Scotland's Referendum 2014

Sort of hehe, haven't really been following it, but saw the news on it last night. Not much detail, just it was (I think) the last campaigning day? It will be interesting to see which way it goes.

People were talking about practical things like can they keep the pound as currency etc, which is the sort of thing I'd never thought about before. It would be kind of cool to create your own new currency, but wouldn't it make things kind of unstable for a while?

If it's a yes vote, it will be 18 months at least before it happens as there is a lot of stuff to sort out.

And Scotland has been around for a lot longer than 300 years so have a strong sense of identity. So not really like growing up. More like splitting up a business partnership.

EYYYYYY IT'S MY JAM

Seriously, I've been hoping to see some #IndyRef discussions around here and was always disappointed that there wasn't any.

I'm very very excited about tomorrow's referendum! I'm voting Yes because, even though I think it'll hit the economy negatively for a while, in the end we will have more power as a nation to control our own destiny.

Yes-voting Scots are tired of lacking control over decisions that matter to us. We've voted for a Conservative government 6 years out of the last 68, but because votes are counted for the UK as a whole we've been ruled by Conservative governments for 38 of those years. We've had to see changes put in place that we vehemently disagree with, like privatising the NHS. We've had to be home to the TRIDENT nuclear weapons, and our own oil was hidden from us. And don't even get me started on what happened to our culture and history back when Scotland was originally joined with the UK...

We just want control of our own country instead of being ruled from by an English-based government. Independent Scotland won't be a perfect thing, but at least we'll be responsible for what happens to it.

We won't stop being British -- we're still Great Britain (a geographical entity), just not the United Kingdom (a political union). We're not doing this out of spite to the rest of the United Kingdom, and we're not making this choice to hurt them. We're all very reliant on each other for trade, tourism and commerce, and I hope that partnership won't end just because we have a separate governing body.

(The Wee Blue Book links are a source biased to Yes, however, the information on the website is well-sourced to impartial parties.)

I think that if you were to tell Thomas Jefferson that one day it would be possible to just vote out of the commonwealth he would say, "Yes. That's the whole goddamn point."

I have mixed feelings, but on the whole, I'm not happy. Regardless of the result, this country is now broken. If Scotland wins independence, it starts with a house divided. Not the best start for a new country. What frightens me more than anything is that 41 Labour seats will be lost and it will make it even more difficult for anyone to beat the Tories. So, yeah, Scotland may shake off the Tory yolk, but the rest of us will be stuck with them for a very long time unless there's electoral reform.

The Yes vote seems to be based entirely on emotion. Salmond blithely waves off the hard questions, like separate currency. I've yet to see him respond with anything other than 'Oh, we'll keep the pound."

I'm not sure I understand. Yes, there will be less seats at the next election. But that doesn't mean there will be proportionally less Labour MPs, will it?

mirandashell said:

I'm not sure I understand. Yes, there will be less seats at the next election. But that doesn't mean there will be proportionally less Labour MPs, will it?

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Here, from the BBC web site.You'll have to scroll down.

Hmmm.... that's a rehash of the 2010 election result. Doesn't mean the rest will be like that.

TBH, that's a crappy website. Whoever put it together is either trying to scare people or has no knowledge of how to use statistics.

mirandashell said:

Hmmm.... that's a rehash of the 2010 election result. Doesn't mean the rest will be like that.

TBH, that's a crappy website. Whoever put it together is either trying to scare people or has no knowledge of how to use statistics.

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Well, I hope you're right and they're wrong, because I'm not crazy about decades of Toryism, even if the current Labour party is crap.

Not sure there's a lot of difference between the two at the moment! LOL!

I agree with you though. But we'll have to wait and see at the next election. It's possible the turnout will be so low that it could be all 3 parties in charge.

mirandashell said:

Not sure there's a lot of difference between the two at the moment! LOL!

I agree with you though. But we'll have to wait and see at the next election. It's possible the turnout will be so low that it could be all 3 parties in charge.

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Heh. You're right there. I'd vote Green, if we had PR.
It just worries me that UKIP could really make an inroads in poorer urban areas.

Godyth said:

I know we'll find out on Friday, but I just wondered generally how some thought it might go and how people felt about the opportunity (because, this chance won't happen again anytime soon).

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As far as I can tell, most non-Scots are waiting to see what will happen. All the Scottish politicians have been busy shouting at each other and not answering any questions. The young Scots are worried about it because it's their future on the line.

I expect Emaree will know better than me though.

I was up in Edinburgh and Falkirk today, and my gut instinct is that it will be No. To be honest, it didn't feel like a country that was on the brink of making history.

If I was still living in Stirling, I would have been voting No. The media in London seems to be getting their knickers in a twist far more than what's going on in Scotland.

That wouldn't surprise me. The media do love to get all dramatic and noisy about stuff.

Considering the local polls show the race too close to call, can anyone tell us how voting is contested in England? In the states it becomes a civil matter with the FEC able to call a recount only if challenged in the court system.

