Approach Agent or Publisher First?

readmikenow said:

I have spoken with writers who tell me it's best to get an agent to have a book writing career. I recently spoke with someone who said they've never had an agent and go directly to publishers when their book is ready. They have done well selling their work. What is best? Is there an advantage of one over the other?

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An agent isn't just some checklist that an author needs to secure before making it as a full time writer.

Which way to go depends a lot on you, the publisher, and your comfort level.

I've had a similar conversation with a NYT bestseller who doesn't have an agent. He had a background where he was comfortable reading the contract and understanding it and a publisher well known for not trying any monkey business, so he didn't feel the need for an agent.

However, despite his background, he said he would have gone with an agent had he been dealing with any other publisher.

Personallly, I'm looking at getting an agent because I know my limitations. I can't negotiate for squat and I know it, but that's what agents do.

Depends what kind of publisher you hope to sell your book to...

TomKnighton said:

Personallly, I'm looking at getting an agent because I know my limitations.

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This.

I don't have contacts in the publishing world; my agent does.

I can't understand publishing contracts or royalties or international rights; my agent does.

My agent also happens to be a personal friend, which helps, but even if she wasn't I'd feel happier trusting someone else with all this malarky so I can just concentrate on writing

Personally, I'm going for agents first. I would prefer to have someone which experience of the publishing industry to fight my corner (when I sell I will also join the Society of Authors.)

I think in the past its been more prevalent to go for a publisher first, but the norm is to get an agent. Many good publishers won't even look at unsolicited MSS now.

An agent makes things easier. This is simply the way it works. Without an agent, it's extremely difficult to impossible for a new writer to even get a manuscript in front of an editor at a a large publisher. "No unsolicited queries or manuscripts" is common at large publishers. It's the norm. If publishers won't even read your queries, how are you going to sell them a novel?

Even with publisher who will look at unsolicited queries and manuscripts, you're still at a disadvantage because your work hasn't gone through a gatekeeper who will weed out most of the bad manuscripts. As an editor, would you rather read a novel sent in by a good agent, or one by a new writer with no sales?

This certainly doesn't mean it can't be done. It does mean you'll probably have to approach much smaller publishers.

And a good agent does a heck of a lot more than place your manuscript in front of an editor, and a heck of a lot more than negotiate a contract. When yu start selling, all sorts of other writing opportunities can come your way, all sorts of subsidiary rights, can come into play, and an agent not only handles the contracts for these, but often finds them for you. In short, an agent handles the business, and lets you spend your time writing.

On the other hand, while a good agent is a huge advantage, if you have a head for business, and if you are willing to learn as much abut the business side of writing as any agent, and if you can write well enough, it's certainly possible to build a career without an agent.

This depends on how you want to manage your business and what your publishing goals are. Most big traditional presses won't take unagented submissions, so if you're targeting those, definitely get an agent.

Smaller presses and digital imprints of some publishers don't require an agent. If you find submission guidelines when you're researching a press, then you can probably submit directly.

One thing you shouldn't do is submit all over first, rack up the Rs, then give the manuscript to the agent to try to sell. The agent can't take it back to any press that has already rejected it so you've already shut all the doors. If you're planning on going agented, start there.

When looking for an agent, be aware of what you want from the business relationship, and what you don't want. Agents offer a variety of different things. Some are editors, some lawyers who can offer more during contract negotiations, some won't do anything but present the manuscript to editors. What they offer and what you want are things that you should discuss before signing anyone.

First, you finish the book.

I. If you're going for print publication with one of the Big Five New York Publishers you probably need an agent, because these publishers mostly don't look at unagented manuscripts.

Who are the Big Five? If you go to a book-and-mortar bookstore or the book aisle in the grocery and run your finger down a row of books, 90% of them are from the Big Five. Most of the folks who make good money writing publish with one of these imprints. We're talking Hatchette, McMillian, Penguin Random House, Harper Collins, Simon & Schuster and all the subsidiaries thereof.

So that is one career path. If you take it, you need an agent.

