermory Cat'. If you did, the status would be 'Registered'. (Do a search on, say, 'coca' and 'cola' to see what that looks like.)



Momento Mori, can you comment on how a trademark grant applies to pre-existing uses? I highly doubt that this trademark will be granted, but I'm curious to know, if by some chance it is, how would that affect Gliori's book, since it was already well into production by the time Angus Stewart made his first application?

Also, are there laws prohibiting the claim of a trademark before it has been granted, do you know?
 
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Torgo

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Thing is, the Tobermory Cat guy can of course protect his work under existing copyright law, should anyone infringe on it. But that hasn't happened. And he could protect the trademark 'The Tobermory Cat' if it had ever been registered as a mark in publishing - and prevent anyone else from writing a book with that title - but that hasn't happened.

There's no legal or moral right here.

It would all be very silly if it weren't so hurtful to Debi Gliori et al. I also find it rather sad that it seems to be framed quite often by the Cat Guy as rich powerful Debi grinding the face of struggling local artist into the dust, and though I don't know Debi personally, I know picture book publishing; everyone's a struggling local artist to some extent.
 

bearilou

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One of Mr. Stewart's supporters wrote to the owner of a blog that promotes tourism in the area to ask for assistance in publicizing the "robbery" of his work and rallying public support for him. The blog owner has posted the request, and the response from the publisher, a crisply written and perfectly cogent rebuttal of the claims:

http://www.isle-of-mull.net/tobermory-cat-the-claws-are-out/

I deeply regret his lack of understanding of laws of copyright, his inability to explain what it is he is claiming to protect.

That, in a nutshell, is the issue.

I've read this thread beginning to end. I've read the links. I've seen the discussion. I've watched the disgustingly poor behavior of a grown adult.

I still can't figure out what his complaint actually is.
 

jaksen

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I also had a ginger tabby cat (I called him an orange tiger cat). Alas, he ran away. His name was Winnie as he was the same color as the famous children's book character.

I can provide photographs as proof.
 

Terie

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Nicola Morgan has blogged about this in her usual calm and clear way.

I hope that the person registered here as Tobermory Cat reads her post and learns from it.

Great post, Nicola.

From Tobermory Cat's post there, it appears that Mr Stewart believes that he personally is solely responsible for the cat's celebrity, that if he hadn't started up his Facebook page, no one in the world would ever have heard of the critter. Which is just plain wrong -- and wouldn't matter even if it were true.

It's very clear that Tobermory's cats have a long history of celebrity, Mr Stewart notwithstanding.
 
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leahzero

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Seems pretty clear from this post

I actually like Debi's work, I could see benifits from working with them - but not for them. I have suggested ways to work with them, they pay a small percentage to our village Hall, true, I get nothing but as a maker of things, I expect some reward. 2.5% gross from all sales does not sound excessive.

what this is all about.
 

Wisteria Vine

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Yeah, this guy's just never gonna get it. He's just not.

He thinks he's the victim, he's got his internet fans who know nothing about the law to back him up, and he's going to make the author's life miserable in any way he can.

He sounds like a real gem.
 

Mr Flibble

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Um

Did anyone else notice that one of (this article says 'the') Tobermory cats died? Mind, it also says that Mr Artist made it famous....


And that it had an owner - not said artist either....

I also wonder if he's up for suing the Royal Opera house?
 

jeffo20

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One of the sad things about all this is he actually stands to benefit from the success of Debi Gliori's Tobermory Cat. A successful book from Ms. Gliori will bring further attention to Tobermory Cats in general, which would bring attention to 'his' Tobermory Cat, with his coffee mugs and postcards, etc. He should have take the deal they offered him way back when.
 

Ketzel

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I've read this thread beginning to end. I've read the links. I've seen the discussion. I've watched the disgustingly poor behavior of a grown adult.

I still can't figure out what his complaint actually is.
Oh, I think I can. He's angry because the publisher didn't approach him. He's angry because he believes nobody would have any interest in the Cat if it weren't for him promoting it, so once it did catch the attention of a publisher with money and power, he should have been the one they approached, not some "totally unrelated" artist.

Delusional, ignorant of the law and not nearly as talented as Ms. Gliori, but I think this is the source of his ugly behavior - flat out hurt pride, envy and resentment of a more successful artist. Which also explains why he's directed most of his ire at her, rather than the publisher, at least in his initial campaign.
 

Bookewyrme

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Momento Mori, can you comment on how a trademark grant applies to pre-existing uses? I highly doubt that this trademark will be granted, but I'm curious to know, if by some chance it is, how would that affect Gliori's book, since it was already well into production by the time Angus Stewart made his first application?

Also, are there laws prohibiting the claim of a trademark before it has been granted, do you know?
I started thinking of this last night and wondered the same thing. Even if by some chance the Trademark is granted, how would that effect Debi's book if it was already published?
 

Filigree

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A hallmark of current reality: when your basic competence is called into question, do not work to improve your skills. Sue the evil person whose achievements made you look bad.

Meh. I'm thinking I may buy three of Debi's books: one for me, one for the public library, and one for a local charter school I love.
 

Terie

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Over on Nicola's blog, he's still asserting that he has the trademark, despite clear evidence from the IPO site to the contrary, and wants to 'settle' with the publisher. It's really kind of sad. Or it would be if, as Torgo mentioned already, he hadn't taken to cyber-bullying and wreaking havoc on a perfectly innocent party.
 

Torgo

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A 2.5% PP royalty when you haven't written or illustrated the book certainly is excessive. An author or illustrator on a picture book could expect to share 10% PR.
 
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