Outlander Series on Starz

BethS · Sep 9, 2014

00Pepper said:
A verra long wait! Does anyone know when it will be back on?

"Early 2015" is all the network has said. I do hope that means January!

So, Episode 5 just aired. What does everyone think?

I both liked it and was frustrated with it, in places anyway. I really, really felt like they needed Jamie's tavern fight scene. We needed to see him standing up for himself. He seemed very subdued this episode.

Also, apparently it wasn't originally filmed with a cliffhanger ending. Not sure why they did that.

00Pepper · Sep 9, 2014

Episode 5

BethS said:
"Early 2015" is all the network has said. I do hope that means January!

Me too!

So, Episode 5 just aired. What does everyone think?

I both liked it and was frustrated with it, in places anyway. I really, really felt like they needed Jamie's tavern fight scene. We needed to see him standing up for himself. He seemed very subdued this episode.

Also, apparently it wasn't originally filmed with a cliffhanger ending. Not sure why they did that.

I liked the cliffhanger because it surprised me. I was waiting kind of breathless for her answer and then it ended just as she opened her mouth. I think for the first time I felt like I didn't know what was going to happen.

Things I loved:

- Jamie sleeping outside Claire's door - one of my favorites in the book.
- Angus! He's really growing on me and I love that he gives Claire such a hard time but was the first one to stand up for her.
- the waulking the wool scene.
- all the dirty jokes

Things I missed or thought they could have done better:

- I missed Jamie's tavern fight scene, I think it was important one.
- I didn't really feel they played up Jamie's anger enough at being used by Dougal.
- The scene between Claire and Jamie after he had it out with Dougal was lacking IMO.

BethS · Sep 16, 2014

So. "The Garrison Commander." Comments?

I have mixed feelings about this one.

I give it really high marks for the scene between Claire and BJR. That was just masterfully done. Ditto the flogging. I still haven't quite recovered from that. Did anyone spot Brian Fraser?

I have a bit of a hard time with Claire going all misty-eyed compassionate about BJR's tormented soul--that's not something book-Claire would ever have done--but it's consistent with TV-Claire, and of course it set up what happened next beautifully.

Had to roll my eyes at the General's kilt joke, since that would be a complete anachronism. Nobody wore underwear in those days (some might wear drawers in winter, for warmth), so mocking the Scots for not wearing any makes no sense whatsoever.

Also rolled my eyes at the way the show is presenting the Jacobite cause as a struggle for "freedom." It was no such thing. They wanted to replace the English king with a Catholic king who would rule over all of England, Scotland, and Ireland. It was a power struggle, not a freedom fight. Yes, they wanted to be free of the English king's rule, but not so as they could mind their own business and be independent.

Still, those are minor quibbles. I did like the way it ended, though I think Claire should have protested the idea of marriage more. Maybe they'll cover that bit next week.

DanielaTorre · Sep 16, 2014

BethS said:
So. "The Garrison Commander." Comments?

I have mixed feelings about this one.

I give it really high marks for the scene between Claire and BJR. That was just masterfully done. Ditto the flogging. I still haven't quite recovered from that. Did anyone spot Brian Fraser?

I have a bit of a hard time with Claire going all misty-eyed compassionate about BJR's tormented soul--that's not something book-Claire would ever have done--but it's consistent with TV-Claire, and of course it set up what happened next beautifully.

Still, those are minor quibbles. I did like the way it ended, though I think Claire should have protested the idea of marriage more. Maybe they'll cover that bit next week.

Totally agree that the this scene was masterfully done and well acted. It deviated from the book, but c'est la vie. I also thought Claire's reaction to BJR was a out of character, but it did play up the tension. It also made (in my opinion) the one-dimensional character like BJR a bit of, well, multidimensional. In the book, he was sort of your run-of-the-mill sadist, and the show allowed him to breath a bit thanks to the actor.

My problem is that the entire episode focused on this one scene then barreled through Claire's reaction and resistance to marrying Jamie. That was one of the best parts. :Shrug:

So was the conversation leading to the Jamie's big reveal which they blew through as well.

Forbidden Snowflake · Sep 17, 2014

Oh my.

Episode 5 was interesting. Quite enjoyed myself.

