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gianni pezzano

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Unfortunately worse still when you're on this side...(!)

From my discussions with other authors we've all suffered and I can say I'm not an exception...
 

Old Hack

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@OldHack I know depression is debhilitating and it destroys lives and business etc, but in this case, when Miss Hicks can manage to cash checks and spend money from her business account, I think we can probably say that she's not too deeply depressed to be non-functioning.

Depression doesn't stop someone functioning: it stops them from functioning properly.

When I've been really ill, I've been perfectly able to do some things without any difference at all: but other things have been completely beyond me.

It was usually the things I felt the most anxious about that paralysed me. So, cashing a cheque could be a good thing, not scary, not anxious, and so possible; answering an email when I know I should have answered it the week before? Impossible. No matter how much I know I have to do it.

As I said earlier, I'm not trying to excuse Ms Hicks' behaviour. But I don't see much understanding here about how hugely incapacitating depression can be, and I wanted to try to address the balance. Your response is a perfect example of how people just don't get what depression is: I hope I've helped clarify that for you now.
 
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mscelina

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There are two things I want out of all of this--for the authors to get their publication rights back and for the unpaid staff to get their pay. That's it. I have tried every available avenue open to me to bring this mess to a cordial, amicable conclusion. I failed--not because of anything I did, but because the owner did not believe that the situation was serious, that the authors had legitimate complaints, and that none of the contracts were actually breached.

Well--and a third thing too. I want Ms. Hicks to get the help she needs so she can recover from the series of things that have knocked her down. Am I still angry about what's happened at AMP? You betcha. I always used my royalties to pay for my house. We've had to scramble to survive. But Ms. Hicks was once my dear friend and my mentor. It took me a long time to realize that you can't save someone who doesn't want to be saved. And to me, that's tragic.
 

firedrake

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Depression doesn't stop someone functioning: it stops them from functioning properly.

When I've been really ill, I've been perfectly able to do some things without any difference at all: but other things have been completely beyond me.

It was usually the things I felt the most anxious about that paralysed me. So, cashing a cheque could be a good thing, not scary, not anxious, and so possible; answering an email when I know I should have answered it the week before? Impossible. No matter how much I know I have to do it.

As I said earlier, I'm not trying to excuse Ms Hicks' behaviour. But I don't see much understanding here about how hugely incapacitating depression can be, and I wanted to try to address the balance. Your response is a perfect example of how people just don't get what depression is: I hope I've helped clarify that for you now.

This. Depression can just freeze you. You know that things are going tits-up around you and you know what needs to be done to put things right, but you just....can't.

Ms.Hicks' behaviour doesn't strike me as being the deliberate behaviour of a criminal, more like a person who is in a mess and can't find a way out.

Having said this, I've been following this thread, and I really feel for all caught up in this disaster. I hope it gets sorted one way or another.
 

Dani

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Your response is a perfect example of how people just don't get what depression is: I hope I've helped clarify that for you now.

On the contrary, I do know exactly what depression is and how it can affect someone. I lost my mediation business in 1998 because of depression. I left bills unpaid, clients not contacted, lease agreements lapse and checks uncashed.

I would not have been able to negotiate a deal at ALL back then, let alone work a deal out where I could manage to refuse a sale of a failing company and keep the rights of individual contracts. My sanity at the time wouldn't have allowed decisions beyond "OMG SOMEONE IS OFFERING ME MONEY, I CAN TAKE IT AND RUN." In my situation, someone could have offered me 1/10th of the value of my company and I would have taken it because it would have seemed an answer to my prayers. I probably would have been in worse straights but I wouldn't have been able to see beyond that 'godsend'.

I think it's valiant of you to defend someone with depression, but in this case I believe you're wrong.

If you read the blog post you can see the very rational choices she is making in regards to selling her company. Indeed, you can see just how shrewd she is to retain the contracts. In this way she has the leverage to sell to another publisher the contracts in question.

She may be burying her head in the sand, which is typical of depression, oldhack, but she is selectively doing so. This tells me she has at least some common sense with regards to the situation.

Btw, she also states she is seeking treatment. This is a red flag for me that she is not under the full duress of depression. She has the wherewithal to make correct decisions. She's choosing not to.

This is, of course, my personal opinion. I could be wrong. I often am. But it is what I believe.
 

Unimportant

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Dani, I don't think everyone with depression has the exact same problems/inabilities. It affects each person individually. Some sleep excessively; others get insomnia. Some cry; others turn to stone. Some have a friend or partner who recognise what is going on and can convince/force them to get treatment; others don't. Some have chronic lifetime depression; others have episodic depression.

Your experience with depression is valid for you, of course, but it doesn't necessarily equate to what every other person with depression would experience.
 

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I don't want to turn this thread into a discussion about depression and Ms Hicks' mental health, so after this post I'll drop it: but I wanted to say a couple of important things first.

