what are they writting a book or publishing gold? OMG that's alot of money, most authors want to make that not spend that
Publishers are held to ever tighter margins: for some Christmas promotions, I was told, Waterstone's is demanding 65-70 per cent discount on all titles, in addition to contributions of £30,000 or more towards marketing costs for each promoted book.
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[/font][font=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]The basic lesson, he suggests, was that, while you try to stock as diverse a range of things as possible, you don't take too many risks with what you promote, and you spread your costs.[/font]
Publishers spoke to me darkly of how Waterstone's these days made them pay 'ludicrous figures' on top of the usual discounts to be involved in promotions, and then, if a promotion failed, had their books returned to them.
Memphis Ed said:.... is an example of why this board is such an asset.
James D. Macdonald said:Well, yeah, you're in a fix.
You're right -- no publisher is going to want books II and III if another publisher has Book I. Especially if that other publisher is PA.
Now it's also true that being with PA doesn't count as being published. You can wait out the seven years and present the first book, and if it's had typical PA sales it'll still count as unpublished. You'll probably get nailed with a lower advance because it's a reprint, but what the hey.
Skanky as that contract is, it's still a contract, and you're presumed to have known what you were doing when you signed it. Perhaps a clever lawyer can break their contract. I'm not a lawyer, clever or otherwise.
Stealth66 said:Where there's a Will, there's a way.
Lady of Prose said:You got that right, Ed. He's a publishing encyclopedia!
Cathy C said:Only if you sell that many [250,000] to bookstores in a single week. A slow progression won't do it. Plus, only the USA Today list and BookScan include "point of sale" transactions. The NYT list, Walden's, and some of the others rely on sales from the Publisher to the bookstore, not the end buyer.
changling said:I'm not very popular with the PA happymooners anymore,(fake sigh-those I meet at the fest). I besmirched their publisher to the point that Kinkos is now a better choice than PA.
But we’re stupid don’t you know that? They call us dimwits, nitwits and naïve. Fifteen thousand stupid dumb naïve nitwits. We’re not real published authors either. It hardly matters that we’re players; that we sell out of the trunks of our cars, on consignment in real bookstores (yes, real stores), flea markets, truck stops, cafes, coffeshops, book signings; give talks and perform readings at libraries (yes, real libraries), attend festivals and book fests (yes, real festivals--real bookfests). It hardly matters that we have books posted all over the internet, that we appear on television and radio and have newspaper articles and books mentioned in various print media. And that our publisher is on the forefront of publishing innovation.
They really ought to be thanking us poor dumb naive nitwits--that we found this stupid, dumb naive avenue of publishing, that allowed us to get our hopes and dreams out there, and out of their competing slushpiles. Sure we’re stupid for not taking the “traditional” way to published greatness--the trips to the post office. (Did I include a SASE, or did I forget to put a stamp on it. Now let’s see did this agent want a synopsis, outline and the first five pages, or was it the first five chapters? Now wasn’t this the publisher that will accept unagented submissions, but wants only a query letter and a synopsis, or was this the publisher that just wanted a one page query letter, or was it supposed to be not more than two pages, or was that six pages? Now, how many rejections will this make? I’m going to have to do a better job of record keeping. The bulletin board is full, and I don’t think I need to be punching holes in the wall with thumbtacks. I guess I’m fortunate that the agents and publishers have started cutting their preprinted rejection slips in half. I guess it saves them money and it certainly will take up less of my space. Maybe I need some kind of filing system. I sure wish there was a way around all this—some publisher that would make it easy for me to get started—some inexpensive way).
Sure we’re dumb naïve nitwits. We’re the Forrest Gumps of the publishing world. But as my mama used to say, “Stupid is as stupid does.”
...the “traditional” way to published greatness--the trips to the post office. (Did I include a SASE, or did I forget to put a stamp on it. Now let’s see did this agent want a synopsis, outline and the first five pages, or was it the first five chapters? Now wasn’t this the publisher that will accept unagented submissions, but wants only a query letter and a synopsis, or was this the publisher that just wanted a one page query letter, or was it supposed to be not more than two pages, or was that six pages? Now, how many rejections will this make? <<snip>>
I sure wish there was a way around all this—some publisher that would make it easy for me to get started—some inexpensive way).
mreddin said:If you look through the NYT Bestsellers, I think you will find some abuse memoirs there periodically the last couple of years. Like all other genres, they must be well written, engaging to the reader and sold to the appropriate agent that handles that genre. You could be the next Tom Clancy, but if the novel is not written with an eye towards marketability or is sent to the wrong editor or agent, it's not likely to sell I suspect.
Mike
Trepanny Peck said:Also, I think that White Raven's post would be good line-by-lined.
MacAllister said:Aruna, have you got a link to that thread?
I can't help but think that a big part of the breakdown is exactly this thinking:
The problem is that this writer wants a shortcut. But in the end, will spend even more energy, time, and money hustling books out of the trunk of his car than he ever would've spent had he done his research, done the homework, and landed a real publisher. Meanwhile, all that time, energy and money goes to selling, what, a couple hundred copies?
Some people expect to win at poker without learning how to play the game. When they don't win, they blame the dealer.
Christine N. said:My personal favorite...
Yeah, but being with PA is expecting to win at poker while sitting at the black jack table.
PA is nowhere even remotely close to the game - it ain't even in the same casino.
aruna said:Their bombastic claims of upsetting the book trade is like somebody with a video camera taking movies and expecting to throw over Hollywood.
Yeah, Rick, but did Doubleday ever call the cops on their authors and try to have them arrested?Rick Russell said:Jean Marie,
Your vehemence reminds me of an old friend whose complaints against his publisher were almost identical to yours. He warned everyone he knew to avoid the publisher, ranted and raved at how badly the publisher screwed him. Would get positively livid whenever the publisher was brought up. His publisher? Doubleday.
xhouseboy said:His answers came from a single source, and initially in the form of a level headed dissertation of PA's pros and cons, but this soon descended into a ranting rhetoric about how one had to be sleeping with the publisher's maid's cousin's dog in order to get a foot in the traditional publisher's door. QUOTE]
What kind of dog was it? If it was a Collie I might thin about it, after all I basically slept with a few scroungy mutts (Clopper, Meiners, Miranda) to get my book printed anyways. Maybe a pure breed would be worth it.
Kevin Yarbrough said:What kind of dog was it? If it was a Collie I might thin about it, after all I basically slept with a few scroungy mutts (Clopper, Meiners, Miranda) to get my book printed anyways. Maybe a pure breed would be worth it.
James D. Macdonald said:Where there's a will there are relatives.