Scene/Sequel Progression Question

Rusted · Jul 18, 2012

Hi guys,

FIrst let me say I've had a really good sesson of writing today (hooray!). I don't know about you, but sometimes writing can be like swimming in honey. Very hard, and you don't get very far. But! Today, for the first time in a long while, I had a really good day! I experienced what Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi calls 'The flow experience' - what I call channeling - you can check it out here:
http://www.ted.com/talks/mihaly_csikszentmihalyi_on_flow.html

This has nothing to do with my question and everything to do with me celebrating a good day, which will hopefully lead to more good days ...

Anyway, to my question:

I've been thinking/reading a lot about the scene/sequel pattern. I'm trying to analyze my first chapter in light of scene/sequel, and I've come across a bit that I can't quite seem to classify. In this (scene), it's basically the main characters laying out their plan. Or at least, the bits of the plan the reader needs to know. it's only ~500 words, but it doesn't conform to the scene/sequel pattern, in that there's no obstacle to their goal and no emotional reaction. I suppose this scene could be considered a continuation of the emotional reaction to the inciting incident, but I'm not so sure - two sequels in a row?
Should I cut it because it doesn't conform to the scene/sequal progression? If so, how should I replace it? If I'm being honest, there's a bit in there I really want to keep.
Should I try and put an obstacle in there somewhere? (this is going to be difficult?) Or some kind of continuing emotional reaction? would this get too hammy?
Should I stop overthinking things and just go cook dinner?

Thanks for your advice,

Rusty

WittyandorIronic · Jul 18, 2012

Before I started writing this post I realized I was going to sound like a broken record... but I will say it (again) anyways.

Have you finished your whole first draft yet? If not, don't worry about analyzing it in depth. Just get back to writing.
If this is draft 2 or 3, then you need to approach editing with a stern resolve to only keep/clean up that which furthers the plot. I love the scene/sequel progression to analyze the structure of my writing, though I actually use it more to prompt me to figure out "what should happen next" if I get stuck (As in, am I missing a sequel? Did they not have enough time to calm down? What would be the next immediate goal? What would prevent them from attaining it?).

If you are in the editing phase, figure out what is essential to the plot and strip away everything else. If you substituted sweeping the floor for that scene would the reader miss something vital? If not... then most readers are going to react to that scene as if the characters are sitting around, sweeping the floor.

For anyone unfamiliar, this is what the OP is referring to.

Rusted · Jul 18, 2012

You're right, you picked it straight away. I haven't finished writing my first draft yet. I'm using the scene/sequel progression to structure my writing, but in the opening it feels like I haven't really done it that well.

When I first started this book I wasn't really thinking about it - but now that I'm 'settled in' and am working in the scene/sequel progression, I'm looking backward and thinking of revising.

I guess I finish the book first, then rewrite the opening

I've read the page you linked, I found it very helpful - Though I must say, I'm not completely sold on the MRU idea. Is anyone a strong advocate of this? I find it a bit restrictive. Perhaps it's more of an editing tool. But, I'm not a published author, so what would I know.

Some more links I found useful:
Scene: http://jimbutcher.livejournal.com/2647.html
Sequel: http://jimbutcher.livejournal.com/2880.html

Rusted · Jul 18, 2012

bearilou · Jul 18, 2012

Rusted said:
Though I must say, I'm not completely sold on the MRU idea. Is anyone a strong advocate of this? I find it a bit restrictive.

It's only restrictive if you try to follow it letter and verse. Even Randy mentions that not all scenes/sequels have the MRU flow exactly all the time.

What helped me really grok the scene/sequel and MRU rhythm was to grab two chapters from several books, multicolored highlighters and mark up according to the different parts. Many novels follow this rhythm naturally (whether it's intentionally followed or not, I don't know. I suspect not) and in the scenes that I analyzed many 'parts' were left out or previous parts were repeated a few times and sometimes, for flow, out of 'order', before falling into the rhythm again.

But the highlighters helped me see how it all fit together.

Rusted said:
Perhaps it's more of an editing tool.

Which is why it's advisable, as a new writer, to finish the book first, then go back to apply scene/sequel and MRU to your writing. The biggest danger, I think at this point, is to keep dithering around with this one scene that may end up being cut or completely reworked by the time you reached the end. While it's a good exercise regardless, it will be harder to cut it if it needs it because it's human nature to not want to trash something you worked so hard on. :/

Bufty · Jul 18, 2012

MRU's are based on the perfectly logical assumption that in novels things don't happen without a reason.

Read something and if you find yourself scratching your head and asking 'Why did he do that? the chances are that the action or reaction or whatever it is has no obvious stimulus or motivation.

Write the story and then check it to see if you have any missing stimuli or if the motivations and reactions are confused or reversed or whatever.

It's simply another tool in the box, the same as scene/sequel and other techniques.

BethS · Jul 18, 2012

Rusted said:
I've been thinking/reading a lot about the scene/sequel pattern. I'm trying to analyze my first chapter in light of scene/sequel, and I've come across a bit that I can't quite seem to classify. In this (scene), it's basically the main characters laying out their plan. Or at least, the bits of the plan the reader needs to know. it's only ~500 words, but it doesn't conform to the scene/sequel pattern, in that there's no obstacle to their goal and no emotional reaction. I suppose this scene could be considered a continuation of the emotional reaction to the inciting incident, but I'm not so sure - two sequels in a row?
Should I cut it because it doesn't conform to the scene/sequal progression? If so, how should I replace it? If I'm being honest, there's a bit in there I really want to keep.
Should I try and put an obstacle in there somewhere? (this is going to be difficult?) Or some kind of continuing emotional reaction? would this get too hammy?
Should I stop overthinking things and just go cook dinner?

Thanks for your advice,

Rusty

You're way overthinking.

You don't have to slavishly follow the scene/sequel progression. You can have several scenes followed by a single sequel. Thrillers tend to follow this pattern. Slower paced books will have more sequels. You write sequels when they're appropriate, not because you just wrote a scene.

Trust your storytelling instincts and just write. When you need a reaction scene, you'll write one.

As to the character laying out the plan -- if you reveal the plan to the reader beforehand, something had better go wrong with it in the execution.

Scene/Sequel Progression Question

Rusted

WittyandorIronic

Rusted

Rusted

bearilou

DenturePunk writer

Bufty

Where have the last ten years gone?

BethS