Now, onto episode 6. Tense, tense, tense from the beginning. How much do I hate Captain Randall?

BethS · Sep 17, 2014

DanielaTorre said:
My problem is that the entire episode focused on this one scene then barreled through Claire's reaction and resistance to marrying Jamie. That was one of the best parts. So was the conversation leading to the Jamie's big reveal which they blew through as well.

Yeah, that went by pretty fast. I think they could have spent far less time on the dinner party with the General.

~Beth

c.e.lawson · Sep 17, 2014

BethS said:
Yeah, that went by pretty fast. I think they could have spent far less time on the dinner party with the General.

~Beth

I agree with everything BethS and Daniela have said about this last ep. I wonder if the emphasis on the dinner with the general and the rushing through these other really good parts from the book have something to do with trying to connect more with the male demographic?

Has anyone seen any sort of breakdown on female vs. male viewers of the series thus far?

DanielaTorre · Sep 17, 2014

c.e.lawson said:
I agree with everything BethS and Daniela have said about this last ep. I wonder if the emphasis on the dinner with the general and the rushing through these other really good parts from the book have something to do with trying to connect more with the male demographic? Has anyone seen any sort of breakdown on female vs. male viewers of the series thus far?

Haven't looked up the demo, but the second half of the book is heavy on the romance and sex, which bothers me a bit because the author deviates almost entirely from Claire's goal which is getting back home. Once that starts to happen, I wouldn't doubt that the demographic would shift.

I read somewhere that the author was resistant to the idea of marketing the book as a romance, but after reading it, it's very obvious why.

00Pepper · Sep 17, 2014

BethS said:
So. "The Garrison Commander." Comments?

I have mixed feelings about this one.

I give it really high marks for the scene between Claire and BJR. That was just masterfully done. Ditto the flogging. I still haven't quite recovered from that. Did anyone spot Brian Fraser?

I have a bit of a hard time with Claire going all misty-eyed compassionate about BJR's tormented soul--that's not something book-Claire would ever have done--but it's consistent with TV-Claire, and of course it set up what happened next beautifully.

Still, those are minor quibbles. I did like the way it ended, though I think Claire should have protested the idea of marriage more. Maybe they'll cover that bit next week.

I think you said it perfectly - masterfully done! I loved Tobias Menzies portrayal of BJR. I was blown away by the whole episode.

I didn't realize Brian Fraser was in the episode until reading a blog post recapping it. I have to say I didn't think he was quite as dashing as I had made him out to be in my head.

I didn't take Claire's reaction to BJR's tormented soul to be compassionate. I felt like she was just trying not to jeopardize her precarious situation any further than she already had. But the whole scene was so different from what actually happened so I'm not sure she wouldn't have reacted that way if she had heard the story from BJR instead of Dougal.

DanielaTorre said:
Totally agree that the this scene was masterfully done and well acted. It deviated from the book, but c'est la vie. I also thought Claire's reaction to BJR was a out of character, but it did play up the tension. It also made (in my opinion) the one-dimensional character like BJR a bit of, well, multidimensional. In the book, he was sort of your run-of-the-mill sadist, and the show allowed him to breath a bit thanks to the actor.

My problem is that the entire episode focused on this one scene then barreled through Claire's reaction and resistance to marrying Jamie. That was one of the best parts. So was the conversation leading to the Jamie's big reveal which they blew through as well.

I did feel like that last scene was a bit rushed and like Beth said I'm hoping they'll cover that more in this new episode!

BethS · Sep 19, 2014

00Pepper said:
I didn't take Claire's reaction to BJR's tormented soul to be compassionate. I felt like she was just trying not to jeopardize her precarious situation any further than she already had.

After a second viewing I saw it a bit differently. I think she was seeing, or hoping to see, something of Frank in him, something that could be saved, because I think she was also afraid that one day (if she made it back home) she would find something of BJR in Frank.

Also, as a more surface interpretation, I think the writers were setting her (and the viewer) up for more of a shock when he hits her.

TV-Claire is somewhat different than book-Claire, but they are keeping the character consistent with what they've already shown so far.