A good agent will not only get your foot in the door, she will (a) know the best place to sell your work, which makes the sale more likely, (b) get the best contract terms, and (c) keep the author from making contract mistakes.

There are exceptions to the rule that you need an agent to get in this particular door. Some folk meet an editor at a conference; they're already published; they have a following for their fanfic; they are successfully self-published; they know somebody who knows somebody ...


II. Some imprints from the Big Five (Tor, Avon,) and some large independent publishers (HQN, Baen, Kensington, Ellora's Cave, Sourcebooks, Grand Central, Carina) accept unagented manuscripts.

These books are distributed to brick-and-mortar stores and groceries. Writers can do very well indeed dealing with this set of publishers. A number of the folks making a living at writing sell to these companies.

If you plan to deal with them, you do not need an agent to get your work seen. But a good agent might still perform functions (a), (b), and (c) above.


III. E-publishers and almost all small presses accept unagented submissions.

Agents do not generally submit to these publishers because there's not enough advance money in it.


IV. Self publishing/indie publishing, of course, doesn't need an agent.


So, the short answer is --

-- You need an agent for some career paths and not for others.
-- There are many profitable career paths that don't require an agent.
-- Even where an agent is required, you may be able to sneak by without one, depending.
-- Agents earn their weight in gold at contract time.
-- If you plan to submit to the Big Five, get an agent before you start firing your ms out to random publishers.
-- Finish the book.

Like everyone else said, it depends what your goals are. Most big publishers won't accept unagented submissions, but if you wanted to go small press you could do that yourself. Even still, you'll have to negotiate everything without an agent and I personally would not be comfortable with that.

There are advantages either way...just like everybody else said, it depends on your publishing goals. When I first started, I knew I wanted an agent, so that was where I began, but after a slew of rejections (even after requests of partials and fulls), I decided to try subbing to decent digital first publishers to get some publishing creds. I also entered some contests. When self-pubbing hit the scene hard a few years ago, I dabbled in that, too. By the time I was ready to sub to agents again, I had a lot of accolades I could include (I was already a PAN member of RWA, won a contest and finaled in another major one, sold LOTS of books, got great reviews in major publications, etc.). Within a few months of my querying process I got multiple offers.

My "goals" are different than when I first started. Just because I have an agent now doesn't mean I plan on going through her for everything. I've made my own connections, which I'll still utilize, and I really like self-pubbing some projects. However, she gets me in the Big 5 and handles my foreign and film rights. For me, having an agent is part of my publishing goals, but not "the" goal. Could I make a decent living without one? Yes, but I want my hands in as many pots as possible, and having an agent will get me in more of them.

FWIW, I have spent decades negotiating contracts, and I know contract law inside and out, having spent the first decade of my career as a commercial litigator. I have never seen a literary contract, and consider myself unqualified to negotiate one. Even if you aren't planning to go with an agent, I think it would be dangerous not to hire a literary attorney.

I think you should always query agents first so that you can say you went for the biggest option before anything else. But it is discouraging. I can't get an agent for my life. I must suck really, really bad. But . . . it's still good to try.

MookyMcD said:

FWIW, I have spent decades negotiating contracts, and I know contract law inside and out, having spent the first decade of my career as a commercial litigator. I have never seen a literary contract, and consider myself unqualified to negotiate one. Even if you aren't planning to go with an agent, I think it would be dangerous not to hire a literary attorney.

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That's good advice.

"Most" publishing contracts really aren't very complicated. The real trick with a publishing contract is more about knowing what is and isn't negotiable, rather than complexity.

An agent, or a writer, doesn't have to draw up a contract, and for the most part, one publishing contract is like every other, as far as what it says. Where they differ is royalty percentage electronic rights, size of advance, things like this. Most of the contract will be boilerplate. It's just those few clauses, those few areas, where negotiation is the norm, that you have to worry about. You have to know how much you can ask for, and what rights you can negotiate.

