Ezine published without permission

Cathy C · Sep 7, 2014

Mileage will vary, of course, as with all things. I have had several markets simply publish the piece and pay me without a word or contract. I would simply get a check and a copy of the issue. And they were fairly well known publications. Now, it could simply be that they tried to reach me and got the email or mail address wrong and the acceptance never reached me. Or, it could be they never tried.

I did a lot of magazine work where this happened, as well. I've asked editors which they prefer as far as whether or not they want to know about the first rights issue. It's a mixed bag. :Shrug:

All you can do is do the best you can. There is no one standard in this business.

Jamesaritchie · Sep 8, 2014

King Neptune said:
A submission is a request to be considered for publication, no more, no less. As such requesting a letter or contract isn't really appropriate, and some editors would find it strange.

.

In thirty-five years, I've never had a editor be anything but polite when I inquired about pay rates, contracts, or anything else. I'd find it unbelievably strange if one did. I have had editors wonder why writers don't inquire far more often, and I've wondered the same.

It is always appropriate to ask about pay rate, rights requested, publication terms, whether you get a chance to see the editor story before publication, etc. For that matter, it is also always appropriate to ask for more money, or to ask for at least some money, even if the magazine usually doesn't pay.

Every editor I've known or dealt with expects writers to ask such things, and are surprised when they don't.

Jamesaritchie · Sep 8, 2014

King Neptune said:
Submitting a story is a request that it be published. In itself and by the guidelines submission was not permission.

To you, maybe. To many small magazines out there, submission most certainly is permission to publish, and should be. That's just how it is.

Did you expect the magazine to ask for permission to publish the story. You can't have it both ways. You say that submitting the story is a request that it be published. Huh?

So by submitting the story, you requested that they publish the story, but you did not give them permission to publish the story? Really?

You're completely contradicting yourself.

A magazine says and us stories, and if we like them, we'll publish them, and then you're surprised when they do exactly this. This is not, in any way, unprofessional. Unprofessional is being surprised when a magazine does exactly what every magazine out there says it's going to do, which is publish some of the stories writers submit. It's just really odd to think submitting a story is not giving permission to publish it.

The only reason it doesn't work this way at most magazines is because money is involved, taxes are involved, and particular rights are involved, which means a contract must be signed.

If, however, a magazine does not use contracts, there is no reason at all to contact the writer to ask for permission to publish. If the writer didn't want the magazine to publish the story, why in bloody Rupa would he submit the story?

veinglory · Sep 8, 2014

And if the accept simultaneous submission they just all publish it and are happy?

If like may they do not reply to rejection you just never publish the work? Or have to give then a long period and withdraw first?

I see no way for them to get publishing rights without those rights being assigned. And the way I write a submission email at least, it does not assign those rights.

King Neptune · Sep 8, 2014

Jamesaritchie said:
In thirty-five years, I've never had a editor be anything but polite when I inquired about pay rates, contracts, or anything else. I'd find it unbelievably strange if one did. I have had editors wonder why writers don't inquire far more often, and I've wondered the same.

It is always appropriate to ask about pay rate, rights requested, publication terms, whether you get a chance to see the editor story before publication, etc. For that matter, it is also always appropriate to ask for more money, or to ask for at least some money, even if the magazine usually doesn't pay.

Every editor I've known or dealt with expects writers to ask such things, and are surprised when they don't.

I was thinking about asking in the cover letter. If I were the editor, then my reply would be: Did you bother reading what on the guideline page?

But after the initial submission I agree that asking for more details or more money is reasonable.

King Neptune · Sep 8, 2014

veinglory said:
I see no way for them to get publishing rights without those rights being assigned. And the way I write a submission email at least, it does not assign those rights.

I agree. Without an explicit grant of rights there is no grant of rights.

gettingby · Sep 9, 2014

What confuses me is that you wanted this place to publish your story when you sent it in. And they did. Sure it would have been great to get an acceptance letter. But isn't getting published by this place what you wanted? I am having a hard time understanding why you are so upset since you got what you originally wanted.

King Neptune · Sep 9, 2014

gettingby said:
What confuses me is that you wanted this place to publish your story when you sent it in. And they did. Sure it would have been great to get an acceptance letter. But isn't getting published by this place what you wanted? I am having a hard time understanding why you are so upset since you got what you originally wanted.