As to the demographics of the viewing audience, I think men are fairly well represented. (I have this vague memory of having seen the figures somewhere.) A number of male reviewers have liked the show. And there's this one very young man who does wildly enthusiastic and rather adorable video reviews of each episode. He's never read the books, so it's fun to hear his take on things. Just go to YouTube and search for "Kevin Falk Outlander."

00Pepper · Sep 19, 2014

BethS said:
After a second viewing I saw it a bit differently. I think she was seeing, or hoping to see, something of Frank in him, something that could be saved, because I think she was also afraid that one day (if she made it back home) she would find something of BJR in Frank.

It's funny because I've been thinking about this a lot this week and I've basically come to the same conclusion. But I didn't think of that last part - that she's afraid she'll see something of BJR in Frank when she gets home. That makes sense.

Also, as a more surface interpretation, I think the writers were setting her (and the viewer) up for more of a shock when he hits her.

TV-Claire is somewhat different than book-Claire, but they are keeping the character consistent with what they've already shown so far.

As to the demographics of the viewing audience, I think men are fairly well represented. (I have this vague memory of having seen the figures somewhere.) A number of male reviewers have liked the show. And there's this one very young man who does wildly enthusiastic and rather adorable video reviews of each episode. He's never read the books, so it's fun to hear his take on things. Just go to YouTube and search for "Kevin Falk Outlander."

I agree that TV-Claire is somewhat different from Book-Claire. She almost seems softer somehow and doesn't always behave the way I expect...or more like does or says what I expect but in a completely different tone or manner than I'm anticipating. I'm still really enjoying TV-Claire though!

I'll have to look up this Kevin Falk guy. I've really been enjoying the recaps at That's Normal though. Especially when she posts her husbands commentary.

00Pepper · Sep 23, 2014

So no one wants to talk about The Wedding, huh?

I can't wait to hear y'alls thoughts!

I loved it! There were some things I missed but overall I thought it worked great. I was a little upset at first that they just dumped the first kiss on us with no warning and thought they were going to skip the wedding completely but as it went on I really warmed up to the flashbacks.

I did miss the "room for secrets but not for lies" discussion and hope that comes up at some point.

BethS · Sep 24, 2014

Diana says that line will appear later. I missed it, too, and wish they could have found room for it here.

Loved the episode. Once I realized what they were doing with the flashbacks, I thought it was brilliant. They've been pretty consistent about not showing anything Claire wouldn't know about, so having Jamie tell Claire about his day provided a way to show scenes that Claire wasn't privy to.

The wedding night itself was so well done. They managed to capture beautifully the mix of awkwardness, fear, tenderness, sexual excitement, and growing trust.

Not crazy about the change to the ring, but otherwise, I thought the episode was magnificent.

ETA: Something I forgot to mention. The love scenes were shown through the female gaze, something that is really rare in films and TV.

BethS · Sep 26, 2014

Starz has announced that the second half of the season will return on (wait for it) April 4.

That's a long hiatus. But it coincides with a Nielson sweeps period, so to them I'm sure it's just ideal.

DanielaTorre · Sep 26, 2014

Not a fan of being dropped into the middle of something with no explanation. Doctor Who tends to do that a lot and it bugs me. Personally, I think it could have been better. Between the last episode and this one, they seem to have ignored Claire's feelings and thoughts on the subject for the sake of getting them in bed together faster. The wedding alone was a blink and you'll miss it moment.

So yeah, I wasn't a big fan of the episode. Didn't allow the sexual tension and awkwardness build up through the episode, and it ignored her thoughts of Frank almost entirely.

Of course, this is me speaking as a reader as well. This is the part of the book where I got bored. From here on, sorry for the spoilers, it's pretty much sex like ALL the time.

BethS · Sep 27, 2014

Ah. I had a different perception. From here on out is where the story really gets good. And a substantial portion of that story is how she develops their relationship. Sex is part of that. But I never had the impression it was overdone. There're plenty of other things happening.

beckethm · Sep 27, 2014

DanielaTorre said:
Not a fan of being dropped into the middle of something with no explanation. Doctor Who tends to do that a lot and it bugs me. Personally, I think it could have been better. Between the last episode and this one, they seem to have ignored Claire's feelings and thoughts on the subject for the sake of getting them in bed together faster. The wedding alone was a blink and you'll miss it moment.