But this brings up a very interesting point, if the count shows that Scottland has voted for independence by a recount margin, what country and court system would the recount be decided by?

If they count shows that Scottland has voted to remain in England by a recount margin, what is to prevent an English judge from ruling against a recount?

It suddenly go rather heated in the last few days didn't it?

Jack Asher said:

Considering the local polls show the race too close to call, can anyone tell us how voting is contested in England? In the states it becomes a civil matter with the FEC able to call a recount only if challenged in the court system.

But this brings up a very interesting point, if the count shows that Scottland has voted for independence by a recount margin, what country and court system would the recount be decided by?

If they count shows that Scottland has voted to remain in England by a recount margin, what is to prevent an English judge from ruling against a recount?

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Scotland isn't and has never been part of England, and there is no recount margin in this referendum - if one side wins by a single vote, they've won.

If anyone's referring to BBC articles for information on the referendum, please bear in mind that BBC are very heavily invested in a No Vote. I lvoe the Beeb usually, but they're a very biased source for this particular event.

(Most mainstream papers and broadcasters are No-leaning. The news stories and footage so far has been heavily edited to give a picture of Scotland where No is leading, but for most of us up here that doesn't match the reality.)

mirandashell said:

As far as I can tell, most non-Scots are waiting to see what will happen. All the Scottish politicians have been busy shouting at each other and not answering any questions. The young Scots are worried about it because it's their future on the line.

I expect Emaree will know better than me though.

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We don't know which way it will go. The Yes campaign are more outspoken, but No are quiet and determined.

At this point in the debate, the news is useless for information. There's a lot of desperate threats being thrown around to try and sway the vote one way or another at the last minute. It's all white noise for most of us now.

Young and old Scots are all worried, but Yes-voters are cautiously optimistic on top of that worry.

Residents that weren't born here but now live here are more scared: they're mostly No voters, and worried about being seen as foreigners and kicked out or attacked. The No campaign likes to prey on this fear by saying that if the Yes vote happens, we'll all be jobless, destitute, rioting in a barren world stripped of all oil and glory.

(In reality, neither side knows what will happen no matter what way the vote goes. But the EU, Great Britain, and even the US are tight-knit and reliant on each other's economic health. Nobody is going to stand around laughing if Scotland completely collapses and needs help.)

So yeah, you've got it spot on.

gothicangel said:

I was up in Edinburgh and Falkirk today, and my gut instinct is that it will be No. To be honest, it didn't feel like a country that was on the brink of making history.

If I was still living in Stirling, I would have been voting No. The media in London seems to be getting their knickers in a twist far more than what's going on in Scotland.

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My understanding of how the different areas lean politically:

Western Isles: Highly YES
Shetlands, Orkney: Leaning NO, but I could use a local to confirm/deny as I don't trust my sources on this one.
Highlands: Highly YES. Almost non-existent NO side.
Moray: Mixed, but slight majority to YES. Lots of quiet No voters here so could swing either way on the day.
Glasgow: Strongly YES, almost no NO side publicly visible.
Edinburgh: Majority NO, but the YES minority is still a healthy size.
Aberdeen, Perth and others: Not sure?
Closer to the English border: Strongly No

Mass Generalisations

Teens in general: YES supporters.
Older Scots in general: YES if they've supported SNP in the past, otherwise variable and depends on political leanings.
Residents with other birth nationalities: NO supporters.

(Apologies for any typos or clumsy wording, a bit tired tonight.)

Jack Asher said:

Considering the local polls show the race too close to call, can anyone tell us how voting is contested in England? In the states it becomes a civil matter with the FEC able to call a recount only if challenged in the court system.

But this brings up a very interesting point, if the count shows that Scottland has voted for independence by a recount margin, what country and court system would the recount be decided by?

If they count shows that Scottland has voted to remain in England by a recount margin, what is to prevent an English judge from ruling against a recount?

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*LOUD, CATLIKE HISSING NOISES*

:

Scotland has never been a part of England, any more than Wales or Northern Ireland are. We're voting to leave the United Kingdom, a union between Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. Confusingly for non-Brits, if we leave the United Kingdom we will remain part of Great Britain and will still be British -- Britain is the island.

Parametric said:

Scotland isn't and has never been part of England

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Oops, sorry! I'm still fuzzy on the England/Scotland/Some of Ireland (sort of)/Brittan/United Kingdom/Commonwealth/Empire thing.

Though in this instance I think that would be like saying the Massachusetts was once part of Delaware.

Most of my friends and family are in Glasgow and Lanarkshire. They're all voting 'Yes.' I think I would be, too, if I was still a resident.

Godyth said:

Okay, folks, which way is it going to go? Even some of us outside Scotland are excited about this, right? Anyone care besides me???

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For me, the best moments are seeing the Queen's face melt at the very thought of the plebs VOTING their way out of a UK.

ah, make my heart sing, it does.