Wife v. Agent (and hyphenated names)

I have to go with the agent on this one, because it sounds more posh. But that's only if you don't plan on sometimes referring to her by last name only, as can happen, especially in cop stories. Then your wife's point would be overruling.

Even then, there's a bit of comedy to mine from it if she's over here in the US and people address her only with "Digby" and she's stuck between wanting the dignity and due of her full hyphenate and the awkwardness of correcting people.

1. if it reads "clunky" would seem secondary to if it helps show character

2. the person selling my work would have sway over my spouse, unless they felt horrible about something....if it is a minor quibble, one of them is trying to sell and hopefully knows what they're doing, one is voicing preference...

I know a fair number of posh English people (being a middle-class English person), and none of them have double-barrelled surnames. They do exist, but it's a stereotype not always borne out by reality.

Personally I've seen far too many comedy double-barrelled names ("Chomondeley-Smythe") and I find it annoying / borderline offensive. I'd definitely roll my eyes if I saw in print.

onesecondglance said:

I know a fair number of posh English people (being a middle-class English person), and none of them have double-barrelled surnames. They do exist, but it's a stereotype not always borne out by reality.

Personally I've seen far too many comedy double-barrelled names ("Chomondeley-Smythe") and I find it annoying / borderline offensive. I'd definitely roll my eyes if I saw in print.

Click to expand...

I'd second this. The only people with a double-barrelled name that I've ever met weren't particularly posh, either (dare I say, they were on the other end of the spectrum?).

MarkEsq said:

But... my wife said she doesn't like reading hyphenated names in books, because the tongue trips over them and they're clunky to have to read over and over.

Click to expand...

Presumably, you won't be using the character's last name over and over. Also, find something without too many syllables.

It's a lot harder to find a new agent.

Serious answer: I agree with NRoach. Are you going for actually posh or sounds posh (that is, sounds posh to the reader or sounds posh to the bearer of the name)? Building on what quicklime said, clunkiness could help show character.

onesecondglance said:

I know a fair number of posh English people (being a middle-class English person), and none of them have double-barrelled surnames. They do exist, but it's a stereotype not always borne out by reality.

Personally I've seen far too many comedy double-barrelled names ("Chomondeley-Smythe") and I find it annoying / borderline offensive. I'd definitely roll my eyes if I saw in print.

Click to expand...

Now that's interesting. It is shown in books and film often enough that I thought hyphenated names were a thing in the UK, used particularly in a certain station to preserve venerable old family names. I had no idea the notion had any negative baggage.

One thing I love about AW is the things you learn at random. Very interesting.

If it wasn't for a series, I probably would weigh in on the agent's side. Do what sells. I'm actually changing the last name of my MC at my agent's request -- but I've already drafted the book, and I think that's a key difference.

In a series, though, you're going to have to live with that MC for hopefully a long time. The right character name can sometimes unlock that person's identity and personality. Since she's still just a concept in your head, will it get in your way of developing a great character if you don't like her name?

It's a stereotype so, yeah, it carries negative baggage. Although I suppose you could have some fun with Chomondeley or Featherstone-Haugh as nobody would be able to pronounce them correctly.

Reading 'posh English woman' did make my heart sink as the potential for stereotypes is so huge.

Since MarkEsq is English, the nuances of the stereotype should be in better hands than usual.

quicklime said:

1. if it reads "clunky" would seem secondary to if it helps show character

2. the person selling my work would have sway over my spouse [...] one of them is trying to sell and hopefully knows what they're doing, one is voicing preference...

Click to expand...

Totally agree. Your agent wins this round. It's not even a big enough thing to have a debate over, really.

onesecondglance said:

I know a fair number of posh English people (being a middle-class English person), and none of them have double-barrelled surnames. They do exist, but it's a stereotype not always borne out by reality.

Click to expand...

On the other hand... this. Might be completely irrelevant, seeing as your agent knows your market and the stereotype might not garner the same eyerolling in the states, but yes, here in the UK it is a cliche. (I have known a fair few double-barrelled posh people tho).

And for what it's worth, I don't find Digby-Hume clunky. The hyphenated names that roll off the tongue best seem to follow the 2-1 syllable pattern - I know some Lydon-Strutts, and also the Ingram-Hills

Sophia said:

Slightly off-topic: the only person I ever met who had a double-barrelled surname was a friend at uni. An ancestor of his was against the class system, and one of the ways he expressed this was by taking his own common surname and giving a different double-barrelled form of it to each of his sons, with the addition in each case being a kitchen utensil. Hence my friend's surname of Collander-Brown.

