The New Never-Ending PublishAmerica Thread (NEPAT)

smsarber said:

When I first came here, there were posts that said an agent/publisher wouldn't look at your work if they happened to know about your dealings with PA.

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That's not quite it. The advice is don't mention your PA book as a writing credit when approaching agents. Because it isn't one.

Scribhneoir said:

That's not quite it. The advice is don't mention your PA book as a writing credit when approaching agents. Because it isn't one.

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Thanks! Now that you said that I remember. And I will never mention it. They say any publicity is good publicity (even if there's no publicity with PA), but that just ain't true

Here's a thought, and just a thought, because I think we need a break from the usual here. Ken, Dave K., and Don should write a book about the shady business practices of PA and submit it to PA to see if it passes their (ahem) screening process. Dave K. and Ken because of their exhaustive research and foresight, and Don because of his pure intentions to warn hopeful writers. I couldn't be a part of it for obvious reasons--I'm too dramatic, emotionally charged and occasionally vulgar for it. But then again, I could make it fun.

Anyway, I'm sure I'll be recieving some unhappy responses to this, so I will say again--just a thought.

smsarber said:

Here's a thought, and just a thought, because I think we need a break from the usual here. Ken, Dave K., and Don should write a book about the shady business practices of PA and submit it to PA to see if it passes their (ahem) screening process.....

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An amusing thought, but it would require engaging in deliberate deception, even if not carried through all the way.

My own take on PA is on a couple of pages in my booklet on "The Pursuit of Publishing: An Unvarnished Guide for the Perplexed."

The whole thing can be read (in preview form) for free at Lulu.com, or it can be purchased. Mostly, though, I give it away to budding authors who might be at risk.

--Ken

The other thing is, I'm told that PA scans for, and rejects, books that have characters named Miranda, Willem, and Larry.

James D. Macdonald said:

The other thing is, I'm told that PA scans for, and rejects, books that have characters named Miranda, Willem, and Larry.

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That's so funny that it's almost worth testing.

Almost.

James D. Macdonald said:

The other thing is, I'm told that PA scans for, and rejects, books that have characters named Miranda, Willem, and Larry.

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I often wonder if the Unholy Trinity sits around thinking "how do we keep those damned authors from getting any of our money."

smsarber said:

When I first came here, there were posts that said an agent/publisher wouldn't look at your work if they happened to know about your dealings with PA.

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I remember reading something along those lines in this Thread as well, although my recollection of what was said is that publishers would not look at your book if they found out that PA had published that book previously, even if PA no longer had any rights to it. I don't remember it necessarily applying to future works. And of course, I have no personal knowledge as to whether any of this is true or not. I would hope not.

Reprints are often a tough sell regardless of who the previous publisher was.

Then you have the PA authors who tell each other that no legitimate publisher will look at your subsequent works if you've ever said anything bad about PA. That isn't true either.

Reprints are a tough sell, though my agent managed to do so with one of my series.

Reprints might be a very tough sell if PA was the original "publisher" but I'm sure it can be done if the writer's words are worth buying.

But for most PA victims, the best course is to write a new and better book and submit to real publishers or land a good agent.

PA Lurkers, need to know how to find a real publisher?

Go into a bookstore. Look inside books similar to your own. That publisher paid the writer real money for those words.

Chances are excellent there won't be any overpriced PA titles shelved there.

Don Davidson said:

I remember reading something along those lines in this Thread as well, although my recollection of what was said is that publishers would not look at your book if they found out that PA had published that book previously, even if PA no longer had any rights to it. I don't remember it necessarily applying to future works. And of course, I have no personal knowledge as to whether any of this is true or not. I would hope not.

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A few publishers and agents have said that PA books do not count as publishing credits. Here is one specific post

More can be found at the thread "What professional writers, editors say about PA".

The other thing about PA titles is that their publishing histories, even for a PA Best Seller, place them firmly in the Proven Failure range. This may not be the book's fault -- it could be a wonderful book. But those prices, the discount, the lack of distribution, PA's reputation, make it very hard for any of their titles to sell anywhere outside of the laughable range.

Does anyone have best seller figures for PA? I'm curious. I know the average book sells 75 copies, but I also know that some self-published books sell 20,000+ copies, and that these are usually non-fiction books that are sold at conventions or specialty stores and the like.

PA boasted that one of their titles sold 5,200 copies, but information seems to be that the author bought those himself.

James D. Macdonald said:

The other thing is, I'm told that PA scans for, and rejects, books that have characters named Miranda, Willem, and Larry.

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Absolutely true.
And they also scan for inflammatory words such as scam, hoax, Stooges, liars, cheats and such.
Since Atlanta Nights got under the radar, they're paranoid about getting stung again.

Just so you know.

James D. Macdonald said:

PA boasted that one of their titles sold 5,200 copies, but information seems to be that the author bought those himself.

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That was A Destiny Foretold by Neo Franco Contu.

He was subsequently banned from the PAMB.
You can google it for further information if you're interested.

So if you wrote a Travis Tea style book about Melinda, William, and Harry, it would get accepted? More and more I'm tempted to sit down with a few good CDs and a fifth of whiskey and throw together a 20,000 word satire about dishonest...traditional bakers...who agree to bake any recipe for free but charge twice as much as the usual bakers pressure customers to buy their incompletely stirred cakes.

ChristineR said:

So if you wrote a Travis Tea style book about Melinda, William, and Harry, it would get accepted? More and more I'm tempted to sit down with a few good CDs and a fifth of whiskey and throw together a 20,000 word satire about dishonest...traditional bakers...who agree to bake any recipe for free but charge twice as much as the usual bakers pressure customers to buy their incompletely stirred cakes.

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Possibly, if you are very, very careful.

But why waste the energy?
Write a real story and send it to a real publisher instead.

James D. Macdonald said:

PA boasted that one of their titles sold 5,200 copies, but information seems to be that the author bought those himself.

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How the hell did he afford it?

Two words: Loan Shark!

He claimed to have resold 2000 copies himself. How, I have no idea. And 5,200 is the total number sold, not the number sold to him. Still, at $25 for a 200 page book (minus whatever discount PA gave him), you're talking about a lot of money.

ChristineR said:

He claimed to have resold 2000 copies himself. How, I have no idea. And 5,200 is the total number sold, not the number sold to him. Still, at $25 for a 200 page book (minus whatever discount PA gave him), you're talking about a lot of money.

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I've forgotten the name of the book and the author's name, but I do remember he was of spanish descent and from the San Antonio area. He was a veteran and had served in Viet Nam, I believe as an officer. He wrote his novel from the viewpoint of a young Mexican boy during the Mexican Revolution. Additionally, he was able to get local school teachers interested in his book because of the historical nature of it, and if I am not mistaken, he used his military background to give talks to groups in schools like Pan American University and used that platform to generate interest in his book. However, he did it, I believe he must be the most successful PA author to date.

My guess is that he bought 5,000 himself, and generated 200 sales otherwise.

Those were the days when PA books went for $19.95, too. (Which was still five bucks more than the traffic would bear when you're looking at sales to someone who doesn't know you personally.)

The book's up on Amazon and has a look inside feature.

The writing is good, to judge by the much too limited sample.

I wish he could have placed it with a real publisher. Maybe he used PA strictly as a printer, but there are less costly alternatives.