Sex in YA

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Shady Lane

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dude, I know. they had to amp up her tits so that you could tell them apart from the ass...it was kind of hard to tell if she was lying on her back or her stomach in the first version. i liked her better with smaller boobies, 'cause she looked more like me ;) but she's still hot.
 

Ryan_Sullivan

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I usually do my makeout/foreplay scenes pretty graphic and skip right over the sex. I'm kinda with Shady. I don't write the sex not because I find it uncomfortable to write, but just because it gets boring. Lol.

Ditto.
 

Zoombie

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If you're sex and it is boring to write (and presumably to read), then either you're doing it wrong (and I really doubt it's that, due to the what with all of how talented you all are) or it is not important to the plot or character development in its mechanics.

Like, for example, if a big part of character development is like...I don't know, the main character does something weird during sex, then it might be necessary or insightful to show that. Or you can imply it afterwards if that works too.

<shrugs>

I think all this jibber jabber is a bit weird...I mean...

Every scene has a mechanical purpose in a novel, even if you're growing your novel organically like I do by just writing what comes semi-naturally. They show character, or they further the plot...or best, they do both. Sex should not be considered any better or worse than a fight, talking, or driving scene. Does it further character development? Does it further the plot?

If it does neither, why is it here?

Now, this is all just opinion (Which is why I've been stating it as fact the whole time) but I think that if more people were a wee bit more discriminatory in their scene keepage, then we'd have better books.

We're not being paid by the word anymore...at least...last time I checked we were not.
 

Ryan_Sullivan

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If you're sex and it is boring to write (and presumably to read), then either you're doing it wrong (and I really doubt it's that, due to the what with all of how talented you all are) or it is not important to the plot or character development in its mechanics.

Yeah, for me and my purpose, it was important that they didn't do it, since it's meant to be like "Wow, I almost just screwed the girl I played in sand boxes with."

I swear to God, I'm going to use that for a title for one of my erotica novels. And I will dedicate it to you.

(Incidentally, I write erotica and try very hard not to make my sex scenes boring and clinical.)

If you do title it that, you are a god.
 

shaldna

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I'm not opposed to sex in YA, and I include it when it's needed. How graphic it gets depends ont eh needs of the story, the characters involved and the general tone of the rest of the piece. I always try to make it fit the characters and story.

A good sex scene should meld well and not seem out of place. Sometimes they are jarring, for example there were moments like that in Sunshine, where certain words etc seemed to be used for edgy effect, and it was like 'woah, where did that come from' because it didn't fit the character. (Personally I didn't need to hear Sunshine complaining about her King Cannute aching, and considering she's a fairly cleancut character for the rest of the book to me it just didn't fit)
 

Amadan

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I have very rarely read an explicit sex scene that actually added anything to the story. If you want to write erotica, write erotica. Otherwise, explicit sex usually reads like fight scenes where the author describes every blow and every footstep and every twist of the limbs, which a few authors can write well and make interesting, but most just make the fight drag on when all we really want to know is who won and how.

Also, one tidbit I picked up with my book, is that anytime there is sex (unless it is essential to the plot that there be no protection) ALWAYS mention condoms. Which goes for the accountablity wandergirl mentioned.

I disagree -- if it matters to the story whether or not they used protection, then mention it, otherwise, it's irrelevant. Saying you have to mention condoms to be "accountable" to the readers is like saying you should always mention gun safety when the characters use a gun.

(Now, if you have a story where everyone is screwing like rabbits, nobody ever uses protection, and nobody ever gets pregnant or an STD, your readers might raise their eyebrows and say "WTF?", but I don't think every sex scene needs to be a lesson in safe sex.)
 

Elizabeth May

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I find sex scenes boring if they're too frequent (something I haven't yet encountered in YA) or eye-roll inducing.

When the sexual tension is there for the entire novel (or several novels), which then leads to a sex scene, you can bet I'll probably be the girl rooting for it to happen.

But on that note: it has to feel natural and not forced. I've read some YA sex scenes where it seems pretty clear that the author either felt awkward writing it, or didn't know what was appropriate for the genre so he or she held back. Which I find irritating.
 

kaitlin008

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I disagree -- if it matters to the story whether or not they used protection, then mention it, otherwise, it's irrelevant. Saying you have to mention condoms to be "accountable" to the readers is like saying you should always mention gun safety when the characters use a gun.

(Now, if you have a story where everyone is screwing like rabbits, nobody ever uses protection, and nobody ever gets pregnant or an STD, your readers might raise their eyebrows and say "WTF?", but I don't think every sex scene needs to be a lesson in safe sex.)

I have to agree with Kody (blindwriter) on this one. And not just because I assume Kody's editor knows what she's talking about, but because it makes sense. Especially since we're talking about YA here, not fiction in general.

I am not sure about it being in every single sex scene (maybe I'm wrong?), but I do absolutely think it should be brought up at least the first time it happens. If there's one thing human beings can be real idiots about, it's safe sex. (I know, I know, there are other things people are idiots about, and some people are not idiots about it, but I think the point is clear) So showing teens using birth control intelligently is just...a good idea. Or if you show them using it unintelligently, include consequences or at least worries of potential consequences.

That's just my opinion, though, and hopefully it made some sort of sense.
 

kaitiepaige17

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Okay, as for the whole condom usage discussion, yeah, protection is very important. BUT YAs don't want to feel like they're being lectured to while reading a book.