On the contrary, I do know exactly what depression is and how it can affect someone. I lost my mediation business in 1998 because of depression. I left bills unpaid, clients not contacted, lease agreements lapse and checks uncashed.

First up, I'm really sorry to hear that you've had problems with depression. It's a horrible illness, and very difficult to cope with.

I would not have been able to negotiate a deal at ALL back then, let alone work a deal out where I could manage to refuse a sale of a failing company and keep the rights of individual contracts. My sanity at the time wouldn't have allowed decisions beyond "OMG SOMEONE IS OFFERING ME MONEY, I CAN TAKE IT AND RUN." In my situation, someone could have offered me 1/10th of the value of my company and I would have taken it because it would have seemed an answer to my prayers.

That's how depression hit you: but when it hit my friend, he became obsessive about money. He didn't leave a single cheque uncashed; he juggled his bank accounts around like nobody's business, and made a lot of money doing so. What he didn't manage to do was bring money into the business because he was so focussed on money that he overpriced every job he was asked to do, and squeezed his suppliers so hard that they refused to do business with him. He exaggerated the cost of everything in his favour. I was reminded of him when I read how Ms Hicks had demanded $250,000 for her company. That seemed completely disproportionate to me, as did other aspects of her behaviour.

Depression affects everyone differently. The only constant is that people tend to be erratic and irrational when in its grip. Unless we're there, we can't judge: but having done a lot of reading between the lines in Celina's blog, I can see a lot of paralells between Ms Hicks' behaviour and that of other people I know have been depressed. That's all.
 

Al Stevens

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I think trying to legally recover what's owed can get into the blood and turnip situation. Your former friend is not meeting her obligations because she is broke. No matter how she got that way, she did.

As difficult as this might seem, I think the best thing for you to do, for your own well-being, is to cut your losses, back away from the good fight and dedicate your attention to Musa, which shows so much promise.

A crusade like the one against AMP can become a psychic energy sink. It can suck all the life out of you. You can spend all your waking hours dwelling on it. And stress is a killer.

Certainly, you can offer advice and moral support to those whose titles are being held in limbo. But I wouldn't go beyond the call of duty to try and fix it. The wall has been hit.

My 1/5 of a dime's worth of objectivity. Got no dog in this fight. Toss it if it doesn't work. Let me know if you need a shoulder.
 

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Having suffered with clinical depression in the past I was willing to let things ride for awhile at AMP. Two of my books there are in the Del Fantasma(publisher generated) series, so would take extensive rewriting to resub anywhere else and my writing plate is full right now with other projects. Also, my early days there were so nice, checks and statements every month, decent sales...I hoped it would turn about. Then I hoped she'd sell to Musa or another epublisher...now it looks like the grinding down of yet another epub.

I swear(well, whine), I will never get a real backlist. As soon as I get one, the epub explodes and I'm left to start all over.
 

gianni pezzano

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I would put this as a separate post, however, I still can't do a new post and I don't want to annoy the moderators with one liners to reach the 50. In any case I don't think I have mush to go.

One of the lessons in the AMP mess is the situation regarding the authors' rights and their return in case of such a situation. This is not the first timesuch a thing had happened and I don't think it will be the last (unfortunately).

I'm just wondering if there could be a central registry of somesort for authors' rights, similar to what now happens to copyright. Any request for return of rights due to breach fo contract, etc, will then need to be done by a separate, independant third party. This would also avoid possible (and expensive) legal action in case of dispute...

The situation would not be easy to start off, but I think in the long term such a registry could avoid situations such as the one at AMP where the owner refuses to even open lteers, etc, let alone answer them or comply with the request.

I wonder what everyone thinks of this....
 

CaoPaux

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The 50-post rule for starting new threads only applies to the Share Your Work forums. If you'd like to start a new thread re: a registry for publishing rights (?), I suggest the Roundtable.
 

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Hackie, you always were a much nicer person than I, so I give you great kudos for your charitable thoughts re Sandra Hicks. I see so many authors with heartbreaking stories when I talk to them at writer's conferences, so it's more difficult to empathize with her situation.

Facts are she has clearly breached her contracts over and over again and has steadfastly refused to entertain releasing her authors, and they're suffering mightily. Their situation is much easier to appreciate than Sandra's.

The question remains, what options are open to authors? Contacting the FBI is a choice, but not a realistic one. They're overworked and understaffed as is. There aren't enough "victims" for them to pick up the baton and run with it.

That leaves legal means. For US authors, the most logical avenue would be Small Claims. I'm not a lawyer, so I don't know if you can file in your home state or you have to file in the state where AMP is, but it's worth finding out because it's not expensive to file. She doesn't have a contractual leg to stand on, so she'll either not show up, in which case the author wins, or she shows up and loses. Either way, the author wins.

