The New Never-Ending PublishAmerica Thread (NEPAT)

I've had interactions with Harpe and he strikes me as a bit of a bully at times. I lost all respect for him a while ago and don't see that coming back any time soon.

I have a question.

On the PAMB, authors say they take cases of their own books to signings to sell, but yesterday I was reading J. A. Konrath's "Newbie's Guide to Publishing" which cautions writers "NEVER sell your own book unless the bookseller is out of stock". His reasoning is that even if you make money selling books this way, you don't want to be in competition with the bookseller. You want them to make money selling your books, so they like you and keep ordering the book.

This doesn't seem to apply to PA books, which are unlikely to be ordered for various reasons, but I was wondering if the authors here who have had signings have done this (allowed the bookseller to handle sales and only brought a case along for emergencies).

If it's a bookstore signing, I don't bring books. They order books. But I usually have a few in the car just in case.

Libraries are different, because the library is not allowed to handle money. So I might bring them myself to the library, unless the Friends of the Library handles it. But most times its easier if I do it.

At one of my PA signings, I furnished the books, and tipped the book store proprieter 20%of the selling price ($4.00 tip per sale) I almost broke even PA was the only winner.

I look forward to having real signings where the book store realizes profits from books they ordered.

Konrath's advice makes sense to me.

roncouch said:

At one of my PA signings, I furnished the books, and tipped the book store proprieter 20%of the selling price ($4.00 tip per sale) . . . .

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Pretty sweet deal. The norm I've seen around here is that the bookstore gets 40 percent, even on consignment. Not a "tip." A requirement of the deal.

--Ken

In general, the bookstore supplies the books. In the instances where they didn't have enough, or the books didn't come in, I have been known to dip into my own stash of books.

But what happens in my case is, the bookstore orders more copies and "reimburses" me my copies. I don't make money this way. (Except for my standard royalties.)

If I am doing some kind of a talk in a non-bookstore setting, then I will bring my own copies to sell. (Please note that these are copies I have purchased myself as extras to have on hand -- they are NOT my free author copies, which I am forbidden by contract to sell. Oh, and I assure you, I get way more than 2 free copies. <G>) Yes, I make much better money per copy this way.

But... I'm a writer. Not a booksalesman. In general when I do something like that, I still don't make enough to break even on gas and other expenses.

Susan G.

I don't take books to a book signing. I'm not a bookstore.

At non-bookstore events, I sign people's copies from their collections.

The only time I bring books to an event is to the "Book'em" charity events, and even then I don't handle money. Folks buy the books on the way out the door.

ResearchGuy said:

Pretty sweet deal. The norm I've seen around here is that the bookstore gets 40 percent, even on consignment. Not a "tip." A requirement of the deal.

--Ken

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Ken, I should have explained - it was a used book store. The proprieter was tickled pink to get 20%. I only sold around five or six books. One of the customers in the small MI town was the town mortician.
Ron

roncouch said:

Ken, I should have explained - it was a used book store. The proprietor was tickled pink to get 20%. I only sold around five or six books. One of the customers in the small MI town was the town mortician.
Ron

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Ah. Even the used book store I know in this area that hosts signings (and also carries some new books, esp. by local authors) requires 40 percent discount (although that is negotiable under special circumstances).

Selling five or six is nearly par for the course. A former bookstore owner acquaintance of mine (and something of an expert in book marketing) states that the average number of copies sold at a bookstore signing is eight. My own direct observations have run from zero to dozens (and hundreds in the case of a couple of big-name authors at major chain bookstores -- the biggest being Steve Allen for his last book, with a line that must have taken hours to work through).

--Ken

This may have been covered in this thread or another, but PA must be really struggling financially. They've periodically sent e-mails celebrating something or other, so they could run a "special discount offer", but the last month or so there have been a steady barrage of these things. I just got this:

Dear Author,

Alright, one more week, for authors who choose to have books on hand! Remember, this one-time discount offer will not come back anytime soon.

All orders of 20 or more copies: 55 pct discount.

Phone orders only, at 301 695 1707, between 9am - 5pm EST. Hardcovers are excluded, but full-color books are included! Offer expires this Friday, Sept. 12.