This was my initial reaction as well. In retrospect, I think the flashback format and pacing of the episode were an effective way to show how Claire and Jamie's intimacy developed over the course of the wedding night, whereas if the story had been told in a more linear fashion, it might have seemed like just sex, sex, and more sex. Watching it, though, I spent the first twenty minutes stewing because they skipped the wedding, and it kept me from enjoying the story.

From the previews, it looks like tonight's episode will depart pretty significantly from the book. I'm interested to see how that plays out.

regdog · Sep 28, 2014

And now we have to wait until April 2015 :gaah

DanielaTorre · Sep 29, 2014

regdog said:
And now we have to wait until April 2015

I think it's a tad ridiculous that it'll take 7 months for the show to come back. It's just a mid-season finale. That's longer than a regular season finale. I don't remember any other show taking this absurd about of time mid-season.

regdog · Sep 29, 2014

Game of Thrones usually airs in April. Maybe they want to take viewers away or if they air on different nights gain more viewers.

00Pepper · Oct 1, 2014

It is a long wait but at least we have other tv to watch now with all the premiers and the holidays coming up and...well can't think of anything else but surely we'll survive.

I enjoyed Both Sides Now (episode 8). It was the biggest departure from the book but it was also very enjoyable to me. So far I've been able to enjoy the show for the show and not get too upset about the things they do differently. I really loved the place they left us at...I feel like maybe when it comes back we'll get to see more of Jamie The Man than we've seen up to this point.

I also really enjoyed seeing little Roger!

Finally!

BethS · Oct 1, 2014

00Pepper said:
I enjoyed Both Sides Now (episode 8). It was the biggest departure from the book but it was also very enjoyable to me. So far I've been able to enjoy the show for the show and not get too upset about the things they do differently. I really loved the place they left us at...I feel like maybe when it comes back we'll get to see more of Jamie The Man than we've seen up to this point.

I understand from Diana that he is coming out of the shadows in the second half. He's even getting his own voiceover narration.

I loved the episode. Some fans complained about the Frank plot, but I thought it was really well done.

beckethm · Oct 1, 2014

BethS said:
I understand from Diana that he is coming out of the shadows in the second half. He's even getting his own voiceover narration.

Good to know. If I have any complaint about the series so far, it's that Jamie has been too much in the background. If I didn't know him from reading all the books, I don't think I would see him as a hero. But then maybe he was like that in the first part of the book, and my memory is tainted by subsequent events.

I loved the episode. Some fans complained about the Frank plot, but I thought it was really well done.

I agree. Even though that part of the episode departed from the book, it was very much in keeping with the parallel narratives in Dragonfly in Amber and subsequent books. I wondered whether, if Diana were writing Outlander now, she might do something similar.

greendragon · Feb 9, 2015

So, did anyone notice that Frank was carrying a weapon with him... a 'blackjack'? Hmmmm....

I've been a fan of the books for over 10 years now. I'm loving the way they've filmed it so far. My one quibble is the 'marriage has room for secrets but not lies', so far, and the ring substitution. I can understand using Lallybroch's key, but that makes a problem later on, as him getting the ring is part of a plot line...

Yes, I've heard that some of the narrative becomes Jamie's in the second half.

Does everyone realize that Outlander was Diana Gabaldon's PRACTICE novel? A novel she wrote to figure out how to write novels? She never intended to publish at first. This boggles my mind!

greendragon · Feb 9, 2015

Oh, and the wedding episode. I had a momentary 'WTF!' moment at the beginning, like I had missed an episode. The same sort of feeling I got when I started book two, as a matter of fact!

Outlander Series on Starz

BethS

00Pepper

Super Pepper

BethS

DanielaTorre

...

Forbidden Snowflake

I'm quite put out.

BethS

c.e.lawson

DanielaTorre

...

00Pepper

Super Pepper

BethS

00Pepper

Super Pepper

00Pepper

Super Pepper

BethS

BethS

DanielaTorre

...

BethS

beckethm

regdog

The Scavengers

DanielaTorre

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regdog

The Scavengers

00Pepper

Super Pepper

BethS

beckethm

greendragon

greendragon