I find it surprising that anyone who writes short fiction would be surprised that someone was annoyed by such an unprofessional ezine.

Cybernaught · Sep 9, 2014

If you're really so bothered by this, all you have to do is send them an email politely requesting them to remove the piece from their archives. I can't stress the word politely enough.

Cathy C · Sep 9, 2014

King Neptune said:
I find it surprising that anyone who writes short fiction would be surprised that someone was annoyed by such an unprofessional ezine.

I write a lot of short fiction. My greatest hope in sending out a spec piece is that nothing further is required on my part. No edits, no discussion. Just publish it as is. If there's a check, more the better! :Shrug:

Abderian · Sep 9, 2014

gettingby said:
What confuses me is that you wanted this place to publish your story when you sent it in. And they did. Sure it would have been great to get an acceptance letter. But isn't getting published by this place what you wanted? I am having a hard time understanding why you are so upset since you got what you originally wanted.

From what I understand, the editor published the piece a year after it was submitted and after King Neptune had emailed asking whether s/he was still considering it. The editor didn't reply to the email and instead published the piece. In an industry where some publications don't allow simultaneous subs and get annoyed if you withdraw a submission because it's published elsewhere, the editor's behaviour is inexcusable.

In King Neptune's circumstances I wouldn't have gone back to check the publication after receiving no reply to my email and would have continued to sub my work, offering first publication rights. If the story was published those rights would have been invalid and King Neptune's rep would be soiled with publisher and elsewhere.

Being put at risk of that was not what King Neptune wanted.

King Neptune · Sep 9, 2014

Abderian said:
From what I understand, the editor published the piece a year after it was submitted and after King Neptune had emailed asking whether s/he was still considering it. The editor didn't reply to the email and instead published the piece. In an industry where some publications don't allow simultaneous subs and get annoyed if you withdraw a submission because it's published elsewhere, the editor's behaviour is inexcusable.

In King Neptune's circumstances I wouldn't have gone back to check the publication after receiving no reply to my email and would have continued to sub my work, offering first publication rights. If the story was published those rights would have been invalid and King Neptune's rep would be soiled with publisher and elsewhere.

Being put at risk of that was not what King Neptune wanted.

I still own first publication rights, but, as you mentioned, those right have been tarnished. Or, if I wanted to think even nastier thoughts, the first rights were stolen, but I prefer to contend that I still have those.

And the story has been out for submission since I realized that I hadn't heard anything for more than a year.

King Neptune · Sep 9, 2014

Cathy C said:
I write a lot of short fiction. My greatest hope in sending out a spec piece is that nothing further is required on my part. No edits, no discussion. Just publish it as is. If there's a check, more the better!

Well, now you know an ezine that does exactly that. Send in something and see what happens.

Witch_turtle · Sep 9, 2014

I really can't wrap my head around why some people are confused by Neptune's reaction to this. While it may be technically correct that he "got what he wanted" when the zine published what he submitted, it's absolutely inexcusable that they did it without even informing him. Regardless of whether they use contracts or not.

King Neptune · Sep 10, 2014

Witch_turtle said:
I really can't wrap my head around why some people are confused by Neptune's reaction to this. While it may be technically correct that he "got what he wanted" when the zine published what he submitted, it's absolutely inexcusable that they did it without even informing him. Regardless of whether they use contracts or not.

I had that same problem understanding some of the posts, until I realized that some people have never even thought about submitting anything for publication, and there are few places that give a clear explanation of the process of submitting and selling short fiction in the various magazine markets. The short story market is different from selling novels, non-fiction articles, and other kinds of writing.

Reading through this thread might give someone some idea of steps involved, but it doesn't all come together until one starts reading the submission guidelines of a few dozen (or hundred) magazines and adjusting to the varying demands, and so on.

Jenkki · Sep 10, 2014

One lesson this might be to only submit to paying markets. After all, they would need to contact you on either acceptance or publication in order to arrange payment. I hadn't in my earlier post realized this was a non-paying market.

Ezine published without permission

Cathy C

Ooo! Shiny new cover!

Jamesaritchie

Jamesaritchie

veinglory

volitare nequeo

King Neptune

King Neptune

gettingby

King Neptune

Cybernaught

Decker

Cathy C

Ooo! Shiny new cover!

Abderian

King Neptune

King Neptune

Witch_turtle

hanging around for a spell

King Neptune

Jenkki