Click to expand...

Ah yes, I knew his brothers - John Spatula-Brown and Bob Eggwhisk-Brown

A family my father knew converted Jones to Dale-Jones, possibly because Jones is a common name in Wales.

Hyphenated does sound more posh. But I think this is something that will have two camps. I don't like reading hyphenated names, either. I get that they're out there and appreciate their usage in everyday life. Just...in fiction, I'm like, ACK! REALLY!? But I get over it quickly...there's just that initial ticked off feeling when I see it used.

OTOH, a hyphenated name could really become a differentiator if you play it up the right way. Kind of like Sara Paretsky did with VI Warshawski.

As a person with a hyphenated surname, I am firstly having hurt feelings about all the hate

Mine came about because my mum kept her maiden name and wanted to include it. I'd have liked to have done the same, but couldn't justify giving my children three surnames.

I went to school with at least half a dozen double-barelled-surnamed kids. Some of them rolled off the tongue far more easily than others. 2-1 or 2-2 syllables seems to be the easiest. One girl I knew had a 4-3, which is just cruel (and doesn't fit on any forms, besides).

There's a great footballer here called George Horlin-Smith. That's always struck me as a particularly posh name, though in Australia it has very little to do with class. People from all kinds of socioeconomic situations have hyphenated surnames.

I think my surname is gratefully innocuous, as far as hyphenated ones go. Had my parents been Cumberbatch and Humperdinck, I might have felt differently.

Er, real-life hyphenate here.

I'm not posh. (Didn't even know that stereotype existed! Maybe it's a UK thing?)

I love being a hyphenate.

And yes, my parents hyphenated already-very-lengthy surnames. My name is so long that it never fit on forms as a kid. My name is so long my mom made up a song to teach us to spell it (which I hummed in my head while writing my name till I was at least in my teens). Nobody can ever pronounce my name, and it's properly intimidating (even in classes where people are called by last name or whatever, I always get tagged with my first name). Lots of places can't fit my name in or don't do hyphenation, so every single form of ID I have says something slightly different -- sometimes it's mushed together, sometimes I only get half of it, sometimes they make it into a middle/last name instead of a hyphenated surname. One time I had to go back to the DMV armed with six forms of ID so they would let me get my driver's license ("Seriously? Do you REALLY think someone else has this name? I AM THE ONLY PERSON WITH THIS NAME ON THE PLANET!") I still love it.

I've also never been told that my name sounds in any way posh or arrogant or cliche or....anything, really, other than hard-to-spell. It's just me. Although my name is ethnic, and neither half is English, so that might have something to do with it. Now that I'm an adult, people sometimes assume I'm married because of the hyphenation and that my spouse is one of the halves, but it's rare people even think that far about it.

There are plenty of reasons people hyphenate. Names can be so important, and so linked to identity. In my family, I think my parents wanted us to have a name connection to both of them. I suspect ethnicity also played a role -- my parents are clearly different ethnicities and I think it probably would have felt weird for my mother if she had adopted my father's name wholly as hers.

Never heard the term "double-barreled" before, but I love it and am cheerfully going to steal it.

Anyway, I've never felt it was weird being a hyphenate. It's normal for me. There are plenty of us around. And a big fat BOO on the stereotyping -- I truly love my name and it makes me all sadface to think of people hating on it for the hyphen!

I cross-posted with you!

Anna Spargo-Ryan said:

As a person with a hyphenated surname, I am firstly having hurt feelings about all the hate

Click to expand...

Yes!

*high fives Anna in the hyphenate corner*

Sophia said:

Slightly off-topic: the only person I ever met who had a double-barrelled surname was a friend at uni. An ancestor of his was against the class system, and one of the ways he expressed this was by taking his own common surname and giving a different double-barrelled form of it to each of his sons, with the addition in each case being a kitchen utensil. Hence my friend's surname of Collander-Brown.

Click to expand...

Oh god - I've got such a crush on your uni-friend's ancestor.

I used to work for an extremely posh family. Their surname was Owen. (All the first names were very posh though!)

The only family I know with a double-barreled surname are a working class family.

I'm a working class girl - never going to change my surname, but if I ever change my mind and decide to have kids, then I'd want them to have my name as well as his, so they'd be double-barreled. I don't think poshness has much to do with it, really.

This isn't really what you're talking about, but, I have a character in my book called Sin-dy, it's her only name.

slhuang said:

I cross-posted with you!

Yes!

*high fives Anna in the hyphenate corner*

Click to expand...

*weeps openly*