Hannibal?

lalyil

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I'm on the other side of the fence. I really like that Hannibal is grey--more on the black side, but grey nonetheless. He has these moments of humanity that make you wonder what he would have turned out like if his life had gone differently. *Spoilers* HANNIBAL RISING really shows you how he turned into the monster that he is. He and his little sister fled the Nazis, but were found in their hunting cabin. The men who found them were starving. They abused them both, but they killed Hannibal's sister and made him eat her. That's really what flipped the switch. He set his sights on vengeance for his sister's murder. So you feel sorry for him, but fear him at the same time. I think Harris did a great job portraying this throughout the series. In THE SILENCE OF THE LAMBS he had these moments of humanity where you could see he really cared about Clarice, mixed with him wearing a prison guard's face as a mask. For me, the show has done well balancing that humanity with the monster. Abigail is irritating, but I like seeing what she brings out in Hannibal. The person I'd love to see him cook up is Freddy Loundes even though *Spoiler* I know she doesn't die until Red Dragon.

Hannibal reminds me of a stray dog. He's vicious at times, and mistrusting, and there are only a couple people he lets himself connect to, but you know at any time his instincts can take over and he'll attack.

The knowledge of why he's the monster he is, is something I'd expect in any villain. I just don't like them turning all softie. Once they turn to who they are, I like them to stay that way.
But that's my own taste ;)
I remember from the film how he was like with Clarice. Then again you could say Will, and Lecter's psychiatrist (forgot her name), both bring out another side of Lecter too. Even Alana does. But not in the same way Abigail does. I find that too extreme for his character and doesn't fit him, and it's why I still want to hope he's treating her the way he does for his selfish needs.

Is Abigail in the books at all? Still hoping she dies soon. lol
 

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Is Abigail in the books at all? Still hoping she dies soon. lol

Not that I recall. There's a only brief mention of the Minnesota Shrike in Red Dragon that they drew from for the show. Hannibal Rising ends with Hannibal coming to America to do a residency at John's Hopkins. When Red Dragon starts, Hannibal has already been caught and is in prison. He and Will work together to capture the Toothfairy.

I guess to me, it's almost like he sees Abigail as a replacement for his sister. Young, in trouble, someone who needs him. He and Will never had that kind of relationship *spoiler* He tries to kill Will on multiple occasions. I'm definitely interested to see where it all goes, though.
 

victoriajakes

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I love Abigail. I hope she's manipulating them all and turns into a proper psycho and escapes in the night.

And I like my villains a little bit squishy on the inside. Makes them all the more vicious when they turn away from it. Hannibal comforting Abigail makes him more complex for me, and therefore more frightening. And more fun.
 

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^^This. So this. Abigail should go psycho on all of them, leave Hannibal standing there like "wtf just happened". Would be hilarious, and a brilliant move.
 

lalyil

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I love Abigail. I hope she's manipulating them all and turns into a proper psycho and escapes in the night.

And I like my villains a little bit squishy on the inside. Makes them all the more vicious when they turn away from it. Hannibal comforting Abigail makes him more complex for me, and therefore more frightening. And more fun.

^^This. So this. Abigail should go psycho on all of them, leave Hannibal standing there like "wtf just happened". Would be hilarious, and a brilliant move.



That's the problem when talking about stuff in a writers' forum. I think you guys are much more creative than the show's writers :D
 

victoriajakes

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That's the problem when talking about stuff in a writers' forum. I think you guys are much more creative than the show's writers :D

Haha, that's why I love writing. I take my frustrations with flawed existing media I consume and turn them into awesome new media.

(also, why I love fan fiction. re-writing canon to fit your inner most desires is great.)

All that said, I really do like Abigail. Even as she is. :D
 

victoriajakes

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Thought last night's episode was one of the best yet. Genuinely scary, both in the jump-out sense, and psychologically. Very glad we're going to get another season of this.
 