Thank you!

PublishAmerica Author Support Team

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For any PA authors reading this, 55% off is still not a good deal. It's still more than bookstores can (or will) sell them for. Meaning, even if you can get someone to take them on consignment (not that easy), and they do happen to sell (even rarer), you're going to be about five bucks in the red for each one.

Alright, one more week,

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Notice that they misspelled "all right." Miranda is the one in upper management who can't spell, but it's possible that the lower echelons are also spelling challenged.

And what "hardcovers"? As I recall, that "Independence" imprint died a-borning several years ago.

There were hardcovers in the early years, and given the seven-year contract I'm sure some of them are still technically available. An Amazon search for Publisherublishamerica binding:hardcover yields 114 results.

Besides, mentioning hardcovers in the letter makes them sound more like a publisher, doesn't it?

tru dat

There are no hardcovers (eta : any longer), but that phrase makes it seem as though PA actually prints them. I wonder if any of the authors ever asked about their books being released as hardcovers rather than paperbacks.

Gravity said:

And what "hardcovers"? As I recall, that "Independence" imprint died a-borning several years ago.

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That's probably in there just to maintain an illusion of quality. Kind of like a Motel 6 offering a discount, but adding, "Honeymoon suites with a jacuzzi and heart-shaped bed excluded."

SC Harrison said:

Kind of like a Motel 6 offering a discount, but adding, "Honeymoon suites with a jacuzzi and heart-shaped bed excluded."

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:::shudder::: You know the old saw, "lie down with dogs, rise up with fleas"? If Motel 6 offers a Jacuzzi, it would be "lie down in this, rise up with STDs they don't even have names for yet."

They're charging for $30 for paperbacks?

Wow. Just wow. I put Ford Madox Ford back on the shelf when I realised it was £12.

Hi there..

I am new to this forum but I am (sadly) a P.A. published author. Yes prices have skyrocketed over the last week or so. In some cases anywhere from $2 to $5 per paperback. Anyone questioning their pricing policies has had their user names and passwords deactivated (mine being one of them) and scolded by P.A. as requiring a "time out" if we can't tow the line.
This has ocurred twice before to me in particluar because Ihad the apparent "gaul" to ask pertinant questions.
I am many authors this week have asked that our contracts be broken or forfeited to be told that we have to hand over $300 in order to thave th epleasure of P.A. termination our 7year contracts.
Although I have grown a small and loyal readership due to my own hard work and marketing, I have now had potential buyers tell me outrigh tthat they'd love to read my book.....but.....pricing is too high.
P.A. royalites are a joke as well and they have been well know to continue to sell the work of former authors who have broken contrats without forwarding any royalites.
I am currently trying to break my contract and have been actiley seeking a new publisher for my next 2 manuscripts. I would NEVER recommend P.A. to anyone.

Hi Heather, and welcome to the AW forums! Sorry to hear about the problems with PA (especially the recent price hike), but best of luck in getting a new publisher.

Welcome Heather!

Do you still have a copy of the email or letter demanding $300? There are people here who are interested in reading it.

Hi Heather. I am also a PA author and was banned from their boards early in 07' for asking such questions. My contract is in force, I haven't asked for rights back although I no longer market the book. I have it on Myspace only, just for the simple fact I do not have the heart to take it off. I have heard of others who requested their rights back for the standard $300 fee. Best thing to do is to forget PA and said PA book, write a better one and re-submit elsewhere no matter how long it takes for acceptance. Some say to start out with smaller presses, but not necessarily POD.

I feel for you. Been there done that, but you came to the right place for help and understanding. Welcome!

Wow. When I demanded my rights back they gave in quickly. No fee. And that was only about a year and a half ago. Maybe they are realizing that they're losing their grip on the "sleaze-publishing" market.

Open arms for you here, Heather. PA's dictatorial behavior is unrelenting and easily qualifies as cruel and unusual punishment. Simply for asking legitimate questions. It's fab you have two additional books in inventory. They deserve a better place.

Tri

A few other authors have been advised by their lawyers to get P.A. to forward a detailed expense report, sales report etc. in order to apprise them of why it costs $300 to break the contract. I will copy you the form email letter a number of us have gotten.