An unprotected sex scene in a novel isn't going to make us go screw without protection. It just isn't. And I doubt readers will even notice if there isn't anything said about a condom anyway. I never read a sex scene a think, "uh, no condom! shame, shame." Just my thoughts.

I also think this goes with the story; sometimes condom usage is necessary, sometimes it isn't depending on what's actually going on in the story.
 

Mayfield

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Okay, as for the whole condom usage discussion, yeah, protection is very important. BUT YAs don't want to feel like they're being lectured to while reading a book.

An unprotected sex scene in a novel isn't going to make us go screw without protection. It just isn't. And I doubt readers will even notice if there isn't anything said about a condom anyway. I never read a sex scene a think, "uh, no condom! shame, shame." Just my thoughts.

I also think this goes with the story; sometimes condom usage is necessary, sometimes it isn't depending on what's actually going on in the story.

I don't think anyone wants to be lectured to. But I know that in some adult fiction, there can be lots of sex and the issue of birth control/protection never gets mentioned at all. I guess one is just supposed to assume someone put their nuvaring in, but I can understand the accountability part of not making it "assumed" in YA. Either say they used protection or that they didn't...whichever is relevant to the story/characters. But don't portray that fake world of sterile-non-babymaking booty calls.
 

kaitlin008

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I don't think anyone wants to be lectured to. But I know that in some adult fiction, there can be lots of sex and the issue of birth control/protection never gets mentioned at all. I guess one is just supposed to assume someone put their nuvaring in, but I can understand the accountability part of not making it "assumed" in YA. Either say they used protection or that they didn't...whichever is relevant to the story/characters. But don't portray that fake world of sterile-non-babymaking booty calls.

yes. this.

Also, I'm going to have to say that if a teen feels lectured by your condom usage, then you're probably not writing it properly.
 

Shady Lane

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I think the condoms thing is ridiculous. Do you specifically mention them buckling their seatbelts every time they get in a car?
 

Shady Lane

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It's tempting. Very tempting. It wouldn't be the first time I'd written something on a dare, but it would definitely be the first time I titled something on a dare...

Hmm...*strokes chinbeard*...

LORI DO IT. And yeah, I'm sure you write much better sex scenes than any of us, let's be honest.
 

Amadan

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I think the condoms thing is ridiculous. Do you specifically mention them buckling their seatbelts every time they get in a car?

And make sure if they drink or use drugs that someone mentions that drugs are bad, mmkay?
 

Blind Writer

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Re: condom reference - this is actually from an editor, not me. No, teens don't want to feel lectured, I agree. But the fact is, a lot of teens (and pre-teens) reading YA haven't HAD sex. It comse back to the accountability thing. You don't necessarily say "He put the condom . . . on the penis" (LOL - giggling at "and then the penis" right now). But just reference them. Like one character could ask, "Do you have protection?" or just have someone produce it form their wallet.

I'm not for lecturing, for sure, but you can do this WITHOUT lecturing.

And, again, this isn't just something I made up. I was informed of this last year by an editor on my own sex scenes. She said "In YA, always mention a condom." And after reading more contemporary YA, it's true. Check out Simone Elkeles. Her scenes are FAR from preachy (they're SUPER hawt, actually) and still mention protection.
 

Amadan

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I'm not saying protection should never be mentioned -- it's certainly realistic that that would be a concern (at least in a modern setting). But a rule like "Always mention protection" sounds like when Saturday morning cartoons had mandated moral messages inserted into them (for example, they were actually required to show characters putting on their seatbelts when they got into a car, just before driving off a cliff while shooting lasers at each other...)
 

Shady Lane

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Eh, like I said, in INVINCIBLE SUMMER, there's no mention at the time, and afterwards he mentions that he didn't use a condom. And the world doesn't explode, he doesn't get an STD, no one gets preggo, and my editor didn't even mention it.
 

kaitiepaige17

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I think this is why I'm going to stick to the foreplay, then the closed curtain sex. I don't completely agree with the condom discussion, just because sometimes it calls for it, sometimes it doesn't. It really depends on the scene, I think.
 

Blind Writer

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But, Shady, didn't you say the brother says "That was stupid"? I feel like that's enough. Just ONE PERSON saying "You didn't, that was dumb" counts for accountability Even if no one gets pregnant or catches an STD. I still consider that being accountable.
 

kaitiepaige17

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But, Shady, didn't you say the brother says "That was stupid"? I feel like that's enough. Just ONE PERSON saying "You didn't, that was dumb" counts for accountability Even if no one gets pregnant or catches an STD. I still consider that being accountable.

Yes, accountability is good! You don't need to mention using a condom or birth control for there to be some sort of accountability woven in.
 

Shady Lane

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I think he just throws a pillow at him.

He half-cough half-laughs into his fist, then studies me. “Are you okay?”

I squint. “What?”

“You’re fifteen.”

“Practically sixteen. And how old were you your first time?”

“Uh, eighteen.”

“Jesus, Noah, seriously?”

“Last summer. Melinda was my first. And only.”

I feel suddenly even worse than before, which I hadn’t thought was possible, but Noah’s just scrubbing at his hair and laughing. “Man, at this rate, we better pick up some condoms for Gideon.” He raises an eyebrow. “You did use a condom, yeah?”

“Not exactly.”

He throws a pillow at me.

“I, um, really don’t think there was much pregnancy risk, given—”

“You failed to uphold your duties as a time-sensitive male? Aw, a little impatient?”

so yeah. I guess the rules are

a. mention a condom
b. mention them coming during foreplay :(
 
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