The_Ink_Goddess

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Not that I recall. There's a only brief mention of the Minnesota Shrike in Red Dragon that they drew from for the show. Hannibal Rising ends with Hannibal coming to America to do a residency at John's Hopkins. When Red Dragon starts, Hannibal has already been caught and is in prison. He and Will work together to capture the Toothfairy.

I guess to me, it's almost like he sees Abigail as a replacement for his sister. Young, in trouble, someone who needs him. He and Will never had that kind of relationship *spoiler* REDACTED. I'm definitely interested to see where it all goes, though.

We only hear of Abigail once, according to superfans of both - she got help and moved on with her life. They're either not going there or your predictions of Abigail going psycho and escaping everyone is accurate. ;) However, they've already moved distinctly from the source material - the way that the woman Hannibal killed, who saw his drawing? That's how Will finds out. So presumably they're going to change it for the show.

I don't know what I think of Abigail. Fascinating character, but that's unfortunately it so far. She's interesting, and there's a lot going on, but the problem with her manipulative character is that she's essentially nebulous. I desperately want to know more of her life with her dad and her role in the murders, but it's hard to get on a grip on anything and it's always possible that she's lying in whatever she says. Very interesting, though (could have been a more interesting way to approach I HUNT KILLERS :tongue).

What does everyone think of Fuller's plan for S6 (if it ever gets that far): Silence of the Lambs redux? It's the thing that makes me hope it finishes/gets cancelled after Will catches Hannibal to be honest, but I'm willing to be proven wrong, as I was with the show in general.
 

Persei

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The show, looking from the POV of a person who didn't read the books and didn't watch the movies, is extremely good. I really like the actor playing Hannibal because it gives Dr. Lecter an innocent, harmless aura. I saw him killing, and eating people (the "food is people" jokes are hilarious) but still I don't get to be really afraid of him, because at least in the show, that's the point of his character.

There shouldn't be something obviously unsettling about him... Not until we are dinner, of course lol
 

lalyil

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The show, looking from the POV of a person who didn't read the books and didn't watch the movies, is extremely good. I really like the actor playing Hannibal because it gives Dr. Lecter an innocent, harmless aura. I saw him killing, and eating people (the "food is people" jokes are hilarious) but still I don't get to be really afraid of him, because at least in the show, that's the point of his character.

There shouldn't be something obviously unsettling about him... Not until we are dinner, of course lol

Mads Mikkelsen is indeed exceptional. And if you like his acting in Hannibal, I recommend you watch 'The Hunt'
 

eternalised

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Not that impressed with this week's episode. I thought it was a good filler, now leading up to the epic final two episodes for this season. It wasn't too bad, just not nearly as good as some of the previous episodes.
 

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I've been watching from the beginning and I'm really enjoying it. But I'm getting tired of Will having these hallucinations and not getting any medical attention for it. I mean, he's on all these cases and is showing signs to everyone he's unstable, but not one person is saying you need medical help and to be put on medication. It's hard to believe a person like that, surrounded by all that professional help and not get treated right away.
 

lalyil

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I've been watching from the beginning and I'm really enjoying it. But I'm getting tired of Will having these hallucinations and not getting any medical attention for it. I mean, he's on all these cases and is showing signs to everyone he's unstable, but not one person is saying you need medical help and to be put on medication. It's hard to believe a person like that, surrounded by all that professional help and not get treated right away.

That's one of the reasons I said I dislike the writing. There are a lot of things like that throughout the show that don't get an answer, it seems like lazy writing to me cos I know that when I write I do all I can to think about all the questions one must ask themselves during. It makes it all unbelievable and it's unfortunate.
 

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Well, since Hannibal was supposedly caring for Will, and he DID send him for medical tests, I could kind of see it slipping past the others. However, now that Will's been hospitalized, there is no way his Encephalitis won't be found and I wonder how Hannibal is going to weasel out of saying he knew about it since he reviewed the tests of the doctor who gave Will a clean bill of health.
 

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Well, since Hannibal was supposedly caring for Will, and he DID send him for medical tests, I could kind of see it slipping past the others. However, now that Will's been hospitalized, there is no way his Encephalitis won't be found and I wonder how Hannibal is going to weasel out of saying he knew about it since he reviewed the tests of the doctor who gave Will a clean bill of health.