The question authors need to ask is how much their books mean to them and whether it's worth the time, energy, and expense of traveling out of state (if you have to file in AMP's state). Is there anything in the contract that stipulates mediation in case of a dispute?
 

Al Stevens

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I don't know whether small claims court can impose a reversion of rights, which is what authors would want. Somebody ought to talk to a lawyer.
 

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For me, it's too early to bring legal action. The contract requires the author to send a certified letter notifying AMP of the breach. AMP then has 90 days to cure the breach. If AMP fails to cure the breach, the contract terminates. Of course, termination of the contract doesn't mean AMP will actually take down books, as evidenced by its continuing sale of out-of-contract books.

I still have a good chunk of my 90 days left, but I'm using the time to research my next options. Unfortunately, I don't trust AMP to send me a rights reversion letter even though the contract requires them to do so, but I hope publishers will accept my other documentation instead.
 
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priceless1

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I don't know whether small claims court can impose a reversion of rights, which is what authors would want. Somebody ought to talk to a lawyer.
One would have to check the claims in their states, but in CA, it says:
In California, the maximum a plaintiff can recover through the small claims process is $7,500. The limit for suits involving a surety company or guarantor is $4,000; if the guarantor does not charge for the guarantee, the limit is $2,500. The limit for a claim brought by a corporation or LLC is $5,000. The statute of limitations is 4 years for issues involving written contracts, 2 years for issues involving oral contracts, 2 years for personal injury issues, and 3 years for cases involving property damage. An attorney is not allowed unless he or she happens to be the plaintiff or the defendant.

It's a simple matter of the aggrieved party presenting the contract as proof that it has been nullified by the merits of non-payment or not publishing a book within the stated parameters (if she included a deadline, that is). The long and short is that authors have a lot of proof of contractual malfeasance, so why not see if it can be argued out in Small Claims.
 

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Ms.Hicks' behaviour doesn't strike me as being the deliberate behaviour of a criminal, more like a person who is in a mess and can't find a way out.

Everyone who never received the two signed pages of the publishing contract back from Ms. Hicks, please raise your hands.

Okay, I don't know how many that is exactly, but I know I never got them back and many others have said the same thing. This is deliberate. I'm not in a position to judge if it's criminal behavior, but it seems clear Ms. Hicks had no intention of returning those documents. Perhaps she had some reason other than that she already knew she had no intention of honoring the contract. But for the life of me I can't imagine what that might be.
 

mscelina

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The problem with AMP's owner originates with her belief that the 90 day clause to address breach of contracts saves her from any kind of consequences and gives her the ability to SOLELY determine what constitutes a breach and what doesn't. She is most definitely not a lawyer--and clearly does not understand the ramifications of her own contract. Ignoring the correspondence with notification of breach does not mean that AMP is innocent of the breaches of contract.

I, at least, have spoken with several lawyers regarding the situation at AMP. The advice is always the same--follow the directions in the AMP contract and start the ninety day countdown. At the end of ninety days, then AMP is in violation of copyright.
 

gianni pezzano

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It could be, but the authors would have to show how much money they are owed and back that up. This owuld be difficult for them to do individually...

It would NOT resolve the issue for those authors who simply want their rights back. I'm one of them...
 

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mscelina

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As I said in the follow up blog post to the big one yesterday, most of the authors just want their rights back. To be honest, the majority of the trapped authors either had small by steady royalties OR were the authors I contracted after the senior staff took over to fill gaps in the release schedule and to launch the speculative fiction imprint. That last set of authors isn't owed a PENNY by AMP so it makes absolutely no sense to me why the owner isn't releasing them at least. She hasn't released a book since the week after we resigned from AMP.

So for those authors, small claims court would do no good.

Interestingly enough, the authors who were making big or good royalties at AMP were usually the ones that she paid on time and sent a royalty statement to. That was something we noticed in her habits; she kept the big names happy and let the less known ones slide.

The authors and books that are trapped at AMP are, to my way of thinking, a far worse situation than the royalties owed until the last three months. Once we left, and the owner didn't pay the third party quarterly royalties in addition to the AMP website royalties and the monthly-paid Amazon royalties is when the financial duress really kicked in company-wide.

But those royalty breaches are on the 90 day countdown. The authors with problems with royalties BEFORE then have been victimized by the owner's deliberate lack of knowledge of her own contract. It's like she thinks if she ignores them, everything is just going to go away.

And then if the money is really gone, spent for personal expenses, and she declares bankruptcy for herself and the business, then those authors are really screwed. Not only will their royalties then be tied up with the bankruptcy trust, but their book rights will be too.
 

Soccer Mom

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It could be, but the authors would have to show how much money they are owed and back that up. This owuld be difficult for them to do individually...

It would NOT resolve the issue for those authors who simply want their rights back. I'm one of them...

Actually, small claims can also be for the return of property, which is what these authors are seeking. You can also sue in small claims to perform a contract, set one aside, or comply with restrictive covenenats.
 
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