I've negotiated a couple, and it wasn't very difficult at all. Sample contracts are available online, what agents do and don't negotiate is available, and so is pretty much everything else. I found a contract a top agent had negotiated at that publishing house, made a list, and asked for the same. I received it.

But, yes, it's smart to get an IP attorney to do it for you. An IP attorney has a lot more clout, simply because he is an IP attorney.

Another huge advantage of an IP attorney over an agent is that an IP attorney takes a one time fee, but an agent takes fifteen percent domestic, and twenty percent foreign, for life.

Is there any prevailing wisdom when it comes to querying both agents and publishing houses that accept unsolicited queries? Kind of like casting one's net, I'be been thinking...

Updrifting said:

Is there any prevailing wisdom when it comes to querying both agents and publishing houses that accept unsolicited queries? Kind of like casting one's net, I'be been thinking...

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I think you would have to inform any agent that you've been reject by X publisher. So say, you subbed to Snow Books and they said no, and your agent thinks the book would be perfect for Snow Books, and you say nothing, the agent is going to be pissed if the editor comes back saying we rejected this six months ago.

I extensively queried agents first, because I thought (and still think) that's the best way to go. However, none were interested, so I queried publishers direct until one signed me up. I'm hoping that now I don't need an agent, I'll get one!

My understanding is that it is a Very Bad Idea (note the capitals ) to send your book off to publishers and agents at the same time. If you get a lot of rejections from publishers, those are places that your potential future agent can't send your book again. Meaning you've made their job more difficult and they will be less likely to take you on.

From everything I've seen, if you want to publish traditionally, it's best to try for an agent first. If you exhaust all your options, then send it to publishers. It's a LONG process.....

Alright, then. So for the extremely uninformed, did you search web sites/utilize the Writer's Market/how did you identify which publishers might be the best fit for your work?

This also depends largely on genre.

Updrifting said:

Alright, then. So for the extremely uninformed, did you search web sites/utilize the Writer's Market/how did you identify which publishers might be the best fit coy your work?

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It's not complicated. I looked at books like mine then looked at who published them.

Yes, it really is that simple.

VoireyLinger said:

It's not complicated. I looked at books like mine then looked at who published them.

Yes, it really is that simple.

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With all of the resources out there (which I made the mistake of burning a LOT of hours on first), this is what I found is the best agent database, too.

Updrifting said:

Alright, then. So for the extremely uninformed, did you search web sites/utilize the Writer's Market/how did you identify which publishers might be the best fit coy your work?

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Well, in addition to the Bewares thread here about agencies and publishers, a great database to use for both agents and publishers is Query Tracker: www.querytracker.net

After seeing all the boilerplate language my agent struck out of my contract (which I wouldn't even have known to question) and the language he was able to insert (which I wouldn't have known needed inserting), was I glad to have an agent?

Yes.

Not to mention I couldn't have gotten the MS to any of the editors he approached.

Not to mention he's an amazing reader and literary counselor.

So my biased opinion: agent first.

What Phael said.

I tried agents and couldn't find one, so I went to publishers directly instead. I signed with one of the biggies and, six books later (four books out; two written and scheduled for publication), haven't looked back.

But I got insanely lucky, and though I still don't have an agent, and though I just signed another book contract, I'm certain if I were smarter I'd have picked one up by now. Here are a few of the things an agent would almost certainly be better at than I am:

Negotiating the advance.

Negotiating the terms (Three-book contract with basket accounting? Advance broken into five installments? American rights, English-language rights, or world rights?).

Bugging the publisher for money when it is late.

Being the bad guy when there are disputes about a book cover or cover copy or a rescheduled pub date that results in a check you were counting on coming three months later than when you need it or a rescheduled pub date that results in you having three fewer months to write than you were counting on.

And more. It isn't just about getting in the door.

A publisher works with you; an agent works for you. It is almost always better, in my opinion, to have someone on your side.

Again, if I were smarter I'd go get an agent today. I don't know what internal force is keeping me from doing so.

My two wooden nickels: take 'em for what they're worth.