Agreed. He has been seeking treatment, and everyone talks about Will's mental health a good deal. It seems like the episode before last, the girl who thought she was dead, was drawing a corollary between the girl and Will. They repeatedly said there wasn't anything that could be done for her mental condition, and to me Will read into it that he couldn't be helped either.

Do Will and Jack know Hannibal actually reviewed the tests? Or did Hannibal set it up where he went on the word of the neurologist? I honestly don't remember.

I was starting to feel like they'd dragged out the encephalitis, and then they hospitalized Will. Surely they'll catch it now. I mean, they have to. Otherwise they couldn't stretch the show very long. Encephalitis isn't something you can live with for years and years, and we know Will's condition at the Red Dragon point.

I thought the last episode was mostly set-up for the next two, but I still enjoyed it. Really, who didn't love seeing Frederick Chilton getting some just desserts?
 

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This show (after tonight's epi, 6/13/2013) is traipsing very close to the edge of the shark tank. I don't mind Hannibal being a psychotic genius, but his also being the luckiest man alive is starting to wear thin.

As a matter of fact, the way everything ALWAYS breaks in his favor really undercuts the whole genius part.
 

lalyil

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Episode 10 finally reached Israel and... the whole thing with the..

Neurologist not telling Will he has a decease, playing along with Hannibal like that, and them basically testing on Will...

Did that make sense to anybody? It seems like such lazy writing to me and completely unbelievable.
 

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This show (after tonight's epi, 6/13/2013) is traipsing very close to the edge of the shark tank. I don't mind Hannibal being a psychotic genius, but his also being the luckiest man alive is starting to wear thin.

As a matter of fact, the way everything ALWAYS breaks in his favor really undercuts the whole genius part.

I didn't really get that from the last episode. I saw Hannibal's carefully laid plans starting to crack because of Will, but he's been setting Will up all season. I think there was some measure of luck with the whole Tobias thing, but everything else seems pretty well crafted.

If anyone is lucky, it's Will. Being able to function for so long, and so well, with encephalitis, and seeing the connection between the two copy-cat murders is pretty amazing.

For me, the writers have done a good job so far. They'll never be Thomas Harris, so it will never be as good as the source material, in my opinion, but it's still fresh and different as compared to what else is out there, and I think they've done a good job trying to stay as close as possible to the source.

My only real problem is that I know the source material so well. I know what happens to Will Graham, so I haven't felt any real fear or nervousness for his character yet. None of their "cliffhangers" have kept me on the edge of my seat because I already know what's going to happen. I keep watching, though, because it's intriguing to see Will and Hannibal's journey.

Episode 10 finally reached Israel and... the whole thing with the..

Neurologist not telling Will he has a decease, playing along with Hannibal like that, and them basically testing on Will...

Did that make sense to anybody? It seems like such lazy writing to me and completely unbelievable.

I think it makes sense in this world. Will has basically been a science experiment for Hannibal for a while. All of his patients are--he toys with them and manipulates them into different behaviors. It doesn't strike me as so odd Hannibal would pull in a trusted colleague for assistance. Crazy in the normal world? Yes. Crazy for Hannibal world? Not really.
 
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lalyil

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I think it makes sense in this world. Will has basically been a science experiment for Hannibal for a while. All of his patients are--he toys with them and manipulates them into different behaviors. It doesn't strike me as so odd Hannibal would pull in a trusted colleague for assistance. Crazy in the normal world? Yes. Crazy for Hannibal world? Not really.

Hannibal's world is Virginia. It doesn't strike me as a fantasy TV show. People around, Jack, Dr. Maurier, Dr. Bloom... they aren't all sadistic like Lecter. Lecter toying with Will and manipulating him - Yes, of course it makes sense, he's a sociopath.
But luckily for him the neurologist is also deranged? And willing to jeopardize his career and act unethically when Lecter suggests it? It makes zero sense. It's a lucky coincidence and therefore, lazy writing.
 

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Hannibal's world is Virginia. It doesn't strike me as a fantasy TV show. People around, Jack, Dr. Maurier, Dr. Bloom... they aren't all sadistic like Lecter. Lecter toying with Will and manipulating him - Yes, of course it makes sense, he's a sociopath.
But luckily for him the neurologist is also deranged? And willing to jeopardize his career and act unethically when Lecter suggests it? It makes zero sense. It's a lucky coincidence and therefore, lazy writing.

:Shrug:I guess we can agree to disagree. From my perspective, it's not the first time Hannibal has manipulated someone to get them to act how he wants them to act, even at a detriment to their own interests. That's pretty much what he does for four books. It's also not like the neurologist is someone he picked out of the phone book. They'd known each other since Johns Hopkins. I know what Hannibal did in med school in France, and he only grew more deranged when he left Europe, so I can only imagine the exploits he would've gotten into with a friend who also walked the moral tightrope. Especially if that friend had been manipulated by Hannibal from the start.

This is the man who *Spoiler* convinced Clarice Starling, after all she'd been through because of him, to leave with him and become his lover, and eat Agent Krendler's brain while Krendler was still alive. Convincing a neurologist to withhold test results in the name of "science" is hardly beyond the realm of possibility.
 

lalyil

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:Shrug:I guess we can agree to disagree. From my perspective, it's not the first time Hannibal has manipulated someone to get them to act how he wants them to act, even at a detriment to their own interests. That's pretty much what he does for four books. It's also not like the neurologist is someone he picked out of the phone book. They'd known each other since Johns Hopkins. I know what Hannibal did in med school in France, and he only grew more deranged when he left Europe, so I can only imagine the exploits he would've gotten into with a friend who also walked the moral tightrope. Especially if that friend had been manipulated by Hannibal from the start.

This is the man who *Spoiler* convinced Clarice Starling, after all she'd been through because of him, to leave with him and become his lover, and eat Agent Krendler's brain while Krendler was still alive. Convincing a neurologist to withhold test results in the name of "science" is hardly beyond the realm of possibility.

I can understand how it may make sense in the books, but the TV show is separate. What we see is what there is. You shouldn't have to read the books for the script of the TV show to make sense. And here all we saw was Lecter hinting to the neurologist they could use this for their advantage, it wasn't convincing at all. Even if they had known each other long ago, which was clear, it's still not enough for the neurologist to put himself on the line like that just cos of the hint Lecter gave him.
 

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I didn't really get that from the last episode. I saw Hannibal's carefully laid plans starting to crack because of Will, but he's been setting Will up all season. I think there was some measure of luck with the whole Tobias thing, but everything else seems pretty well crafted.
I basically can agree with this. But I was actually referring to all the myriad miniscule strokes of luck that Hannibal encounters.

For instance, that huge hospital, with that seriously ill woman inside some seriously expensive machinery, that no one is monitoring or even occasionally glancing at, apparently.

Or, before that, the same seriously ill woman walking in on him murdering someone--yet her condition etc prevents her from doing anything but being a very fortunate (alternate)patsy.

And, luckiest of all, Abigail abandoning Will and, out of the whole wide world, running directly into Hannibal's waiting arms.

And those are just the three I recollected first, sitting here sipping my morning coffee.
 

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Ah, yeah, I can see the luck with the girl (Georgia?), and some measure of luck with killing Abigail's friend, disposing of the kid Abigail killed (why can't I remember these names?). Abigail herself didn't seem as contrived to me--it's logical she'd go back to her house, and Hannibal probably had a plan to deal with her and Will there.

What feels luckier to me is that he can commit alllll these murders and eat all these people and no one ever notices. Surely he must go missing sometimes? People must spot him in the area? He's pretty identifiable.

I guess I can forgive the show a lot, since I'm such a fan of the source, haha, so I'm probably a bit biased. Speaking of which, did anyone see this Buzzfeed article on Fannibals? There's some pretty funny stuff there.